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From: Sonny Rao <sonnyrao@chromium.org>
To: Michal Hocko <mhocko@kernel.org>
Cc: Robert Foss <robert.foss@collabora.com>,
	Jonathan Corbet <corbet@lwn.net>,
	Andrew Morton <akpm@linux-foundation.org>,
	Vlastimil Babka <vbabka@suse.cz>, Hugh Dickins <hughd@google.com>,
	Konstantin Khlebnikov <koct9i@gmail.com>,
	Naoya Horiguchi <n-horiguchi@ah.jp.nec.com>,
	"Kirill A. Shutemov" <kirill.shutemov@linux.intel.com>,
	John Stultz <john.stultz@linaro.org>,
	Minchan Kim <minchan@kernel.org>,
	ross.zwisler@linux.intel.com, jmarchan@redhat.com,
	Johannes Weiner <hannes@cmpxchg.org>,
	Kees Cook <keescook@chromium.org>,
	oleg@redhat.com, Al Viro <viro@zeniv.linux.org.uk>,
	Mateusz Guzik <mguzik@redhat.com>,
	Janis Danisevskis <jdanis@google.com>,
	calvinowens@fb.com, Alexey Dobriyan <adobriyan@gmail.com>,
	ebiederm@xmission.com, Seth Forshee <seth.forshee@canonical.com>,
	Djalal Harouni <tixxdz@gmail.com>,
	linux-doc@vger.kernel.org,
	"linux-kernel@vger.kernel.org" <linux-kernel@vger.kernel.org>,
	Ben Zhang <benzh@chromium.org>, Bryan Freed <bfreed@chromium.org>,
	Filipe Brandenburger <filbranden@chromium.org>,
	Jann Horn <jann@thejh.net>,
	linux-api@vger.kernel.org,
	Jacek Anaszewski <j.anaszewski@samsung.com>
Subject: Re: [PATCH v5 0/3] mm, proc: Implement /proc/<pid>/totmaps
Date: Tue, 13 Sep 2016 13:27:39 -0700	[thread overview]
Message-ID: <CAPz6YkXq_QPffYgBJZGxZG9SboTVoCEH2qqCgAuB6YYj1e95ig@mail.gmail.com> (raw)
In-Reply-To: <20160913071208.GC31898@dhcp22.suse.cz>

On Tue, Sep 13, 2016 at 12:12 AM, Michal Hocko <mhocko@kernel.org> wrote:
> On Mon 12-09-16 10:28:53, Sonny Rao wrote:
>> On Mon, Sep 12, 2016 at 10:15 AM, Michal Hocko <mhocko@kernel.org> wrote:
>> > On Mon 12-09-16 08:31:36, Sonny Rao wrote:
> [...]
>> >> but how about the other fields like Swap, Private_Dirty and
>> >> Private_Shared?
>> >
>> > Private_Shared can be pretty confusing as well without the whole context
>> > as well see my other emails in the original thread (just to remind
>> > shmem/tmpfs makes all this really confusing).
>>
>> But this is exactly the issue -- RSS is can be just as confusing if
>> you don't know something about the application.
>
> I agree that rss can be confusing but we will not make the situation any
> better if we add yet another confusing metric.
>
>> I think the issue is
>> how common that situation is, and you seem to believe that it's so
>> uncommon that it's actually better to keep the information more
>> difficult to get for those of us who know something about our systems.
>>
>> That's fine, I guess we just have to disagree here, thanks for look at this.
>
> I think you should just step back and think more about what exactly
> you expect from the counter(s). I believe what you want is an
> estimate of a freeable memory when the particular process dies or is
> killed. That would mean resident single mapped private anonymous memory
> + unlinked single mapped shareable mappings + single mapped swapped out
> memory. Maybe I've missed something but it should be something along
> those lines. Definitely something that the current smaps infrastructure
> doesn't give you, though.

Yes your description of what we want is pretty good.  Having a
reasonable lower bound on the estimate is fine, though we probably
want to break out swapped out memory separately.  Given that smaps
doesn't provide this in a straightforward way, what do you think is
the right way to provide this information?

> --
> Michal Hocko
> SUSE Labs

WARNING: multiple messages have this Message-ID (diff)
From: Sonny Rao <sonnyrao@chromium.org>
To: Michal Hocko <mhocko@kernel.org>
Cc: Robert Foss <robert.foss@collabora.com>,
	Jonathan Corbet <corbet@lwn.net>,
	Andrew Morton <akpm@linux-foundation.org>,
	Vlastimil Babka <vbabka@suse.cz>, Hugh Dickins <hughd@google.com>,
	Konstantin Khlebnikov <koct9i@gmail.com>,
	Naoya Horiguchi <n-horiguchi@ah.jp.nec.com>,
	"Kirill A. Shutemov" <kirill.shutemov@linux.intel.com>,
	John Stultz <john.stultz@linaro.org>,
	Minchan Kim <minchan@kernel.org>,
	ross.zwisler@linux.intel.com, jmarchan@redhat.com,
	Johannes Weiner <hannes@cmpxchg.org>,
	Kees Cook <keescook@chromium.org>,
	oleg@redhat.com, Al Viro <viro@zeniv.linux.org.uk>,
	Mateusz Guzik <mguzik@redhat.com>,
	Janis Danisevskis <jdanis@google.com>,
	calvinowens@fb.com, Alexey Dobriyan <adobriyan@gmail.com>,
	ebiederm@xmission.com, Seth Forshee <seth.forshee@canonical>
Subject: Re: [PATCH v5 0/3] mm, proc: Implement /proc/<pid>/totmaps
Date: Tue, 13 Sep 2016 13:27:39 -0700	[thread overview]
Message-ID: <CAPz6YkXq_QPffYgBJZGxZG9SboTVoCEH2qqCgAuB6YYj1e95ig@mail.gmail.com> (raw)
In-Reply-To: <20160913071208.GC31898@dhcp22.suse.cz>

On Tue, Sep 13, 2016 at 12:12 AM, Michal Hocko <mhocko@kernel.org> wrote:
> On Mon 12-09-16 10:28:53, Sonny Rao wrote:
>> On Mon, Sep 12, 2016 at 10:15 AM, Michal Hocko <mhocko@kernel.org> wrote:
>> > On Mon 12-09-16 08:31:36, Sonny Rao wrote:
> [...]
>> >> but how about the other fields like Swap, Private_Dirty and
>> >> Private_Shared?
>> >
>> > Private_Shared can be pretty confusing as well without the whole context
>> > as well see my other emails in the original thread (just to remind
>> > shmem/tmpfs makes all this really confusing).
>>
>> But this is exactly the issue -- RSS is can be just as confusing if
>> you don't know something about the application.
>
> I agree that rss can be confusing but we will not make the situation any
> better if we add yet another confusing metric.
>
>> I think the issue is
>> how common that situation is, and you seem to believe that it's so
>> uncommon that it's actually better to keep the information more
>> difficult to get for those of us who know something about our systems.
>>
>> That's fine, I guess we just have to disagree here, thanks for look at this.
>
> I think you should just step back and think more about what exactly
> you expect from the counter(s). I believe what you want is an
> estimate of a freeable memory when the particular process dies or is
> killed. That would mean resident single mapped private anonymous memory
> + unlinked single mapped shareable mappings + single mapped swapped out
> memory. Maybe I've missed something but it should be something along
> those lines. Definitely something that the current smaps infrastructure
> doesn't give you, though.

Yes your description of what we want is pretty good.  Having a
reasonable lower bound on the estimate is fine, though we probably
want to break out swapped out memory separately.  Given that smaps
doesn't provide this in a straightforward way, what do you think is
the right way to provide this information?

> --
> Michal Hocko
> SUSE Labs

  reply	other threads:[~2016-09-13 20:28 UTC|newest]

Thread overview: 43+ messages / expand[flat|nested]  mbox.gz  Atom feed  top
2016-09-05 20:14 [PATCH v5 0/3] mm, proc: Implement /proc/<pid>/totmaps robert.foss
2016-09-05 20:14 ` robert.foss
2016-09-05 20:14 ` [PATCH v5 1/3] " robert.foss
2016-09-05 20:14   ` robert.foss
2016-09-07 12:58   ` Oleg Nesterov
2016-09-07 12:58     ` Oleg Nesterov
2016-09-12 22:12     ` Robert Foss
2016-09-12 22:12       ` Robert Foss
2016-09-05 20:14 ` [PATCH v5 2/3] Documentation/filesystems: Fixed typo robert.foss
2016-09-05 20:14   ` robert.foss-ZGY8ohtN/8qB+jHODAdFcQ
2016-09-07 23:22   ` Kees Cook
2016-09-07 23:22     ` Kees Cook
2016-09-08  0:22     ` Robert Foss
2016-09-08  0:22       ` Robert Foss
2016-09-08  6:23       ` Jonathan Corbet
2016-09-08  6:23         ` Jonathan Corbet
2016-09-05 20:14 ` [PATCH v5 3/3] Documentation/filesystems: Added /proc/PID/totmaps documentation robert.foss
2016-09-05 20:14   ` robert.foss
2016-09-12 12:02 ` [PATCH v5 0/3] mm, proc: Implement /proc/<pid>/totmaps Michal Hocko
2016-09-12 15:31   ` Sonny Rao
2016-09-12 15:31     ` Sonny Rao
2016-09-12 17:15     ` Michal Hocko
2016-09-12 17:15       ` Michal Hocko
2016-09-12 17:28       ` Sonny Rao
2016-09-12 17:28         ` Sonny Rao
2016-09-13  7:12         ` Michal Hocko
2016-09-13  7:12           ` Michal Hocko
2016-09-13 20:27           ` Sonny Rao [this message]
2016-09-13 20:27             ` Sonny Rao
2016-09-14  9:12             ` Michal Hocko
2016-09-14  9:12               ` Michal Hocko
2016-09-19 15:16               ` Robert Foss
2016-09-19 15:16                 ` Robert Foss
2016-09-19 19:32                 ` Michal Hocko
2016-09-19 19:32                   ` Michal Hocko
     [not found]                   ` <20160919194001.GE2903@pc.thejh.net>
     [not found]                     ` <20160919195109.GB28639@dhcp22.suse.cz>
2016-09-19 19:56                       ` Jann Horn
2016-09-19 19:56                         ` Jann Horn
2016-09-19 20:15                         ` Sonny Rao
2016-09-19 20:15                           ` Sonny Rao
2016-09-20  0:27                   ` Robert Foss
2016-09-20  0:27                     ` Robert Foss
2016-09-20  0:29                     ` Sonny Rao
2016-09-20  0:29                       ` Sonny Rao

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