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From: Linus Torvalds <torvalds@osdl.org>
To: Robert White <rwhite@casabyte.com>
Cc: "'Albert Cahalan'" <albert@users.sourceforge.net>,
	"'Ulrich Drepper'" <drepper@redhat.com>,
	"'Mikael Pettersson'" <mikpe@csd.uu.se>,
	"'Kernel Mailing List'" <linux-kernel@vger.kernel.org>
Subject: RE: Who changed /proc/<pid>/ in 2.6.0-test5-bk9?
Date: Tue, 7 Oct 2003 17:54:35 -0700 (PDT)	[thread overview]
Message-ID: <Pine.LNX.4.44.0310071743370.32358-100000@home.osdl.org> (raw)
In-Reply-To: <!~!UENERkVCMDkAAQACAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAABgAAAAAAAAA2ZSI4XW+fk25FhAf9BqjtMKAAAAQAAAAwtz+A6aJAkeufXSGK2GIiwEAAAAA@casabyte.com>


On Tue, 7 Oct 2003, Robert White wrote:
> 
> What is gained by having the independent file descriptor context that would
> be *broken* for lack of that independence?

You're coming at it from the wrong end. Sharing resources is inherently
bad. If there is no reason to share, you shouldn't share.

The reason people use threads is that sharing the VM space has real 
advantages: it makes context switching much cheaper (fewer hw resources in 
the form of TLB usages) and it allows for much faster synchronization 
through a shared address space.

But the same isn't true of file descriptors or a lot of other software-
level abstractions. There are no inherent advantages to sharing, and in
fact sharing just gives more opportunity for race conditions, bad
interaction etc.

For example, one reason _not_ to share is that the subthread may want to 
be as invisible to the "main thread" as possible. That's just good 
programming practice - trying to isolate and encapsulate as much data as 
possible.

The same way you shouldn't make all your variables global, you shouldn't 
make all your data structures global unless you have a reason.

		Linus


  reply	other threads:[~2003-10-08  0:54 UTC|newest]

Thread overview: 94+ messages / expand[flat|nested]  mbox.gz  Atom feed  top
2003-09-28  1:27 Linux 2.6.0-test6 Linus Torvalds
2003-09-28  7:03 ` Con Kolivas
2003-09-28 10:02   ` Rob Landley
2003-09-29  4:55     ` Nick Piggin
2003-09-29  7:35       ` Rob Landley
2003-09-29 16:55       ` Ed Sweetman
2003-09-30  0:03         ` Nick Piggin
2003-10-02  0:41         ` Pedro Larroy
2003-10-02  3:05           ` Nick Piggin
2003-10-02 19:07             ` Pedro Larroy
2003-10-03  0:07               ` Nick Piggin
2003-10-03 19:34                 ` Pedro Larroy
2003-09-29 18:45       ` bill davidsen
2003-09-30  1:12         ` Nick Piggin
2003-10-01 21:13           ` bill davidsen
2003-10-02  2:45             ` Nick Piggin
2003-09-28  8:26 ` Markus Hästbacka
2003-09-28 10:54   ` Jeff Garzik
2003-09-28  8:59 ` keyboard repeat / sound [was Re: Linux 2.6.0-test6] Roger Luethi
2003-09-29 15:16   ` Vojtech Pavlik
2003-09-30  7:50     ` Paul
2003-09-30 12:51       ` Vojtech Pavlik
2003-09-30 13:21         ` Aristeu Sergio Rozanski Filho
2003-09-30 13:44           ` Vojtech Pavlik
2003-09-30 14:05             ` Aristeu Sergio Rozanski Filho
2003-09-30 14:16               ` Vojtech Pavlik
2003-10-01 23:51                 ` Aristeu Sergio Rozanski Filho
2003-09-30 18:16               ` Mark W. Alexander
2003-10-01 23:52                 ` Aristeu Sergio Rozanski Filho
2003-09-28 10:09 ` Linux 2.6.0-test6 Rafał 'rmrmg' Roszak
2003-09-28 11:05 ` Andreas Jellinghaus
2003-09-28 12:34   ` Dave Jones
2003-09-28 16:12     ` Andreas Jellinghaus
2003-09-28 17:51       ` Andries Brouwer
2003-09-28 16:42 ` Ivan Gyurdiev
2003-09-28 20:26 ` [patch] 2.6.0-test6: correct hdlcdrv.h prototypes Adrian Bunk
2003-09-29 13:23 ` Linux 2.6.0-test6 Florin Iucha
2003-09-29 13:55   ` Muli Ben-Yehuda
2003-09-29 14:01     ` Jaroslav Kysela
2003-09-29 14:18       ` Muli Ben-Yehuda
2003-09-29 19:04         ` bill davidsen
2003-09-29 14:30       ` Takashi Iwai
2003-09-29 13:58   ` Jaroslav Kysela
2003-09-29 16:30 ` Linux 2.6.0-test6 (compile statistics) John Cherry
2003-09-29 17:44   ` Jesper Juhl
2003-10-06 20:39     ` John Cherry
2003-10-01  8:58 ` Who changed /proc/<pid>/ in 2.6.0-test5-bk9? Mikael Pettersson
2003-10-01 11:52   ` John Levon
2003-10-01 20:21     ` bill davidsen
2003-10-02  1:00       ` John Levon
2003-10-06  3:01         ` bill davidsen
2003-10-01 15:11   ` Linus Torvalds
2003-10-01 20:58     ` bill davidsen
2003-10-01 23:42     ` Albert Cahalan
2003-10-02  0:38       ` Linus Torvalds
2003-10-02  0:57         ` Albert Cahalan
2003-10-02  3:35     ` Ulrich Drepper
2003-10-02  4:12       ` Albert Cahalan
2003-10-02  4:58         ` Ulrich Drepper
2003-10-02 13:48           ` Albert Cahalan
2003-10-02 17:30             ` Ulrich Drepper
2003-10-03  0:03               ` Albert Cahalan
2003-10-03  0:40                 ` Linus Torvalds
2003-10-03  2:53                   ` Jamie Lokier
2003-10-06  4:54                     ` Mike Fedyk
2003-10-06  2:52                   ` bill davidsen
2003-10-07 23:08                   ` Robert White
2003-10-07 22:46                 ` Robert White
2003-10-07 23:25                   ` Linus Torvalds
2003-10-08  0:41                     ` Robert White
2003-10-08  0:54                       ` Linus Torvalds [this message]
2003-10-08  2:31                         ` Robert White
2003-10-08  2:39                           ` David Lang
2003-10-08  2:59                             ` Robert White
2003-10-09 18:25                               ` bill davidsen
2003-10-08  2:47                           ` Who changed /proc/<pid>/ in 2.6.0-test5-bk9? (SIGPIPE?) Robert White
2003-10-08  2:57                             ` Linus Torvalds
2003-10-08  4:01                               ` Robert White
2003-10-08  4:08                                 ` Linus Torvalds
2003-10-08 10:47                         ` Who changed /proc/<pid>/ in 2.6.0-test5-bk9? bert hubert
2003-10-08 19:12                           ` Ulrich Drepper
2003-10-09 18:43                             ` bill davidsen
2003-10-08 21:54                           ` Robert White
2003-10-09 18:12                         ` bill davidsen
2003-10-10  4:39                           ` Jamie Lokier
2003-10-09 17:59                       ` bill davidsen
2003-10-11  3:02                       ` Here is a case that proves my previous position wrong regurading CLONE_THREAD and CLONE_FILES Robert White
2003-10-11  3:48                         ` viro
2003-10-12 11:41                         ` Jamie Lokier
2003-10-02  8:46       ` Who changed /proc/<pid>/ in 2.6.0-test5-bk9? Miquel van Smoorenburg
2003-10-02 22:35         ` Jamie Lokier
2003-10-02 23:43           ` Miquel van Smoorenburg
2003-10-06  2:57         ` bill davidsen
2003-10-02  3:38     ` Ulrich Drepper

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