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From: Johan Hovold <johan@kernel.org>
To: Maarten Brock <m.brock@vanmierlo.com>
Cc: Mychaela Falconia <mychaela.falconia@gmail.com>,
	Greg Kroah-Hartman <gregkh@linuxfoundation.org>,
	Johan Hovold <johan@kernel.org>,
	Jiri Slaby <jirislaby@kernel.org>,
	"Mychaela N . Falconia" <falcon@freecalypso.org>,
	linux-serial@vger.kernel.org, linux-usb@vger.kernel.org,
	linux-kernel@vger.kernel.org
Subject: Re: [PATCH v2 0/7] tty: add flag to suppress ready signalling on open
Date: Fri, 11 Dec 2020 11:41:46 +0100	[thread overview]
Message-ID: <X9NM6i5mRTUTFKr9@localhost> (raw)
In-Reply-To: <6b81cca21561305b55ba8f019b78da28@vanmierlo.com>

On Thu, Dec 10, 2020 at 11:41:24AM +0100, Maarten Brock wrote:
> Hello Mychaela,
> 
> On 2020-12-09 23:49, Mychaela Falconia wrote:

> > But the problem is that the current status quo is fundamentally broken
> > for those hardware devices in which DTR and/or RTS have been repurposed
> > for something other than modem and flow control.  Right now whenever a
> > "cold" (never previously opened) serial port is opened for the first
> > time, that open action immediately and unstoppably asserts both DTR
> > and RTS hardware outputs, without giving userspace any opportunity to
> > say "no, please don't do it".  Yes, this behaviour is codified in a
> > bunch of standards that ultimately trace back to 1970s Original UNIX,
> > but just because it is a standard does not make it right - this
> > Unix/POSIX/Linux "standard" serial port behaviour is a bug, not a
> > feature.
> 
> I agree. And an application not configuring the required handshakes, but
> still relying on them is an equal bug.

Ehh, don't be silly. Relying on having Linux assert DTR/RTS on open is
in no way a bug; it's the standard behaviour that we must continue to
support unless explicitly overridden. Period.

> > But if there exist some custom hw devices out there that are in the
> > same predicament as my DUART28 adapter, but are different in that they
> > are classic old-fashioned RS-232 rather than integrated USB-serial,
> > with no place to assign a custom USB ID, *then* we need a non-USB-ID-
> > dependent solution such as Johan's sysfs attribute or O_DIRECT.
> 
> Any device with a classic old-fashioned RS-232 has probably already
> solved this in another way or is accepted as not working on Linux.
> 
> And then there is also the device tree (overlay?) through which a quirk
> like this can be communicated to the kernel driver. Not sure if this
> could help for a plug-and-play device like on USB.

Not every system use devicetree and no, it doesn't help with
hotpluggable buses either.

Johan

      parent reply	other threads:[~2020-12-11 10:43 UTC|newest]

Thread overview: 30+ messages / expand[flat|nested]  mbox.gz  Atom feed  top
2020-12-02 11:39 [PATCH v2 0/7] tty: add flag to suppress ready signalling on open Johan Hovold
2020-12-02 11:39 ` [PATCH v2 1/7] tty: use assign_bit() in port-flag accessors Johan Hovold
2020-12-02 11:39 ` [PATCH v2 2/7] tty: use const parameters " Johan Hovold
2020-12-02 11:39 ` [PATCH v2 3/7] tty: add port flag to suppress ready signalling on open Johan Hovold
2020-12-02 11:39 ` [PATCH v2 4/7] serial: core: add sysfs attribute " Johan Hovold
2020-12-02 11:39 ` [PATCH v2 5/7] USB: serial: " Johan Hovold
2020-12-02 11:39 ` [PATCH v2 6/7] USB: serial: ftdi_sio: pass port to quirk port_probe functions Johan Hovold
2020-12-02 11:39 ` [PATCH v2 7/7] USB: serial: ftdi_sio: add support for FreeCalypso DUART28C adapter Johan Hovold
2020-12-02 18:07 ` [PATCH v2 0/7] tty: add flag to suppress ready signalling on open Mychaela Falconia
2020-12-03  9:21   ` Johan Hovold
2020-12-09 14:30 ` Greg Kroah-Hartman
2020-12-09 15:10   ` Johan Hovold
2020-12-09 22:49   ` Mychaela Falconia
2020-12-10  9:06     ` Greg Kroah-Hartman
2020-12-10 10:41     ` Maarten Brock
2020-12-10 10:50       ` Greg Kroah-Hartman
2020-12-10 12:05         ` Maarten Brock
2020-12-10 13:01           ` Greg Kroah-Hartman
2020-12-10 18:59             ` Mychaela Falconia
2020-12-11  8:46               ` Jiri Slaby
2020-12-11 16:08                 ` Greg Kroah-Hartman
2020-12-11 15:51               ` Maarten Brock
2020-12-11 16:08               ` Greg Kroah-Hartman
2020-12-14 14:21               ` Johan Hovold
2020-12-18 18:03                 ` Mychaela Falconia
2021-01-07 15:25                   ` Greg Kroah-Hartman
     [not found]                   ` <YBPxG+i/ZLP8/wg1@hovoldconsulting.com>
2021-01-31  0:18                     ` Mychaela Falconia
2021-01-31  5:24                       ` Greg Kroah-Hartman
2020-12-11 10:46             ` Johan Hovold
2020-12-11 10:41       ` Johan Hovold [this message]

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