From: Andy Lutomirski <luto@kernel.org>
To: Greg KH <greg@kroah.com>
Cc: Andy Lutomirski <luto@kernel.org>,
David Howells <dhowells@redhat.com>,
Linus Torvalds <torvalds@linux-foundation.org>,
linux-man <linux-man@vger.kernel.org>,
Linux API <linux-api@vger.kernel.org>,
James Morris <jmorris@namei.org>,
LKML <linux-kernel@vger.kernel.org>,
LSM List <linux-security-module@vger.kernel.org>
Subject: Re: [PATCH 24/24] debugfs: Restrict debugfs when the kernel is locked down
Date: Thu, 12 Apr 2018 07:19:35 -0700 [thread overview]
Message-ID: <CALCETrVm8c0dN=kymg=5-TQEWbL_zk9yCr4Bv4PKJXNC=6j=Fw@mail.gmail.com> (raw)
In-Reply-To: <20180412082313.GA6054@kroah.com>
On Thu, Apr 12, 2018 at 1:23 AM, Greg KH <greg@kroah.com> wrote:
> On Wed, Apr 11, 2018 at 07:54:12PM -0700, Andy Lutomirski wrote:
>> On Wed, Apr 11, 2018 at 1:33 PM, Greg KH <greg@kroah.com> wrote:
>> > On Wed, Apr 11, 2018 at 09:09:16PM +0100, David Howells wrote:
>> >> Greg KH <greg@kroah.com> wrote:
>> >>
>> >> > Why not just disable debugfs entirely? This half-hearted way to sorta
>> >> > lock it down is odd, it is meant to not be there at all, nothing in your
>> >> > normal system should ever depend on it.
>> >> >
>> >> > So again just don't allow it to be mounted at all, much simpler and more
>> >> > obvious as to what is going on.
>> >>
>> >> Yeah, I agree - and then I got complaints because it seems that it's been
>> >> abused to allow drivers and userspace components to communicate.
>> >
>> > With in-kernel code? Please let me know and I'll go fix it up to not
>> > allow that, as that is not ok.
>> >
>> > I do know of some bad examples of out-of-tree code abusing debugfs to do
>> > crazy things (battery level monitoring?), but that's their own fault...
>> >
>> > debugfs is for DEBUGGING! For anything you all feel should be "secure",
>> > then just disable it entirely.
>> >
>>
>> Debugfs is very, very useful for, ahem, debugging. I really think
>> this is an example of why we should split lockdown into the read and
>> write varieties and allow mounting and reading debugfs when only write
>> is locked down.
>
> Ok, but be sure that there are no "secrets" in those debugging files if
> you really buy into the whole "lock down" mess...
>
> Really, it's easier to just disable the whole thing.
>
I mostly agree with your sentiment. I'm saying that, for most uses, I
*don't* buy into the idea that a normal secure-boot-supporting distro
should block debugfs. I sometimes like to ask people who report
problems to send me the contents of such-and-such file in debugfs, and
I think it should keep working. Blocking write access to debugfs is
mostly sensible for a lockdown system, but blocking read only makes
sense if you're worried about straight-up bugs or if you think that
debugfs contains protection-worthy secrets.
What I want to see is:
lockdown=protect_integrity: debugfs is read-only, bpf and perf are
unrestricted, iopl and ioperm are disabled, etc.
lockdown=protect_integrity_and_secrecy: debugfs is gone, bpf and perf
are restricted, plus all the restrictions from
lockdown=protect_integrity
Distros should strongly prefer lockdown=protect_integrity (or
lockdown=off) by default. lockdown=protect_integrity_and_secrecy is
for custom setups, embedded applications, etc.
--Andy
next prev parent reply other threads:[~2018-04-12 14:19 UTC|newest]
Thread overview: 63+ messages / expand[flat|nested] mbox.gz Atom feed top
2018-04-11 16:24 [PATCH 00/24] security: Add kernel lockdown David Howells
2018-04-11 16:24 ` [PATCH 01/24] Add the ability to lock down access to the running kernel image David Howells
2018-04-11 16:44 ` Jann Horn
2018-04-11 17:37 ` Randy Dunlap
2018-04-11 18:50 ` Miguel Ojeda
2018-04-11 19:56 ` Greg KH
2018-04-11 17:49 ` David Howells
2018-04-11 18:09 ` Linus Torvalds
2018-04-11 18:35 ` Justin Forbes
2018-04-11 21:05 ` Jordan Glover
2018-04-11 22:38 ` Linus Torvalds
2018-04-12 13:09 ` Justin Forbes
2018-04-12 16:52 ` Linus Torvalds
2018-04-12 2:57 ` Andy Lutomirski
2018-04-11 16:24 ` [PATCH 02/24] Add a SysRq option to lift kernel lockdown David Howells
2018-04-11 17:05 ` Jann Horn
2018-04-13 20:22 ` Pavel Machek
2018-04-11 16:24 ` [PATCH 03/24] ima: require secure_boot rules in lockdown mode David Howells
2018-04-11 16:25 ` [PATCH 04/24] Enforce module signatures if the kernel is locked down David Howells
2018-04-11 16:25 ` [PATCH 05/24] Restrict /dev/{mem, kmem, port} when " David Howells
2018-04-11 16:25 ` [PATCH 06/24] kexec_load: Disable at runtime if " David Howells
2018-04-11 19:00 ` Eric W. Biederman
2018-04-11 20:09 ` Mimi Zohar
2018-04-12 11:38 ` Mimi Zohar
2018-04-11 20:05 ` David Howells
2018-04-11 16:25 ` [PATCH 07/24] hibernate: Disable when " David Howells
2018-04-13 20:22 ` Pavel Machek
2018-04-19 14:38 ` David Howells
2018-04-22 14:34 ` Andy Lutomirski
2018-04-26 7:26 ` Pavel Machek
2018-04-26 7:34 ` Rafael J. Wysocki
2018-04-26 8:20 ` Jiri Kosina
2018-05-23 8:46 ` joeyli
2018-04-11 16:25 ` [PATCH 08/24] uswsusp: " David Howells
2018-04-11 16:25 ` [PATCH 09/24] PCI: Lock down BAR access " David Howells
2018-04-11 16:25 ` [PATCH 10/24] x86: Lock down IO port " David Howells
2018-04-11 16:25 ` [PATCH 11/24] x86/msr: Restrict MSR " David Howells
2018-04-11 16:25 ` [PATCH 12/24] ACPI: Limit access to custom_method " David Howells
2018-04-11 16:26 ` [PATCH 13/24] acpi: Ignore acpi_rsdp kernel param when the kernel has been " David Howells
2018-04-11 16:26 ` [PATCH 14/24] acpi: Disable ACPI table override if the kernel is " David Howells
2018-04-11 16:26 ` [PATCH 15/24] acpi: Disable APEI error injection " David Howells
2018-04-11 16:26 ` [PATCH 16/24] Prohibit PCMCIA CIS storage when " David Howells
2018-04-11 16:26 ` [PATCH 17/24] Lock down TIOCSSERIAL David Howells
2018-04-11 16:26 ` [PATCH 18/24] Lock down module params that specify hardware parameters (eg. ioport) David Howells
2018-04-11 17:22 ` Randy Dunlap
2018-04-11 16:26 ` [PATCH 19/24] x86/mmiotrace: Lock down the testmmiotrace module David Howells
2018-04-11 16:26 ` [PATCH 20/24] Lock down /proc/kcore David Howells
2018-04-11 16:26 ` [PATCH 21/24] Lock down kprobes David Howells
2018-04-11 16:27 ` [PATCH 22/24] bpf: Restrict kernel image access functions when the kernel is locked down David Howells
2018-04-11 16:27 ` [PATCH 23/24] Lock down perf David Howells
2018-04-11 16:27 ` [PATCH 24/24] debugfs: Restrict debugfs when the kernel is locked down David Howells
2018-04-11 17:26 ` Randy Dunlap
2018-04-11 18:50 ` Eric W. Biederman
2018-04-11 19:54 ` Greg KH
2018-04-11 20:08 ` David Howells
2018-04-11 20:09 ` David Howells
2018-04-11 20:33 ` Greg KH
2018-04-12 2:54 ` Andy Lutomirski
2018-04-12 8:23 ` Greg KH
2018-04-12 14:19 ` Andy Lutomirski [this message]
2018-04-13 20:22 ` Pavel Machek
2018-04-19 14:35 ` David Howells
2018-05-10 11:01 ` Pavel Machek
Reply instructions:
You may reply publicly to this message via plain-text email
using any one of the following methods:
* Save the following mbox file, import it into your mail client,
and reply-to-all from there: mbox
Avoid top-posting and favor interleaved quoting:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Posting_style#Interleaved_style
* Reply using the --to, --cc, and --in-reply-to
switches of git-send-email(1):
git send-email \
--in-reply-to='CALCETrVm8c0dN=kymg=5-TQEWbL_zk9yCr4Bv4PKJXNC=6j=Fw@mail.gmail.com' \
--to=luto@kernel.org \
--cc=dhowells@redhat.com \
--cc=greg@kroah.com \
--cc=jmorris@namei.org \
--cc=linux-api@vger.kernel.org \
--cc=linux-kernel@vger.kernel.org \
--cc=linux-man@vger.kernel.org \
--cc=linux-security-module@vger.kernel.org \
--cc=torvalds@linux-foundation.org \
/path/to/YOUR_REPLY
https://kernel.org/pub/software/scm/git/docs/git-send-email.html
* If your mail client supports setting the In-Reply-To header
via mailto: links, try the mailto: link
Be sure your reply has a Subject: header at the top and a blank line
before the message body.
This is a public inbox, see mirroring instructions
for how to clone and mirror all data and code used for this inbox;
as well as URLs for NNTP newsgroup(s).