Re: Fwd: [Bug 201647] New: Intel Wireless card 3165 does not get detected but bluetooth works

Re: Fwd: [Bug 201647] New: Intel Wireless card 3165 does not get detected but bluetooth works

[Bjorn Helgaas]

[+cc Emmanuel, LKML]

On Fri, Nov 09, 2018 at 03:43:06PM -0600, Bjorn Helgaas wrote:
> ---------- Forwarded message ---------
> From: <bugzilla-daemon@bugzilla.kernel.org>
> Date: Fri, Nov 9, 2018 at 4:10 AM
> Subject: [Bug 201647] New: Intel Wireless card 3165 does not get
> detected but bluetooth works
> 
> https://bugzilla.kernel.org/show_bug.cgi?id=201647
> 
>             Bug ID: 201647
>            Summary: Intel Wireless card 3165 does not get detected but
>                     bluetooth works
>            Product: Drivers
>            Version: 2.5
>     Kernel Version: 4.19.1
>           Hardware: Intel
>                 OS: Linux
>               Tree: Mainline
>             Status: NEW
>           Severity: high
>           Priority: P1
>          Component: PCI
>           Assignee: drivers_pci@kernel-bugs.osdl.org
>           Reporter: Mertarg10@gmail.com
>         Regression: No
> 
> This bug affects most of the devices with a Celeron N4000 and an
> Intel wifi 3165 Ac adapter.
> 
> When using Linux wifi is not working however, Bluetooth is working
> fine.  Also, Bluetooth part of this chip is connected via btusb and
> the wifi part of this chip is connected via PCIe.

Can you attach a screenshot of the Windows 10 device manager info for
the wifi adapter to the bugzilla?  If you can get a raw hex dump of
its config space, that would be awesome.

Also attach a copy of your kernel .config file (typically in /boot/).

My only guess is that maybe the system keeps wifi completely powered
down and uses hotplug to add it when needed.  [1] mentions wifi being
on pcibus 1 under Windows.  Your lspci does show bridge 00:13.0
leading to bus 01, but Linux doesn't find any devices on bus 01.

Hotplug could be done via either acpiphp (ACPI mediated hotplug) or
pciehp (native PCIe hotplug).  Your dmesg shows you do have acpiphp.

I can't tell about pciehp (your .config will show that), but I think
pciehp will only claim bridges where SltCap contains HotPlug+, and
yours shows HotPlug-, so I don't think pciehp will do anything on your
system.

Even if the system does use hotplug, I don't know what mechanism the
OS would use to wake up the device, since we don't know it even
exists.  I guess there could be some magic switch accessible via USB.
But if that were the case, I'm sure Emmanuel would know about it.

[1] https://www.chinamobilemag.de/forum/hardware/3779-teclast-f5-linux-erkennt-kein-wlan-intel-3165-in-ubuntu-18-04-1.html?start=10

RE: Fwd: [Bug 201647] New: Intel Wireless card 3165 does not get detected but bluetooth works

[Grumbach, Emmanuel]

> 
> [+cc Emmanuel, LKML]
> 
> On Fri, Nov 09, 2018 at 03:43:06PM -0600, Bjorn Helgaas wrote:
> > ---------- Forwarded message ---------
> > From: <bugzilla-daemon@bugzilla.kernel.org>
> > Date: Fri, Nov 9, 2018 at 4:10 AM
> > Subject: [Bug 201647] New: Intel Wireless card 3165 does not get
> > detected but bluetooth works
> >
> > https://bugzilla.kernel.org/show_bug.cgi?id=201647
> >
> >             Bug ID: 201647
> >            Summary: Intel Wireless card 3165 does not get detected but
> >                     bluetooth works
> >            Product: Drivers
> >            Version: 2.5
> >     Kernel Version: 4.19.1
> >           Hardware: Intel
> >                 OS: Linux
> >               Tree: Mainline
> >             Status: NEW
> >           Severity: high
> >           Priority: P1
> >          Component: PCI
> >           Assignee: drivers_pci@kernel-bugs.osdl.org
> >           Reporter: Mertarg10@gmail.com
> >         Regression: No
> >
> > This bug affects most of the devices with a Celeron N4000 and an Intel
> > wifi 3165 Ac adapter.
> >
> > When using Linux wifi is not working however, Bluetooth is working
> > fine.  Also, Bluetooth part of this chip is connected via btusb and
> > the wifi part of this chip is connected via PCIe.
> 
> Can you attach a screenshot of the Windows 10 device manager info for the
> wifi adapter to the bugzilla?  If you can get a raw hex dump of its config
> space, that would be awesome.
> 
> Also attach a copy of your kernel .config file (typically in /boot/).
> 
> My only guess is that maybe the system keeps wifi completely powered
> down and uses hotplug to add it when needed.  [1] mentions wifi being on
> pcibus 1 under Windows.  Your lspci does show bridge 00:13.0 leading to bus
> 01, but Linux doesn't find any devices on bus 01.
> 
> Hotplug could be done via either acpiphp (ACPI mediated hotplug) or pciehp
> (native PCIe hotplug).  Your dmesg shows you do have acpiphp.
> 
> I can't tell about pciehp (your .config will show that), but I think pciehp will
> only claim bridges where SltCap contains HotPlug+, and yours shows HotPlug-
> , so I don't think pciehp will do anything on your system.
> 
> Even if the system does use hotplug, I don't know what mechanism the OS
> would use to wake up the device, since we don't know it even exists.  I guess
> there could be some magic switch accessible via USB.
> But if that were the case, I'm sure Emmanuel would know about it.
> 

Hm... Don't be so sure... :)
I don't think we have anything as fancy as this.
I guess you can try to dig into the BIOS settings?
I have heard of such a switch that would make the device disappear.

Re: Fwd: [Bug 201647] New: Intel Wireless card 3165 does not get detected but bluetooth works

[Bjorn Helgaas]

On Sun, Dec 02, 2018 at 06:57:35AM +0000, Grumbach, Emmanuel wrote:
> > On Fri, Nov 09, 2018 at 03:43:06PM -0600, Bjorn Helgaas wrote:
> > > ---------- Forwarded message ---------
> > > From: <bugzilla-daemon@bugzilla.kernel.org>
> > > Date: Fri, Nov 9, 2018 at 4:10 AM
> > > Subject: [Bug 201647] New: Intel Wireless card 3165 does not get
> > > detected but bluetooth works
> > >
> > > https://bugzilla.kernel.org/show_bug.cgi?id=201647
> > >
> > >             Bug ID: 201647
> > >            Summary: Intel Wireless card 3165 does not get detected but
> > >                     bluetooth works
> > >            Product: Drivers
> > >            Version: 2.5
> > >     Kernel Version: 4.19.1
> > >           Hardware: Intel
> > >                 OS: Linux
> > >               Tree: Mainline
> > >             Status: NEW
> > >           Severity: high
> > >           Priority: P1
> > >          Component: PCI
> > >           Assignee: drivers_pci@kernel-bugs.osdl.org
> > >           Reporter: Mertarg10@gmail.com
> > >         Regression: No
> > >
> > > This bug affects most of the devices with a Celeron N4000 and an Intel
> > > wifi 3165 Ac adapter.
> > >
> > > When using Linux wifi is not working however, Bluetooth is working
> > > fine.  Also, Bluetooth part of this chip is connected via btusb and
> > > the wifi part of this chip is connected via PCIe.
> > 
> > Can you attach a screenshot of the Windows 10 device manager info for the
> > wifi adapter to the bugzilla?  If you can get a raw hex dump of its config
> > space, that would be awesome.
> > 
> > Also attach a copy of your kernel .config file (typically in /boot/).
> > 
> > My only guess is that maybe the system keeps wifi completely powered
> > down and uses hotplug to add it when needed.  [1] mentions wifi being on
> > pcibus 1 under Windows.  Your lspci does show bridge 00:13.0 leading to bus
> > 01, but Linux doesn't find any devices on bus 01.
> > 
> > Hotplug could be done via either acpiphp (ACPI mediated hotplug) or pciehp
> > (native PCIe hotplug).  Your dmesg shows you do have acpiphp.
> > 
> > I can't tell about pciehp (your .config will show that), but I think pciehp will
> > only claim bridges where SltCap contains HotPlug+, and yours shows HotPlug-
> > , so I don't think pciehp will do anything on your system.
> > 
> > Even if the system does use hotplug, I don't know what mechanism the OS
> > would use to wake up the device, since we don't know it even exists.  I guess
> > there could be some magic switch accessible via USB.
> > But if that were the case, I'm sure Emmanuel would know about it.
> 
> Hm... Don't be so sure... :)
> I don't think we have anything as fancy as this.
> I guess you can try to dig into the BIOS settings?
> I have heard of such a switch that would make the device disappear.

It's worth looking, but I don't understand how a BIOS switch would
solve this problem.  I assume that with the same BIOS settings,
Windows works and Linux fails.

Maybe there would be a clue in an acpidump from affected machines,
e.g., maybe we'd see some kind of ACPI hotplug notification.  That
seems like a long shot because we do have acpiphp in the kernel, and
it *should* be handling such notifications, but it could always be
broken.

The Windows device manager info (requested above) would be
interesting.

Bjorn

RE: Fwd: [Bug 201647] New: Intel Wireless card 3165 does not get detected but bluetooth works

[Grumbach, Emmanuel]

> > > >
> > > > https://bugzilla.kernel.org/show_bug.cgi?id=201647
> > > >
> > > >             Bug ID: 201647
> > > >            Summary: Intel Wireless card 3165 does not get detected but
> > > >                     bluetooth works
> > > >            Product: Drivers
> > > >            Version: 2.5
> > > >     Kernel Version: 4.19.1
> > > >           Hardware: Intel
> > > >                 OS: Linux
> > > >               Tree: Mainline
> > > >             Status: NEW
> > > >           Severity: high
> > > >           Priority: P1
> > > >          Component: PCI
> > > >           Assignee: drivers_pci@kernel-bugs.osdl.org
> > > >           Reporter: Mertarg10@gmail.com
> > > >         Regression: No
> > > >
> > > > This bug affects most of the devices with a Celeron N4000 and an
> > > > Intel wifi 3165 Ac adapter.
> > > >
> > > > When using Linux wifi is not working however, Bluetooth is working
> > > > fine.  Also, Bluetooth part of this chip is connected via btusb
> > > > and the wifi part of this chip is connected via PCIe.
> > >
> > > Can you attach a screenshot of the Windows 10 device manager info
> > > for the wifi adapter to the bugzilla?  If you can get a raw hex dump
> > > of its config space, that would be awesome.
> > >
> > > Also attach a copy of your kernel .config file (typically in /boot/).
> > >
> > > My only guess is that maybe the system keeps wifi completely powered
> > > down and uses hotplug to add it when needed.  [1] mentions wifi
> > > being on pcibus 1 under Windows.  Your lspci does show bridge
> > > 00:13.0 leading to bus 01, but Linux doesn't find any devices on bus 01.
> > >
> > > Hotplug could be done via either acpiphp (ACPI mediated hotplug) or
> > > pciehp (native PCIe hotplug).  Your dmesg shows you do have acpiphp.
> > >
> > > I can't tell about pciehp (your .config will show that), but I think
> > > pciehp will only claim bridges where SltCap contains HotPlug+, and
> > > yours shows HotPlug- , so I don't think pciehp will do anything on your
> system.
> > >
> > > Even if the system does use hotplug, I don't know what mechanism the
> > > OS would use to wake up the device, since we don't know it even
> > > exists.  I guess there could be some magic switch accessible via USB.
> > > But if that were the case, I'm sure Emmanuel would know about it.
> >
> > Hm... Don't be so sure... :)
> > I don't think we have anything as fancy as this.
> > I guess you can try to dig into the BIOS settings?
> > I have heard of such a switch that would make the device disappear.
> 
> It's worth looking, but I don't understand how a BIOS switch would solve this
> problem.  I assume that with the same BIOS settings, Windows works and
> Linux fails.

I guess I had a typo there... I have *not* heard of such a switch.

> 
> Maybe there would be a clue in an acpidump from affected machines, e.g.,
> maybe we'd see some kind of ACPI hotplug notification.  That seems like a
> long shot because we do have acpiphp in the kernel, and it *should* be
> handling such notifications, but it could always be broken.
> 
> The Windows device manager info (requested above) would be interesting.
> 
Indeed.
FWIW: I saw another problem like this with a 9650 device.

PS: PCI folks don't use bugzilla's anymore? It's all over the mailing list?

Re: Fwd: [Bug 201647] New: Intel Wireless card 3165 does not get detected but bluetooth works

[Bjorn Helgaas]

On Tue, Dec 11, 2018 at 06:35:20AM +0000, Grumbach, Emmanuel wrote:
> > > > > https://bugzilla.kernel.org/show_bug.cgi?id=201647

> > The Windows device manager info (requested above) would be interesting.

I *thought* I had requested it, but I can't find that.  Mert, thanks
for the screenshot you attached.  Would you mind also capturing the
other tabs from device manager?  I'm really looking for a hex dump of
the config space, which should be at least 256 bytes.  I *think*
that's available somewhere in device manager.  If not, AIDA64
(https://www.aida64.com/downloads) should be able to get it.

> FWIW: I saw another problem like this with a 9650 device.

Do you have a pointer to any info about this 9650 issue?  Maybe that
would have a clue.

> PS: PCI folks don't use bugzilla's anymore? It's all over the mailing list?

Personally, I use bugzilla as a convenient place to archive artifacts
like logs, screenshots, etc.  But it doesn't seem as convenient for
conversations as the mailing list, and it doesn't have the visibility
that the list does.

Bjorn

RE: Fwd: [Bug 201647] New: Intel Wireless card 3165 does not get detected but bluetooth works

[Grumbach, Emmanuel]

[-- Attachment #1: Type: text/plain, Size: 1411 bytes --]

+ the person who reported the problem with 9560

> 
> On Tue, Dec 11, 2018 at 06:35:20AM +0000, Grumbach, Emmanuel wrote:
> > > > > > https://bugzilla.kernel.org/show_bug.cgi?id=201647
> 
> > > The Windows device manager info (requested above) would be
> interesting.
> 
> I *thought* I had requested it, but I can't find that.  Mert, thanks for the
> screenshot you attached.  Would you mind also capturing the other tabs
> from device manager?  I'm really looking for a hex dump of the config space,
> which should be at least 256 bytes.  I *think* that's available somewhere in
> device manager.  If not, AIDA64
> (https://www.aida64.com/downloads) should be able to get it.
> 
> > FWIW: I saw another problem like this with a 9650 device.
> 
> Do you have a pointer to any info about this 9650 issue?  Maybe that would
> have a clue.

I added him here so that you can ask whatever you like :)
The story is the same. I am attaching a picture I got from the reporter.
I can confirm that this device ID / subdevice ID is supported by the linux driver.

> 
> > PS: PCI folks don't use bugzilla's anymore? It's all over the mailing list?
> 
> Personally, I use bugzilla as a convenient place to archive artifacts like logs,
> screenshots, etc.  But it doesn't seem as convenient for conversations as the
> mailing list, and it doesn't have the visibility that the list does.
> 


[-- Attachment #2: win10.jpg --]
[-- Type: image/jpeg, Size: 130054 bytes --]

Re: Fwd: [Bug 201647] New: Intel Wireless card 3165 does not get detected but bluetooth works

[Bjorn Helgaas]

On Tue, Dec 11, 2018 at 04:32:25PM +0000, Grumbach, Emmanuel wrote:
> > On Tue, Dec 11, 2018 at 06:35:20AM +0000, Grumbach, Emmanuel wrote:
> > > > > > > https://bugzilla.kernel.org/show_bug.cgi?id=201647
> > 
> > > FWIW: I saw another problem like this with a 9650 device.
> > 
> > Do you have a pointer to any info about this 9650 issue?  Maybe that would
> > have a clue.
> 
> I added him here so that you can ask whatever you like :)
> The story is the same. I am attaching a picture I got from the reporter.
> I can confirm that this device ID / subdevice ID is supported by the linux driver.

Was there a resolution, i.e., if somebody figured out how to make the
9650 wifi work, maybe a similar solution would work for the 3165?

RE: Fwd: [Bug 201647] New: Intel Wireless card 3165 does not get detected but bluetooth works

[Grumbach, Emmanuel]

> 
> On Tue, Dec 11, 2018 at 04:32:25PM +0000, Grumbach, Emmanuel wrote:
> > > On Tue, Dec 11, 2018 at 06:35:20AM +0000, Grumbach, Emmanuel wrote:
> > > > > > > > https://bugzilla.kernel.org/show_bug.cgi?id=201647
> > >
> > > > FWIW: I saw another problem like this with a 9650 device.
> > >
> > > Do you have a pointer to any info about this 9650 issue?  Maybe that
> > > would have a clue.
> >
> > I added him here so that you can ask whatever you like :) The story is
> > the same. I am attaching a picture I got from the reporter.
> > I can confirm that this device ID / subdevice ID is supported by the linux
> driver.
> 
> Was there a resolution, i.e., if somebody figured out how to make the
> 9650 wifi work, maybe a similar solution would work for the 3165?

Unfortunately not, I am stuck there at the exact same point.
No Wifi device shows up in lspci...

Re: Fwd: [Bug 201647] New: Intel Wireless card 3165 does not get detected but bluetooth works

[Bjorn Helgaas]

On Tue, Dec 11, 2018 at 06:31:47PM +0000, Grumbach, Emmanuel wrote:
> > On Tue, Dec 11, 2018 at 04:32:25PM +0000, Grumbach, Emmanuel wrote:
> > > > On Tue, Dec 11, 2018 at 06:35:20AM +0000, Grumbach, Emmanuel wrote:
> > > > > > > > > https://bugzilla.kernel.org/show_bug.cgi?id=201647
> > > >
> > > > > FWIW: I saw another problem like this with a 9650 device.
> > > >
> > > > Do you have a pointer to any info about this 9650 issue?  Maybe that
> > > > would have a clue.
> > >
> > > I added him here so that you can ask whatever you like :) The story is
> > > the same. I am attaching a picture I got from the reporter.
> > > I can confirm that this device ID / subdevice ID is supported by the linux
> > driver.
> > 
> > Was there a resolution, i.e., if somebody figured out how to make the
> > 9650 wifi work, maybe a similar solution would work for the 3165?
> 
> Unfortunately not, I am stuck there at the exact same point.
> No Wifi device shows up in lspci...

Is there a public spec?  My patience for reverse engineering things
that are documented somewhere that I'm not allowed to see is pretty
limited.  Presumably *you* should be able to see the spec, since this
is an Intel device and you have an @intel.com address?

From what we can tell so far, I don't *think* this is a PCI issue.  If
the device doesn't respond to a PCI config access, the PCI core can't
really be expected to do anything about it.

Bjorn

RE: Fwd: [Bug 201647] New: Intel Wireless card 3165 does not get detected but bluetooth works

[Grumbach, Emmanuel]

> 
> On Tue, Dec 11, 2018 at 06:31:47PM +0000, Grumbach, Emmanuel wrote:
> > > On Tue, Dec 11, 2018 at 04:32:25PM +0000, Grumbach, Emmanuel wrote:
> > > > > On Tue, Dec 11, 2018 at 06:35:20AM +0000, Grumbach, Emmanuel
> wrote:
> > > > > > > > > > https://bugzilla.kernel.org/show_bug.cgi?id=201647
> > > > >
> > > > > > FWIW: I saw another problem like this with a 9650 device.
> > > > >
> > > > > Do you have a pointer to any info about this 9650 issue?  Maybe
> > > > > that would have a clue.
> > > >
> > > > I added him here so that you can ask whatever you like :) The
> > > > story is the same. I am attaching a picture I got from the reporter.
> > > > I can confirm that this device ID / subdevice ID is supported by
> > > > the linux
> > > driver.
> > >
> > > Was there a resolution, i.e., if somebody figured out how to make
> > > the
> > > 9650 wifi work, maybe a similar solution would work for the 3165?
> >
> > Unfortunately not, I am stuck there at the exact same point.
> > No Wifi device shows up in lspci...
> 
> Is there a public spec?  My patience for reverse engineering things that are
> documented somewhere that I'm not allowed to see is pretty limited.
> Presumably *you* should be able to see the spec, since this is an Intel device
> and you have an @intel.com address?

Ok, I start to understand. So no, no public spec. I am an Intel employee,
I used to maintain the WiFi driver (iwlwifi). I don't know much about PCI though.
I am definitely not asking you to reverse engineer our device :)
I can try to ask internally what could be going on.
The reason I haven't done so so far and reached out to you is because I am not
aware about switches that we need to toggle to make the device magically
show up. So I thought it'd be related to the PCI core, which take me to the next point...

> 
> From what we can tell so far, I don't *think* this is a PCI issue.  If the device
> doesn't respond to a PCI config access, the PCI core can't really be expected
> to do anything about it.

Ok, thanks. So I understand from you that you didn't see any weird log from the
PCI core saying: "I can see this device, but I can't enumerate it because XYZ".
I tried to look for such a thing but couldn't.

From this point, I guess I can't do much either. I'll try to get info internally.

Re: Fwd: [Bug 201647] New: Intel Wireless card 3165 does not get detected but bluetooth works

[Bjorn Helgaas]

On Tue, Dec 11, 2018 at 06:51:14PM +0000, Grumbach, Emmanuel wrote:
> > 
> > On Tue, Dec 11, 2018 at 06:31:47PM +0000, Grumbach, Emmanuel wrote:
> > > > On Tue, Dec 11, 2018 at 04:32:25PM +0000, Grumbach, Emmanuel wrote:
> > > > > > On Tue, Dec 11, 2018 at 06:35:20AM +0000, Grumbach, Emmanuel
> > wrote:
> > > > > > > > > > > https://bugzilla.kernel.org/show_bug.cgi?id=201647
> > > > > >
> > > > > > > FWIW: I saw another problem like this with a 9650 device.
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Do you have a pointer to any info about this 9650 issue?  Maybe
> > > > > > that would have a clue.
> > > > >
> > > > > I added him here so that you can ask whatever you like :) The
> > > > > story is the same. I am attaching a picture I got from the reporter.
> > > > > I can confirm that this device ID / subdevice ID is supported by
> > > > > the linux
> > > > driver.
> > > >
> > > > Was there a resolution, i.e., if somebody figured out how to make
> > > > the
> > > > 9650 wifi work, maybe a similar solution would work for the 3165?
> > >
> > > Unfortunately not, I am stuck there at the exact same point.  No
> > > Wifi device shows up in lspci...
> > 
> > Is there a public spec?  My patience for reverse engineering
> > things that are documented somewhere that I'm not allowed to see
> > is pretty limited.  Presumably *you* should be able to see the
> > spec, since this is an Intel device and you have an @intel.com
> > address?
> 
> Ok, I start to understand. So no, no public spec. I am an Intel
> employee, I used to maintain the WiFi driver (iwlwifi). I don't know
> much about PCI though.  I am definitely not asking you to reverse
> engineer our device :) I can try to ask internally what could be
> going on.  The reason I haven't done so so far and reached out to
> you is because I am not aware about switches that we need to toggle
> to make the device magically show up. So I thought it'd be related
> to the PCI core, which take me to the next point...
>
> > From what we can tell so far, I don't *think* this is a PCI issue.
> > If the device doesn't respond to a PCI config access, the PCI core
> > can't really be expected to do anything about it.
> 
> Ok, thanks. So I understand from you that you didn't see any weird
> log from the PCI core saying: "I can see this device, but I can't
> enumerate it because XYZ".  I tried to look for such a thing but
> couldn't.

Right; we should be doing a config read to the device, but apparently
we don't get a response so we think it's not there.  It's still
conceivable there's some hotplug or power management wrinkle that we
aren't handling correctly, but those things are used on many systems,
so it would have to be a fairly esoteric issue.

> From this point, I guess I can't do much either. I'll try to get
> info internally.

Great, thanks!

Bjorn