linux-kernel.vger.kernel.org archive mirror
 help / color / mirror / Atom feed
From: "Henning P . Schmiedehausen" <hps@intermeta.de>
To: Jean Francois Micouleau <Jean-Francois.Micouleau@dalalu.fr>
Cc: linux-kernel@vger.kernel.org
Subject: Re: Linux stifles innovation...
Date: Sat, 17 Feb 2001 19:40:28 +0100	[thread overview]
Message-ID: <20010217194028.A13970@forge.intermeta.de> (raw)
In-Reply-To: <96lril$ddc$1@forge.intermeta.de> <Pine.LNX.3.96.1010217145415.31128A-100000@orion.hq.dalalu.fr>
In-Reply-To: <Pine.LNX.3.96.1010217145415.31128A-100000@orion.hq.dalalu.fr>; from "Jean Francois Micouleau" on Sat, Feb 17, 2001 at 02:58:45PM

On Sat, Feb 17, 2001 at 02:58:45PM +0100, Jean Francois Micouleau wrote:
> 
> On Sat, 17 Feb 2001, Henning P. Schmiedehausen wrote:
> 
> > If IBM, Intel, Compaq, HP, Dell, SGI and other companies would
> > wholeheartedly drop their Windows support in favour of Linux, that I
> > would call "a move". If HP would spent only 5% of their driver writing
> > buget for Windows into Linux driver development, that I would call "a
> > move". 
> 
> I'm wondering if the $600 000 HP gave to VA linux and myself last year is
> only 5% of their driver budget.

> Henning, HP is supporting linux and the open source movement. They are
> paying people to port linux to the ia64 platform and the hp-pa risc.

Yes. They want to sell the IA64 and the HP-PA hardware. So it is
logically for them to fund people and companies that port the kernel
or build OS software for their hardware.

> They are supporting the open source movement by paying people like me to
> improve Samba.

Yes. They want to sell products which use this special piece of software.

I don't see HP supporting software authors to write CD-ROM burning
software for all CDROM writers just to be able to bundle Linux
software with their CDROM writers [just watching an HP commercial on
TV].

IMHO, this is no "basic change in company policy". HP and many other
companies understood that they have two ways to conduct their business
in the future: Being dependent on a company that dictates how to write
software, being forced to live with the way that company wants future
products to be and the fact that this company will always have an edge
over their competitors. Or the will support open _protocols_ like
CORBA, TCP/IP, XML and the like to keep their closed source products
working on many (especially their own) platforms and avoid the
strangle hold of a single company.

Linux is ideal for them because no company has "a grip" on the OS. 
This is good!

But is it "commitment to open source"? Or just "keeping all options
open"? Because these companies still support their products on M$. 

Most of the programs are in newer, larger and more mature versions for
Windows. Why? Did you ever try to write a non-web based GUI program
for Linux? For which Linux? Which desktop (besides using statically
linked motif applications or bare metal X11)? Which version of the
desktop? What tools do you get? How mature are the tools, especially
GUI builders and IDEs? Most developers in bigger companies are not
kernel wizards but just average run-of-the-mill-have-a-grip-on-c++
developers who code after specs.

Most companies simply use Java and leave the details to the VM. If you
write for Windows, you have an ugly and complicated API with lots of
bugs, but the API itself is stable since six (!) years.  You can write
programs that run on 95/98/ME/NT/2000 unchanged. Writing them sucks
but it is possible. For Linux to do so, you must use almost bare X11.

Don't get me wrong. I am _happy_ that there are big companies
recognizing, funding and supporting Linux. But then it is for Linux to
grow mature and recognize that these companies don't do it because
they think "Linux is cool". They do it because they think "Linux is
business. Linux is profit. Linux helps us to avoid the strangle hold
of M$" No news here. No basic direction change here. They do Windows
and anything else for exactly the same reasons.

And they don't do desktop applications besides java applications and
Web stuff.

	Regards
		Henning


-- 
Dipl.-Inf. (Univ.) Henning P. Schmiedehausen       -- Geschaeftsfuehrer
INTERMETA - Gesellschaft fuer Mehrwertdienste mbH     hps@intermeta.de

Am Schwabachgrund 22  Fon.: 09131 / 50654-0   info@intermeta.de
D-91054 Buckenhof     Fax.: 09131 / 50654-20   

  parent reply	other threads:[~2001-02-17 18:40 UTC|newest]

Thread overview: 170+ messages / expand[flat|nested]  mbox.gz  Atom feed  top
2001-02-15 17:49 Linux stifles innovation fsnchzjr
2001-02-15 17:55 ` Stephen Frost
2001-02-15 18:04 ` Mark Haney
2001-02-15 19:49   ` David D.W. Downey
2001-02-15 20:20     ` Alan Olsen
2001-02-15 20:42       ` dave
2001-02-15 21:17         ` Richard B. Johnson
2001-02-15 20:43       ` [OTP] " David D.W. Downey
2001-02-15 22:31       ` Bill Wendling
2001-02-15 22:37         ` William T Wilson
2001-02-16 12:45       ` Rik van Riel
2001-02-16 15:10         ` James Sutherland
2001-02-16 16:02           ` Mark Haney
2001-02-16 16:26             ` David Woodhouse
2001-02-16 16:30               ` Mark Haney
2001-02-16 19:23           ` David D.W. Downey
2001-02-16 20:18             ` James Sutherland
2001-02-17  0:03               ` Carlos Fernandez Sanz
2001-02-17  0:35                 ` Dan Hollis
2001-02-17  0:41                   ` Michael H. Warfield
2001-02-17  1:52                     ` Dan Hollis
2001-02-17  2:20                     ` XOR [ was: Linux stifles innovation... ] David Relson
2001-02-17  2:32                       ` Dan Hollis
2001-02-17  8:16                       ` Jonathan Morton
2001-02-17 13:16                       ` David Relson
2001-02-17 18:12                       ` brian
2001-02-18  2:01                         ` Dan Hollis
2001-02-17  9:08                     ` Linux stifles innovation James Sutherland
2001-02-17 12:45                     ` Henning P. Schmiedehausen
2001-02-17  9:05                 ` James Sutherland
2001-02-17  0:04     ` LA Walsh
2001-02-16  9:26 ` Helge Hafting
2001-02-16  9:36   ` James Sutherland
2001-02-16 12:44     ` Helge Hafting
2001-02-16 17:40     ` Joseph Pingenot
2001-02-16 14:25 ` Andrew Scott
2001-02-16 19:48   ` Jesse Pollard
2001-02-16 22:27   ` Dennis
2001-02-16 22:20     ` Alan Cox
2001-02-17 12:37       ` [LONG RANT] " Henning P. Schmiedehausen
2001-02-17 13:37         ` Russell King
2001-02-17 19:15           ` Henning P . Schmiedehausen
2001-02-17 22:03             ` Felix von Leitner
2001-02-18 11:54               ` Henning P. Schmiedehausen
2001-02-18 12:26                 ` Henning P. Schmiedehausen
2001-02-18 13:43                 ` Russell King
2001-02-18  9:27             ` Russell King
2001-02-17 19:20           ` Jacob Luna Lundberg
2001-02-18  1:06             ` Peter Samuelson
2001-02-18  4:15             ` Ben Ford
2001-02-17 18:48         ` Jonathan Morton
2001-02-19  9:24         ` Helge Hafting
2001-02-19 10:53         ` Werner Almesberger
2001-02-19 11:07           ` Jeff Garzik
2001-02-19 11:28             ` Nicholas Knight
2001-02-19 11:36               ` David Lang
2001-02-19 12:53                 ` Nicholas Knight
2001-02-19 11:47               ` Jeff Garzik
2001-02-19 12:57                 ` Nicholas Knight
2001-02-19 12:00             ` Werner Almesberger
2001-02-19 12:15             ` Henning P . Schmiedehausen
2001-02-19 16:04               ` Paul Jakma
2001-02-19 16:07               ` Alan Cox
2001-02-19 14:15             ` Jes Sorensen
2001-02-20 23:39             ` Brian May
2001-02-19 11:59           ` Henning P . Schmiedehausen
2001-02-19 13:11             ` Werner Almesberger
2001-02-19 14:07               ` David Howells
2001-02-19 14:55                 ` Jeff Garzik
2001-02-19 15:53                   ` Mikulas Patocka
2001-02-19 16:26                     ` Jeff Garzik
2001-02-19 19:11                       ` The lack of specification (was Re: [LONG RANT] Re: Linux stifles innovation... ) Mikulas Patocka
2001-02-19 20:02                         ` Eric W. Biederman
2001-02-19 20:17                         ` Albert D. Cahalan
2001-02-19 21:18                           ` Mikulas Patocka
2001-02-19 21:34                           ` The lack of specification Russell King
2001-02-19 21:47                             ` Eli Carter
2001-02-19 15:58                   ` [LONG RANT] Re: Linux stifles innovation Richard B. Johnson
2001-02-19 16:14                     ` Jeff Garzik
2001-02-19 16:26                     ` Alan Cox
2001-02-19 21:57                     ` Keith Owens
2001-02-19 19:27             ` Andre Hedrick
2001-02-17 16:54       ` Francois Romieu
2001-02-16 22:31     ` Dan Hollis
2001-02-16 22:51     ` David D.W. Downey
2001-02-16 22:59     ` Linux stifles innovation... [way O.T.] John Cavan
2001-02-16 23:07     ` Linux stifles innovation Mike A. Harris
2001-02-16 23:45       ` Matt D. Robinson
2001-02-16 23:46         ` Mike A. Harris
2001-02-17  0:15           ` Matt D. Robinson
2001-02-17  0:34             ` Werner Almesberger
2001-02-17  0:54               ` Matt D. Robinson
2001-02-17  1:58                 ` Werner Almesberger
2001-02-17 12:41       ` Henning P. Schmiedehausen
2001-02-17 17:51         ` Robert Read
     [not found]         ` <Pine.LNX.3.96.1010217145415.31128A-100000@orion.hq.dalalu.fr>
2001-02-17 18:40           ` Henning P . Schmiedehausen [this message]
2001-02-17  0:01     ` Alan Olsen
2001-02-17  0:10     ` rjd
2001-02-17  1:34     ` Neal Dias
2001-02-17  2:05     ` Augustin Vidovic
2001-02-17 12:46       ` Henning P. Schmiedehausen
2001-02-17 13:13         ` Roeland Th. Jansen
2001-02-21 23:00       ` Dr. Kelsey Hudson
2001-02-21 23:17         ` Augustin Vidovic
2001-02-22  1:08           ` Dr. Kelsey Hudson
2001-02-22  0:09       ` Jonathan Morton
2001-02-22  0:21         ` Alan Cox
2001-02-23 12:14         ` Wakko Warner
2001-02-23 12:31           ` David Weinehall
2001-02-27  8:48             ` Geert Uytterhoeven
2001-02-17  7:20     ` Mike Pontillo
2001-02-17 16:11       ` [OT]Re: " Gregory Maxwell
2001-02-17  7:39     ` Vesselin Atanasov
2001-02-17 19:08     ` Dennis
2001-02-17 19:08       ` Mohammad A. Haque
2001-02-17 20:47       ` Alan Cox
2001-02-24 21:11       ` Dennis
2001-02-24 21:06         ` Alan Cox
2001-02-17 19:11     ` Dennis
2001-02-17 19:36       ` Francois Romieu
2001-02-17 20:48       ` Alan Cox
2001-02-17 19:24     ` Dennis
2001-02-17 19:38     ` Dennis
2001-02-17 20:01       ` Michael Bacarella
2001-02-17 20:11         ` James A. Sutherland
2001-02-17 19:56     ` Linux stifles innovation... [way O.T.] Dennis
2001-02-17 20:28       ` Michael H. Warfield
2001-02-18 11:25         ` Henning P. Schmiedehausen
2001-02-18 15:32           ` John Cavan
2001-02-18  0:13       ` Gerhard Mack
2001-02-17 20:05     ` Linux stifles innovation Dennis
2001-02-17 20:05       ` James A. Sutherland
2001-02-17 20:14       ` Michael H. Warfield
2001-02-18 10:57         ` Henning P. Schmiedehausen
2001-02-17 20:28       ` Alan Olsen
2001-02-21 23:48         ` Dr. Kelsey Hudson
2001-02-17 22:07       ` Felix von Leitner
2001-02-17 20:08     ` Dennis
2001-02-17 20:22       ` Michael H. Warfield
2001-02-17 20:41       ` Gregory Maxwell
2001-02-18 10:59         ` Henning P. Schmiedehausen
2001-02-18 21:02           ` Bob Taylor
2001-02-17 22:38       ` Andre Hedrick
2001-02-17 23:07         ` Michael H. Warfield
2001-02-18 15:20       ` Stefan Smietanowski
2001-02-18  0:51     ` Peter Samuelson
2001-02-16 23:33   ` Hristo Doichev
2001-02-16 17:25 ` Byron Albert
2001-02-16 17:21 Wayne.Brown
2001-02-18  2:10 Torrey Hoffman
2001-02-18  3:55 Torrey Hoffman
2001-02-18  5:15 ` Ben Ford
2001-02-18 11:17   ` Henning P. Schmiedehausen
2001-02-18 16:42   ` Michael H. Warfield
2001-02-18 18:00     ` Gregory S. Youngblood
2001-02-18 18:04       ` Michael H. Warfield
2001-02-19  1:36         ` Gregory S. Youngblood
2001-02-18 18:21       ` Peter Svensson
2001-02-18 11:16 ` Henning P. Schmiedehausen
2001-02-18 12:19   ` Francis Galiegue
2001-02-18 17:50   ` Andre Hedrick
2001-02-18 18:13     ` Henning P . Schmiedehausen
2001-02-18 22:15       ` Andre Hedrick
2001-02-18 22:25       ` Steve VanDevender
2001-02-18 22:31         ` Andre Hedrick
2001-02-18 11:46 ` Alan Cox
2001-02-18 23:14 ` Jonathan Morton
2001-02-22  0:11 ` Dr. Kelsey Hudson
2001-02-22  1:39 Leif Sawyer
2001-02-22  1:44 ` Dr. Kelsey Hudson

Reply instructions:

You may reply publicly to this message via plain-text email
using any one of the following methods:

* Save the following mbox file, import it into your mail client,
  and reply-to-all from there: mbox

  Avoid top-posting and favor interleaved quoting:
  https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Posting_style#Interleaved_style

* Reply using the --to, --cc, and --in-reply-to
  switches of git-send-email(1):

  git send-email \
    --in-reply-to=20010217194028.A13970@forge.intermeta.de \
    --to=hps@intermeta.de \
    --cc=Jean-Francois.Micouleau@dalalu.fr \
    --cc=linux-kernel@vger.kernel.org \
    /path/to/YOUR_REPLY

  https://kernel.org/pub/software/scm/git/docs/git-send-email.html

* If your mail client supports setting the In-Reply-To header
  via mailto: links, try the mailto: link
Be sure your reply has a Subject: header at the top and a blank line before the message body.
This is a public inbox, see mirroring instructions
for how to clone and mirror all data and code used for this inbox;
as well as URLs for NNTP newsgroup(s).