A Desktop Linux idea: modulized open hardware database for the linux kernel config

A Desktop Linux idea: modulized open hardware database for the linux kernel config

[andreas.thalhammer]

Hello LKML!

I am a Linux Desktop user since around 2001. Doing the math, that’s more than 
a decade!

Having watched http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jjRAKuis7T8 (LinuxCon 2013, Dirk 
Hohndel and Linus Torvalds on stage) I decided to share an idea I had to make 
kernel building easier for computer end-users:

How aboud a free and open hardware database for configuring Linux?

My idea would make a very simple to get kernel configuration for a modulized 
hardware and feature base. It should be some kind of open for everybody 
database in which everyone may participate.

(This would off course only be of use for power users or developers. Regular 
users will use stock kernels from their Linux distribution anyway. BTW, I use 
Gentoo Linux.)

An example:
My computer is a PC. The motherboard is an MSI 890FXA-GD70, it has an AMD 
Phenom II X6 1090T in the CPU slot. So this setup would be the basic entry to 
look for, which will provide a kernel configurtion for this specific hardware. 
For example, the module for the Fintek F71889ED Super IO Sensor has to be 
selected (CONFIG_SENSORS_F71882FG) as well as CONFIG_SENSORS_K10TEMP for the 
CPU.

I  know lm_sensors has a tools for that already: sensors-detect. But not 
everything is covered there, is there?

Then I would also combine this config with a config module for my graphics 
card. It is a Radeon HD 6770, so readonkms has to be selected properly. Some 
kernel parameters may also be wise, such as video=radeondrmfb, radeon.aspm=1 
and radeon.dpm=1.

It should also be possible to combine this config with a config module for my 
monitor. This will show that the resolution of this monitor is 1680x1050. 
Unfortunately this resultution is not part of the VESA BIOS, so the kernel 
command-line parameter video=radeondrmfb will be expanded by 1680x1050-32@60.

Some basic profiles may define how the PC will be used: i.e. as a file server, 
as a Desktop conputer or as a gaming computer. A "cutting edge with all the 
new features" profile may select everything that is usable for this computer.

Every ISA/EISA/VLB/PCI/AGP/PCIe expansion card can and will add some config 
settings to the big kernel configuration. I.e. if you had a DVB-TV card or 
whatever.

A basic "All USB-end-user-devices" config module for all possible USB devices 
may select everything except those self-made stuff, like a thermal probe. On 
the other hand, specific stuff should be allowed too. I.e. the Digitus 
Cardreader All-in-one, USB 3.0 (DA-70330) – is a specific reader module 
required (CONFIG_USB_STORAGE_*)?

In the end there would be a hardware database, maybe combined with a wiki, 
that includes developer information like hardware addresses and such as well 
as user reports and kernel configuration modules for that hardware.

Jumping to a newer kernel will automatically set the new/changed 
CONFIG_SOMETHING for the selected profile.

This would also be handy for Laptops and very narrow configured hardware such 
as Apple computers (my Power Mac G4 for example).

A tool for this could go into the kernel sources. It would detect the hardware 
present in the system using everything that is available (e.g. lspci) and show 
a configuration menu (make config-alike) that will enable the user to select 
or deselect specific hardware config modules and profiles (i.e. "file 
server").

Compiling a new kernel will then not result in searching the whole kernel 
config for new or changed options like it is now (just recently I had to 
change video=radeonfb to video=radeonkmsfb in my GRUB config).

For kernel developers this could also be a very useful tool, because users can 
point to the specific hardware that makes troubles on Linux. And, like it is 
in a community, developers may be able to reach users willing to participate 
in testing new patches for fixing these troubles…

This is just an idea. Now it’s out there – do with it whatever you like. The 
idea is hereby released under the GPL-2 :-)

Re: A Desktop Linux idea: modulized open hardware database for the linux kernel config

[Aldo Iljazi]

 andreas.thalhammer@linux.com wrote:

> Hello LKML!
> 
> I am a Linux Desktop user since around 2001. Doing the math, that’s more than 
> a decade!
> 
> Having watched http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jjRAKuis7T8 (LinuxCon 2013, Dirk 
> Hohndel and Linus Torvalds on stage) I decided to share an idea I had to make 
> kernel building easier for computer end-users:
> 
> How aboud a free and open hardware database for configuring Linux?
> 
> My idea would make a very simple to get kernel configuration for a modulized 
> hardware and feature base. It should be some kind of open for everybody 
> database in which everyone may participate.
> 
> (This would off course only be of use for power users or developers. Regular 
> users will use stock kernels from their Linux distribution anyway. BTW, I use 
> Gentoo Linux.)
> 
> An example:
> My computer is a PC. The motherboard is an MSI 890FXA-GD70, it has an AMD 
> Phenom II X6 1090T in the CPU slot. So this setup would be the basic entry to 
> look for, which will provide a kernel configurtion for this specific hardware. 
> For example, the module for the Fintek F71889ED Super IO Sensor has to be 
> selected (CONFIG_SENSORS_F71882FG) as well as CONFIG_SENSORS_K10TEMP for the 
> CPU.
> 
> I  know lm_sensors has a tools for that already: sensors-detect. But not 
> everything is covered there, is there?
> 
> Then I would also combine this config with a config module for my graphics 
> card. It is a Radeon HD 6770, so readonkms has to be selected properly. Some 
> kernel parameters may also be wise, such as video=radeondrmfb, radeon.aspm=1 
> and radeon.dpm=1.
> 
> It should also be possible to combine this config with a config module for my 
> monitor. This will show that the resolution of this monitor is 1680x1050. 
> Unfortunately this resultution is not part of the VESA BIOS, so the kernel 
> command-line parameter video=radeondrmfb will be expanded by 1680x1050-32@60.
> 
> Some basic profiles may define how the PC will be used: i.e. as a file server, 
> as a Desktop conputer or as a gaming computer. A "cutting edge with all the 
> new features" profile may select everything that is usable for this computer.
> 
> Every ISA/EISA/VLB/PCI/AGP/PCIe expansion card can and will add some config 
> settings to the big kernel configuration. I.e. if you had a DVB-TV card or 
> whatever.
> 
> A basic "All USB-end-user-devices" config module for all possible USB devices 
> may select everything except those self-made stuff, like a thermal probe. On 
> the other hand, specific stuff should be allowed too. I.e. the Digitus 
> Cardreader All-in-one, USB 3.0 (DA-70330) – is a specific reader module 
> required (CONFIG_USB_STORAGE_*)?
> 
> In the end there would be a hardware database, maybe combined with a wiki, 
> that includes developer information like hardware addresses and such as well 
> as user reports and kernel configuration modules for that hardware.
> 
> Jumping to a newer kernel will automatically set the new/changed 
> CONFIG_SOMETHING for the selected profile.
> 
> This would also be handy for Laptops and very narrow configured hardware such 
> as Apple computers (my Power Mac G4 for example).
> 
> A tool for this could go into the kernel sources. It would detect the hardware 
> present in the system using everything that is available (e.g. lspci) and show 
> a configuration menu (make config-alike) that will enable the user to select 
> or deselect specific hardware config modules and profiles (i.e. "file 
> server").
> 
> Compiling a new kernel will then not result in searching the whole kernel 
> config for new or changed options like it is now (just recently I had to 
> change video=radeonfb to video=radeonkmsfb in my GRUB config).
> 
> For kernel developers this could also be a very useful tool, because users can 
> point to the specific hardware that makes troubles on Linux. And, like it is 
> in a community, developers may be able to reach users willing to participate 
> in testing new patches for fixing these troubles…
> 
> This is just an idea. Now it’s out there – do with it whatever you like. The 
> idea is hereby released under the GPL-2 :-)
> --
> To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe linux-kernel" in
> the body of a message to majordomo@vger.kernel.org
> More majordomo info at  http://vger.kernel.org/majordomo-info.html
> Please read the FAQ at  http://www.tux.org/lkml/

So, you are saying that this should be available for power users only,
since it requires kernel compilation.

I have a few points to make.

1. Wouldn't power users know how to configure the kernel anyway for
their system?

2. What about future hardware upgrades (on both a laptop and desktop
machines).

3. What's wrong with stock distribution kernels?

4. Wouldn't this take a great amount of manpower for I guess minimum
benefits?
-- 
Aldo Iljazi

Re: A Desktop Linux idea: modulized open hardware database for the linux kernel config

[andreas.thalhammer]

Your message from Sunday, 03rd November 2013:
>  andreas.thalhammer@linux.com wrote:
> > Hello LKML!
> > 
> > I am a Linux Desktop user since around 2001. Doing the math, that’s more
> > than a decade!
> > 
> > Having watched http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jjRAKuis7T8 (LinuxCon 2013,
> > Dirk Hohndel and Linus Torvalds on stage) I decided to share an idea I
> > had to make kernel building easier for computer end-users:
> > 
> > How aboud a free and open hardware database for configuring Linux?
> > 
> > My idea would make a very simple to get kernel configuration for a
> > modulized hardware and feature base. It should be some kind of open for
> > everybody database in which everyone may participate.
> > 
> > (This would off course only be of use for power users or developers.
> > Regular users will use stock kernels from their Linux distribution
> > anyway. BTW, I use Gentoo Linux.)
> > 
> > An example:
> > My computer is a PC. The motherboard is an MSI 890FXA-GD70, it has an AMD
> > Phenom II X6 1090T in the CPU slot. So this setup would be the basic
> > entry to look for, which will provide a kernel configurtion for this
> > specific hardware. For example, the module for the Fintek F71889ED Super
> > IO Sensor has to be selected (CONFIG_SENSORS_F71882FG) as well as
> > CONFIG_SENSORS_K10TEMP for the CPU.
> > 
> > I  know lm_sensors has a tools for that already: sensors-detect. But not
> > everything is covered there, is there?
> > 
> > Then I would also combine this config with a config module for my
> > graphics card. It is a Radeon HD 6770, so readonkms has to be selected
> > properly. Some kernel parameters may also be wise, such as
> > video=radeondrmfb, radeon.aspm=1 and radeon.dpm=1.
> > 
> > It should also be possible to combine this config with a config module
> > for my monitor. This will show that the resolution of this monitor is
> > 1680x1050. Unfortunately this resultution is not part of the VESA BIOS,
> > so the kernel command-line parameter video=radeondrmfb will be expanded
> > by 1680x1050-32@60.
> > 
> > Some basic profiles may define how the PC will be used: i.e. as a file
> > server, as a Desktop conputer or as a gaming computer. A "cutting edge
> > with all the new features" profile may select everything that is usable
> > for this computer.
> > 
> > Every ISA/EISA/VLB/PCI/AGP/PCIe expansion card can and will add some
> > config settings to the big kernel configuration. I.e. if you had a
> > DVB-TV card or whatever.
> > 
> > A basic "All USB-end-user-devices" config module for all possible USB
> > devices may select everything except those self-made stuff, like a
> > thermal probe. On the other hand, specific stuff should be allowed too.
> > I.e. the Digitus Cardreader All-in-one, USB 3.0 (DA-70330) – is a
> > specific reader module required (CONFIG_USB_STORAGE_*)?
> > 
> > In the end there would be a hardware database, maybe combined with a
> > wiki, that includes developer information like hardware addresses and
> > such as well as user reports and kernel configuration modules for that
> > hardware.
> > 
> > Jumping to a newer kernel will automatically set the new/changed
> > CONFIG_SOMETHING for the selected profile.
> > 
> > This would also be handy for Laptops and very narrow configured hardware
> > such as Apple computers (my Power Mac G4 for example).
> > 
> > A tool for this could go into the kernel sources. It would detect the
> > hardware present in the system using everything that is available (e.g.
> > lspci) and show a configuration menu (make config-alike) that will
> > enable the user to select or deselect specific hardware config modules
> > and profiles (i.e. "file server").
> > 
> > Compiling a new kernel will then not result in searching the whole kernel
> > config for new or changed options like it is now (just recently I had to
> > change video=radeonfb to video=radeonkmsfb in my GRUB config).
> > 
> > For kernel developers this could also be a very useful tool, because
> > users can point to the specific hardware that makes troubles on Linux.
> > And, like it is in a community, developers may be able to reach users
> > willing to participate in testing new patches for fixing these troubles…
> > 
> > This is just an idea. Now it’s out there – do with it whatever you like.
> > The idea is hereby released under the GPL-2 :-)
> > --
> > To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe linux-kernel"
> > in the body of a message to majordomo@vger.kernel.org
> > More majordomo info at  http://vger.kernel.org/majordomo-info.html
> > Please read the FAQ at  http://www.tux.org/lkml/
> 
> So, you are saying that this should be available for power users only,
> since it requires kernel compilation.
> 
> I have a few points to make.
> 
> 1. Wouldn't power users know how to configure the kernel anyway for
> their system?
> 
> 2. What about future hardware upgrades (on both a laptop and desktop
> machines).
> 
> 3. What's wrong with stock distribution kernels?
> 
> 4. Wouldn't this take a great amount of manpower for I guess minimum
> benefits?

@1: You’re propably right.
I’m just sometimes surprised how much manual work is required to update the 
kernel due to changed names.

It is also very hard to find a configuration for a new system from the start. 
Once you’ve got it running, it’s quite okay.

Such a database would make it easier for newbies or for users who are 
interested in compiling their own kernel, but were not sure which 
configuration to choose.

@2: Since it would be modulized, you’d simply add your new upgrade to your 
specific system config. Like I mentioned with the radeon card in my example. 
Or a new monitor.

@3: They are bloated because they need to run on every possible system. 
Sometimes some specific parts are missing, because it’s too specific (like 
support for experimental chipsets, or staging drivers).
Other than that: nothing’s wrong with distribution kernels.

@4: Yes, definitely. That’s why I think it would be best in a community based 
way. Like authors for Wikipedia – users would provide profiles that work for 
them. Discussions will make them come closer together and fix issues that 
others have.


Now, the kernel needs a basic configuration, like make x86_64_defconfig. Then 
you need to tell it which features you want. Then which drivers you need.

You can, off course, select all. But isn’t this a waste of time and resources?


But hey, it was just an idea. A stupid one maybe. So thanks for answering 
anyway.

Re: A Desktop Linux idea: modulized open hardware database for the linux kernel config

[el_es]

 <andreas.thalhammer <at> linux.com> writes:
[cut down because of gmane's web interface quotation policy]

> But hey, it was just an idea. A stupid one maybe. So thanks for answering 
> anyway.
> 


Uh like any great idea, you need to show the world, how
serious you are about it : do the first step and collect a few, 
then share a link, wikipedia or pastebin style maybe for starters ;)

In other words, "let's go and you do it", doesn't sound like 
a good starting pitch ;)

-L.

Re: A Desktop Linux idea: modulized open hardware database for the linux kernel config

[andreas.thalhammer]

> <andreas.thalhammer <at> linux.com> writes:
>[cut down because of gmane's web interface quotation policy]
>
>> But hey, it was just an idea. A stupid one maybe. So thanks for answering 
>> anyway.
>> 
>
>
>Uh like any great idea, you need to show the world, how
>serious you are about it : do the first step and collect a few, 
>then share a link, wikipedia or pastebin style maybe for starters ;)
>
>In other words, "let's go and you do it", doesn't sound like 
>a good starting pitch ;)
>
>-L.

"If I could have, I would have" already done it. I wouldn’t know how.
I’m sorry if this soulds like "you do it"… the intension was to see what you 
think about it.

I was working with the hardware database from Fedora (RedHat): Smolt. But 
Smolt was shut down: https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Smolt_retirement

When I started working with it, and with other resources of this kind, I 
always found that it was too chaotic because there are too many ways of 
describing how to get a Linux system running on a specific hardware. Take the 
ThinkWiki for example. It describes how to get some specific parts of specific 
ThinkPad series to work on Linux, but it could be the same procedure and/or 
patch used for other Laptops or PCs.

I had my hardware added to Smolt for the reason to have other benefit from the 
information on how to get it running (if I got it running) and which kernel 
version is at least required and other useful information.

During that time the idea came up that an automized configuration for a 
specific computer would be a benefit.

That is: make a defconfig, not for a very generic system but for very specific 
system parts. The example is: PC + Desktop + experimental + <My specific 
motherboard> + AMD_K10 SMP + RadeonHD_Barts + AllStableUSB + <My specific 
webcam> + …

This "profile" would go into a global configuration file for my computer. The 
"make defconfig" would then use this information to e.g. set this very 
specific CONFIG_SENSORS_F71882FG, because the system now knows which specific 
hardware it is built for. It will leave out all unnecessary stuff, unless 
otherwise included (in the profile). The provided information could even be 
used to tell GRUB (grub-mkconfig) for which kernel version which command line 
options must be used.

Putting all this on a server (like Smolt) and having it put together with 
version information (like: on kernel 3.2 it is CONFIG_SOMETHING whereas 
starting with 3.3 it is CONFIG_SOMETHINGELSE and includes 
CONFIG_SOMETHINGELSE_WITH_AN_OPTION) and combined with a Wiki – and all of 
that can be discussed and created online by users, would get a power-user-
community process started. Maybe. Hopefully.

With Smolt this wasn’t so. It was too limited in many ways.

There are verious Wiki, Blog and Wordpress pages that describe how to compile 
the linux kernel (and userland software) for a specific system. But there is no 
central site for that.

If Smolt had been a little "better", and more useful in the sense of "this is 
my hardware – someone with the same, what is your kernel .config file looking 
like?" would have helped a lot of non-power-users, that – nevertheless – like 
to compile their own kernel, and maybe add something that was missing in the 
distribution kernel…

Giving them a "make myconfig" with some little extra information (What type of 
use? "Desktop", how stable? "experimental", and what extra hardware? 
"<specific>" or "very general, like a distribution kernel") would make their 
lifes easier; also for power-users.

Power-users would in addition provide the config modules (like: what is needed 
for a specific hardware/hardware expansion) and help on a server site that 
hosts this information.

I’m sorry, but I cannot possibly do this all by myself. I was able to help in 
some Wikis and in Smolt, but I cannot setup such a system. Apparently I was 
only able to come up with the idea…


(Since I am not even able to answer you, I post as a follow-up to my previous 
post).

Re for el_es: A Desktop Linux idea: modulized open hardware database for the linux kernel config

[andreas.thalhammer]

> <andreas.thalhammer <at> linux.com> writes:
>[cut down because of gmane's web interface quotation policy]
>
>> But hey, it was just an idea. A stupid one maybe. So thanks for answering 
>> anyway.
>> 
>
>
>Uh like any great idea, you need to show the world, how
>serious you are about it : do the first step and collect a few, 
>then share a link, wikipedia or pastebin style maybe for starters ;)
>
>In other words, "let's go and you do it", doesn't sound like 
>a good starting pitch ;)
>
>-L.

"If I could have, I would have" already done it. I wouldn’t know how.
I’m sorry if this soulds like "you do it"… the intension was to see what you 
think about it.

I was working with the hardware database from Fedora (RedHat): Smolt. But 
Smolt was shut down: https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Smolt_retirement

When I started working with it, and with other resources of this kind, I 
always found that it was too chaotic because there are too many ways of 
describing how to get a Linux system running on a specific hardware. Take the 
ThinkWiki for example. It describes how to get some specific parts of specific 
ThinkPad series to work on Linux, but it could be the same procedure and/or 
patch used for other Laptops or PCs.

I had my hardware added to Smolt for the reason to have other benefit from the 
information on how to get it running (if I got it running) and which kernel 
version is at least required and other useful information.

During that time the idea came up that an automized configuration for a 
specific computer would be a benefit.

That is: make a defconfig, not for a very generic system but for very specific 
system parts. The example is: PC + Desktop + experimental + <My specific 
motherboard> + AMD_K10 SMP + RadeonHD_Barts + AllStableUSB + <My specific 
webcam> + …

This "profile" would go into a global configuration file for my computer. The 
"make defconfig" would then use this information to e.g. set this very 
specific CONFIG_SENSORS_F71882FG, because the system now knows which specific 
hardware it is built for. It will leave out all unnecessary stuff, unless 
otherwise included (in the profile). The provided information could even be 
used to tell GRUB (grub-mkconfig) for which kernel version which command line 
options must be used.

Putting all this on a server (like Smolt) and having it put together with 
version information (like: on kernel 3.2 it is CONFIG_SOMETHING whereas 
starting with 3.3 it is CONFIG_SOMETHINGELSE and includes 
CONFIG_SOMETHINGELSE_WITH_AN_OPTION) and combined with a Wiki – and all of 
that can be discussed and created online by users, would get a power-user-
community process started. Maybe. Hopefully.

With Smolt this wasn’t so. It was too limited in many ways.

There are verious Wiki, Blog and Wordpress pages that describe how to compile 
the linux kernel (and userland software) for a specific system. But there is no 
central site for that.

If Smolt had been a little "better", and more useful in the sense of "this is 
my hardware – someone with the same, what is your kernel .config file looking 
like?" would have helped a lot of non-power-users, that – nevertheless – like 
to compile their own kernel, and maybe add something that was missing in the 
distribution kernel…

Giving them a "make myconfig" with some little extra information (What type of 
use? "Desktop", how stable? "experimental", and what extra hardware? 
"<specific>" or "very general, like a distribution kernel") would make their 
lifes easier; also for power-users.

Power-users would in addition provide the config modules (like: what is needed 
for a specific hardware/hardware expansion) and help on a server site that 
hosts this information.

I’m sorry, but I cannot possibly do this all by myself. I was able to help in 
some Wikis and in Smolt, but I cannot setup such a system. Apparently I was 
only able to come up with the idea…


(Since I am not even able to answer you, I post as a follow-up to my previous 
post).

Re: Re for el_es: A Desktop Linux idea: modulized open hardware database for the linux kernel config

[Theodore Ts'o]

On Sun, Nov 03, 2013 at 07:57:29PM +0100, andreas.thalhammer@linux.com wrote:
> 
> I’m sorry, but I cannot possibly do this all by myself. I was able
> to help in some Wikis and in Smolt, but I cannot setup such a
> system. Apparently I was only able to come up with the idea...

It's an idea that people have tossed around before, but utltimately,
it's far more work than it's worth, and it's a maintenance nightmare.
For most non-technical users, using a distro kernel is quite good
enough.

For power users, they have no trouble configuring their own custom
kernel --- they can start with a full distribution kernel config, run
"make localmodconfig" which will compile a kernel with the currently
loaded modules (which are presumably the ones required for your
hardware) compiled into the kernel, and then the power user can then
disable those modules that he or she does't think they'll ever need.

The set of people who aren't willing to use a distribution kernel, but
aren't clueful enough to figure out how to customize their own kernel,
is a pretty small set.  And it's certainly not big enough such that
those of us who could implement such an idea would think that it's
worth the huge amount of effort it would require, and how to deal with
the enusing support burden when clueless end-users try to use it, and
then complain when the information is out of date.

If you told me that you wanted to try it, I would tell you that you
were going to be getting into a huge amount of work, and it's not
obvious to me that it's worth it --- but if you are going to volunteer
your own time, then it's ultimately up to you.  But having you trying
to volunteer *other* people's time for what might be a sisyphean does
take a fair amount of chutzpah.

Regards,

					- Ted

[Topic closed] A Desktop Linux idea: modulized open hardware database for the linux kernel config

[andreas.thalhammer]

Theodore Ts'o wrote on Sunday, 03rd November 2013:
> It's an idea that people have tossed around before, but utltimately,
> it's far more work than it's worth, and it's a maintenance nightmare.
> For most non-technical users, using a distro kernel is quite good
> enough.

Yes, I get it. Thanks for the honesty.

> > I’m sorry, but I cannot possibly do this all by myself. I was able
> > to help in some Wikis and in Smolt, but I cannot setup such a
> > system. Apparently I was only able to come up with the idea...
>
> If you told me that you wanted to try it, I would tell you that you
> were going to be getting into a huge amount of work, and it's not
> obvious to me that it's worth it --- but if you are going to volunteer
> your own time, then it's ultimately up to you.  But having you trying
> to volunteer *other* people's time for what might be a sisyphean does
> take a fair amount of chutzpah.

I don’t want other people to volunteer, I was expressing an idea, but – after 
reading your answer – I do understand that the gain is not worth the effort. At 
least now I know what you (the people making Linux) think about it.

I was trying to off-load some workload from you (developers) to power-users. I 
consider myself to be good enough to compile a kernel by myself, and to 
install Gentoo for that matter, and I’m also willing to volunteer some of my 
spare time to help other people who run Linux. I wrote some Wiki entries on 
how to install Linux on a specific machine and how to get things to run. I 
found that most of the times a new kernel was required due to some devices 
requireing a staging driver or a deactivated feature of a driver.

However, my possibilities are limited. As I wrote before, I tried some tools 
(written by others!) that unfortunately didn’t work out, like Smolt.

So I’ll let go of that idea. I’m certainly glad to have proposed it, but I get 
it that it isn’t worth it.

I don’t think it has anything to do with chutzpah though, since the posting 
was motivated by me being eager to help where I can, not where I cannot.
(Although I do understand it may look different.)

Thanks!

Re: A Desktop Linux idea: modulized open hardware database for the linux kernel config

[Pavel Machek]

Hi!

> So, you are saying that this should be available for power users only,
> since it requires kernel compilation.
> 
> I have a few points to make.
> 
> 1. Wouldn't power users know how to configure the kernel anyway for
> their system?

No, not really. Getting configuration to work is always interesting...

> 2. What about future hardware upgrades (on both a laptop and desktop
> machines).
> 
> 3. What's wrong with stock distribution kernels?

Actually, biggest problem with configurations for various non-PC
systems like Nokia N900 or Zaurus (where distributions does not work).

> 4. Wouldn't this take a great amount of manpower for I guess minimum
> benefits?

									Pavel
-- 
(english) http://www.livejournal.com/~pavelmachek
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