[PATCH v2] MAINTAINERS: Update maintainer for Marvell Prestera Ethernet Switch driver

[PATCH v2] MAINTAINERS: Update maintainer for Marvell Prestera Ethernet Switch driver

[Vadym Kochan]

From: Taras Chornyi <tchornyi@marvell.com>

Add Elad Nachman as maintainer for Marvell Prestera Ethernet Switch driver.

Change Taras Chornyi mailbox to plvision.

Signed-off-by: Taras Chornyi <tchornyi@marvell.com>
Signed-off-by: Vadym Kochan <vadym.kochan@plvision.eu>
---
 MAINTAINERS | 3 ++-
 1 file changed, 2 insertions(+), 1 deletion(-)

diff --git a/MAINTAINERS b/MAINTAINERS
index 61fe86968111..a2bae5fa66f2 100644
--- a/MAINTAINERS
+++ b/MAINTAINERS
@@ -12366,7 +12366,8 @@ F:	Documentation/networking/device_drivers/ethernet/marvell/octeontx2.rst
 F:	drivers/net/ethernet/marvell/octeontx2/af/
 
 MARVELL PRESTERA ETHERNET SWITCH DRIVER
-M:	Taras Chornyi <tchornyi@marvell.com>
+M:	Taras Chornyi <taras.chornyi@plvision.eu>
+M:	Elad Nachman <enachman@marvell.com>
 S:	Supported
 W:	https://github.com/Marvell-switching/switchdev-prestera
 F:	drivers/net/ethernet/marvell/prestera/
-- 
2.25.1

Re: [PATCH v2] MAINTAINERS: Update maintainer for Marvell Prestera Ethernet Switch driver

[Jakub Kicinski]

On Mon, 28 Nov 2022 11:39:34 +0200 Vadym Kochan wrote:
> Add Elad Nachman as maintainer for Marvell Prestera Ethernet Switch driver.
> 
> Change Taras Chornyi mailbox to plvision.

This is a patch, so the description needs to explain why...
and who these people are. It would seem more natural if you, 
Oleksandr and Yevhen were the maintainers.

Seriously, this is a community project please act the part.

Re: [PATCH v2] MAINTAINERS: Update maintainer for Marvell Prestera Ethernet Switch driver

[Taras Chornyi]

On 30.11.22 07:14, Jakub Kicinski wrote:
> On Mon, 28 Nov 2022 11:39:34 +0200 Vadym Kochan wrote:
>> Add Elad Nachman as maintainer for Marvell Prestera Ethernet Switch driver.
>>
>> Change Taras Chornyi mailbox to plvision.
> This is a patch, so the description needs to explain why...
> and who these people are. It would seem more natural if you,
> Oleksandr and Yevhen were the maintainers.
>
> Seriously, this is a community project please act the part.
The Marvell Prestera Switchdev Kernel Driver's focus and maintenance are 
shifted from PLVision (Marvell Contractors) to the Marvell team in Israel.
In the last 12 months, the driver's development efforts have been shared 
between the PLVision team and Elad Nachman from the Marvell Israel group.

Elad Nachman is a veteran with over ten years of experience in Linux 
kernel development.
He has made many Linux kernel contributions to several community 
projects, including the Linux kernel, DPDK (KNI Linux Kernel driver) and 
the DENT project.
Elad has done reviews and technical code contributions on Armada 3700, 
Helping Pali Rohár, who is the maintainer of the Armada 3700 PCI 
sub-system, as well as others in the Armada 3700 cpufreq sub-system.
In the last year and a half, Elad has internally dealt extensively with 
the Marvell Prestera sub-system and has led various upstreaming 
sub-projects related to the Prestera sub-system, Including Prestera 
sub-system efforts related to the Marvell AC5/X SOC drivers upstreaming. 
This included technical review and guidance on the technical aspects and 
code content of the patches sent for review.
In addition, Elad is a member of the internal review group of code 
before it applies as a PR.

Finally, do note the fact that I will continue to maintain/support this 
driver, but I would like to have someone that I can share the effort with.

Re: [PATCH v2] MAINTAINERS: Update maintainer for Marvell Prestera Ethernet Switch driver

[Andrew Lunn]

On Thu, Dec 01, 2022 at 10:39:07AM +0200, Taras Chornyi wrote:
> On 30.11.22 07:14, Jakub Kicinski wrote:
> > On Mon, 28 Nov 2022 11:39:34 +0200 Vadym Kochan wrote:
> > > Add Elad Nachman as maintainer for Marvell Prestera Ethernet Switch driver.
> > > 
> > > Change Taras Chornyi mailbox to plvision.
> > This is a patch, so the description needs to explain why...
> > and who these people are. It would seem more natural if you,
> > Oleksandr and Yevhen were the maintainers.
> > 
> > Seriously, this is a community project please act the part.
> The Marvell Prestera Switchdev Kernel Driver's focus and maintenance are
> shifted from PLVision (Marvell Contractors) to the Marvell team in Israel.
> In the last 12 months, the driver's development efforts have been shared
> between the PLVision team and Elad Nachman from the Marvell Israel group.
> 
> Elad Nachman is a veteran with over ten years of experience in Linux kernel
> development.
> He has made many Linux kernel contributions to several community projects,
> including the Linux kernel, DPDK (KNI Linux Kernel driver) and the DENT
> project.
> Elad has done reviews and technical code contributions on Armada 3700,
> Helping Pali Rohár, who is the maintainer of the Armada 3700 PCI sub-system,
> as well as others in the Armada 3700 cpufreq sub-system.
> In the last year and a half, Elad has internally dealt extensively with the
> Marvell Prestera sub-system and has led various upstreaming sub-projects
> related to the Prestera sub-system, Including Prestera sub-system efforts
> related to the Marvell AC5/X SOC drivers upstreaming. This included
> technical review and guidance on the technical aspects and code content of
> the patches sent for review.
> In addition, Elad is a member of the internal review group of code before it
> applies as a PR.

Hi Taras

The problem we have is that all this is totally opaque to us, in
netdev. The name Elad Nachman does not appear on a single patch in
mainline git for the Prestera. All i can find anywhere in mainline is
one patch in 2018 for stmmac.

The community bases a lot of its judgements on trust.  We look at
contributions, be it patches, review comments, or helping others
finding bugs etc, and slowly build up a level of trust. And at the
moment there is nothing to base trust on.

So lets wait until there are a number of merged patchsets, trust has
been established, before adding this entry. It should not take too
long, given his level of experience. As i've said before, you become a
Maintainer by being a Maintainer.

      Andrew

Re: [PATCH v2] MAINTAINERS: Update maintainer for Marvell Prestera Ethernet Switch driver

[Jakub Kicinski]

On Thu, 1 Dec 2022 10:39:07 +0200 Taras Chornyi wrote:
> On 30.11.22 07:14, Jakub Kicinski wrote:
> > On Mon, 28 Nov 2022 11:39:34 +0200 Vadym Kochan wrote:  
> >> Add Elad Nachman as maintainer for Marvell Prestera Ethernet Switch driver.
> >>
> >> Change Taras Chornyi mailbox to plvision.  
> > This is a patch, so the description needs to explain why...
> > and who these people are. It would seem more natural if you,
> > Oleksandr and Yevhen were the maintainers.
> >
> > Seriously, this is a community project please act the part.  
> The Marvell Prestera Switchdev Kernel Driver's focus and maintenance are 
> shifted from PLVision (Marvell Contractors) to the Marvell team in Israel.
> In the last 12 months, the driver's development efforts have been shared 
> between the PLVision team and Elad Nachman from the Marvell Israel group.

Ah, damn, I was worried that's what you'd say :(

> Elad Nachman is a veteran with over ten years of experience in Linux 
> kernel development.
> He has made many Linux kernel contributions to several community 
> projects, including the Linux kernel, DPDK (KNI Linux Kernel driver) and 
> the DENT project.
> Elad has done reviews and technical code contributions on Armada 3700, 
> Helping Pali Rohár, who is the maintainer of the Armada 3700 PCI 
> sub-system, as well as others in the Armada 3700 cpufreq sub-system.
> In the last year and a half, Elad has internally dealt extensively with 
> the Marvell Prestera sub-system and has led various upstreaming 
> sub-projects related to the Prestera sub-system, Including Prestera 
> sub-system efforts related to the Marvell AC5/X SOC drivers upstreaming. 
> This included technical review and guidance on the technical aspects and 
> code content of the patches sent for review.
> In addition, Elad is a member of the internal review group of code 
> before it applies as a PR.

I see 4 mentions of Elad Nachman in the entire git history.

The distinction between the kernel community and the corporate Linux
involvement is something I don't quite know how to verbalize.
And I don't know whether my perspective is shared by others.

Linux has taken over the world (at least the technical world) so having
Linux kernel exposure is common. But building a product based on Linux
which is then packaged and shipped to customers, in the usual corp
product development methodology, translates very poorly to developing
upstream. This is more true in networking that other parts of the
kernel, to my knowledge, because we attempt to build vendor-independent
abstractions.

While I do not mean to question Elad's expertise and capability as an
engineer/lead/manager, and very much appreciate Marvell's investment 
in the upstream drivers for Prestera and in DENT -- I think the
community involvement is lacking. Short to medium term we should try to
find a way of improving this situation, we can clarify what we expect
from you and if you have ideas on how we can make the involvement**
easier - we'd love to hear them.

** community involvement ideas, less interested in how we can make the
   "ship products" part easier, but you can share those too

> Finally, do note the fact that I will continue to maintain/support this 
> driver, but I would like to have someone that I can share the effort with.

Understandable. I hope PLVision does not disappear form the picture.
We are really allergic to the "push the driver upstream and disengage"
or "throw it over the wall open source" model, if you will.

Unfortunately we only have one nuclear button for discouraging such
arrangements (git-rm), which will hopefully never be used.

To conclude, I think we should have a call first, and then decide
who the best choice for a maintainer is. 

Re: [PATCH v2] MAINTAINERS: Update maintainer for Marvell Prestera Ethernet Switch driver

[Taras Chornyi]

On 01.12.22 23:17, Jakub Kicinski wrote:
> On Thu, 1 Dec 2022 10:39:07 +0200 Taras Chornyi wrote:
>> On 30.11.22 07:14, Jakub Kicinski wrote:
>>> On Mon, 28 Nov 2022 11:39:34 +0200 Vadym Kochan wrote:
>>>> Add Elad Nachman as maintainer for Marvell Prestera Ethernet Switch driver.
>>>>
>>>> Change Taras Chornyi mailbox to plvision.
>>> This is a patch, so the description needs to explain why...
>>> and who these people are. It would seem more natural if you,
>>> Oleksandr and Yevhen were the maintainers.
>>>
>>> Seriously, this is a community project please act the part.
>> The Marvell Prestera Switchdev Kernel Driver's focus and maintenance are
>> shifted from PLVision (Marvell Contractors) to the Marvell team in Israel.
>> In the last 12 months, the driver's development efforts have been shared
>> between the PLVision team and Elad Nachman from the Marvell Israel group.
> 
> Ah, damn, I was worried that's what you'd say :(
> 
>> Elad Nachman is a veteran with over ten years of experience in Linux
>> kernel development.
>> He has made many Linux kernel contributions to several community
>> projects, including the Linux kernel, DPDK (KNI Linux Kernel driver) and
>> the DENT project.
>> Elad has done reviews and technical code contributions on Armada 3700,
>> Helping Pali Rohár, who is the maintainer of the Armada 3700 PCI
>> sub-system, as well as others in the Armada 3700 cpufreq sub-system.
>> In the last year and a half, Elad has internally dealt extensively with
>> the Marvell Prestera sub-system and has led various upstreaming
>> sub-projects related to the Prestera sub-system, Including Prestera
>> sub-system efforts related to the Marvell AC5/X SOC drivers upstreaming.
>> This included technical review and guidance on the technical aspects and
>> code content of the patches sent for review.
>> In addition, Elad is a member of the internal review group of code
>> before it applies as a PR.
> 
> I see 4 mentions of Elad Nachman in the entire git history.
> 
> The distinction between the kernel community and the corporate Linux
> involvement is something I don't quite know how to verbalize.
> And I don't know whether my perspective is shared by others.
> 
> Linux has taken over the world (at least the technical world) so having
> Linux kernel exposure is common. But building a product based on Linux
> which is then packaged and shipped to customers, in the usual corp
> product development methodology, translates very poorly to developing
> upstream. This is more true in networking that other parts of the
> kernel, to my knowledge, because we attempt to build vendor-independent
> abstractions.
> 
> While I do not mean to question Elad's expertise and capability as an
> engineer/lead/manager, and very much appreciate Marvell's investment
> in the upstream drivers for Prestera and in DENT -- I think the
> community involvement is lacking. Short to medium term we should try to
> find a way of improving this situation, we can clarify what we expect
> from you and if you have ideas on how we can make the involvement**
> easier - we'd love to hear them.
> 
> ** community involvement ideas, less interested in how we can make the
>     "ship products" part easier, but you can share those too
> 
>> Finally, do note the fact that I will continue to maintain/support this
>> driver, but I would like to have someone that I can share the effort with.
> 
> Understandable. I hope PLVision does not disappear form the picture.
> We are really allergic to the "push the driver upstream and disengage"
> or "throw it over the wall open source" model, if you will.
> 
> Unfortunately we only have one nuclear button for discouraging such
> arrangements (git-rm), which will hopefully never be used.
> 
> To conclude, I think we should have a call first, and then decide
> who the best choice for a maintainer is.

So we will drop this patch and create a new one with changing my email 
to PLVision one.

Re: [PATCH v2] MAINTAINERS: Update maintainer for Marvell Prestera Ethernet Switch driver

[Jakub Kicinski]

On Wed, 7 Dec 2022 14:36:02 +0200 Taras Chornyi wrote:
> So we will drop this patch and create a new one with changing my email 
> to PLVision one.

Hah, I was so proud of my nice and polite email, and yet this is all
the engagement we get.. :)  Oh, well 🤷️