From: "Paul E. McKenney" <paulmck@kernel.org>
To: Mark Rutland <mark.rutland@arm.com>
Cc: Steven Rostedt <rostedt@goodmis.org>,
Ankur Arora <ankur.a.arora@oracle.com>,
linux-kernel@vger.kernel.org, tglx@linutronix.de,
peterz@infradead.org, torvalds@linux-foundation.org,
akpm@linux-foundation.org, luto@kernel.org, bp@alien8.de,
dave.hansen@linux.intel.com, hpa@zytor.com, mingo@redhat.com,
juri.lelli@redhat.com, vincent.guittot@linaro.org,
willy@infradead.org, mgorman@suse.de, jpoimboe@kernel.org,
jgross@suse.com, andrew.cooper3@citrix.com, bristot@kernel.org,
mathieu.desnoyers@efficios.com, glaubitz@physik.fu-berlin.de,
anton.ivanov@cambridgegreys.com, mattst88@gmail.com,
krypton@ulrich-teichert.org, David.Laight@aculab.com,
richard@nod.at, jon.grimm@amd.com, bharata@amd.com,
boris.ostrovsky@oracle.com, konrad.wilk@oracle.com
Subject: Re: [PATCH 00/30] PREEMPT_AUTO: support lazy rescheduling
Date: Fri, 23 Feb 2024 07:31:50 -0800 [thread overview]
Message-ID: <5641c2f4-3453-4b04-ab0d-db9e5b464b9c@paulmck-laptop> (raw)
In-Reply-To: <Zdh8CdrtbL9LgOLG@FVFF77S0Q05N>
On Fri, Feb 23, 2024 at 11:05:45AM +0000, Mark Rutland wrote:
> On Thu, Feb 22, 2024 at 11:11:34AM -0800, Paul E. McKenney wrote:
> > On Thu, Feb 22, 2024 at 03:50:02PM +0000, Mark Rutland wrote:
> > > On Wed, Feb 21, 2024 at 12:22:35PM -0800, Paul E. McKenney wrote:
> > > > On Wed, Feb 21, 2024 at 03:11:57PM -0500, Steven Rostedt wrote:
> > > > > On Wed, 21 Feb 2024 11:41:47 -0800
> > > > > "Paul E. McKenney" <paulmck@kernel.org> wrote:
> > > > >
> > > > > > > I wonder if we can just see if the instruction pointer at preemption is at
> > > > > > > something that was allocated? That is, if it __is_kernel(addr) returns
> > > > > > > false, then we need to do more work. Of course that means modules will also
> > > > > > > trigger this. We could check __is_module_text() but that does a bit more
> > > > > > > work and may cause too much overhead. But who knows, if the module check is
> > > > > > > only done if the __is_kernel() check fails, maybe it's not that bad.
> > > > > >
> > > > > > I do like very much that idea, but it requires that we be able to identify
> > > > > > this instruction pointer perfectly, no matter what. It might also require
> > > > > > that we be able to perfectly identify any IRQ return addresses as well,
> > > > > > for example, if the preemption was triggered within an interrupt handler.
> > > > > > And interrupts from softirq environments might require identifying an
> > > > > > additional level of IRQ return address. The original IRQ might have
> > > > > > interrupted a trampoline, and then after transitioning into softirq,
> > > > > > another IRQ might also interrupt a trampoline, and this last IRQ handler
> > > > > > might have instigated a preemption.
> > > > >
> > > > > Note, softirqs still require a real interrupt to happen in order to preempt
> > > > > executing code. Otherwise it should never be running from a trampoline.
> > > >
> > > > Yes, the first interrupt interrupted a trampoline. Then, on return,
> > > > that interrupt transitioned to softirq (as opposed to ksoftirqd).
> > > > While a softirq handler was executing within a trampoline, we got
> > > > another interrupt. We thus have two interrupted trampolines.
> > > >
> > > > Or am I missing something that prevents this?
> > >
> > > Surely the problematic case is where the first interrupt is taken from a
> > > trampoline, but the inner interrupt is taken from not-a-trampoline? If the
> > > innermost interrupt context is a trampoline, that's the same as that without
> > > any nesting.
> >
> > It depends. If we wait for each task to not have a trampoline in effect
> > then yes, we only need to know whether or not a given task has at least
> > one trampoline in use. One concern with this approach is that a given
> > task might have at least one trampoline in effect every time it is
> > checked, unlikely though that might seem.
> >
> > If this is a problem, one way around it is to instead ask whether the
> > current task still has a reference to one of a set of trampolines that
> > has recently been removed. This avoids the problem of a task always
> > being one some trampoline or another, but requires exact identification
> > of any and all trampolines a given task is currently using.
> >
> > Either way, we need some way of determining whether or not a given
> > PC value resides in a trampoline. This likely requires some data
> > structure (hash table? tree? something else?) that must be traversed
> > in order to carry out that determination. Depending on the traversal
> > overhead, it might (or might not) be necessary to make sure that the
> > traversal is not on the entry/exit/scheduler fast paths. It is also
> > necessary to keep the trampoline-use overhead low and the trampoline
> > call points small.
>
> Thanks; I hadn't thought about that shape of livelock problem; with that in
> mind my suggestion using flags was inadequate.
>
> I'm definitely in favour of just using Tasks RCU! That's what arm64 does today,
> anyhow!
Full speed ahead, then!!! But if you come up with a nicer solution,
please do not keep it a secret!
Thanx, Paul
next prev parent reply other threads:[~2024-02-23 15:31 UTC|newest]
Thread overview: 157+ messages / expand[flat|nested] mbox.gz Atom feed top
2024-02-13 5:55 [PATCH 00/30] PREEMPT_AUTO: support lazy rescheduling Ankur Arora
2024-02-13 5:55 ` [PATCH 01/30] preempt: introduce CONFIG_PREEMPT_AUTO Ankur Arora
2024-02-13 5:55 ` [PATCH 02/30] thread_info: selector for TIF_NEED_RESCHED[_LAZY] Ankur Arora
2024-02-19 15:16 ` Thomas Gleixner
2024-02-20 22:50 ` Ankur Arora
2024-02-21 17:05 ` Thomas Gleixner
2024-02-21 18:26 ` Steven Rostedt
2024-02-21 20:03 ` Thomas Gleixner
2024-02-13 5:55 ` [PATCH 03/30] thread_info: tif_need_resched() now takes resched_t as param Ankur Arora
2024-02-14 3:17 ` kernel test robot
2024-02-14 14:08 ` Mark Rutland
2024-02-15 4:08 ` Ankur Arora
2024-02-19 12:30 ` Mark Rutland
2024-02-20 22:09 ` Ankur Arora
2024-02-19 15:21 ` Thomas Gleixner
2024-02-20 22:21 ` Ankur Arora
2024-02-21 17:07 ` Thomas Gleixner
2024-02-21 21:22 ` Ankur Arora
2024-02-13 5:55 ` [PATCH 04/30] sched: make test_*_tsk_thread_flag() return bool Ankur Arora
2024-02-14 14:12 ` Mark Rutland
2024-02-15 2:04 ` Ankur Arora
2024-02-13 5:55 ` [PATCH 05/30] sched: *_tsk_need_resched() now takes resched_t as param Ankur Arora
2024-02-19 15:26 ` Thomas Gleixner
2024-02-20 22:37 ` Ankur Arora
2024-02-21 17:10 ` Thomas Gleixner
2024-02-13 5:55 ` [PATCH 06/30] entry: handle lazy rescheduling at user-exit Ankur Arora
2024-02-19 15:29 ` Thomas Gleixner
2024-02-20 22:38 ` Ankur Arora
2024-02-13 5:55 ` [PATCH 07/30] entry/kvm: handle lazy rescheduling at guest-entry Ankur Arora
2024-02-13 5:55 ` [PATCH 08/30] entry: irqentry_exit only preempts for TIF_NEED_RESCHED Ankur Arora
2024-02-13 5:55 ` [PATCH 09/30] sched: __schedule_loop() doesn't need to check for need_resched_lazy() Ankur Arora
2024-02-13 5:55 ` [PATCH 10/30] sched: separate PREEMPT_DYNAMIC config logic Ankur Arora
2024-02-13 5:55 ` [PATCH 11/30] sched: runtime preemption config under PREEMPT_AUTO Ankur Arora
2024-02-13 5:55 ` [PATCH 12/30] rcu: limit PREEMPT_RCU to full preemption " Ankur Arora
2024-02-13 5:55 ` [PATCH 13/30] rcu: fix header guard for rcu_all_qs() Ankur Arora
2024-02-13 5:55 ` [PATCH 14/30] preempt,rcu: warn on PREEMPT_RCU=n, preempt=full Ankur Arora
2024-02-13 5:55 ` [PATCH 15/30] rcu: handle quiescent states for PREEMPT_RCU=n, PREEMPT_COUNT=y Ankur Arora
2024-03-10 10:03 ` Joel Fernandes
2024-03-10 18:56 ` Paul E. McKenney
2024-03-11 0:48 ` Joel Fernandes
2024-03-11 3:56 ` Paul E. McKenney
2024-03-11 15:01 ` Joel Fernandes
2024-03-11 20:51 ` Ankur Arora
2024-03-11 22:12 ` Thomas Gleixner
2024-03-11 5:18 ` Ankur Arora
2024-03-11 15:25 ` Joel Fernandes
2024-03-11 19:12 ` Thomas Gleixner
2024-03-11 19:53 ` Paul E. McKenney
2024-03-11 20:29 ` Thomas Gleixner
2024-03-12 0:01 ` Paul E. McKenney
2024-03-12 0:08 ` Joel Fernandes
2024-03-12 3:16 ` Ankur Arora
2024-03-12 3:24 ` Joel Fernandes
2024-03-12 5:23 ` Ankur Arora
2024-02-13 5:55 ` [PATCH 16/30] rcu: force context-switch " Ankur Arora
2024-02-13 5:55 ` [PATCH 17/30] x86/thread_info: define TIF_NEED_RESCHED_LAZY Ankur Arora
2024-02-14 13:25 ` Mark Rutland
2024-02-14 20:31 ` Ankur Arora
2024-02-19 12:32 ` Mark Rutland
2024-02-13 5:55 ` [PATCH 18/30] sched: prepare for lazy rescheduling in resched_curr() Ankur Arora
2024-02-13 5:55 ` [PATCH 19/30] sched: default preemption policy for PREEMPT_AUTO Ankur Arora
2024-02-13 5:55 ` [PATCH 20/30] sched: handle idle preemption " Ankur Arora
2024-02-13 5:55 ` [PATCH 21/30] sched: schedule eagerly in resched_cpu() Ankur Arora
2024-02-13 5:55 ` [PATCH 22/30] sched/fair: refactor update_curr(), entity_tick() Ankur Arora
2024-02-13 5:55 ` [PATCH 23/30] sched/fair: handle tick expiry under lazy preemption Ankur Arora
2024-02-21 21:38 ` Steven Rostedt
2024-02-28 13:47 ` Juri Lelli
2024-02-29 6:43 ` Ankur Arora
2024-02-29 9:33 ` Juri Lelli
2024-02-29 23:54 ` Ankur Arora
2024-03-01 0:28 ` Paul E. McKenney
2024-02-13 5:55 ` [PATCH 24/30] sched: support preempt=none under PREEMPT_AUTO Ankur Arora
2024-02-13 5:55 ` [PATCH 25/30] sched: support preempt=full " Ankur Arora
2024-02-13 5:55 ` [PATCH 26/30] sched: handle preempt=voluntary " Ankur Arora
2024-03-03 1:08 ` Joel Fernandes
2024-03-05 8:11 ` Ankur Arora
2024-03-06 20:42 ` Joel Fernandes
2024-03-07 19:01 ` Paul E. McKenney
2024-03-08 0:15 ` Joel Fernandes
2024-03-08 0:42 ` Paul E. McKenney
2024-03-08 4:22 ` Ankur Arora
2024-03-08 21:33 ` Paul E. McKenney
2024-03-11 4:50 ` Ankur Arora
2024-03-11 19:26 ` Paul E. McKenney
2024-03-11 20:09 ` Ankur Arora
2024-03-11 20:23 ` Linus Torvalds
2024-03-11 21:03 ` Ankur Arora
2024-03-12 0:03 ` Paul E. McKenney
2024-03-12 12:14 ` Thomas Gleixner
2024-03-12 19:40 ` Paul E. McKenney
2024-03-08 3:49 ` Ankur Arora
2024-03-08 5:29 ` Joel Fernandes
2024-03-08 6:54 ` Juri Lelli
2024-03-11 5:34 ` Ankur Arora
2024-02-13 5:55 ` [PATCH 27/30] sched: latency warn for TIF_NEED_RESCHED_LAZY Ankur Arora
2024-02-13 5:55 ` [PATCH 28/30] tracing: support lazy resched Ankur Arora
2024-02-13 5:55 ` [PATCH 29/30] Documentation: tracing: add TIF_NEED_RESCHED_LAZY Ankur Arora
2024-02-21 21:43 ` Steven Rostedt
2024-02-21 23:22 ` Ankur Arora
2024-02-21 23:53 ` Steven Rostedt
2024-03-01 23:33 ` Joel Fernandes
2024-03-02 3:09 ` Ankur Arora
2024-03-03 19:32 ` Joel Fernandes
2024-02-13 5:55 ` [PATCH 30/30] osnoise: handle quiescent states for PREEMPT_RCU=n, PREEMPTION=y Ankur Arora
2024-02-13 9:47 ` [PATCH 00/30] PREEMPT_AUTO: support lazy rescheduling Geert Uytterhoeven
2024-02-13 21:46 ` Ankur Arora
2024-02-14 23:57 ` Paul E. McKenney
2024-02-15 2:03 ` Ankur Arora
2024-02-15 3:45 ` Paul E. McKenney
2024-02-15 19:28 ` Paul E. McKenney
2024-02-15 20:04 ` Thomas Gleixner
2024-02-15 20:54 ` Paul E. McKenney
2024-02-15 20:53 ` Ankur Arora
2024-02-15 20:55 ` Paul E. McKenney
2024-02-15 21:24 ` Ankur Arora
2024-02-15 22:54 ` Paul E. McKenney
2024-02-15 22:56 ` Paul E. McKenney
2024-02-16 0:45 ` Ankur Arora
2024-02-16 2:59 ` Paul E. McKenney
2024-02-17 0:55 ` Paul E. McKenney
2024-02-17 3:59 ` Ankur Arora
2024-02-18 18:17 ` Paul E. McKenney
2024-02-19 16:48 ` Paul E. McKenney
2024-02-21 18:19 ` Steven Rostedt
2024-02-21 19:41 ` Paul E. McKenney
2024-02-21 20:11 ` Steven Rostedt
2024-02-21 20:22 ` Paul E. McKenney
2024-02-22 15:50 ` Mark Rutland
2024-02-22 19:11 ` Paul E. McKenney
2024-02-23 11:05 ` Mark Rutland
2024-02-23 15:31 ` Paul E. McKenney [this message]
2024-03-02 1:16 ` Paul E. McKenney
2024-03-19 11:45 ` Tasks RCU, ftrace, and trampolines (was: Re: [PATCH 00/30] PREEMPT_AUTO: support lazy rescheduling) Mark Rutland
2024-03-19 23:33 ` Paul E. McKenney
2024-02-21 6:48 ` [PATCH 00/30] PREEMPT_AUTO: support lazy rescheduling Ankur Arora
2024-02-21 17:44 ` Paul E. McKenney
2024-02-16 0:45 ` Ankur Arora
2024-02-21 12:23 ` Raghavendra K T
2024-02-21 17:15 ` Thomas Gleixner
2024-02-21 17:27 ` Raghavendra K T
2024-02-21 21:16 ` Ankur Arora
2024-02-22 4:05 ` Raghavendra K T
2024-02-22 21:23 ` Thomas Gleixner
2024-02-23 3:14 ` Ankur Arora
2024-02-23 6:28 ` Raghavendra K T
2024-02-24 3:15 ` Raghavendra K T
2024-02-27 17:45 ` Ankur Arora
2024-02-22 13:04 ` Raghavendra K T
2024-04-23 15:21 ` Shrikanth Hegde
2024-04-23 16:13 ` Linus Torvalds
2024-04-26 7:46 ` Shrikanth Hegde
2024-04-26 19:00 ` Ankur Arora
2024-05-07 11:16 ` Shrikanth Hegde
2024-05-08 5:18 ` Ankur Arora
2024-05-15 14:31 ` Shrikanth Hegde
[not found] <draft-87a5o4go5i.ffs@tglx>
2024-02-19 15:54 ` Thomas Gleixner
2024-02-21 6:48 ` Ankur Arora
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