linux-kernel.vger.kernel.org archive mirror
 help / color / mirror / Atom feed
From: "Jörg Rödel" <joro@8bytes.org>
To: Leon Romanovsky <leon@kernel.org>
Cc: "Reshetova, Elena" <elena.reshetova@intel.com>,
	Greg Kroah-Hartman <gregkh@linuxfoundation.org>,
	"Shishkin, Alexander" <alexander.shishkin@intel.com>,
	"Shutemov, Kirill" <kirill.shutemov@intel.com>,
	"Kuppuswamy,
	Sathyanarayanan" <sathyanarayanan.kuppuswamy@intel.com>,
	"Kleen, Andi" <andi.kleen@intel.com>,
	"Hansen, Dave" <dave.hansen@intel.com>,
	Thomas Gleixner <tglx@linutronix.de>,
	Peter Zijlstra <peterz@infradead.org>,
	"Wunner, Lukas" <lukas.wunner@intel.com>,
	Mika Westerberg <mika.westerberg@linux.intel.com>,
	"Michael S. Tsirkin" <mst@redhat.com>,
	Jason Wang <jasowang@redhat.com>,
	"Poimboe, Josh" <jpoimboe@redhat.com>,
	"aarcange@redhat.com" <aarcange@redhat.com>,
	Cfir Cohen <cfir@google.com>, Marc Orr <marcorr@google.com>,
	"jbachmann@google.com" <jbachmann@google.com>,
	"pgonda@google.com" <pgonda@google.com>,
	"keescook@chromium.org" <keescook@chromium.org>,
	James Morris <jmorris@namei.org>,
	Michael Kelley <mikelley@microsoft.com>,
	"Lange, Jon" <jlange@microsoft.com>,
	"linux-coco@lists.linux.dev" <linux-coco@lists.linux.dev>,
	Linux Kernel Mailing List <linux-kernel@vger.kernel.org>,
	Kernel Hardening <kernel-hardening@lists.openwall.com>
Subject: Re: Linux guest kernel threat model for Confidential Computing
Date: Fri, 27 Jan 2023 10:32:07 +0100	[thread overview]
Message-ID: <Y9OaF/p6PszOCydn@8bytes.org> (raw)
In-Reply-To: <Y9JyW5bUqV7gWmU8@unreal>

On Thu, Jan 26, 2023 at 02:30:19PM +0200, Leon Romanovsky wrote:
> This is exactly what I said. You presented me the cases which exist in
> your invented world. Mentioned unhandled page fault doesn't exist in real
> world. If PCI device doesn't work, it needs to be replaced/blocked and not
> left to be operable and accessible from the kernel/user.

Believe it or not, this "invented" world is already part of the real
world, and will become even more in the future.

So this has been stated elsewhere in the thread already, but I also like
to stress that hiding misbehavior of devices (real or emulated) is not
the goal of this work.

In fact, the best action for a CoCo guest in case it detects a
(possible) attack is to stop whatever it is doing and crash. And a
misbehaving device in a CoCo guest is a possible attack.

But what needs to be prevented at all costs is undefined behavior in the
CoCo guest that is triggerable by the HV, e.g. by letting an emulated
device misbehave. That undefined behavior can lead to information leak,
which is a way bigger problem for a guest owner than a crashed VM.

Regards,

	Joerg

  parent reply	other threads:[~2023-01-27  9:32 UTC|newest]

Thread overview: 102+ messages / expand[flat|nested]  mbox.gz  Atom feed  top
2023-01-25 12:28 Linux guest kernel threat model for Confidential Computing Reshetova, Elena
2023-01-25 12:43 ` Greg Kroah-Hartman
2023-01-25 13:42   ` Dr. David Alan Gilbert
2023-01-25 14:13     ` Daniel P. Berrangé
2023-01-25 15:29       ` Dr. David Alan Gilbert
2023-01-26 14:23       ` Richard Weinberger
2023-01-26 14:58         ` Dr. David Alan Gilbert
2023-01-26 15:13           ` Richard Weinberger
2023-01-26 15:22             ` Dr. David Alan Gilbert
2023-01-26 15:55             ` Daniel P. Berrangé
2023-01-27  9:02             ` Jörg Rödel
2023-01-26 15:43         ` Daniel P. Berrangé
2023-01-27 11:23         ` Reshetova, Elena
2023-01-30 11:30       ` Christophe de Dinechin
2023-01-25 14:22     ` Greg Kroah-Hartman
2023-01-25 14:30       ` James Bottomley
2023-01-25 14:57       ` Dr. David Alan Gilbert
2023-01-25 15:16         ` Greg Kroah-Hartman
2023-01-25 15:45           ` Michael S. Tsirkin
2023-01-25 16:02             ` Kirill A. Shutemov
2023-01-25 17:47               ` Michael S. Tsirkin
2023-01-25 15:50           ` Dr. David Alan Gilbert
2023-01-25 18:47           ` Jiri Kosina
2023-01-26  9:19           ` Jörg Rödel
2023-01-25 21:53         ` Lukas Wunner
2023-01-26 10:48           ` Dr. David Alan Gilbert
2023-01-26 11:24             ` Jonathan Cameron
2023-01-26 13:32             ` Samuel Ortiz
     [not found]           ` <CAGXJix9-cXNW7EwJf0PVzj_Qmt5fmQvBX1KvXfRX5NAeEpnMvw@mail.gmail.com>
2023-01-26 10:58             ` Jonathan Cameron
2023-01-26 13:15               ` Samuel Ortiz
2023-01-26 16:07                 ` Jonathan Cameron
2023-01-27  7:02                   ` Samuel Ortiz
2023-01-26 15:44             ` Lukas Wunner
2023-01-26 16:25               ` Michael S. Tsirkin
2023-01-26 21:41                 ` Lukas Wunner
2023-01-27  7:17               ` Samuel Ortiz
2023-01-25 20:13       ` Jiri Kosina
2023-01-26 13:13       ` Reshetova, Elena
2023-01-25 15:29   ` Reshetova, Elena
2023-01-25 16:40     ` Theodore Ts'o
2023-01-26  8:08       ` Reshetova, Elena
2023-01-26 11:19     ` Leon Romanovsky
2023-01-26 11:29       ` Reshetova, Elena
2023-01-26 12:30         ` Leon Romanovsky
2023-01-26 13:28           ` Reshetova, Elena
2023-01-26 13:50             ` Leon Romanovsky
2023-01-26 20:54             ` Theodore Ts'o
2023-01-27 19:24             ` James Bottomley
2023-01-30  7:42               ` Reshetova, Elena
2023-01-30 12:40                 ` James Bottomley
2023-01-31 11:31                   ` Reshetova, Elena
2023-01-31 13:28                     ` James Bottomley
2023-01-31 15:14                       ` Christophe de Dinechin
2023-01-31 17:39                         ` Michael S. Tsirkin
2023-02-01 10:52                           ` Christophe de Dinechin Dupont de Dinechin
2023-02-01 11:01                             ` Michael S. Tsirkin
2023-02-01 13:15                               ` Christophe de Dinechin Dupont de Dinechin
2023-02-01 16:02                                 ` Michael S. Tsirkin
2023-02-01 17:13                                   ` Christophe de Dinechin
2023-02-06 18:58                                     ` Dr. David Alan Gilbert
2023-02-02  3:24                               ` Jason Wang
2023-02-01 10:24                         ` Christophe de Dinechin
2023-01-31 16:34                       ` Reshetova, Elena
2023-01-31 17:49                         ` James Bottomley
2023-02-02 14:51                     ` Jeremi Piotrowski
2023-02-03 14:05                       ` Reshetova, Elena
2023-01-27  9:32           ` Jörg Rödel [this message]
2023-01-26 13:58         ` Dr. David Alan Gilbert
2023-01-26 17:48           ` Reshetova, Elena
2023-01-26 18:06             ` Leon Romanovsky
2023-01-26 18:14               ` Dr. David Alan Gilbert
2023-01-26 16:29     ` Michael S. Tsirkin
2023-01-27  8:52       ` Reshetova, Elena
2023-01-27 10:04         ` Michael S. Tsirkin
2023-01-27 12:25           ` Reshetova, Elena
2023-01-27 14:32             ` Michael S. Tsirkin
2023-01-27 20:51             ` Carlos Bilbao
2023-01-30 11:36 ` Christophe de Dinechin
2023-01-30 12:00   ` Kirill A. Shutemov
2023-01-30 15:14     ` Michael S. Tsirkin
2023-01-31 10:06   ` Reshetova, Elena
2023-01-31 16:52     ` Christophe de Dinechin
2023-02-02 11:31       ` Reshetova, Elena
2023-02-07  0:27 ` Carlos Bilbao
2023-02-07  6:03   ` Greg Kroah-Hartman
2023-02-07 19:53     ` Carlos Bilbao
2023-02-07 21:55       ` Michael S. Tsirkin
2023-02-08  1:51       ` Theodore Ts'o
2023-02-08  9:31         ` Michael S. Tsirkin
2023-02-08 10:44           ` Reshetova, Elena
2023-02-08 10:58             ` Greg Kroah-Hartman
2023-02-08 16:19               ` Christophe de Dinechin
2023-02-08 17:29                 ` Greg Kroah-Hartman
2023-02-08 18:02                   ` Dr. David Alan Gilbert
2023-02-08 18:58                     ` Thomas Gleixner
2023-02-09 19:48                       ` Dr. David Alan Gilbert
2023-02-08 13:00             ` Michael S. Tsirkin
2023-02-08 13:42             ` Theodore Ts'o
2023-02-08  7:19       ` Greg Kroah-Hartman
2023-02-08 10:16       ` Reshetova, Elena
2023-02-08 13:15         ` Michael S. Tsirkin
2023-02-09 14:30           ` Reshetova, Elena

Reply instructions:

You may reply publicly to this message via plain-text email
using any one of the following methods:

* Save the following mbox file, import it into your mail client,
  and reply-to-all from there: mbox

  Avoid top-posting and favor interleaved quoting:
  https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Posting_style#Interleaved_style

* Reply using the --to, --cc, and --in-reply-to
  switches of git-send-email(1):

  git send-email \
    --in-reply-to=Y9OaF/p6PszOCydn@8bytes.org \
    --to=joro@8bytes.org \
    --cc=aarcange@redhat.com \
    --cc=alexander.shishkin@intel.com \
    --cc=andi.kleen@intel.com \
    --cc=cfir@google.com \
    --cc=dave.hansen@intel.com \
    --cc=elena.reshetova@intel.com \
    --cc=gregkh@linuxfoundation.org \
    --cc=jasowang@redhat.com \
    --cc=jbachmann@google.com \
    --cc=jlange@microsoft.com \
    --cc=jmorris@namei.org \
    --cc=jpoimboe@redhat.com \
    --cc=keescook@chromium.org \
    --cc=kernel-hardening@lists.openwall.com \
    --cc=kirill.shutemov@intel.com \
    --cc=leon@kernel.org \
    --cc=linux-coco@lists.linux.dev \
    --cc=linux-kernel@vger.kernel.org \
    --cc=lukas.wunner@intel.com \
    --cc=marcorr@google.com \
    --cc=mika.westerberg@linux.intel.com \
    --cc=mikelley@microsoft.com \
    --cc=mst@redhat.com \
    --cc=peterz@infradead.org \
    --cc=pgonda@google.com \
    --cc=sathyanarayanan.kuppuswamy@intel.com \
    --cc=tglx@linutronix.de \
    /path/to/YOUR_REPLY

  https://kernel.org/pub/software/scm/git/docs/git-send-email.html

* If your mail client supports setting the In-Reply-To header
  via mailto: links, try the mailto: link
Be sure your reply has a Subject: header at the top and a blank line before the message body.
This is a public inbox, see mirroring instructions
for how to clone and mirror all data and code used for this inbox;
as well as URLs for NNTP newsgroup(s).