* Re: [RFC] Move tools sources to the tools directory (was Re: [PATCH v2] MAINTAINERS: Fix the location of tools manuals)
2021-02-04 14:22 ` [RFC] Move tools sources to the tools directory (was Re: [PATCH v2] MAINTAINERS: Fix the location of tools manuals) Wainer dos Santos Moschetta
@ 2021-02-04 14:31 ` Peter Maydell
2021-02-04 14:40 ` Kevin Wolf
2021-02-04 14:40 ` Paolo Bonzini
` (2 subsequent siblings)
3 siblings, 1 reply; 23+ messages in thread
From: Peter Maydell @ 2021-02-04 14:31 UTC (permalink / raw)
To: Wainer dos Santos Moschetta
Cc: Kevin Wolf, QEMU Developers, Dr. David Alan Gilbert, Greg Kurz,
Stefan Hajnoczi, Paolo Bonzini, Max Reitz,
Philippe Mathieu-Daudé
On Thu, 4 Feb 2021 at 14:23, Wainer dos Santos Moschetta
<wainersm@redhat.com> wrote:
> Unrelated too, but allow me to ask:
>
> Should we move the tools (qemu-img, qemu-io, qemu-nbd...etc) to the
> tools directory (virtiofsd seems to feel alone there)?
I think that would be a good thing, yes (things documented in docs/tools
should have their source code in tools).
-- PMM
^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 23+ messages in thread* Re: [RFC] Move tools sources to the tools directory (was Re: [PATCH v2] MAINTAINERS: Fix the location of tools manuals)
2021-02-04 14:31 ` Peter Maydell
@ 2021-02-04 14:40 ` Kevin Wolf
2021-02-04 14:47 ` Daniel P. Berrangé
2021-02-04 14:47 ` Peter Maydell
0 siblings, 2 replies; 23+ messages in thread
From: Kevin Wolf @ 2021-02-04 14:40 UTC (permalink / raw)
To: Peter Maydell
Cc: QEMU Developers, Wainer dos Santos Moschetta,
Dr. David Alan Gilbert, Greg Kurz, Stefan Hajnoczi,
Paolo Bonzini, Max Reitz, Philippe Mathieu-Daudé
Am 04.02.2021 um 15:31 hat Peter Maydell geschrieben:
> On Thu, 4 Feb 2021 at 14:23, Wainer dos Santos Moschetta
> <wainersm@redhat.com> wrote:
> > Unrelated too, but allow me to ask:
> >
> > Should we move the tools (qemu-img, qemu-io, qemu-nbd...etc) to the
> > tools directory (virtiofsd seems to feel alone there)?
>
> I think that would be a good thing, yes (things documented in docs/tools
> should have their source code in tools).
Maybe we should define then what a tool is. I think contrib/ has a few
more things that could be considered tools.
Also note that qemu-io-cmds.c is linked to the system emulator (for
HMP), so you would have to keep that somewhere else and spread qemu-io
over two otherwise unrelated directories. I'm not sure if that improves
the situation.
Kevin
^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 23+ messages in thread
* Re: [RFC] Move tools sources to the tools directory (was Re: [PATCH v2] MAINTAINERS: Fix the location of tools manuals)
2021-02-04 14:40 ` Kevin Wolf
@ 2021-02-04 14:47 ` Daniel P. Berrangé
2021-02-04 14:50 ` Peter Maydell
2021-02-04 14:57 ` Kevin Wolf
2021-02-04 14:47 ` Peter Maydell
1 sibling, 2 replies; 23+ messages in thread
From: Daniel P. Berrangé @ 2021-02-04 14:47 UTC (permalink / raw)
To: Kevin Wolf
Cc: Peter Maydell, Greg Kurz, Wainer dos Santos Moschetta,
QEMU Developers, Stefan Hajnoczi, Paolo Bonzini, Max Reitz,
Philippe Mathieu-Daudé,
Dr. David Alan Gilbert
On Thu, Feb 04, 2021 at 03:40:06PM +0100, Kevin Wolf wrote:
> Am 04.02.2021 um 15:31 hat Peter Maydell geschrieben:
> > On Thu, 4 Feb 2021 at 14:23, Wainer dos Santos Moschetta
> > <wainersm@redhat.com> wrote:
> > > Unrelated too, but allow me to ask:
> > >
> > > Should we move the tools (qemu-img, qemu-io, qemu-nbd...etc) to the
> > > tools directory (virtiofsd seems to feel alone there)?
> >
> > I think that would be a good thing, yes (things documented in docs/tools
> > should have their source code in tools).
>
> Maybe we should define then what a tool is. I think contrib/ has a few
> more things that could be considered tools.
The distinction of contrib/ vs tools/ is supposed to be more a
reflection on the quality of the program.
contrib/ should be considered demo-ware, no back compat guaranteed,
may or may not work, no testing guaranteed, no man pages.
tools/ should be for any program that we intend end users to actively
use in real world, with an expectation of quality and stable CLI and
man pages.
Regards,
Daniel
--
|: https://berrange.com -o- https://www.flickr.com/photos/dberrange :|
|: https://libvirt.org -o- https://fstop138.berrange.com :|
|: https://entangle-photo.org -o- https://www.instagram.com/dberrange :|
^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 23+ messages in thread
* Re: [RFC] Move tools sources to the tools directory (was Re: [PATCH v2] MAINTAINERS: Fix the location of tools manuals)
2021-02-04 14:47 ` Daniel P. Berrangé
@ 2021-02-04 14:50 ` Peter Maydell
2021-02-04 15:02 ` Paolo Bonzini
2021-02-04 15:04 ` Daniel P. Berrangé
2021-02-04 14:57 ` Kevin Wolf
1 sibling, 2 replies; 23+ messages in thread
From: Peter Maydell @ 2021-02-04 14:50 UTC (permalink / raw)
To: Daniel P. Berrangé
Cc: Kevin Wolf, Greg Kurz, Wainer dos Santos Moschetta,
QEMU Developers, Stefan Hajnoczi, Paolo Bonzini, Max Reitz,
Philippe Mathieu-Daudé,
Dr. David Alan Gilbert
On Thu, 4 Feb 2021 at 14:47, Daniel P. Berrangé <berrange@redhat.com> wrote:
> The distinction of contrib/ vs tools/ is supposed to be more a
> reflection on the quality of the program.
>
> contrib/ should be considered demo-ware, no back compat guaranteed,
> may or may not work, no testing guaranteed, no man pages.
On this definition, why do we have any of it in our source tree?
Interesting but unmaintained side things can live quite happily
elsewhere (other peoples' git forks, blog posts, whatever).
If we care about a bit of code enough to keep it in our source
tree we ought to care about it enough to properly document
and test it and give it a suitable place to live.
thanks
-- PMM
^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 23+ messages in thread
* Re: [RFC] Move tools sources to the tools directory (was Re: [PATCH v2] MAINTAINERS: Fix the location of tools manuals)
2021-02-04 14:50 ` Peter Maydell
@ 2021-02-04 15:02 ` Paolo Bonzini
2021-02-04 15:06 ` Daniel P. Berrangé
2021-02-04 15:04 ` Daniel P. Berrangé
1 sibling, 1 reply; 23+ messages in thread
From: Paolo Bonzini @ 2021-02-04 15:02 UTC (permalink / raw)
To: Peter Maydell, Daniel P. Berrangé
Cc: Kevin Wolf, Greg Kurz, Wainer dos Santos Moschetta,
QEMU Developers, Stefan Hajnoczi, Max Reitz,
Philippe Mathieu-Daudé,
Dr. David Alan Gilbert
On 04/02/21 15:50, Peter Maydell wrote:
> On Thu, 4 Feb 2021 at 14:47, Daniel P. Berrangé <berrange@redhat.com> wrote:
>> The distinction of contrib/ vs tools/ is supposed to be more a
>> reflection on the quality of the program.
>>
>> contrib/ should be considered demo-ware, no back compat guaranteed,
>> may or may not work, no testing guaranteed, no man pages.
>
> On this definition, why do we have any of it in our source tree?
> Interesting but unmaintained side things can live quite happily
> elsewhere (other peoples' git forks, blog posts, whatever).
> If we care about a bit of code enough to keep it in our source
> tree we ought to care about it enough to properly document
> and test it and give it a suitable place to live.
That's indeed what happened with libvhost-user; it has graduated to a
separate project since it is okay for use in other (production-ready)
vhost-user backends.
Most of the software in contrib/ is essentially a reference
implementations. They are "perfect" for that task, but not meant to
grow more features or to be used in production (compare vhost-user-blk
with qemu-storage-daemon for example).
The other four can be classified as follows:
- elf2dmp and rdmacm-mux should be in tools/, probably it's in contrib/
because nobody uses it and there's no tests so it might bitrot.
- systemd is just a couple files meant for distros to pick up, possibly
with customizations. gitdm is just for people who want to get QEMU
development stats, so I suppose these two are in the same group as well.
Paolo
^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 23+ messages in thread
* Re: [RFC] Move tools sources to the tools directory (was Re: [PATCH v2] MAINTAINERS: Fix the location of tools manuals)
2021-02-04 15:02 ` Paolo Bonzini
@ 2021-02-04 15:06 ` Daniel P. Berrangé
2021-02-04 17:37 ` Philippe Mathieu-Daudé
0 siblings, 1 reply; 23+ messages in thread
From: Daniel P. Berrangé @ 2021-02-04 15:06 UTC (permalink / raw)
To: Paolo Bonzini
Cc: Kevin Wolf, Peter Maydell, Greg Kurz,
Wainer dos Santos Moschetta, QEMU Developers, Stefan Hajnoczi,
Max Reitz, Philippe Mathieu-Daudé,
Dr. David Alan Gilbert
On Thu, Feb 04, 2021 at 04:02:01PM +0100, Paolo Bonzini wrote:
> On 04/02/21 15:50, Peter Maydell wrote:
> > On Thu, 4 Feb 2021 at 14:47, Daniel P. Berrangé <berrange@redhat.com> wrote:
> > > The distinction of contrib/ vs tools/ is supposed to be more a
> > > reflection on the quality of the program.
> > >
> > > contrib/ should be considered demo-ware, no back compat guaranteed,
> > > may or may not work, no testing guaranteed, no man pages.
> >
> > On this definition, why do we have any of it in our source tree?
> > Interesting but unmaintained side things can live quite happily
> > elsewhere (other peoples' git forks, blog posts, whatever).
> > If we care about a bit of code enough to keep it in our source
> > tree we ought to care about it enough to properly document
> > and test it and give it a suitable place to live.
>
> That's indeed what happened with libvhost-user; it has graduated to a
> separate project since it is okay for use in other (production-ready)
> vhost-user backends.
>
> Most of the software in contrib/ is essentially a reference implementations.
> They are "perfect" for that task, but not meant to grow more features or to
> be used in production (compare vhost-user-blk with qemu-storage-daemon for
> example).
>
> The other four can be classified as follows:
>
> - elf2dmp and rdmacm-mux should be in tools/, probably it's in contrib/
> because nobody uses it and there's no tests so it might bitrot.
>
> - systemd is just a couple files meant for distros to pick up, possibly with
> customizations. gitdm is just for people who want to get QEMU development
> stats, so I suppose these two are in the same group as well.
gitdm ought to be in scripts/ really
The systemd files ought to be in the same directory as the tool they
are associated with.
Regards,
Daniel
--
|: https://berrange.com -o- https://www.flickr.com/photos/dberrange :|
|: https://libvirt.org -o- https://fstop138.berrange.com :|
|: https://entangle-photo.org -o- https://www.instagram.com/dberrange :|
^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 23+ messages in thread
* Re: [RFC] Move tools sources to the tools directory (was Re: [PATCH v2] MAINTAINERS: Fix the location of tools manuals)
2021-02-04 15:06 ` Daniel P. Berrangé
@ 2021-02-04 17:37 ` Philippe Mathieu-Daudé
2021-02-04 17:39 ` Paolo Bonzini
0 siblings, 1 reply; 23+ messages in thread
From: Philippe Mathieu-Daudé @ 2021-02-04 17:37 UTC (permalink / raw)
To: Daniel P. Berrangé, Paolo Bonzini
Cc: Kevin Wolf, Peter Maydell, Greg Kurz,
Wainer dos Santos Moschetta, QEMU Developers, Stefan Hajnoczi,
Max Reitz, Dr. David Alan Gilbert
On 2/4/21 4:06 PM, Daniel P. Berrangé wrote:
> On Thu, Feb 04, 2021 at 04:02:01PM +0100, Paolo Bonzini wrote:
>> On 04/02/21 15:50, Peter Maydell wrote:
>>> On Thu, 4 Feb 2021 at 14:47, Daniel P. Berrangé <berrange@redhat.com> wrote:
>>>> The distinction of contrib/ vs tools/ is supposed to be more a
>>>> reflection on the quality of the program.
>>>>
>>>> contrib/ should be considered demo-ware, no back compat guaranteed,
>>>> may or may not work, no testing guaranteed, no man pages.
>>>
>>> On this definition, why do we have any of it in our source tree?
>>> Interesting but unmaintained side things can live quite happily
>>> elsewhere (other peoples' git forks, blog posts, whatever).
>>> If we care about a bit of code enough to keep it in our source
>>> tree we ought to care about it enough to properly document
>>> and test it and give it a suitable place to live.
>>
>> That's indeed what happened with libvhost-user; it has graduated to a
>> separate project since it is okay for use in other (production-ready)
>> vhost-user backends.
>>
>> Most of the software in contrib/ is essentially a reference implementations.
>> They are "perfect" for that task, but not meant to grow more features or to
>> be used in production (compare vhost-user-blk with qemu-storage-daemon for
>> example).
>>
>> The other four can be classified as follows:
>>
>> - elf2dmp and rdmacm-mux should be in tools/, probably it's in contrib/
>> because nobody uses it and there's no tests so it might bitrot.
Why keep something nobody uses?
^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 23+ messages in thread
* Re: [RFC] Move tools sources to the tools directory (was Re: [PATCH v2] MAINTAINERS: Fix the location of tools manuals)
2021-02-04 17:37 ` Philippe Mathieu-Daudé
@ 2021-02-04 17:39 ` Paolo Bonzini
0 siblings, 0 replies; 23+ messages in thread
From: Paolo Bonzini @ 2021-02-04 17:39 UTC (permalink / raw)
To: Philippe Mathieu-Daudé, Daniel P. Berrangé
Cc: Kevin Wolf, Peter Maydell, Greg Kurz,
Wainer dos Santos Moschetta, QEMU Developers, Stefan Hajnoczi,
Max Reitz, Dr. David Alan Gilbert
On 04/02/21 18:37, Philippe Mathieu-Daudé wrote:
>> - elf2dmp and rdmacm-mux should be in tools/, probably it's in contrib/
>> because nobody uses it and there's no tests so it might bitrot.
>
> Why keep something nobody uses?
Well, not really nobody but no maintainer.
Paolo
^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 23+ messages in thread
* Re: [RFC] Move tools sources to the tools directory (was Re: [PATCH v2] MAINTAINERS: Fix the location of tools manuals)
2021-02-04 14:50 ` Peter Maydell
2021-02-04 15:02 ` Paolo Bonzini
@ 2021-02-04 15:04 ` Daniel P. Berrangé
1 sibling, 0 replies; 23+ messages in thread
From: Daniel P. Berrangé @ 2021-02-04 15:04 UTC (permalink / raw)
To: Peter Maydell
Cc: Kevin Wolf, Greg Kurz, Wainer dos Santos Moschetta,
QEMU Developers, Stefan Hajnoczi, Paolo Bonzini, Max Reitz,
Philippe Mathieu-Daudé,
Dr. David Alan Gilbert
On Thu, Feb 04, 2021 at 02:50:08PM +0000, Peter Maydell wrote:
> On Thu, 4 Feb 2021 at 14:47, Daniel P. Berrangé <berrange@redhat.com> wrote:
> > The distinction of contrib/ vs tools/ is supposed to be more a
> > reflection on the quality of the program.
> >
> > contrib/ should be considered demo-ware, no back compat guaranteed,
> > may or may not work, no testing guaranteed, no man pages.
>
> On this definition, why do we have any of it in our source tree?
> Interesting but unmaintained side things can live quite happily
> elsewhere (other peoples' git forks, blog posts, whatever).
Yes, broadly speaking I would actually agree with this. I think much of
this could easily live outside of qemu.git, beit a separate repo uner
QEMU project namespace, or a complete 3rd party.
Especially the vhost-user stuff has no dependency on QEMU in general
and could be used with other KVM userspaces.
> If we care about a bit of code enough to keep it in our source
> tree we ought to care about it enough to properly document
> and test it and give it a suitable place to live.
Regards,
Daniel
--
|: https://berrange.com -o- https://www.flickr.com/photos/dberrange :|
|: https://libvirt.org -o- https://fstop138.berrange.com :|
|: https://entangle-photo.org -o- https://www.instagram.com/dberrange :|
^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 23+ messages in thread
* Re: [RFC] Move tools sources to the tools directory (was Re: [PATCH v2] MAINTAINERS: Fix the location of tools manuals)
2021-02-04 14:47 ` Daniel P. Berrangé
2021-02-04 14:50 ` Peter Maydell
@ 2021-02-04 14:57 ` Kevin Wolf
1 sibling, 0 replies; 23+ messages in thread
From: Kevin Wolf @ 2021-02-04 14:57 UTC (permalink / raw)
To: Daniel P. Berrangé
Cc: Peter Maydell, Greg Kurz, Wainer dos Santos Moschetta,
QEMU Developers, Stefan Hajnoczi, Paolo Bonzini, Max Reitz,
Philippe Mathieu-Daudé,
Dr. David Alan Gilbert
Am 04.02.2021 um 15:47 hat Daniel P. Berrangé geschrieben:
> On Thu, Feb 04, 2021 at 03:40:06PM +0100, Kevin Wolf wrote:
> > Am 04.02.2021 um 15:31 hat Peter Maydell geschrieben:
> > > On Thu, 4 Feb 2021 at 14:23, Wainer dos Santos Moschetta
> > > <wainersm@redhat.com> wrote:
> > > > Unrelated too, but allow me to ask:
> > > >
> > > > Should we move the tools (qemu-img, qemu-io, qemu-nbd...etc) to the
> > > > tools directory (virtiofsd seems to feel alone there)?
> > >
> > > I think that would be a good thing, yes (things documented in docs/tools
> > > should have their source code in tools).
> >
> > Maybe we should define then what a tool is. I think contrib/ has a few
> > more things that could be considered tools.
>
> The distinction of contrib/ vs tools/ is supposed to be more a
> reflection on the quality of the program.
>
> contrib/ should be considered demo-ware, no back compat guaranteed,
> may or may not work, no testing guaranteed, no man pages.
>
> tools/ should be for any program that we intend end users to actively
> use in real world, with an expectation of quality and stable CLI and
> man pages.
Maybe the difference should be related to what we build by default then?
Just checking what executables my build directory contains, I guess
these are candidates for tools/:
qemu-bridge-helper
qemu-edid
qemu-img
qemu-io
qemu-keymap
qemu-nbd
qemu-pr-helper
Almost all of them are currently in the root directory today. Only
qemu-pr-helper is in scsi/.
And then there is qemu-storage-daemon which lives in storage-daemon/
today and whose executable ends up in a storage-daemon/ subdirectory of
the build directory since the Meson conversion, which is inconsistent
with all other tools.
I haven't checked other subdirectories for more executables that might
exist.
Kevin
^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 23+ messages in thread
* Re: [RFC] Move tools sources to the tools directory (was Re: [PATCH v2] MAINTAINERS: Fix the location of tools manuals)
2021-02-04 14:40 ` Kevin Wolf
2021-02-04 14:47 ` Daniel P. Berrangé
@ 2021-02-04 14:47 ` Peter Maydell
1 sibling, 0 replies; 23+ messages in thread
From: Peter Maydell @ 2021-02-04 14:47 UTC (permalink / raw)
To: Kevin Wolf
Cc: QEMU Developers, Wainer dos Santos Moschetta,
Dr. David Alan Gilbert, Greg Kurz, Stefan Hajnoczi,
Paolo Bonzini, Max Reitz, Philippe Mathieu-Daudé
On Thu, 4 Feb 2021 at 14:40, Kevin Wolf <kwolf@redhat.com> wrote:
>
> Am 04.02.2021 um 15:31 hat Peter Maydell geschrieben:
> > On Thu, 4 Feb 2021 at 14:23, Wainer dos Santos Moschetta
> > <wainersm@redhat.com> wrote:
> > > Unrelated too, but allow me to ask:
> > >
> > > Should we move the tools (qemu-img, qemu-io, qemu-nbd...etc) to the
> > > tools directory (virtiofsd seems to feel alone there)?
> >
> > I think that would be a good thing, yes (things documented in docs/tools
> > should have their source code in tools).
>
> Maybe we should define then what a tool is. I think contrib/ has a few
> more things that could be considered tools.
I think that's more that contrib/ is a weird mess and dumping
ground (as directories named "contrib" usually are -- it often
seems to mean "pile of random unmaintained stuff"). If there are
things in it that have better homes elsewhere it would be good to
move them too.
thanks
-- PMM
^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 23+ messages in thread
* Re: [RFC] Move tools sources to the tools directory (was Re: [PATCH v2] MAINTAINERS: Fix the location of tools manuals)
2021-02-04 14:22 ` [RFC] Move tools sources to the tools directory (was Re: [PATCH v2] MAINTAINERS: Fix the location of tools manuals) Wainer dos Santos Moschetta
2021-02-04 14:31 ` Peter Maydell
@ 2021-02-04 14:40 ` Paolo Bonzini
2021-02-04 17:42 ` Philippe Mathieu-Daudé
2021-02-04 18:24 ` Eric Blake
2021-02-04 20:57 ` John Snow
3 siblings, 1 reply; 23+ messages in thread
From: Paolo Bonzini @ 2021-02-04 14:40 UTC (permalink / raw)
To: Wainer dos Santos Moschetta, Philippe Mathieu-Daudé, qemu-devel
Cc: kwolf, peter.maydell, Dr. David Alan Gilbert, Max Reitz,
Greg Kurz, stefanha
On 04/02/21 15:22, Wainer dos Santos Moschetta wrote:
>>> -F: docs/interop/virtfs-proxy-helper.rst
>>> +F: docs/tools/virtfs-proxy-helper.rst
>>
>> Unrelated, but Paolo once said helpers are not tools.
I think helpers is not a good word. However, if an executable:
- can be started directly by QEMU, or is not useful without an emulator
- is usually too complex for a user to run manually
then it should be documented in docs/interop (not docs/tools). Their
sources however can be in tools/, that's not a problem at all.
Paolo
> Unrelated too, but allow me to ask:
>
> Should we move the tools (qemu-img, qemu-io, qemu-nbd...etc) to the
> tools directory (virtiofsd seems to feel alone there)?
^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 23+ messages in thread
* Re: [RFC] Move tools sources to the tools directory (was Re: [PATCH v2] MAINTAINERS: Fix the location of tools manuals)
2021-02-04 14:40 ` Paolo Bonzini
@ 2021-02-04 17:42 ` Philippe Mathieu-Daudé
2021-02-04 17:55 ` Paolo Bonzini
0 siblings, 1 reply; 23+ messages in thread
From: Philippe Mathieu-Daudé @ 2021-02-04 17:42 UTC (permalink / raw)
To: Paolo Bonzini, Wainer dos Santos Moschetta, qemu-devel
Cc: kwolf, peter.maydell, Dr. David Alan Gilbert, Max Reitz,
Greg Kurz, stefanha
On 2/4/21 3:40 PM, Paolo Bonzini wrote:
> On 04/02/21 15:22, Wainer dos Santos Moschetta wrote:
>>>> -F: docs/interop/virtfs-proxy-helper.rst
>>>> +F: docs/tools/virtfs-proxy-helper.rst
>>>
>>> Unrelated, but Paolo once said helpers are not tools.
>
> I think helpers is not a good word. However, if an executable:
>
> - can be started directly by QEMU, or is not useful without an emulator
>
> - is usually too complex for a user to run manually
>
> then it should be documented in docs/interop (not docs/tools). Their
> sources however can be in tools/, that's not a problem at all.
I understand tools can be built/used standalone (no dependence),
while helpers are companion of another binary, thus dependent on it:
- we can build tools without emulator
- it is probably pointless to build an helper without its helpee
- some binaries can't be use without helpers
Maybe "companion" is a better candidate to describe?
^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 23+ messages in thread
* Re: [RFC] Move tools sources to the tools directory (was Re: [PATCH v2] MAINTAINERS: Fix the location of tools manuals)
2021-02-04 17:42 ` Philippe Mathieu-Daudé
@ 2021-02-04 17:55 ` Paolo Bonzini
0 siblings, 0 replies; 23+ messages in thread
From: Paolo Bonzini @ 2021-02-04 17:55 UTC (permalink / raw)
To: Philippe Mathieu-Daudé, Wainer dos Santos Moschetta, qemu-devel
Cc: kwolf, peter.maydell, Dr. David Alan Gilbert, Max Reitz,
Greg Kurz, stefanha
On 04/02/21 18:42, Philippe Mathieu-Daudé wrote:
> On 2/4/21 3:40 PM, Paolo Bonzini wrote:
>> On 04/02/21 15:22, Wainer dos Santos Moschetta wrote:
>>>>> -F: docs/interop/virtfs-proxy-helper.rst
>>>>> +F: docs/tools/virtfs-proxy-helper.rst
>>>>
>>>> Unrelated, but Paolo once said helpers are not tools.
>>
>> I think helpers is not a good word. However, if an executable:
>>
>> - can be started directly by QEMU, or is not useful without an emulator
>>
>> - is usually too complex for a user to run manually
>>
>> then it should be documented in docs/interop (not docs/tools). Their
>> sources however can be in tools/, that's not a problem at all.
>
> I understand tools can be built/used standalone (no dependence),
> while helpers are companion of another binary, thus dependent on it:
>
> - we can build tools without emulator
> - it is probably pointless to build an helper without its helpee
> - some binaries can't be use without helpers
>
> Maybe "companion" is a better candidate to describe?
I don't think we use the word helper anymore in the build system, so
really the only thing left is whether the documentation goes in tools/
or interop/.
The sources can be in tools/ unconditionally if people decide that's
desirable, either with or without subdirectories. I didn't propose that
because the Meson change was big enough and it can be the decision of
individual maintainers.
Moving the individual tools is easy enough, since most of them are just
one source file, however moving the executables would require changes in
the tests and son on.
Paolo
^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 23+ messages in thread
* Re: [RFC] Move tools sources to the tools directory (was Re: [PATCH v2] MAINTAINERS: Fix the location of tools manuals)
2021-02-04 14:22 ` [RFC] Move tools sources to the tools directory (was Re: [PATCH v2] MAINTAINERS: Fix the location of tools manuals) Wainer dos Santos Moschetta
2021-02-04 14:31 ` Peter Maydell
2021-02-04 14:40 ` Paolo Bonzini
@ 2021-02-04 18:24 ` Eric Blake
2021-02-04 20:57 ` John Snow
3 siblings, 0 replies; 23+ messages in thread
From: Eric Blake @ 2021-02-04 18:24 UTC (permalink / raw)
To: Wainer dos Santos Moschetta, Philippe Mathieu-Daudé, qemu-devel
Cc: kwolf, peter.maydell, Dr. David Alan Gilbert, Max Reitz,
Greg Kurz, stefanha, Paolo Bonzini
On 2/4/21 8:22 AM, Wainer dos Santos Moschetta wrote:
> Unrelated too, but allow me to ask:
>
> Should we move the tools (qemu-img, qemu-io, qemu-nbd...etc) to the
> tools directory (virtiofsd seems to feel alone there)?
No complaint by me for qemu-nbd (I had floated the idea before the meson
conversion, but held off at the time because it would conflict)
--
Eric Blake, Principal Software Engineer
Red Hat, Inc. +1-919-301-3226
Virtualization: qemu.org | libvirt.org
^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 23+ messages in thread
* Re: [RFC] Move tools sources to the tools directory (was Re: [PATCH v2] MAINTAINERS: Fix the location of tools manuals)
2021-02-04 14:22 ` [RFC] Move tools sources to the tools directory (was Re: [PATCH v2] MAINTAINERS: Fix the location of tools manuals) Wainer dos Santos Moschetta
` (2 preceding siblings ...)
2021-02-04 18:24 ` Eric Blake
@ 2021-02-04 20:57 ` John Snow
3 siblings, 0 replies; 23+ messages in thread
From: John Snow @ 2021-02-04 20:57 UTC (permalink / raw)
To: Wainer dos Santos Moschetta, Philippe Mathieu-Daudé, qemu-devel
Cc: kwolf, peter.maydell, Greg Kurz, Dr. David Alan Gilbert,
stefanha, Paolo Bonzini, Max Reitz
On 2/4/21 9:22 AM, Wainer dos Santos Moschetta wrote:
>
> On 2/4/21 10:59 AM, Philippe Mathieu-Daudé wrote:
>> On 2/4/21 2:54 PM, Wainer dos Santos Moschetta wrote:
>>> The qemu-img.rst, qemu-nbd.rst, virtfs-proxy-helper.rst,
>>> qemu-trace-stap.rst,
>>> and virtiofsd.rst manuals were moved to docs/tools, so this update
>>> MAINTAINERS
>>> accordingly.
>>>
>>> Fixes: a08b4a9fe6c ("docs: Move tools documentation to tools manual")
>>> Signed-off-by: Wainer dos Santos Moschetta <wainersm@redhat.com>
>>> ---
>>> v1: was "MAINTAINERS: Fix the location of virtiofsd.rst"
>>> v2: Fixed the location of all files [philmd]
>>>
>>> MAINTAINERS | 10 +++++-----
>>> 1 file changed, 5 insertions(+), 5 deletions(-)
>>>
>>> diff --git a/MAINTAINERS b/MAINTAINERS
>>> index 00626941f1..174425a941 100644
>>> --- a/MAINTAINERS
>>> +++ b/MAINTAINERS
>>> @@ -1829,7 +1829,7 @@ S: Odd Fixes
>>> F: hw/9pfs/
>>> X: hw/9pfs/xen-9p*
>>> F: fsdev/
>>> -F: docs/interop/virtfs-proxy-helper.rst
>>> +F: docs/tools/virtfs-proxy-helper.rst
>> Unrelated, but Paolo once said helpers are not tools.
>
> Unrelated too, but allow me to ask:
>
> Should we move the tools (qemu-img, qemu-io, qemu-nbd...etc) to the
> tools directory (virtiofsd seems to feel alone there)?
>
Only smiles and cheers from me. I recommend a README.rst that can go in
the tools/ directory that explains the purpose of the directory and
standards for inclusion, etc.
Very small blurbs explaining what, broadly, the tools are, could be nice
for passers-by on gitlab while browsing the source structure.
This would allow us to codify much of what happened later in this thread
(what goes here, why? do we support it? etc.)
--js
^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 23+ messages in thread