New member

New member

[Satwantjit Kaur]

Hi,
    I am a final year B.Tech (CSE) student from NIT Jalandhar. I like
programming and I know C and C++ programming languages. I have worked
on IPC and socket programming in C/C++. I wish to take up a project in
Linux Kernel development and contribute to it. Can somebody guide me
further?

-- 
Satwantjit Kaur

New member

[Valdis.Kletnieks at vt.edu]

On Sun, 25 Jan 2015 10:07:44 -0800, Satwantjit Kaur said:
>     I am a final year B.Tech (CSE) student from NIT Jalandhar. I like
> programming and I know C and C++ programming languages. I have worked
> on IPC and socket programming in C/C++. I wish to take up a project in
> Linux Kernel development and contribute to it. Can somebody guide me
> further?

I'll be blunt. Unless you *already* have an interest or desire in a particular
part of the kernel (for instance, filesystems, or networking, or memory
management, etc), you probably aren't a good fit for actually contributing to
the Linux kernel.  You might be able to hack up some code that will satisfy a
professor for a project, but actual contributions are usually held to a higher
standard.

Consider the difference between "I'd like to write a book, but have no idea
what to write about, can somebody suggest whether to write fantasy, or a
romance, or non-fiction about sports, or something", and "I'm thinking about a
story about the adventures of a Roman centurion fighting the Gauls, but need
help making it historically accurate".

Pretty much everybody will agree that the first book is doomed, because
the author obviously isn't connected that much to their project.  The second?
That has a *much* higher chance of producing a good story, simply because
the author has a vision for the project that they can stick to.

And that affects mentoring - nobody who knows anything about writing fantasy
novels will be interested in helping somebody who hasn't even decided if
they want to write about fantasy or scuba diving. Somebody who knows they
want to write about a Roman centurion fighting the Gauls? At that point,
it's worth the 5 minutes for a Roman history expert to give suggestions
and references to the way things were then....

And the Linux kernel is the same way.

Now, if you have a professor that's *insisting* on a Linux kernel project,
that's an entirely different problem. ;)



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New member

[Surendra Patil]

Hi Kaur,

I would recommend you take a look at this videos by Greg -
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LLBrBBImJt4.
He has explained how to get started to contribute Linux Kernel.

Good Luck !!!


On Sun, Jan 25, 2015 at 10:31 AM, <Valdis.Kletnieks@vt.edu> wrote:

> On Sun, 25 Jan 2015 10:07:44 -0800, Satwantjit Kaur said:
> >     I am a final year B.Tech (CSE) student from NIT Jalandhar. I like
> > programming and I know C and C++ programming languages. I have worked
> > on IPC and socket programming in C/C++. I wish to take up a project in
> > Linux Kernel development and contribute to it. Can somebody guide me
> > further?
>
> I'll be blunt. Unless you *already* have an interest or desire in a
> particular
> part of the kernel (for instance, filesystems, or networking, or memory
> management, etc), you probably aren't a good fit for actually contributing
> to
> the Linux kernel.  You might be able to hack up some code that will
> satisfy a
> professor for a project, but actual contributions are usually held to a
> higher
> standard.
>
> Consider the difference between "I'd like to write a book, but have no idea
> what to write about, can somebody suggest whether to write fantasy, or a
> romance, or non-fiction about sports, or something", and "I'm thinking
> about a
> story about the adventures of a Roman centurion fighting the Gauls, but
> need
> help making it historically accurate".
>
> Pretty much everybody will agree that the first book is doomed, because
> the author obviously isn't connected that much to their project.  The
> second?
> That has a *much* higher chance of producing a good story, simply because
> the author has a vision for the project that they can stick to.
>
> And that affects mentoring - nobody who knows anything about writing
> fantasy
> novels will be interested in helping somebody who hasn't even decided if
> they want to write about fantasy or scuba diving. Somebody who knows they
> want to write about a Roman centurion fighting the Gauls? At that point,
> it's worth the 5 minutes for a Roman history expert to give suggestions
> and references to the way things were then....
>
> And the Linux kernel is the same way.
>
> Now, if you have a professor that's *insisting* on a Linux kernel project,
> that's an entirely different problem. ;)
>
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Kernelnewbies mailing list
> Kernelnewbies at kernelnewbies.org
> http://lists.kernelnewbies.org/mailman/listinfo/kernelnewbies
>
>


-- 
------------------------------
Best,
Surendra Patil
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Fwd: New member

[srinivas bakki]

Valdis,
           You got to be polite with people.Not everybody is as smart as
you, but they would like to contribute. Just keep in in mind that there's
no future for linux without such people. You cannot keep bullying everybody
like this.

On Mon, Jan 26, 2015 at 12:46 AM, Surendra Patil <surendra.tux@gmail.com>
wrote:

> Hi Kaur,
>
> I would recommend you take a look at this videos by Greg -
> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LLBrBBImJt4.
> He has explained how to get started to contribute Linux Kernel.
>
> Good Luck !!!
>
>
> On Sun, Jan 25, 2015 at 10:31 AM, <Valdis.Kletnieks@vt.edu> wrote:
>
>> On Sun, 25 Jan 2015 10:07:44 -0800, Satwantjit Kaur said:
>> >     I am a final year B.Tech (CSE) student from NIT Jalandhar. I like
>> > programming and I know C and C++ programming languages. I have worked
>> > on IPC and socket programming in C/C++. I wish to take up a project in
>> > Linux Kernel development and contribute to it. Can somebody guide me
>> > further?
>>
>> I'll be blunt. Unless you *already* have an interest or desire in a
>> particular
>> part of the kernel (for instance, filesystems, or networking, or memory
>> management, etc), you probably aren't a good fit for actually
>> contributing to
>> the Linux kernel.  You might be able to hack up some code that will
>> satisfy a
>> professor for a project, but actual contributions are usually held to a
>> higher
>> standard.
>>
>> Consider the difference between "I'd like to write a book, but have no
>> idea
>> what to write about, can somebody suggest whether to write fantasy, or a
>> romance, or non-fiction about sports, or something", and "I'm thinking
>> about a
>> story about the adventures of a Roman centurion fighting the Gauls, but
>> need
>> help making it historically accurate".
>>
>> Pretty much everybody will agree that the first book is doomed, because
>> the author obviously isn't connected that much to their project.  The
>> second?
>> That has a *much* higher chance of producing a good story, simply because
>> the author has a vision for the project that they can stick to.
>>
>> And that affects mentoring - nobody who knows anything about writing
>> fantasy
>> novels will be interested in helping somebody who hasn't even decided if
>> they want to write about fantasy or scuba diving. Somebody who knows they
>> want to write about a Roman centurion fighting the Gauls? At that point,
>> it's worth the 5 minutes for a Roman history expert to give suggestions
>> and references to the way things were then....
>>
>> And the Linux kernel is the same way.
>>
>> Now, if you have a professor that's *insisting* on a Linux kernel project,
>> that's an entirely different problem. ;)
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> Kernelnewbies mailing list
>> Kernelnewbies at kernelnewbies.org
>> http://lists.kernelnewbies.org/mailman/listinfo/kernelnewbies
>>
>>
>
>
> --
> ------------------------------
> Best,
> Surendra Patil
>
> _______________________________________________
> Kernelnewbies mailing list
> Kernelnewbies at kernelnewbies.org
> http://lists.kernelnewbies.org/mailman/listinfo/kernelnewbies
>
>
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New member

[Robert P. J. Day]

On Sun, 25 Jan 2015, Valdis.Kletnieks at vt.edu wrote:

> On Sun, 25 Jan 2015 10:07:44 -0800, Satwantjit Kaur said:
> >     I am a final year B.Tech (CSE) student from NIT Jalandhar. I like
> > programming and I know C and C++ programming languages. I have worked
> > on IPC and socket programming in C/C++. I wish to take up a project in
> > Linux Kernel development and contribute to it. Can somebody guide me
> > further?

... snip ...

> Consider the difference between "I'd like to write a book, but have
> no idea what to write about, can somebody suggest whether to write
> fantasy, or a romance, or non-fiction about sports, or something",
> and "I'm thinking about a story about the adventures of a Roman
> centurion fighting the Gauls, but need help making it historically
> accurate".

  i think this is the best analogy i've seen to answer this question
... "i want to write a book, can anyone suggest what i should write
about?"

  if you haven't taken the time to peruse the *vast* amount of kernel
material out there and at least started to concentrate on a subsystem
of interest, it's pointless to throw out an utterly general question
like that.

  i agree with valdis ... if you won't even take the time to narrow
down your field of interest and do a little reading on your own, it's
unlikely you're going to make any major contributions.

rday

-- 

========================================================================
Robert P. J. Day                                 Ottawa, Ontario, CANADA
                        http://crashcourse.ca

Twitter:                                       http://twitter.com/rpjday
LinkedIn:                               http://ca.linkedin.com/in/rpjday
========================================================================

New member

[srinivas bakki]

PJ, Let me take head on .. i have been following this mailing list for
quite some time now. And i know where you started from. I also realize when
you started to claim youself a trainer !!! Please do not discourage people
wanting to learn. Either show them the learning curve or back off. Do not
show linux to  be rocket science. The creators want it to be as simple.

On Mon, Jan 26, 2015 at 1:18 AM, Robert P. J. Day <rpjday@crashcourse.ca>
wrote:

> On Sun, 25 Jan 2015, Valdis.Kletnieks at vt.edu wrote:
>
> > On Sun, 25 Jan 2015 10:07:44 -0800, Satwantjit Kaur said:
> > >     I am a final year B.Tech (CSE) student from NIT Jalandhar. I like
> > > programming and I know C and C++ programming languages. I have worked
> > > on IPC and socket programming in C/C++. I wish to take up a project in
> > > Linux Kernel development and contribute to it. Can somebody guide me
> > > further?
>
> ... snip ...
>
> > Consider the difference between "I'd like to write a book, but have
> > no idea what to write about, can somebody suggest whether to write
> > fantasy, or a romance, or non-fiction about sports, or something",
> > and "I'm thinking about a story about the adventures of a Roman
> > centurion fighting the Gauls, but need help making it historically
> > accurate".
>
>   i think this is the best analogy i've seen to answer this question
> ... "i want to write a book, can anyone suggest what i should write
> about?"
>
>   if you haven't taken the time to peruse the *vast* amount of kernel
> material out there and at least started to concentrate on a subsystem
> of interest, it's pointless to throw out an utterly general question
> like that.
>
>   i agree with valdis ... if you won't even take the time to narrow
> down your field of interest and do a little reading on your own, it's
> unlikely you're going to make any major contributions.
>
> rday
>
> --
>
> ========================================================================
> Robert P. J. Day                                 Ottawa, Ontario, CANADA
>                         http://crashcourse.ca
>
> Twitter:                                       http://twitter.com/rpjday
> LinkedIn:                               http://ca.linkedin.com/in/rpjday
> ========================================================================
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Kernelnewbies mailing list
> Kernelnewbies at kernelnewbies.org
> http://lists.kernelnewbies.org/mailman/listinfo/kernelnewbies
>
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New member

[Anuz Pratap Singh Tomar]

On Sun, Jan 25, 2015 at 7:38 PM, srinivas bakki <srinivas.bakki@gmail.com>
wrote:

> Valdis,
>            You got to be polite with people.Not everybody is as smart as
> you, but they would like to contribute. Just keep in in mind that there's
> no future for linux without such people. You cannot keep bullying everybody
> like this.
>

Talking about polite, you are Top posting, how rude is that?


>
> On Mon, Jan 26, 2015 at 12:46 AM, Surendra Patil <surendra.tux@gmail.com>
> wrote:
>
>> Hi Kaur,
>>
>> I would recommend you take a look at this videos by Greg -
>> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LLBrBBImJt4.
>> He has explained how to get started to contribute Linux Kernel.
>>
>> Good Luck !!!
>>
>>
>> On Sun, Jan 25, 2015 at 10:31 AM, <Valdis.Kletnieks@vt.edu> wrote:
>>
>>> On Sun, 25 Jan 2015 10:07:44 -0800, Satwantjit Kaur said:
>>> >     I am a final year B.Tech (CSE) student from NIT Jalandhar. I like
>>> > programming and I know C and C++ programming languages. I have worked
>>> > on IPC and socket programming in C/C++. I wish to take up a project in
>>> > Linux Kernel development and contribute to it. Can somebody guide me
>>> > further?
>>>
>>> I'll be blunt. Unless you *already* have an interest or desire in a
>>> particular
>>> part of the kernel (for instance, filesystems, or networking, or memory
>>> management, etc), you probably aren't a good fit for actually
>>> contributing to
>>> the Linux kernel.  You might be able to hack up some code that will
>>> satisfy a
>>> professor for a project, but actual contributions are usually held to a
>>> higher
>>> standard.
>>>
>>> Consider the difference between "I'd like to write a book, but have no
>>> idea
>>> what to write about, can somebody suggest whether to write fantasy, or a
>>> romance, or non-fiction about sports, or something", and "I'm thinking
>>> about a
>>> story about the adventures of a Roman centurion fighting the Gauls, but
>>> need
>>> help making it historically accurate".
>>>
>>> Pretty much everybody will agree that the first book is doomed, because
>>> the author obviously isn't connected that much to their project.  The
>>> second?
>>> That has a *much* higher chance of producing a good story, simply because
>>> the author has a vision for the project that they can stick to.
>>>
>>> And that affects mentoring - nobody who knows anything about writing
>>> fantasy
>>> novels will be interested in helping somebody who hasn't even decided if
>>> they want to write about fantasy or scuba diving. Somebody who knows they
>>> want to write about a Roman centurion fighting the Gauls? At that point,
>>> it's worth the 5 minutes for a Roman history expert to give suggestions
>>> and references to the way things were then....
>>>
>>> And the Linux kernel is the same way.
>>>
>>> Now, if you have a professor that's *insisting* on a Linux kernel
>>> project,
>>> that's an entirely different problem. ;)
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> Kernelnewbies mailing list
>>> Kernelnewbies at kernelnewbies.org
>>> http://lists.kernelnewbies.org/mailman/listinfo/kernelnewbies
>>>
>>>
>>
>>
>> --
>> ------------------------------
>> Best,
>> Surendra Patil
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> Kernelnewbies mailing list
>> Kernelnewbies at kernelnewbies.org
>> http://lists.kernelnewbies.org/mailman/listinfo/kernelnewbies
>>
>>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Kernelnewbies mailing list
> Kernelnewbies at kernelnewbies.org
> http://lists.kernelnewbies.org/mailman/listinfo/kernelnewbies
>
>


-- 
Thank you
Warm Regards
Anuz
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New member

[srinivas bakki]

Anuz,
         Sorry about that. But am also sorry that you could find a problem
as silly as that. We have a greater problem at hand.

Sorry,
Srinivas Bakki
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New member

[Anuz Pratap Singh Tomar]

On Sun, Jan 25, 2015 at 8:16 PM, srinivas bakki <srinivas.bakki@gmail.com>
wrote:

> Anuz,
>          Sorry about that. But am also sorry that you could find a problem
> as silly as that. We have a greater problem at hand.
>
> As a kernel hacker, no problem is silly like that. All problem needs to be
discussed in open.
I have been on this list for about 8+ years and Robert and Vlad are the
most helpful people on the list. I have not seen Mulyadi for a while but he
was one of the top posters besides these two.
You on the other hand have not helped one bit in this case besides just
criticising them.

Original poster has made no effort whatsoever to actually look into it more
than  knowing keywords like kernel hacking.
To begin with development, one quick google search will reveal the basic
books you need to read.
There is shit tonne of information on kernelnewbies about kernel
development, but that doesn't seem to be mentioned by OP.
Now, this mentality of spoon feeding people, who want to essentially write
code for CORE of an Operating system, which by very definition is one of
the most complex piece of software in existence, is neither good to the
poster nor to the community. To be frank, there was a lot of good advice in
Vlad's mail except for the fact that it was masked in clever banter.

This type of mail spring up every month without fail, where a newbie will
just ask for help without a proper subject line, without a proper issue,
heck sometimes there is not even a real question. Most of these newbies
never turn up with a real question, let alone a problem which need to be
discussed or learned. On main kernel list, this type of mails will not even
be addressed.

I would recommend that if you really want to help OP, then suggest them
with the help and not criticise people, who are really trying to help here.
-- 
Thank you
Warm Regards
Anuz
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New member

[srinivas bakki]

No intentions to criticize(if you think so) really. You got to mature. I
respect Valdis/Robert. I know mulyadi had been the ultimate contributor.
ofcourse iam nobody here but got to say that you are also nobody to preach
me. We are all here to learn and let's do it the way it's supposed to be.

On Mon, Jan 26, 2015 at 2:01 AM, Anuz Pratap Singh Tomar <
chambilkethakur@gmail.com> wrote:

>
>
> On Sun, Jan 25, 2015 at 8:16 PM, srinivas bakki <srinivas.bakki@gmail.com>
> wrote:
>
>> Anuz,
>>          Sorry about that. But am also sorry that you could find a
>> problem as silly as that. We have a greater problem at hand.
>>
>> As a kernel hacker, no problem is silly like that. All problem needs to
> be discussed in open.
> I have been on this list for about 8+ years and Robert and Vlad are the
> most helpful people on the list. I have not seen Mulyadi for a while but he
> was one of the top posters besides these two.
> You on the other hand have not helped one bit in this case besides just
> criticising them.
>
> Original poster has made no effort whatsoever to actually look into it
> more than  knowing keywords like kernel hacking.
> To begin with development, one quick google search will reveal the basic
> books you need to read.
> There is shit tonne of information on kernelnewbies about kernel
> development, but that doesn't seem to be mentioned by OP.
> Now, this mentality of spoon feeding people, who want to essentially write
> code for CORE of an Operating system, which by very definition is one of
> the most complex piece of software in existence, is neither good to the
> poster nor to the community. To be frank, there was a lot of good advice in
> Vlad's mail except for the fact that it was masked in clever banter.
>
> This type of mail spring up every month without fail, where a newbie will
> just ask for help without a proper subject line, without a proper issue,
> heck sometimes there is not even a real question. Most of these newbies
> never turn up with a real question, let alone a problem which need to be
> discussed or learned. On main kernel list, this type of mails will not even
> be addressed.
>
> I would recommend that if you really want to help OP, then suggest them
> with the help and not criticise people, who are really trying to help here.
> --
> Thank you
> Warm Regards
> Anuz
>
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New member

[Anuz Pratap Singh Tomar]

On Sun, Jan 25, 2015 at 8:38 PM, srinivas bakki <srinivas.bakki@gmail.com>
wrote:

> No intentions to criticize(if you think so) really. You got to mature. I
> respect Valdis/Robert. I know mulyadi had been the ultimate contributor.
> ofcourse iam nobody here but got to say that you are also nobody to preach
> me. We are all here to learn and let's do it the way it's supposed to be.
>
> And yet again, you are Top-posting.
I am beginning to think, you are probably trolling, and I should have
ignored you right from the beginning.



*>>resending because not sent to all.*

*Apologies for the noise. *

> On Mon, Jan 26, 2015 at 2:01 AM, Anuz Pratap Singh Tomar <
> chambilkethakur at gmail.com> wrote:
>
>>
>>
>> On Sun, Jan 25, 2015 at 8:16 PM, srinivas bakki <srinivas.bakki@gmail.com
>> > wrote:
>>
>>> Anuz,
>>>          Sorry about that. But am also sorry that you could find a
>>> problem as silly as that. We have a greater problem at hand.
>>>
>>> As a kernel hacker, no problem is silly like that. All problem needs to
>> be discussed in open.
>> I have been on this list for about 8+ years and Robert and Vlad are the
>> most helpful people on the list. I have not seen Mulyadi for a while but he
>> was one of the top posters besides these two.
>> You on the other hand have not helped one bit in this case besides just
>> criticising them.
>>
>> Original poster has made no effort whatsoever to actually look into it
>> more than  knowing keywords like kernel hacking.
>> To begin with development, one quick google search will reveal the basic
>> books you need to read.
>> There is shit tonne of information on kernelnewbies about kernel
>> development, but that doesn't seem to be mentioned by OP.
>> Now, this mentality of spoon feeding people, who want to essentially
>> write code for CORE of an Operating system, which by very definition is one
>> of the most complex piece of software in existence, is neither good to the
>> poster nor to the community. To be frank, there was a lot of good advice in
>> Vlad's mail except for the fact that it was masked in clever banter.
>>
>> This type of mail spring up every month without fail, where a newbie will
>> just ask for help without a proper subject line, without a proper issue,
>> heck sometimes there is not even a real question. Most of these newbies
>> never turn up with a real question, let alone a problem which need to be
>> discussed or learned. On main kernel list, this type of mails will not even
>> be addressed.
>>
>> I would recommend that if you really want to help OP, then suggest them
>> with the help and not criticise people, who are really trying to help here.
>> --
>> Thank you
>> Warm Regards
>> Anuz
>>
>
>


-- 
Thank you
Warm Regards
Anuz
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New member

[Robert P. J. Day]

On Sun, 25 Jan 2015, Anuz Pratap Singh Tomar wrote:

> I have been on this list for about 8+ years and Robert and Vlad are
> the most helpful people on the list...

  while i appreciate the compliment, i have been embarrassingly absent
for a couple years, working my tail off. but i plan on becoming more
regular in the near future.

  in the meantime, in case anyone's interested, i still have a
slightly outdated intro to kernel programming here:

http://crashcourse.ca/introduction-linux-kernel-programming/introduction-linux-kernel-programming

which i hope to update over the next several weeks. i used to charge
for it, but quite some time ago, i just open-sourced it, so you can
help yourself to it but ***please***, don't tell me how out-of-date it
seems ... i already know that. :-)

rday

-- 

========================================================================
Robert P. J. Day                                 Ottawa, Ontario, CANADA
                        http://crashcourse.ca

Twitter:                                       http://twitter.com/rpjday
LinkedIn:                               http://ca.linkedin.com/in/rpjday
========================================================================

New member

[Jonathan Jin]

On Sun, Jan 25, 2015 at 01:29:10PM -0800, Robert P. J. Day wrote:

> http://crashcourse.ca/introduction-linux-kernel-programming/introduction-linux-kernel-programming

Additionally, here are a couple more resources that I've personally
found helpful in my studies of Linux kernel development:

- The Eudyptula Challenge (http://eudyptula-challenge.org/);
- Greg KH's "Linux Kernel in a Nutshell" (http://www.kroah.com/lkn/);
- Robert's own "Linux Kernel Development".

There's an utterly mind-boggling amount of free -- or, at the very
least, affordable -- information and resources out there; it's one of
the benefits of our field and, I believe, of working in open-source in
general. As a fellow newbie to Linux kernel development, I definitely
recommend taking full advantage of it. 

As Valdis, Robert, and company have said, simply showing up out of the
blue and asking something along the lines of "can someone help me get
started" comes off sounding dangeorously close to asking to be spoon-fed
-- not a good impression to make, especially a first one.

-- 
Jonathan Jin
jjin.me

New member

[Robert P. J. Day]

On Sun, 25 Jan 2015, Jonathan Jin wrote:

> On Sun, Jan 25, 2015 at 01:29:10PM -0800, Robert P. J. Day wrote:
>
> > http://crashcourse.ca/introduction-linux-kernel-programming/introduction-linux-kernel-programming
>
> Additionally, here are a couple more resources that I've personally
> found helpful in my studies of Linux kernel development:
>
> - The Eudyptula Challenge (http://eudyptula-challenge.org/);
> - Greg KH's "Linux Kernel in a Nutshell" (http://www.kroah.com/lkn/);
> - Robert's own "Linux Kernel Development".

  as an editor/proofreader of the last two of those above, i can
safely say that they're both starting to show their age but are still
pretty darned good. i would also *massively* recommend the freely
available online courseware from the free electrons folks:

  http://free-electrons.com/docs/

rday

-- 

========================================================================
Robert P. J. Day                                 Ottawa, Ontario, CANADA
                        http://crashcourse.ca

Twitter:                                       http://twitter.com/rpjday
LinkedIn:                               http://ca.linkedin.com/in/rpjday
========================================================================

New member

[Jeshwanth Kumar N K]

On Jan 26, 2015 3:20 AM, "Robert P. J. Day" <rpjday@crashcourse.ca> wrote:
>
> On Sun, 25 Jan 2015, Jonathan Jin wrote:
>
> > On Sun, Jan 25, 2015 at 01:29:10PM -0800, Robert P. J. Day wrote:
> >
> > >
http://crashcourse.ca/introduction-linux-kernel-programming/introduction-linux-kernel-programming
> >
> > Additionally, here are a couple more resources that I've personally
> > found helpful in my studies of Linux kernel development:
> >
> > - The Eudyptula Challenge (http://eudyptula-challenge.org/);
> > - Greg KH's "Linux Kernel in a Nutshell" (http://www.kroah.com/lkn/);
> > - Robert's own "Linux Kernel Development".
>
>   as an editor/proofreader of the last two of those above, i can
> safely say that they're both starting to show their age but are still
> pretty darned good. i would also *massively* recommend the freely
> available online courseware from the free electrons folks:
>
>   http://free-electrons.com/docs/
>
> rday
>
> --
>
> ========================================================================
> Robert P. J. Day                                 Ottawa, Ontario, CANADA
>                         http://crashcourse.ca
>
> Twitter:                                       http://twitter.com/rpjday
> LinkedIn:                               http://ca.linkedin.com/in/rpjday
> ========================================================================
>
> _______________________________________________
> Kernelnewbies mailing list
> Kernelnewbies at kernelnewbies.org
> http://lists.kernelnewbies.org/mailman/listinfo/kernelnewbies

Hi Satwanjit,

If you are doing for final year project, my suggestion is develop some
userspace tools which is not available and useful one. Probably getting
info from kernel and display some info etc. Right now I am not getting any
idea, but developing a tool is good idea. U can identify.

I am mentioning above one because by haven't mentioned any kernel topics u
know.

To learn Linux kernel development. Please google it u will definitely get
it or search in this ML. A lot of people replied for the same question 1000
times :).

Thanks
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New member

[Robert P. J. Day]

On Mon, 26 Jan 2015, Jeshwanth Kumar N K wrote:

> Hi Satwanjit,
>
> If you are doing for final year project, my suggestion is develop
> some userspace tools which is not available and useful one. Probably
> getting info from kernel and display some info etc. Right now I am
> not getting any idea, but developing a tool is good idea. U can
> identify.
>
> I am mentioning above one because by haven't mentioned any kernel
> topics u know.

  what's wrong with ftrace? but seriously, you know what newcomers
might get some value out of doing if they want to contribute? writing
some really, really good documentation or tutorials.

  the mainline kernel developers are, unsurprisingly, tres busy doing,
you know, developing, and often the code gets ahead of the docs. so if
you want, pick a subsystem, read up on it and see if it needs improved
documentation. then write it. there are lots of benefits to this.

  first, there is *always* a desperate need for better documentation,
and absolutely *no* *one* will discourage you from writing docs.

  second, you can't really f**k things up if you stick to
documentation, and because it represents non-functional changes,
you're way more likely to get your patches applied than if you were
trying to contribute code.

  and third (without naming names), if you just want to start getting
your name into the kernel git log (and there's nothing wrong with
having that ambition since it's something you can brag about), it
doesn't get much easier than updating the in-kernel docs.

  if you want a specific project, here's one. start combing through
the Documentation/ directory and identifying the stuff that is
craptastically out of date. there's a lot of docs there, and piles of
it is suffering from neglect. some of it could stand to be updated,
while some of it could stand to be deleted entirely.

  so start reading, and comparing that documentation to the current
kernel source, and start submitting changes to update it. there ... is
that specific enough of a suggestion?

rday

-- 

========================================================================
Robert P. J. Day                                 Ottawa, Ontario, CANADA
                        http://crashcourse.ca

Twitter:                                       http://twitter.com/rpjday
LinkedIn:                               http://ca.linkedin.com/in/rpjday
========================================================================

New member

[Jeshwanth Kumar N K]

On Monday, January 26, 2015, Robert P. J. Day <rpjday@crashcourse.ca> wrote:

> On Mon, 26 Jan 2015, Jeshwanth Kumar N K wrote:
>
> > Hi Satwanjit,
> >
> > If you are doing for final year project, my suggestion is develop
> > some userspace tools which is not available and useful one. Probably
> > getting info from kernel and display some info etc. Right now I am
> > not getting any idea, but developing a tool is good idea. U can
> > identify.
> >
> > I am mentioning above one because by haven't mentioned any kernel
> > topics u know.
>
>   what's wrong with ftrace? but seriously, you know what newcomers
> might get some value out of doing if they want to contribute? writing
> some really, really good documentation or tutorials.
>
>   the mainline kernel developers are, unsurprisingly, tres busy doing,
> you know, developing, and often the code gets ahead of the docs. so if
> you want, pick a subsystem, read up on it and see if it needs improved
> documentation. then write it. there are lots of benefits to this.
>
>   first, there is *always* a desperate need for better documentation,
> and absolutely *no* *one* will discourage you from writing docs.
>
>   second, you can't really f**k things up if you stick to
> documentation, and because it represents non-functional changes,
> you're way more likely to get your patches applied than if you were
> trying to contribute code.
>
>   and third (without naming names), if you just want to start getting
> your name into the kernel git log (and there's nothing wrong with
> having that ambition since it's something you can brag about), it
> doesn't get much easier than updating the in-kernel docs.
>
>   if you want a specific project, here's one. start combing through
> the Documentation/ directory and identifying the stuff that is
> craptastically out of date. there's a lot of docs there, and piles of
> it is suffering from neglect. some of it could stand to be updated,
> while some of it could stand to be deleted entirely.
>
>   so start reading, and comparing that documentation to the current
> kernel source, and start submitting changes to update it. there ... is
> that specific enough of a suggestion?
>
> rday
>
> --
>
>
Robert, Documentation is really good idea :).


> ========================================================================
> Robert P. J. Day                                 Ottawa, Ontario, CANADA
>                         http://crashcourse.ca
>
> Twitter:                                       http://twitter.com/rpjday
> LinkedIn:                               http://ca.linkedin.com/in/rpjday
> ========================================================================
>
>

-- 
Regards
Jeshwanth Kumar N K
Bangalore, India
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New member

[Valdis.Kletnieks at vt.edu]

On Sun, 25 Jan 2015 16:29:00 -0800, "Robert P. J. Day" said:

>   what's wrong with ftrace? but seriously, you know what newcomers
> might get some value out of doing if they want to contribute? writing
> some really, really good documentation or tutorials.

If somebody were to do a really good "Top 25 perf/ftrace tricks/recipes"
for the best incantations for common use cases, they'd have a hard time
buying themselves a beer at a gathering of Linux geeks. ;)

For example: "I don't care the exact function, but which .o or .so is my
program spending its time in?"  (And yes, this *does* come up a lot -for
large programs, there's usually no one single function that burns enough
CPU time to dominate - but if you look at the top 5 shared libraries,
you can pretty much tell "Yeah, those 5 are where I expect it to be burning
a lot of time" or "Wow, why is *that* library I've never heard of at number
2 on the list?"...)

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New member

[Anand Moon]

Hi All,

How about working on ARM development board.

We get to work much close to the latest kernel and features that are build for SOC.
More over we can maintain and test out changes on development boards
and submit our changes to LKM.

Also it fast way to contribute to the LKM.

-Anand Moon



On Monday, January 26, 2015 9:17 AM, "Valdis.Kletnieks at vt.edu" <Valdis.Kletnieks@vt.edu> wrote:
On Sun, 25 Jan 2015 16:29:00 -0800, "Robert P. J. Day" said:

>   what's wrong with ftrace? but seriously, you know what newcomers
> might get some value out of doing if they want to contribute? writing
> some really, really good documentation or tutorials.

If somebody were to do a really good "Top 25 perf/ftrace tricks/recipes"
for the best incantations for common use cases, they'd have a hard time
buying themselves a beer at a gathering of Linux geeks. ;)

For example: "I don't care the exact function, but which .o or .so is my
program spending its time in?"  (And yes, this *does* come up a lot -for
large programs, there's usually no one single function that burns enough
CPU time to dominate - but if you look at the top 5 shared libraries,
you can pretty much tell "Yeah, those 5 are where I expect it to be burning
a lot of time" or "Wow, why is *that* library I've never heard of at number
2 on the list?"...)


_______________________________________________
Kernelnewbies mailing list
Kernelnewbies at kernelnewbies.org
http://lists.kernelnewbies.org/mailman/listinfo/kernelnewbies

New member

[Silvan Jegen]

Am 2015-01-26 04:45, schrieb Valdis.Kletnieks at vt.edu:
> On Sun, 25 Jan 2015 16:29:00 -0800, "Robert P. J. Day" said:
> 
>>   what's wrong with ftrace? but seriously, you know what newcomers
>> might get some value out of doing if they want to contribute? writing
>> some really, really good documentation or tutorials.
> 
> If somebody were to do a really good "Top 25 perf/ftrace 
> tricks/recipes"
> for the best incantations for common use cases, they'd have a hard time
> buying themselves a beer at a gathering of Linux geeks. ;)

Actually, I was interested in writing something along these lines but in 
practice, Brendan Gregg (who is amazing) probably has you covered.

http://www.brendangregg.com/linuxperf.html


Cheers,

Silvan

New member

[Mulyadi Santosa]

On Mon, Jan 26, 2015 at 1:07 AM, Satwantjit Kaur <99satwant@gmail.com>
wrote:

> Hi,
>     I am a final year B.Tech (CSE) student from NIT Jalandhar. I like
> programming and I know C and C++ programming languages. I have worked
> on IPC and socket programming in C/C++. I wish to take up a project in
> Linux Kernel development and contribute to it. Can somebody guide me
> further?
>
> --
> Satwantjit Kaur
>


Dear all

This is an interesting discussion, because it always comes up frequently.

Oh and btw, thank you for mentioning my name as contributor although I am
rarely joining in lately.

here's my view:
I whole heartedly agree with Valdis, Anuz and Robert, that to get into
kernel development, you need to have "vision" first.

However, as someone who grew interest at kernel development while digging
into clustering, I can tell you that sometimes (or most of the times) the
"vision" isn't always within us from day one. So, my trick is, (hopefully
it will work with you too): think about your own OS installation (at home,
office, etc_ and what bugs you most and how you want it to make it better?

Maybe you want it to feel snappier when you click mouse? then perhaps you
need to jump into scheduler.

Maybe you feel awful when you see your OS chews memory too much (although
you're not sure whether to blame OS, your web browser, your office suite
etc), then maybe memory management is the way to go.

Or maybe you're sick your lovely ipod isn't detected properly? then go
ahead into device driver, possibly into USB (cmiiw people).

But above all, you need to be careful not to feed kernel something that can
be done in user space e.g security policy is mostly user space domain.
Evaluate your need properly

PS: guys, i am always monitoring this list passively, so  I am still in :)



-- 
regards,

Mulyadi Santosa
Freelance Linux trainer and consultant

blog: the-hydra.blogspot.com
training: mulyaditraining.blogspot.com
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New member

[John de la Garza]

On Sun, Jan 25, 2015 at 08:10:15PM +0000, Anuz Pratap Singh Tomar wrote:
> On Sun, Jan 25, 2015 at 7:38 PM, srinivas bakki <srinivas.bakki@gmail.com>
> wrote:
> 
> > Valdis,
> >            You got to be polite with people.Not everybody is as smart as
> > you, but they would like to contribute. Just keep in in mind that there's
> > no future for linux without such people. You cannot keep bullying everybody
> > like this.
> >
> 
> Talking about polite, you are Top posting, how rude is that?

I thought the post was very helpfull and not rude at all.  I guess we
all perceive things differently.

New member

[John de la Garza]

On Mon, Jan 26, 2015 at 01:46:26AM +0530, srinivas bakki wrote:
> Anuz,
>          Sorry about that. But am also sorry that you could find a problem
> as silly as that. We have a greater problem at hand.
> 

I don't think top posting is a silly problem.  I think it makes it hard
to follow the thread and the archive.

New member

[Bjørn Mork]

John de la Garza <john@jjdev.com> writes:
> On Sun, Jan 25, 2015 at 08:10:15PM +0000, Anuz Pratap Singh Tomar wrote:
>> On Sun, Jan 25, 2015 at 7:38 PM, srinivas bakki <srinivas.bakki@gmail.com>
>> wrote:
>> 
>> > Valdis,
>> >            You got to be polite with people.Not everybody is as smart as
>> > you, but they would like to contribute. Just keep in in mind that there's
>> > no future for linux without such people. You cannot keep bullying everybody
>> > like this.
>> >
>> 
>> Talking about polite, you are Top posting, how rude is that?
>
> I thought the post was very helpfull and not rude at all.  I guess we
> all perceive things differently.

This document is written for the Debian project, but I believe it's a
good guide to any open mailing list:
https://www.debian.org/code_of_conduct

I am pretty sure all participants in this thread are trying to help. But
I will ask you all to consider the "In case of problems" section of that
document before continuing this discussion.  In particular:

 "Assume good faith; it is more likely that participants are unaware of
  their bad behaviour than that they intentionally try to degrade the
  quality of the discussion."


In my experience, you will miss a lot if you disregard articles you find
"rude".  Direct and concise advice might sometimes come out harsher than
it was meant.  It doesn't make the advice any less worth. On the
contrary.


Thanks,
Bj?rn

New member

[Albert Coder]

On Sun, Jan 25, 2015 at 11:37 PM, Satwantjit Kaur <99satwant@gmail.com> wrote:
> I am a final year B.Tech (CSE) student from NIT Jalandhar. I like
> programming and I know C and C++ programming languages. I have worked
> on IPC and socket programming in C/C++. I wish to take up a project in
> Linux Kernel development and contribute to it. Can somebody guide me
> further?


Hi Satwantjit,

If I had introduced myself, I would have done it in similar fashion
too (as we do similarly in other mailing lists too eg: BRL-CAD). Since
we are newbies we are inexperienced and we cannot at once decide what
we need to contribute in without knowing what exactly it is. But yes
we need to do some homework before asking that's what I have learnt
from this uber fruitful discussion.

And yes it would be cool if you write a blog post for the newbies like
"DOs and DONT DOs before introducing in mailing lists." ;-)

P.S. Don't be disgruntled with the responses but inspired as all are
willing to help but the other way. ;-) Let's contribute as we have a
number of suggested resources!

-- 
Thanks
Albert
www.coderalbert.wordpress.com
https://github.com/albertcoder/
|| Smooth seas do not make skillful sailors. ||
||  If you are not pursuing your goal, you are literally committing
spiritual SUICIDE. ||

New member

[Satwantjit Kaur]

On Tue, Jan 27, 2015 at 9:32 AM, Albert Coder <eralbert9191@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> Hi Satwantjit,
>
> If I had introduced myself, I would have done it in similar fashion
> too (as we do similarly in other mailing lists too eg: BRL-CAD). Since
> we are newbies we are inexperienced and we cannot at once decide what
> we need to contribute in without knowing what exactly it is. But yes
> we need to do some homework before asking that's what I have learnt
> from this uber fruitful discussion.
>
> And yes it would be cool if you write a blog post for the newbies like
> "DOs and DONT DOs before introducing in mailing lists." ;-)
>
> P.S. Don't be disgruntled with the responses but inspired as all are
> willing to help but the other way. ;-) Let's contribute as we have a
> number of suggested resources!
>
Sure, I found the replies really helpful. I am referring to the
tutorials and videos for learning about Linux Kernel Development. I
will try to explore and find the part that interests me the most, so
that I can contribute to it.

-- 
Satwantjit Kaur