patented FTL format

patented FTL format

[Matthias Fuchs]

Hi,

I found this notice in drivers/mtd/ftl.c:

 LEGAL NOTE: The FTL format is patented by M-Systems.  They have
    granted a license for its use with PCMCIA devices:

     "M-Systems grants a royalty-free, non-exclusive license under
      any presently existing M-Systems intellectual property rights
      necessary for the design and development of FTL-compatible
      drivers, file systems and utilities using the data formats with
      PCMCIA PC Cards as described in the PCMCIA Flash Translation
      Layer (FTL) Specification."

    Use of the FTL format for non-PCMCIA applications may be an
    infringement of these patents.  For additional information,
    contact M-Systems (http://www.m-sys.com) directly.


Can anybody tell me what exactly is patended here? The general implementation
of a translation layer to use non-NAND filesystems on top of NAND? 
Or a specific format (as stated) - meaning a data layout - on how or where
to store information on a NAND flash?

Or with other words, does a translation layer (we would also call it differently)
that allows using things like ext3 on a bare NAND chip conflict with any patents?

This is not a technical question about how this could be implemented.

Matthias

Re: patented FTL format

[David Brown]

On Wed, Sep 30, 2009 at 05:32:34PM +0200, Matthias Fuchs wrote:

>Or with other words, does a translation layer (we would also call it
>differently) that allows using things like ext3 on a bare NAND chip
>conflict with any patents?

I'm going to guess that most of the people who know the answer to this
question won't be able to talk about it.  Opinions from
non-legal-experts probably isn't all that useful anyway.

David

Re: patented FTL format

[Matthias Fuchs]

On Wednesday 30 September 2009 19:28, David Brown wrote:
> On Wed, Sep 30, 2009 at 05:32:34PM +0200, Matthias Fuchs wrote:
> 
> >Or with other words, does a translation layer (we would also call it
> >differently) that allows using things like ext3 on a bare NAND chip
> >conflict with any patents?
> 
> I'm going to guess that most of the people who know the answer to this
> question won't be able to talk about it.  Opinions from
> non-legal-experts probably isn't all that useful anyway.
> 
I hope to get an idea about a starting point where to find the answer.
I did no ask anybody to sign his answer.

I expected get heard by the maintainer of the FTL code. Somebody
must have added the notice to the source code. Perhaps that person
knows why :-)

Matthias

Re: patented FTL format

[Wolfram Sang]

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> I expected get heard by the maintainer of the FTL code. Somebody
> must have added the notice to the source code. Perhaps that person
> knows why :-)

'git blame <file>' tells you the author/commit that changed a specific line.
Then, 'git show <commit>' shows you also the description. That usually helps to
find the mail-thread accompanying the patch. Dunno if it works in this case,
but it often does.

-- 
Pengutronix e.K.                           | Wolfram Sang                |
Industrial Linux Solutions                 | http://www.pengutronix.de/  |

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Re: patented FTL format

[Matthias Fuchs]

On Thursday 01 October 2009 12:30, Wolfram Sang wrote:
> > I expected get heard by the maintainer of the FTL code. Somebody
> > must have added the notice to the source code. Perhaps that person
> > knows why :-)
> 
> 'git blame <file>' tells you the author/commit that changed a specific line.
> Then, 'git show <commit>' shows you also the description. That usually helps to
> find the mail-thread accompanying the patch. Dunno if it works in this case,
> but it often does.
Hmm, this brings me to Linus' initial git import in 2.6.12 times :-)

Matthias

Re: patented FTL format

[Wolfram Sang]

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> > 'git blame <file>' tells you the author/commit that changed a specific line.
> > Then, 'git show <commit>' shows you also the description. That usually helps to
> > find the mail-thread accompanying the patch. Dunno if it works in this case,
> > but it often does.
> Hmm, this brings me to Linus' initial git import in 2.6.12 times :-)

There is a history-tree on kernel.org (by tglx).

-- 
Pengutronix e.K.                           | Wolfram Sang                |
Industrial Linux Solutions                 | http://www.pengutronix.de/  |

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