* Xen 4.12 release planning @ 2018-07-25 7:19 Juergen Gross 2018-07-25 8:15 ` Julien Grall 2018-07-26 22:13 ` Stefano Stabellini 0 siblings, 2 replies; 20+ messages in thread From: Juergen Gross @ 2018-07-25 7:19 UTC (permalink / raw) To: xen-devel Its time to plan the Xen 4.12 release dates. There have been concerns with the schedule of 6 months between releases, as this scheme is leading to too many supported versions of Xen at a time. The needed resources to backport bug fixes and security fixes as well as doing the tests for all those releases are a limiting factor to push out the current main release as well as point releases on time. After some discussions at the Xen developer summit, on xen-devel and between the committers a slightly longer release cycle of 8 or 9 months was suggested. With 18 months of full support and 36 months of security support the number of concurrent supported releases will be the same with either 8 or 9 months release cycles, so I have chosen an 8 month cycle for now. Having only 3 possible times in the year for a release will make it easier to avoid major holiday seasons. In case there is no objection I'm planning Xen 4.12 with: * Last posting date: December 14th, 2018 * Hard code freeze: January 11th, 2019 * Release: March 7th, 2019 Release of Xen 4.13 would then be early November 2019, 4.14 at early July 2020. Juergen _______________________________________________ Xen-devel mailing list Xen-devel@lists.xenproject.org https://lists.xenproject.org/mailman/listinfo/xen-devel ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 20+ messages in thread
* Re: Xen 4.12 release planning 2018-07-25 7:19 Xen 4.12 release planning Juergen Gross @ 2018-07-25 8:15 ` Julien Grall 2018-07-25 8:19 ` Andrew Cooper 2018-07-26 22:13 ` Stefano Stabellini 1 sibling, 1 reply; 20+ messages in thread From: Julien Grall @ 2018-07-25 8:15 UTC (permalink / raw) To: Juergen Gross, xen-devel Hi Juergen, On 25/07/18 08:19, Juergen Gross wrote: > Its time to plan the Xen 4.12 release dates. > > There have been concerns with the schedule of 6 months between releases, > as this scheme is leading to too many supported versions of Xen at a > time. The needed resources to backport bug fixes and security fixes as > well as doing the tests for all those releases are a limiting factor to > push out the current main release as well as point releases on time. > > After some discussions at the Xen developer summit, on xen-devel and > between the committers a slightly longer release cycle of 8 or 9 months > was suggested. > > With 18 months of full support and 36 months of security support the > number of concurrent supported releases will be the same with either 8 > or 9 months release cycles, so I have chosen an 8 month cycle for now. > Having only 3 possible times in the year for a release will make it > easier to avoid major holiday seasons. > > In case there is no objection I'm planning Xen 4.12 with: > > * Last posting date: December 14th, 2018 > * Hard code freeze: January 11th, 2019 In general, you would expect western people to slow down during Christmas period and have to deal with a pile of e-mail just after New Year. So I think, this is not very convenient period for a code freeze. I usually take more holidays around Christmas and New Year. For this year, I will be on holidays from 21st December until the 13th January. This basically means my cut off for Arm patches will be 21st December or potentially few days before to avoid having the likely last minute rush. Cheers, -- Julien Grall _______________________________________________ Xen-devel mailing list Xen-devel@lists.xenproject.org https://lists.xenproject.org/mailman/listinfo/xen-devel ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 20+ messages in thread
* Re: Xen 4.12 release planning 2018-07-25 8:15 ` Julien Grall @ 2018-07-25 8:19 ` Andrew Cooper 2018-07-25 9:22 ` Juergen Gross 0 siblings, 1 reply; 20+ messages in thread From: Andrew Cooper @ 2018-07-25 8:19 UTC (permalink / raw) To: Julien Grall, Juergen Gross, xen-devel On 25/07/2018 09:15, Julien Grall wrote: > Hi Juergen, > > On 25/07/18 08:19, Juergen Gross wrote: >> Its time to plan the Xen 4.12 release dates. >> >> There have been concerns with the schedule of 6 months between releases, >> as this scheme is leading to too many supported versions of Xen at a >> time. The needed resources to backport bug fixes and security fixes as >> well as doing the tests for all those releases are a limiting factor to >> push out the current main release as well as point releases on time. >> >> After some discussions at the Xen developer summit, on xen-devel and >> between the committers a slightly longer release cycle of 8 or 9 months >> was suggested. >> >> With 18 months of full support and 36 months of security support the >> number of concurrent supported releases will be the same with either 8 >> or 9 months release cycles, so I have chosen an 8 month cycle for now. >> Having only 3 possible times in the year for a release will make it >> easier to avoid major holiday seasons. > >> In case there is no objection I'm planning Xen 4.12 with: >> >> * Last posting date: December 14th, 2018 >> * Hard code freeze: January 11th, 2019 > > In general, you would expect western people to slow down during > Christmas period and have to deal with a pile of e-mail just after New > Year. So I think, this is not very convenient period for a code freeze. > > I usually take more holidays around Christmas and New Year. For this > year, I will be on holidays from 21st December until the 13th January. > This basically means my cut off for Arm patches will be 21st December > or potentially few days before to avoid having the likely last minute > rush. Given that we have decided to switch to a difference cadence, it would be prudent to work out when the best alignment of an 8-month cadence would be, rather than having it 8 months from now. If that means a one-off shorter or longer cycle for 4.12 then so be it. ~Andrew _______________________________________________ Xen-devel mailing list Xen-devel@lists.xenproject.org https://lists.xenproject.org/mailman/listinfo/xen-devel ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 20+ messages in thread
* Re: Xen 4.12 release planning 2018-07-25 8:19 ` Andrew Cooper @ 2018-07-25 9:22 ` Juergen Gross 2018-07-25 11:24 ` George Dunlap 0 siblings, 1 reply; 20+ messages in thread From: Juergen Gross @ 2018-07-25 9:22 UTC (permalink / raw) To: Andrew Cooper, Julien Grall, xen-devel On 25/07/18 10:19, Andrew Cooper wrote: > On 25/07/2018 09:15, Julien Grall wrote: >> Hi Juergen, >> >> On 25/07/18 08:19, Juergen Gross wrote: >>> Its time to plan the Xen 4.12 release dates. >>> >>> There have been concerns with the schedule of 6 months between releases, >>> as this scheme is leading to too many supported versions of Xen at a >>> time. The needed resources to backport bug fixes and security fixes as >>> well as doing the tests for all those releases are a limiting factor to >>> push out the current main release as well as point releases on time. >>> >>> After some discussions at the Xen developer summit, on xen-devel and >>> between the committers a slightly longer release cycle of 8 or 9 months >>> was suggested. >>> >>> With 18 months of full support and 36 months of security support the >>> number of concurrent supported releases will be the same with either 8 >>> or 9 months release cycles, so I have chosen an 8 month cycle for now. >>> Having only 3 possible times in the year for a release will make it >>> easier to avoid major holiday seasons. > >>> In case there is no objection I'm planning Xen 4.12 with: >>> >>> * Last posting date: December 14th, 2018 >>> * Hard code freeze: January 11th, 2019 >> >> In general, you would expect western people to slow down during >> Christmas period and have to deal with a pile of e-mail just after New >> Year. So I think, this is not very convenient period for a code freeze. >> >> I usually take more holidays around Christmas and New Year. For this >> year, I will be on holidays from 21st December until the 13th January. >> This basically means my cut off for Arm patches will be 21st December >> or potentially few days before to avoid having the likely last minute >> rush. > > Given that we have decided to switch to a difference cadence, it would > be prudent to work out when the best alignment of an 8-month cadence > would be, rather than having it 8 months from now. If that means a > one-off shorter or longer cycle for 4.12 then so be it. The general holiday seasons are: - Chinese new year (end of January ... mid of February), 2 weeks - Eastern (end of March ... end of April), only a weak dependency? - summer (August?), second half of July and first half of September as a weak dependency - Christmas (end of December ... start of January), adding one week as a weak dependency We don't like the planned release to be in or just before a holiday season. The period between last posting date and freeze should last 2 weeks, the freeze period should last 6 weeks. In the diagram below I have used a 'X' for a major holiday season and a 'x' for a weak dependency. The lines below are possible release date variants just shifted by a weak each to show all possibilities. Jan Feb Mar Apr May Jun Jul Aug Sep Oct Nov Dec Xx.XXXXX...xxxx...........xxXXXXx..............X holidays ffFFFFFFR.......ffFFFFFFR.......ffFFFFFFR....... .ffFFFFFFR.......ffFFFFFFR.......ffFFFFFFR...... ..ffFFFFFFR.......ffFFFFFFR.......ffFFFFFFR..... ...ffFFFFFFR.......ffFFFFFFR.......ffFFFFFFR.... ....ffFFFFFFR.......ffFFFFFFR.......ffFFFFFFR... .....ffFFFFFFR.......ffFFFFFFR.......ffFFFFFFR.. ......ffFFFFFFR.......ffFFFFFFR.......ffFFFFFFR. .......ffFFFFFFR.......ffFFFFFFR.......ffFFFFFFR R.......ffFFFFFFR.......ffFFFFFFR.......ffFFFFFF FR.......ffFFFFFFR.......ffFFFFFFR.......ffFFFFF FFR.......ffFFFFFFR.......ffFFFFFFR.......ffFFFF FFFR.......ffFFFFFFR.......ffFFFFFFR.......ffFFF FFFFR.......ffFFFFFFR.......ffFFFFFFR.......ffFF FFFFFR.......ffFFFFFFR.......ffFFFFFFR.......ffF FFFFFFR.......ffFFFFFFR.......ffFFFFFFR.......ff fFFFFFFR.......ffFFFFFFR.......ffFFFFFFR.......f We can rule out several variants with release dates just before or in a holiday season: Jan Feb Mar Apr May Jun Jul Aug Sep Oct Nov Dec Xx.XXXXX...xxxx...........xxXXXXx..............X holidays ffFFFFFFR.......ffFFFFFFR.......ffFFFFFFR....... .ffFFFFFFR.......ffFFFFFFR.......ffFFFFFFR...... Best fit seems to be releasing in first half of March/July/November. The main clash seems to be Chinese new year in the freeze period, but avoiding that would mean we'd have to either move into Christmas or Eastern, or to use a schedule with varying periods. Please remember that Chinese new year is only 2 weeks long (at varying dates) so only 2 weeks of the freeze period are hit. Next year the Chinese new year will be at February 5th. For my 4.12 plan I've added some extra weeks between last posting date and release date to accommodate for the holiday seasons, resulting in my suggestion. Juergen _______________________________________________ Xen-devel mailing list Xen-devel@lists.xenproject.org https://lists.xenproject.org/mailman/listinfo/xen-devel ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 20+ messages in thread
* Re: Xen 4.12 release planning 2018-07-25 9:22 ` Juergen Gross @ 2018-07-25 11:24 ` George Dunlap 2018-07-25 11:30 ` Andrew Cooper 2018-07-25 11:39 ` Lars Kurth 0 siblings, 2 replies; 20+ messages in thread From: George Dunlap @ 2018-07-25 11:24 UTC (permalink / raw) To: Juergen Gross; +Cc: Andrew Cooper, Julien Grall, xen-devel On Wed, Jul 25, 2018 at 10:22 AM, Juergen Gross <jgross@suse.com> wrote: > On 25/07/18 10:19, Andrew Cooper wrote: >> On 25/07/2018 09:15, Julien Grall wrote: >>> Hi Juergen, >>> >>> On 25/07/18 08:19, Juergen Gross wrote: >>>> Its time to plan the Xen 4.12 release dates. >>>> >>>> There have been concerns with the schedule of 6 months between releases, >>>> as this scheme is leading to too many supported versions of Xen at a >>>> time. The needed resources to backport bug fixes and security fixes as >>>> well as doing the tests for all those releases are a limiting factor to >>>> push out the current main release as well as point releases on time. >>>> >>>> After some discussions at the Xen developer summit, on xen-devel and >>>> between the committers a slightly longer release cycle of 8 or 9 months >>>> was suggested. >>>> >>>> With 18 months of full support and 36 months of security support the >>>> number of concurrent supported releases will be the same with either 8 >>>> or 9 months release cycles, so I have chosen an 8 month cycle for now. >>>> Having only 3 possible times in the year for a release will make it >>>> easier to avoid major holiday seasons. > >>>> In case there is no objection I'm planning Xen 4.12 with: >>>> >>>> * Last posting date: December 14th, 2018 >>>> * Hard code freeze: January 11th, 2019 >>> >>> In general, you would expect western people to slow down during >>> Christmas period and have to deal with a pile of e-mail just after New >>> Year. So I think, this is not very convenient period for a code freeze. >>> >>> I usually take more holidays around Christmas and New Year. For this >>> year, I will be on holidays from 21st December until the 13th January. >>> This basically means my cut off for Arm patches will be 21st December >>> or potentially few days before to avoid having the likely last minute >>> rush. >> >> Given that we have decided to switch to a difference cadence, it would >> be prudent to work out when the best alignment of an 8-month cadence >> would be, rather than having it 8 months from now. If that means a >> one-off shorter or longer cycle for 4.12 then so be it. > > The general holiday seasons are: > > - Chinese new year (end of January ... mid of February), 2 weeks > - Eastern (end of March ... end of April), only a weak dependency? > - summer (August?), second half of July and first half of September as > a weak dependency > - Christmas (end of December ... start of January), adding one week as > a weak dependency > > We don't like the planned release to be in or just before a holiday > season. The period between last posting date and freeze should last > 2 weeks, the freeze period should last 6 weeks. > > In the diagram below I have used a 'X' for a major holiday season and > a 'x' for a weak dependency. The lines below are possible release date > variants just shifted by a weak each to show all possibilities. > > Jan Feb Mar Apr May Jun Jul Aug Sep Oct Nov Dec > Xx.XXXXX...xxxx...........xxXXXXx..............X holidays > ffFFFFFFR.......ffFFFFFFR.......ffFFFFFFR....... > .ffFFFFFFR.......ffFFFFFFR.......ffFFFFFFR...... > ..ffFFFFFFR.......ffFFFFFFR.......ffFFFFFFR..... > ...ffFFFFFFR.......ffFFFFFFR.......ffFFFFFFR.... > ....ffFFFFFFR.......ffFFFFFFR.......ffFFFFFFR... > .....ffFFFFFFR.......ffFFFFFFR.......ffFFFFFFR.. > ......ffFFFFFFR.......ffFFFFFFR.......ffFFFFFFR. > .......ffFFFFFFR.......ffFFFFFFR.......ffFFFFFFR > R.......ffFFFFFFR.......ffFFFFFFR.......ffFFFFFF > FR.......ffFFFFFFR.......ffFFFFFFR.......ffFFFFF > FFR.......ffFFFFFFR.......ffFFFFFFR.......ffFFFF > FFFR.......ffFFFFFFR.......ffFFFFFFR.......ffFFF > FFFFR.......ffFFFFFFR.......ffFFFFFFR.......ffFF > FFFFFR.......ffFFFFFFR.......ffFFFFFFR.......ffF > FFFFFFR.......ffFFFFFFR.......ffFFFFFFR.......ff > fFFFFFFR.......ffFFFFFFR.......ffFFFFFFR.......f > > We can rule out several variants with release dates just before or in a > holiday season: > > Jan Feb Mar Apr May Jun Jul Aug Sep Oct Nov Dec > Xx.XXXXX...xxxx...........xxXXXXx..............X holidays > ffFFFFFFR.......ffFFFFFFR.......ffFFFFFFR....... > .ffFFFFFFR.......ffFFFFFFR.......ffFFFFFFR...... > > Best fit seems to be releasing in first half of March/July/November. The > main clash seems to be Chinese new year in the freeze period, but > avoiding that would mean we'd have to either move into Christmas or > Eastern, or to use a schedule with varying periods. > > Please remember that Chinese new year is only 2 weeks long (at varying > dates) so only 2 weeks of the freeze period are hit. Next year the > Chinese new year will be at February 5th. > > For my 4.12 plan I've added some extra weeks between last posting date > and release date to accommodate for the holiday seasons, resulting in > my suggestion. Thanks for the detailed analysis Juregen. This seems good to me. -George _______________________________________________ Xen-devel mailing list Xen-devel@lists.xenproject.org https://lists.xenproject.org/mailman/listinfo/xen-devel ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 20+ messages in thread
* Re: Xen 4.12 release planning 2018-07-25 11:24 ` George Dunlap @ 2018-07-25 11:30 ` Andrew Cooper 2018-07-25 11:34 ` George Dunlap 2018-07-25 11:34 ` Juergen Gross 2018-07-25 11:39 ` Lars Kurth 1 sibling, 2 replies; 20+ messages in thread From: Andrew Cooper @ 2018-07-25 11:30 UTC (permalink / raw) To: George Dunlap, Juergen Gross; +Cc: xen-devel, Julien Grall On 25/07/18 12:24, George Dunlap wrote: > On Wed, Jul 25, 2018 at 10:22 AM, Juergen Gross <jgross@suse.com> wrote: >> On 25/07/18 10:19, Andrew Cooper wrote: >>> On 25/07/2018 09:15, Julien Grall wrote: >>>> Hi Juergen, >>>> >>>> On 25/07/18 08:19, Juergen Gross wrote: >>>>> Its time to plan the Xen 4.12 release dates. >>>>> >>>>> There have been concerns with the schedule of 6 months between releases, >>>>> as this scheme is leading to too many supported versions of Xen at a >>>>> time. The needed resources to backport bug fixes and security fixes as >>>>> well as doing the tests for all those releases are a limiting factor to >>>>> push out the current main release as well as point releases on time. >>>>> >>>>> After some discussions at the Xen developer summit, on xen-devel and >>>>> between the committers a slightly longer release cycle of 8 or 9 months >>>>> was suggested. >>>>> >>>>> With 18 months of full support and 36 months of security support the >>>>> number of concurrent supported releases will be the same with either 8 >>>>> or 9 months release cycles, so I have chosen an 8 month cycle for now. >>>>> Having only 3 possible times in the year for a release will make it >>>>> easier to avoid major holiday seasons. > >>>>> In case there is no objection I'm planning Xen 4.12 with: >>>>> >>>>> * Last posting date: December 14th, 2018 >>>>> * Hard code freeze: January 11th, 2019 >>>> In general, you would expect western people to slow down during >>>> Christmas period and have to deal with a pile of e-mail just after New >>>> Year. So I think, this is not very convenient period for a code freeze. >>>> >>>> I usually take more holidays around Christmas and New Year. For this >>>> year, I will be on holidays from 21st December until the 13th January. >>>> This basically means my cut off for Arm patches will be 21st December >>>> or potentially few days before to avoid having the likely last minute >>>> rush. >>> Given that we have decided to switch to a difference cadence, it would >>> be prudent to work out when the best alignment of an 8-month cadence >>> would be, rather than having it 8 months from now. If that means a >>> one-off shorter or longer cycle for 4.12 then so be it. >> The general holiday seasons are: >> >> - Chinese new year (end of January ... mid of February), 2 weeks >> - Eastern (end of March ... end of April), only a weak dependency? >> - summer (August?), second half of July and first half of September as >> a weak dependency >> - Christmas (end of December ... start of January), adding one week as >> a weak dependency >> >> We don't like the planned release to be in or just before a holiday >> season. The period between last posting date and freeze should last >> 2 weeks, the freeze period should last 6 weeks. >> >> In the diagram below I have used a 'X' for a major holiday season and >> a 'x' for a weak dependency. The lines below are possible release date >> variants just shifted by a weak each to show all possibilities. >> >> Jan Feb Mar Apr May Jun Jul Aug Sep Oct Nov Dec >> Xx.XXXXX...xxxx...........xxXXXXx..............X holidays >> ffFFFFFFR.......ffFFFFFFR.......ffFFFFFFR....... >> .ffFFFFFFR.......ffFFFFFFR.......ffFFFFFFR...... >> ..ffFFFFFFR.......ffFFFFFFR.......ffFFFFFFR..... >> ...ffFFFFFFR.......ffFFFFFFR.......ffFFFFFFR.... >> ....ffFFFFFFR.......ffFFFFFFR.......ffFFFFFFR... >> .....ffFFFFFFR.......ffFFFFFFR.......ffFFFFFFR.. >> ......ffFFFFFFR.......ffFFFFFFR.......ffFFFFFFR. >> .......ffFFFFFFR.......ffFFFFFFR.......ffFFFFFFR >> R.......ffFFFFFFR.......ffFFFFFFR.......ffFFFFFF >> FR.......ffFFFFFFR.......ffFFFFFFR.......ffFFFFF >> FFR.......ffFFFFFFR.......ffFFFFFFR.......ffFFFF >> FFFR.......ffFFFFFFR.......ffFFFFFFR.......ffFFF >> FFFFR.......ffFFFFFFR.......ffFFFFFFR.......ffFF >> FFFFFR.......ffFFFFFFR.......ffFFFFFFR.......ffF >> FFFFFFR.......ffFFFFFFR.......ffFFFFFFR.......ff >> fFFFFFFR.......ffFFFFFFR.......ffFFFFFFR.......f >> >> We can rule out several variants with release dates just before or in a >> holiday season: >> >> Jan Feb Mar Apr May Jun Jul Aug Sep Oct Nov Dec >> Xx.XXXXX...xxxx...........xxXXXXx..............X holidays >> ffFFFFFFR.......ffFFFFFFR.......ffFFFFFFR....... >> .ffFFFFFFR.......ffFFFFFFR.......ffFFFFFFR...... >> >> Best fit seems to be releasing in first half of March/July/November. The >> main clash seems to be Chinese new year in the freeze period, but >> avoiding that would mean we'd have to either move into Christmas or >> Eastern, or to use a schedule with varying periods. >> >> Please remember that Chinese new year is only 2 weeks long (at varying >> dates) so only 2 weeks of the freeze period are hit. Next year the >> Chinese new year will be at February 5th. >> >> For my 4.12 plan I've added some extra weeks between last posting date >> and release date to accommodate for the holiday seasons, resulting in >> my suggestion. > Thanks for the detailed analysis Juregen. This seems good to me. I think it is also worth staying that we need to work on reducing the length of the hard freeze date, because as is visible from that diagram, its basically half the year. ~Andrew _______________________________________________ Xen-devel mailing list Xen-devel@lists.xenproject.org https://lists.xenproject.org/mailman/listinfo/xen-devel ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 20+ messages in thread
* Re: Xen 4.12 release planning 2018-07-25 11:30 ` Andrew Cooper @ 2018-07-25 11:34 ` George Dunlap 2018-07-25 11:36 ` Andrew Cooper 2018-07-25 11:34 ` Juergen Gross 1 sibling, 1 reply; 20+ messages in thread From: George Dunlap @ 2018-07-25 11:34 UTC (permalink / raw) To: Andrew Cooper; +Cc: Juergen Gross, xen-devel, Julien Grall On Wed, Jul 25, 2018 at 12:30 PM, Andrew Cooper <andrew.cooper3@citrix.com> wrote: > On 25/07/18 12:24, George Dunlap wrote: >> On Wed, Jul 25, 2018 at 10:22 AM, Juergen Gross <jgross@suse.com> wrote: >>> On 25/07/18 10:19, Andrew Cooper wrote: >>>> On 25/07/2018 09:15, Julien Grall wrote: >>>>> Hi Juergen, >>>>> >>>>> On 25/07/18 08:19, Juergen Gross wrote: >>>>>> Its time to plan the Xen 4.12 release dates. >>>>>> >>>>>> There have been concerns with the schedule of 6 months between releases, >>>>>> as this scheme is leading to too many supported versions of Xen at a >>>>>> time. The needed resources to backport bug fixes and security fixes as >>>>>> well as doing the tests for all those releases are a limiting factor to >>>>>> push out the current main release as well as point releases on time. >>>>>> >>>>>> After some discussions at the Xen developer summit, on xen-devel and >>>>>> between the committers a slightly longer release cycle of 8 or 9 months >>>>>> was suggested. >>>>>> >>>>>> With 18 months of full support and 36 months of security support the >>>>>> number of concurrent supported releases will be the same with either 8 >>>>>> or 9 months release cycles, so I have chosen an 8 month cycle for now. >>>>>> Having only 3 possible times in the year for a release will make it >>>>>> easier to avoid major holiday seasons. > >>>>>> In case there is no objection I'm planning Xen 4.12 with: >>>>>> >>>>>> * Last posting date: December 14th, 2018 >>>>>> * Hard code freeze: January 11th, 2019 >>>>> In general, you would expect western people to slow down during >>>>> Christmas period and have to deal with a pile of e-mail just after New >>>>> Year. So I think, this is not very convenient period for a code freeze. >>>>> >>>>> I usually take more holidays around Christmas and New Year. For this >>>>> year, I will be on holidays from 21st December until the 13th January. >>>>> This basically means my cut off for Arm patches will be 21st December >>>>> or potentially few days before to avoid having the likely last minute >>>>> rush. >>>> Given that we have decided to switch to a difference cadence, it would >>>> be prudent to work out when the best alignment of an 8-month cadence >>>> would be, rather than having it 8 months from now. If that means a >>>> one-off shorter or longer cycle for 4.12 then so be it. >>> The general holiday seasons are: >>> >>> - Chinese new year (end of January ... mid of February), 2 weeks >>> - Eastern (end of March ... end of April), only a weak dependency? >>> - summer (August?), second half of July and first half of September as >>> a weak dependency >>> - Christmas (end of December ... start of January), adding one week as >>> a weak dependency >>> >>> We don't like the planned release to be in or just before a holiday >>> season. The period between last posting date and freeze should last >>> 2 weeks, the freeze period should last 6 weeks. >>> >>> In the diagram below I have used a 'X' for a major holiday season and >>> a 'x' for a weak dependency. The lines below are possible release date >>> variants just shifted by a weak each to show all possibilities. >>> >>> Jan Feb Mar Apr May Jun Jul Aug Sep Oct Nov Dec >>> Xx.XXXXX...xxxx...........xxXXXXx..............X holidays >>> ffFFFFFFR.......ffFFFFFFR.......ffFFFFFFR....... >>> .ffFFFFFFR.......ffFFFFFFR.......ffFFFFFFR...... >>> ..ffFFFFFFR.......ffFFFFFFR.......ffFFFFFFR..... >>> ...ffFFFFFFR.......ffFFFFFFR.......ffFFFFFFR.... >>> ....ffFFFFFFR.......ffFFFFFFR.......ffFFFFFFR... >>> .....ffFFFFFFR.......ffFFFFFFR.......ffFFFFFFR.. >>> ......ffFFFFFFR.......ffFFFFFFR.......ffFFFFFFR. >>> .......ffFFFFFFR.......ffFFFFFFR.......ffFFFFFFR >>> R.......ffFFFFFFR.......ffFFFFFFR.......ffFFFFFF >>> FR.......ffFFFFFFR.......ffFFFFFFR.......ffFFFFF >>> FFR.......ffFFFFFFR.......ffFFFFFFR.......ffFFFF >>> FFFR.......ffFFFFFFR.......ffFFFFFFR.......ffFFF >>> FFFFR.......ffFFFFFFR.......ffFFFFFFR.......ffFF >>> FFFFFR.......ffFFFFFFR.......ffFFFFFFR.......ffF >>> FFFFFFR.......ffFFFFFFR.......ffFFFFFFR.......ff >>> fFFFFFFR.......ffFFFFFFR.......ffFFFFFFR.......f >>> >>> We can rule out several variants with release dates just before or in a >>> holiday season: >>> >>> Jan Feb Mar Apr May Jun Jul Aug Sep Oct Nov Dec >>> Xx.XXXXX...xxxx...........xxXXXXx..............X holidays >>> ffFFFFFFR.......ffFFFFFFR.......ffFFFFFFR....... >>> .ffFFFFFFR.......ffFFFFFFR.......ffFFFFFFR...... >>> >>> Best fit seems to be releasing in first half of March/July/November. The >>> main clash seems to be Chinese new year in the freeze period, but >>> avoiding that would mean we'd have to either move into Christmas or >>> Eastern, or to use a schedule with varying periods. >>> >>> Please remember that Chinese new year is only 2 weeks long (at varying >>> dates) so only 2 weeks of the freeze period are hit. Next year the >>> Chinese new year will be at February 5th. >>> >>> For my 4.12 plan I've added some extra weeks between last posting date >>> and release date to accommodate for the holiday seasons, resulting in >>> my suggestion. >> Thanks for the detailed analysis Juregen. This seems good to me. > > I think it is also worth staying that we need to work on reducing the > length of the hard freeze date, because as is visible from that diagram, > its basically half the year. That diagram, however, is basically two years packed into one -- taken as only a single year it represents a 4-month cycle, not an 8-month cycle. -George _______________________________________________ Xen-devel mailing list Xen-devel@lists.xenproject.org https://lists.xenproject.org/mailman/listinfo/xen-devel ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 20+ messages in thread
* Re: Xen 4.12 release planning 2018-07-25 11:34 ` George Dunlap @ 2018-07-25 11:36 ` Andrew Cooper 0 siblings, 0 replies; 20+ messages in thread From: Andrew Cooper @ 2018-07-25 11:36 UTC (permalink / raw) To: George Dunlap; +Cc: Juergen Gross, xen-devel, Julien Grall On 25/07/18 12:34, George Dunlap wrote: > On Wed, Jul 25, 2018 at 12:30 PM, Andrew Cooper > <andrew.cooper3@citrix.com> wrote: >> On 25/07/18 12:24, George Dunlap wrote: >>> On Wed, Jul 25, 2018 at 10:22 AM, Juergen Gross <jgross@suse.com> wrote: >>>> On 25/07/18 10:19, Andrew Cooper wrote: >>>>> On 25/07/2018 09:15, Julien Grall wrote: >>>>>> Hi Juergen, >>>>>> >>>>>> On 25/07/18 08:19, Juergen Gross wrote: >>>>>>> Its time to plan the Xen 4.12 release dates. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> There have been concerns with the schedule of 6 months between releases, >>>>>>> as this scheme is leading to too many supported versions of Xen at a >>>>>>> time. The needed resources to backport bug fixes and security fixes as >>>>>>> well as doing the tests for all those releases are a limiting factor to >>>>>>> push out the current main release as well as point releases on time. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> After some discussions at the Xen developer summit, on xen-devel and >>>>>>> between the committers a slightly longer release cycle of 8 or 9 months >>>>>>> was suggested. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> With 18 months of full support and 36 months of security support the >>>>>>> number of concurrent supported releases will be the same with either 8 >>>>>>> or 9 months release cycles, so I have chosen an 8 month cycle for now. >>>>>>> Having only 3 possible times in the year for a release will make it >>>>>>> easier to avoid major holiday seasons. > >>>>>>> In case there is no objection I'm planning Xen 4.12 with: >>>>>>> >>>>>>> * Last posting date: December 14th, 2018 >>>>>>> * Hard code freeze: January 11th, 2019 >>>>>> In general, you would expect western people to slow down during >>>>>> Christmas period and have to deal with a pile of e-mail just after New >>>>>> Year. So I think, this is not very convenient period for a code freeze. >>>>>> >>>>>> I usually take more holidays around Christmas and New Year. For this >>>>>> year, I will be on holidays from 21st December until the 13th January. >>>>>> This basically means my cut off for Arm patches will be 21st December >>>>>> or potentially few days before to avoid having the likely last minute >>>>>> rush. >>>>> Given that we have decided to switch to a difference cadence, it would >>>>> be prudent to work out when the best alignment of an 8-month cadence >>>>> would be, rather than having it 8 months from now. If that means a >>>>> one-off shorter or longer cycle for 4.12 then so be it. >>>> The general holiday seasons are: >>>> >>>> - Chinese new year (end of January ... mid of February), 2 weeks >>>> - Eastern (end of March ... end of April), only a weak dependency? >>>> - summer (August?), second half of July and first half of September as >>>> a weak dependency >>>> - Christmas (end of December ... start of January), adding one week as >>>> a weak dependency >>>> >>>> We don't like the planned release to be in or just before a holiday >>>> season. The period between last posting date and freeze should last >>>> 2 weeks, the freeze period should last 6 weeks. >>>> >>>> In the diagram below I have used a 'X' for a major holiday season and >>>> a 'x' for a weak dependency. The lines below are possible release date >>>> variants just shifted by a weak each to show all possibilities. >>>> >>>> Jan Feb Mar Apr May Jun Jul Aug Sep Oct Nov Dec >>>> Xx.XXXXX...xxxx...........xxXXXXx..............X holidays >>>> ffFFFFFFR.......ffFFFFFFR.......ffFFFFFFR....... >>>> .ffFFFFFFR.......ffFFFFFFR.......ffFFFFFFR...... >>>> ..ffFFFFFFR.......ffFFFFFFR.......ffFFFFFFR..... >>>> ...ffFFFFFFR.......ffFFFFFFR.......ffFFFFFFR.... >>>> ....ffFFFFFFR.......ffFFFFFFR.......ffFFFFFFR... >>>> .....ffFFFFFFR.......ffFFFFFFR.......ffFFFFFFR.. >>>> ......ffFFFFFFR.......ffFFFFFFR.......ffFFFFFFR. >>>> .......ffFFFFFFR.......ffFFFFFFR.......ffFFFFFFR >>>> R.......ffFFFFFFR.......ffFFFFFFR.......ffFFFFFF >>>> FR.......ffFFFFFFR.......ffFFFFFFR.......ffFFFFF >>>> FFR.......ffFFFFFFR.......ffFFFFFFR.......ffFFFF >>>> FFFR.......ffFFFFFFR.......ffFFFFFFR.......ffFFF >>>> FFFFR.......ffFFFFFFR.......ffFFFFFFR.......ffFF >>>> FFFFFR.......ffFFFFFFR.......ffFFFFFFR.......ffF >>>> FFFFFFR.......ffFFFFFFR.......ffFFFFFFR.......ff >>>> fFFFFFFR.......ffFFFFFFR.......ffFFFFFFR.......f >>>> >>>> We can rule out several variants with release dates just before or in a >>>> holiday season: >>>> >>>> Jan Feb Mar Apr May Jun Jul Aug Sep Oct Nov Dec >>>> Xx.XXXXX...xxxx...........xxXXXXx..............X holidays >>>> ffFFFFFFR.......ffFFFFFFR.......ffFFFFFFR....... >>>> .ffFFFFFFR.......ffFFFFFFR.......ffFFFFFFR...... >>>> >>>> Best fit seems to be releasing in first half of March/July/November. The >>>> main clash seems to be Chinese new year in the freeze period, but >>>> avoiding that would mean we'd have to either move into Christmas or >>>> Eastern, or to use a schedule with varying periods. >>>> >>>> Please remember that Chinese new year is only 2 weeks long (at varying >>>> dates) so only 2 weeks of the freeze period are hit. Next year the >>>> Chinese new year will be at February 5th. >>>> >>>> For my 4.12 plan I've added some extra weeks between last posting date >>>> and release date to accommodate for the holiday seasons, resulting in >>>> my suggestion. >>> Thanks for the detailed analysis Juregen. This seems good to me. >> I think it is also worth staying that we need to work on reducing the >> length of the hard freeze date, because as is visible from that diagram, >> its basically half the year. > That diagram, however, is basically two years packed into one -- taken > as only a single year it represents a 4-month cycle, not an 8-month > cycle. Oh - of course. ~Andrew _______________________________________________ Xen-devel mailing list Xen-devel@lists.xenproject.org https://lists.xenproject.org/mailman/listinfo/xen-devel ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 20+ messages in thread
* Re: Xen 4.12 release planning 2018-07-25 11:30 ` Andrew Cooper 2018-07-25 11:34 ` George Dunlap @ 2018-07-25 11:34 ` Juergen Gross 2018-07-25 11:37 ` Juergen Gross 1 sibling, 1 reply; 20+ messages in thread From: Juergen Gross @ 2018-07-25 11:34 UTC (permalink / raw) To: Andrew Cooper, George Dunlap; +Cc: xen-devel, Julien Grall On 25/07/18 13:30, Andrew Cooper wrote: > On 25/07/18 12:24, George Dunlap wrote: >> On Wed, Jul 25, 2018 at 10:22 AM, Juergen Gross <jgross@suse.com> wrote: >>> On 25/07/18 10:19, Andrew Cooper wrote: >>>> On 25/07/2018 09:15, Julien Grall wrote: >>>>> Hi Juergen, >>>>> >>>>> On 25/07/18 08:19, Juergen Gross wrote: >>>>>> Its time to plan the Xen 4.12 release dates. >>>>>> >>>>>> There have been concerns with the schedule of 6 months between releases, >>>>>> as this scheme is leading to too many supported versions of Xen at a >>>>>> time. The needed resources to backport bug fixes and security fixes as >>>>>> well as doing the tests for all those releases are a limiting factor to >>>>>> push out the current main release as well as point releases on time. >>>>>> >>>>>> After some discussions at the Xen developer summit, on xen-devel and >>>>>> between the committers a slightly longer release cycle of 8 or 9 months >>>>>> was suggested. >>>>>> >>>>>> With 18 months of full support and 36 months of security support the >>>>>> number of concurrent supported releases will be the same with either 8 >>>>>> or 9 months release cycles, so I have chosen an 8 month cycle for now. >>>>>> Having only 3 possible times in the year for a release will make it >>>>>> easier to avoid major holiday seasons. > >>>>>> In case there is no objection I'm planning Xen 4.12 with: >>>>>> >>>>>> * Last posting date: December 14th, 2018 >>>>>> * Hard code freeze: January 11th, 2019 >>>>> In general, you would expect western people to slow down during >>>>> Christmas period and have to deal with a pile of e-mail just after New >>>>> Year. So I think, this is not very convenient period for a code freeze. >>>>> >>>>> I usually take more holidays around Christmas and New Year. For this >>>>> year, I will be on holidays from 21st December until the 13th January. >>>>> This basically means my cut off for Arm patches will be 21st December >>>>> or potentially few days before to avoid having the likely last minute >>>>> rush. >>>> Given that we have decided to switch to a difference cadence, it would >>>> be prudent to work out when the best alignment of an 8-month cadence >>>> would be, rather than having it 8 months from now. If that means a >>>> one-off shorter or longer cycle for 4.12 then so be it. >>> The general holiday seasons are: >>> >>> - Chinese new year (end of January ... mid of February), 2 weeks >>> - Eastern (end of March ... end of April), only a weak dependency? >>> - summer (August?), second half of July and first half of September as >>> a weak dependency >>> - Christmas (end of December ... start of January), adding one week as >>> a weak dependency >>> >>> We don't like the planned release to be in or just before a holiday >>> season. The period between last posting date and freeze should last >>> 2 weeks, the freeze period should last 6 weeks. >>> >>> In the diagram below I have used a 'X' for a major holiday season and >>> a 'x' for a weak dependency. The lines below are possible release date >>> variants just shifted by a weak each to show all possibilities. >>> >>> Jan Feb Mar Apr May Jun Jul Aug Sep Oct Nov Dec >>> Xx.XXXXX...xxxx...........xxXXXXx..............X holidays >>> ffFFFFFFR.......ffFFFFFFR.......ffFFFFFFR....... >>> .ffFFFFFFR.......ffFFFFFFR.......ffFFFFFFR...... >>> ..ffFFFFFFR.......ffFFFFFFR.......ffFFFFFFR..... >>> ...ffFFFFFFR.......ffFFFFFFR.......ffFFFFFFR.... >>> ....ffFFFFFFR.......ffFFFFFFR.......ffFFFFFFR... >>> .....ffFFFFFFR.......ffFFFFFFR.......ffFFFFFFR.. >>> ......ffFFFFFFR.......ffFFFFFFR.......ffFFFFFFR. >>> .......ffFFFFFFR.......ffFFFFFFR.......ffFFFFFFR >>> R.......ffFFFFFFR.......ffFFFFFFR.......ffFFFFFF >>> FR.......ffFFFFFFR.......ffFFFFFFR.......ffFFFFF >>> FFR.......ffFFFFFFR.......ffFFFFFFR.......ffFFFF >>> FFFR.......ffFFFFFFR.......ffFFFFFFR.......ffFFF >>> FFFFR.......ffFFFFFFR.......ffFFFFFFR.......ffFF >>> FFFFFR.......ffFFFFFFR.......ffFFFFFFR.......ffF >>> FFFFFFR.......ffFFFFFFR.......ffFFFFFFR.......ff >>> fFFFFFFR.......ffFFFFFFR.......ffFFFFFFR.......f >>> >>> We can rule out several variants with release dates just before or in a >>> holiday season: >>> >>> Jan Feb Mar Apr May Jun Jul Aug Sep Oct Nov Dec >>> Xx.XXXXX...xxxx...........xxXXXXx..............X holidays >>> ffFFFFFFR.......ffFFFFFFR.......ffFFFFFFR....... >>> .ffFFFFFFR.......ffFFFFFFR.......ffFFFFFFR...... >>> >>> Best fit seems to be releasing in first half of March/July/November. The >>> main clash seems to be Chinese new year in the freeze period, but >>> avoiding that would mean we'd have to either move into Christmas or >>> Eastern, or to use a schedule with varying periods. >>> >>> Please remember that Chinese new year is only 2 weeks long (at varying >>> dates) so only 2 weeks of the freeze period are hit. Next year the >>> Chinese new year will be at February 5th. >>> >>> For my 4.12 plan I've added some extra weeks between last posting date >>> and release date to accommodate for the holiday seasons, resulting in >>> my suggestion. >> Thanks for the detailed analysis Juregen. This seems good to me. > > I think it is also worth staying that we need to work on reducing the > length of the hard freeze date, because as is visible from that diagram, > its basically half the year. No, it isn't. It can happen half the year, but in reality it is only every 9 months (so in one case out of three). I believe that question is orthogonal to the one about time between releases. It basically boils down to the question when to branch the new release off the main trunk. Juergen _______________________________________________ Xen-devel mailing list Xen-devel@lists.xenproject.org https://lists.xenproject.org/mailman/listinfo/xen-devel ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 20+ messages in thread
* Re: Xen 4.12 release planning 2018-07-25 11:34 ` Juergen Gross @ 2018-07-25 11:37 ` Juergen Gross 0 siblings, 0 replies; 20+ messages in thread From: Juergen Gross @ 2018-07-25 11:37 UTC (permalink / raw) To: Andrew Cooper, George Dunlap; +Cc: xen-devel, Julien Grall On 25/07/18 13:34, Juergen Gross wrote: > On 25/07/18 13:30, Andrew Cooper wrote: >> On 25/07/18 12:24, George Dunlap wrote: >>> On Wed, Jul 25, 2018 at 10:22 AM, Juergen Gross <jgross@suse.com> wrote: >>>> On 25/07/18 10:19, Andrew Cooper wrote: >>>>> On 25/07/2018 09:15, Julien Grall wrote: >>>>>> Hi Juergen, >>>>>> >>>>>> On 25/07/18 08:19, Juergen Gross wrote: >>>>>>> Its time to plan the Xen 4.12 release dates. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> There have been concerns with the schedule of 6 months between releases, >>>>>>> as this scheme is leading to too many supported versions of Xen at a >>>>>>> time. The needed resources to backport bug fixes and security fixes as >>>>>>> well as doing the tests for all those releases are a limiting factor to >>>>>>> push out the current main release as well as point releases on time. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> After some discussions at the Xen developer summit, on xen-devel and >>>>>>> between the committers a slightly longer release cycle of 8 or 9 months >>>>>>> was suggested. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> With 18 months of full support and 36 months of security support the >>>>>>> number of concurrent supported releases will be the same with either 8 >>>>>>> or 9 months release cycles, so I have chosen an 8 month cycle for now. >>>>>>> Having only 3 possible times in the year for a release will make it >>>>>>> easier to avoid major holiday seasons. > >>>>>>> In case there is no objection I'm planning Xen 4.12 with: >>>>>>> >>>>>>> * Last posting date: December 14th, 2018 >>>>>>> * Hard code freeze: January 11th, 2019 >>>>>> In general, you would expect western people to slow down during >>>>>> Christmas period and have to deal with a pile of e-mail just after New >>>>>> Year. So I think, this is not very convenient period for a code freeze. >>>>>> >>>>>> I usually take more holidays around Christmas and New Year. For this >>>>>> year, I will be on holidays from 21st December until the 13th January. >>>>>> This basically means my cut off for Arm patches will be 21st December >>>>>> or potentially few days before to avoid having the likely last minute >>>>>> rush. >>>>> Given that we have decided to switch to a difference cadence, it would >>>>> be prudent to work out when the best alignment of an 8-month cadence >>>>> would be, rather than having it 8 months from now. If that means a >>>>> one-off shorter or longer cycle for 4.12 then so be it. >>>> The general holiday seasons are: >>>> >>>> - Chinese new year (end of January ... mid of February), 2 weeks >>>> - Eastern (end of March ... end of April), only a weak dependency? >>>> - summer (August?), second half of July and first half of September as >>>> a weak dependency >>>> - Christmas (end of December ... start of January), adding one week as >>>> a weak dependency >>>> >>>> We don't like the planned release to be in or just before a holiday >>>> season. The period between last posting date and freeze should last >>>> 2 weeks, the freeze period should last 6 weeks. >>>> >>>> In the diagram below I have used a 'X' for a major holiday season and >>>> a 'x' for a weak dependency. The lines below are possible release date >>>> variants just shifted by a weak each to show all possibilities. >>>> >>>> Jan Feb Mar Apr May Jun Jul Aug Sep Oct Nov Dec >>>> Xx.XXXXX...xxxx...........xxXXXXx..............X holidays >>>> ffFFFFFFR.......ffFFFFFFR.......ffFFFFFFR....... >>>> .ffFFFFFFR.......ffFFFFFFR.......ffFFFFFFR...... >>>> ..ffFFFFFFR.......ffFFFFFFR.......ffFFFFFFR..... >>>> ...ffFFFFFFR.......ffFFFFFFR.......ffFFFFFFR.... >>>> ....ffFFFFFFR.......ffFFFFFFR.......ffFFFFFFR... >>>> .....ffFFFFFFR.......ffFFFFFFR.......ffFFFFFFR.. >>>> ......ffFFFFFFR.......ffFFFFFFR.......ffFFFFFFR. >>>> .......ffFFFFFFR.......ffFFFFFFR.......ffFFFFFFR >>>> R.......ffFFFFFFR.......ffFFFFFFR.......ffFFFFFF >>>> FR.......ffFFFFFFR.......ffFFFFFFR.......ffFFFFF >>>> FFR.......ffFFFFFFR.......ffFFFFFFR.......ffFFFF >>>> FFFR.......ffFFFFFFR.......ffFFFFFFR.......ffFFF >>>> FFFFR.......ffFFFFFFR.......ffFFFFFFR.......ffFF >>>> FFFFFR.......ffFFFFFFR.......ffFFFFFFR.......ffF >>>> FFFFFFR.......ffFFFFFFR.......ffFFFFFFR.......ff >>>> fFFFFFFR.......ffFFFFFFR.......ffFFFFFFR.......f >>>> >>>> We can rule out several variants with release dates just before or in a >>>> holiday season: >>>> >>>> Jan Feb Mar Apr May Jun Jul Aug Sep Oct Nov Dec >>>> Xx.XXXXX...xxxx...........xxXXXXx..............X holidays >>>> ffFFFFFFR.......ffFFFFFFR.......ffFFFFFFR....... >>>> .ffFFFFFFR.......ffFFFFFFR.......ffFFFFFFR...... >>>> >>>> Best fit seems to be releasing in first half of March/July/November. The >>>> main clash seems to be Chinese new year in the freeze period, but >>>> avoiding that would mean we'd have to either move into Christmas or >>>> Eastern, or to use a schedule with varying periods. >>>> >>>> Please remember that Chinese new year is only 2 weeks long (at varying >>>> dates) so only 2 weeks of the freeze period are hit. Next year the >>>> Chinese new year will be at February 5th. >>>> >>>> For my 4.12 plan I've added some extra weeks between last posting date >>>> and release date to accommodate for the holiday seasons, resulting in >>>> my suggestion. >>> Thanks for the detailed analysis Juregen. This seems good to me. >> >> I think it is also worth staying that we need to work on reducing the >> length of the hard freeze date, because as is visible from that diagram, >> its basically half the year. > > No, it isn't. It can happen half the year, but in reality it is only > every 9 months (so in one case out of three). Aarg, of course this should be: every 8 months (so always skipping one case). Juergen _______________________________________________ Xen-devel mailing list Xen-devel@lists.xenproject.org https://lists.xenproject.org/mailman/listinfo/xen-devel ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 20+ messages in thread
* Re: Xen 4.12 release planning 2018-07-25 11:24 ` George Dunlap 2018-07-25 11:30 ` Andrew Cooper @ 2018-07-25 11:39 ` Lars Kurth 2018-07-25 11:45 ` Juergen Gross 1 sibling, 1 reply; 20+ messages in thread From: Lars Kurth @ 2018-07-25 11:39 UTC (permalink / raw) To: George Dunlap; +Cc: Juergen Gross, Andrew Cooper, Julien Grall, xen-devel [-- Attachment #1.1: Type: text/plain, Size: 1992 bytes --] > On 25 Jul 2018, at 12:24, George Dunlap <dunlapg@umich.edu> wrote: > > On Wed, Jul 25, 2018 at 10:22 AM, Juergen Gross <jgross@suse.com <mailto:jgross@suse.com>> wrote: >> >> fFFFFFFR.......ffFFFFFFR.......ffFFFFFFR.......f >> >> We can rule out several variants with release dates just before or in a >> holiday season: >> >> Jan Feb Mar Apr May Jun Jul Aug Sep Oct Nov Dec >> Xx.XXXXX...xxxx...........xxXXXXx..............X holidays >> ffFFFFFFR.......ffFFFFFFR.......ffFFFFFFR....... >> .ffFFFFFFR.......ffFFFFFFR.......ffFFFFFFR...... >> >> Best fit seems to be releasing in first half of March/July/November. The >> main clash seems to be Chinese new year in the freeze period, but >> avoiding that would mean we'd have to either move into Christmas or >> Eastern, or to use a schedule with varying periods. >> >> Please remember that Chinese new year is only 2 weeks long (at varying >> dates) so only 2 weeks of the freeze period are hit. Next year the >> Chinese new year will be at February 5th. >> >> For my 4.12 plan I've added some extra weeks between last posting date >> and release date to accommodate for the holiday seasons, resulting in >> my suggestion. > > Thanks for the detailed analysis Juregen. This seems good to me. > > -George This looks good to me also. To address Julien's concerns, we could also consider an earlier Last posting date/Hard code freeze date for Arm related code to work around Julien's holiday plans. I think this would be entirely OK and set expectations of contributors accordingly. But maybe this is not necessary if Julien and Stefano can agree a work split somehow. Alternatively we could communicate absences of key reviewers say in November to set expectations of contributors for the final stretch of the release cycle. In other words, if a key reviewer is away, then contributors will need to get series into good shape before their reviewers go on vacation. Regards Lars [-- Attachment #1.2: Type: text/html, Size: 6728 bytes --] [-- Attachment #2: Type: text/plain, Size: 157 bytes --] _______________________________________________ Xen-devel mailing list Xen-devel@lists.xenproject.org https://lists.xenproject.org/mailman/listinfo/xen-devel ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 20+ messages in thread
* Re: Xen 4.12 release planning 2018-07-25 11:39 ` Lars Kurth @ 2018-07-25 11:45 ` Juergen Gross 2018-07-25 11:51 ` Lars Kurth 0 siblings, 1 reply; 20+ messages in thread From: Juergen Gross @ 2018-07-25 11:45 UTC (permalink / raw) To: Lars Kurth, George Dunlap; +Cc: Andrew Cooper, Julien Grall, xen-devel On 25/07/18 13:39, Lars Kurth wrote: > > >> On 25 Jul 2018, at 12:24, George Dunlap <dunlapg@umich.edu >> <mailto:dunlapg@umich.edu>> wrote: >> >> On Wed, Jul 25, 2018 at 10:22 AM, Juergen Gross <jgross@suse.com >> <mailto:jgross@suse.com>> wrote: >>> >>> fFFFFFFR.......ffFFFFFFR.......ffFFFFFFR.......f >>> >>> We can rule out several variants with release dates just before or in a >>> holiday season: >>> >>> Jan Feb Mar Apr May Jun Jul Aug Sep Oct Nov Dec >>> Xx.XXXXX...xxxx...........xxXXXXx..............X holidays >>> ffFFFFFFR.......ffFFFFFFR.......ffFFFFFFR....... >>> .ffFFFFFFR.......ffFFFFFFR.......ffFFFFFFR...... >>> >>> Best fit seems to be releasing in first half of March/July/November. The >>> main clash seems to be Chinese new year in the freeze period, but >>> avoiding that would mean we'd have to either move into Christmas or >>> Eastern, or to use a schedule with varying periods. >>> >>> Please remember that Chinese new year is only 2 weeks long (at varying >>> dates) so only 2 weeks of the freeze period are hit. Next year the >>> Chinese new year will be at February 5th. >>> >>> For my 4.12 plan I've added some extra weeks between last posting date >>> and release date to accommodate for the holiday seasons, resulting in >>> my suggestion. >> >> Thanks for the detailed analysis Juregen. This seems good to me. >> >> -George > > This looks good to me also. To address Julien's concerns, we could also > consider an earlier Last posting date/Hard code freeze date for Arm > related code to work around Julien's holiday plans. I think this would > be entirely OK and set expectations of contributors accordingly. But > maybe this is not necessary if Julien and Stefano can agree a work split > somehow. > > Alternatively we could communicate absences of key reviewers say in > November to set expectations of contributors for the final stretch of > the release cycle. In other words, if a key reviewer is away, then > contributors will need to get series into good shape before their > reviewers go on vacation. I like that idea. Lets expand it to key persons (i.e. release manager, release technician, community manager, key reviewers). Juergen _______________________________________________ Xen-devel mailing list Xen-devel@lists.xenproject.org https://lists.xenproject.org/mailman/listinfo/xen-devel ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 20+ messages in thread
* Re: Xen 4.12 release planning 2018-07-25 11:45 ` Juergen Gross @ 2018-07-25 11:51 ` Lars Kurth 2018-07-25 11:58 ` Juergen Gross 0 siblings, 1 reply; 20+ messages in thread From: Lars Kurth @ 2018-07-25 11:51 UTC (permalink / raw) To: Juergen Gross; +Cc: Andrew Cooper, George Dunlap, Julien Grall, xen-devel > On 25 Jul 2018, at 12:45, Juergen Gross <jgross@suse.com> wrote: > > On 25/07/18 13:39, Lars Kurth wrote: >> >> >>> On 25 Jul 2018, at 12:24, George Dunlap <dunlapg@umich.edu >>> <mailto:dunlapg@umich.edu>> wrote: >>> >>> On Wed, Jul 25, 2018 at 10:22 AM, Juergen Gross <jgross@suse.com >>> <mailto:jgross@suse.com>> wrote: >>>> >>>> fFFFFFFR.......ffFFFFFFR.......ffFFFFFFR.......f >>>> >>>> We can rule out several variants with release dates just before or in a >>>> holiday season: >>>> >>>> Jan Feb Mar Apr May Jun Jul Aug Sep Oct Nov Dec >>>> Xx.XXXXX...xxxx...........xxXXXXx..............X holidays >>>> ffFFFFFFR.......ffFFFFFFR.......ffFFFFFFR....... >>>> .ffFFFFFFR.......ffFFFFFFR.......ffFFFFFFR...... >>>> >>>> Best fit seems to be releasing in first half of March/July/November. The >>>> main clash seems to be Chinese new year in the freeze period, but >>>> avoiding that would mean we'd have to either move into Christmas or >>>> Eastern, or to use a schedule with varying periods. >>>> >>>> Please remember that Chinese new year is only 2 weeks long (at varying >>>> dates) so only 2 weeks of the freeze period are hit. Next year the >>>> Chinese new year will be at February 5th. >>>> >>>> For my 4.12 plan I've added some extra weeks between last posting date >>>> and release date to accommodate for the holiday seasons, resulting in >>>> my suggestion. >>> >>> Thanks for the detailed analysis Juregen. This seems good to me. >>> >>> -George >> >> This looks good to me also. To address Julien's concerns, we could also >> consider an earlier Last posting date/Hard code freeze date for Arm >> related code to work around Julien's holiday plans. I think this would >> be entirely OK and set expectations of contributors accordingly. But >> maybe this is not necessary if Julien and Stefano can agree a work split >> somehow. >> >> Alternatively we could communicate absences of key reviewers say in >> November to set expectations of contributors for the final stretch of >> the release cycle. In other words, if a key reviewer is away, then >> contributors will need to get series into good shape before their >> reviewers go on vacation. > > I like that idea. Lets expand it to key persons (i.e. release manager, > release technician, community manager, key reviewers). We should probably add this to the Release manager TODO list, such that we don't forget when the time comes. The same principle could apply to other holiday periods as well. Lars _______________________________________________ Xen-devel mailing list Xen-devel@lists.xenproject.org https://lists.xenproject.org/mailman/listinfo/xen-devel ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 20+ messages in thread
* Re: Xen 4.12 release planning 2018-07-25 11:51 ` Lars Kurth @ 2018-07-25 11:58 ` Juergen Gross 0 siblings, 0 replies; 20+ messages in thread From: Juergen Gross @ 2018-07-25 11:58 UTC (permalink / raw) To: Lars Kurth; +Cc: Andrew Cooper, George Dunlap, Julien Grall, xen-devel On 25/07/18 13:51, Lars Kurth wrote: > > >> On 25 Jul 2018, at 12:45, Juergen Gross <jgross@suse.com> wrote: >> >> On 25/07/18 13:39, Lars Kurth wrote: >>> >>> >>>> On 25 Jul 2018, at 12:24, George Dunlap <dunlapg@umich.edu >>>> <mailto:dunlapg@umich.edu>> wrote: >>>> >>>> On Wed, Jul 25, 2018 at 10:22 AM, Juergen Gross <jgross@suse.com >>>> <mailto:jgross@suse.com>> wrote: >>>>> >>>>> fFFFFFFR.......ffFFFFFFR.......ffFFFFFFR.......f >>>>> >>>>> We can rule out several variants with release dates just before or in a >>>>> holiday season: >>>>> >>>>> Jan Feb Mar Apr May Jun Jul Aug Sep Oct Nov Dec >>>>> Xx.XXXXX...xxxx...........xxXXXXx..............X holidays >>>>> ffFFFFFFR.......ffFFFFFFR.......ffFFFFFFR....... >>>>> .ffFFFFFFR.......ffFFFFFFR.......ffFFFFFFR...... >>>>> >>>>> Best fit seems to be releasing in first half of March/July/November. The >>>>> main clash seems to be Chinese new year in the freeze period, but >>>>> avoiding that would mean we'd have to either move into Christmas or >>>>> Eastern, or to use a schedule with varying periods. >>>>> >>>>> Please remember that Chinese new year is only 2 weeks long (at varying >>>>> dates) so only 2 weeks of the freeze period are hit. Next year the >>>>> Chinese new year will be at February 5th. >>>>> >>>>> For my 4.12 plan I've added some extra weeks between last posting date >>>>> and release date to accommodate for the holiday seasons, resulting in >>>>> my suggestion. >>>> >>>> Thanks for the detailed analysis Juregen. This seems good to me. >>>> >>>> -George >>> >>> This looks good to me also. To address Julien's concerns, we could also >>> consider an earlier Last posting date/Hard code freeze date for Arm >>> related code to work around Julien's holiday plans. I think this would >>> be entirely OK and set expectations of contributors accordingly. But >>> maybe this is not necessary if Julien and Stefano can agree a work split >>> somehow. >>> >>> Alternatively we could communicate absences of key reviewers say in >>> November to set expectations of contributors for the final stretch of >>> the release cycle. In other words, if a key reviewer is away, then >>> contributors will need to get series into good shape before their >>> reviewers go on vacation. >> >> I like that idea. Lets expand it to key persons (i.e. release manager, >> release technician, community manager, key reviewers). > > We should probably add this to the Release manager TODO list, such that we don't forget when the time comes. The same principle could apply to other holiday periods as well. I would rather tie that to the point in the release process. There might be planned vacations at other times, too. I'll send a patch for the release management doc. Juergen _______________________________________________ Xen-devel mailing list Xen-devel@lists.xenproject.org https://lists.xenproject.org/mailman/listinfo/xen-devel ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 20+ messages in thread
* Re: Xen 4.12 release planning 2018-07-25 7:19 Xen 4.12 release planning Juergen Gross 2018-07-25 8:15 ` Julien Grall @ 2018-07-26 22:13 ` Stefano Stabellini 2018-07-27 7:51 ` Juergen Gross 1 sibling, 1 reply; 20+ messages in thread From: Stefano Stabellini @ 2018-07-26 22:13 UTC (permalink / raw) To: Juergen Gross; +Cc: xen-devel, sstabellini On Wed, 25 Jul 2018, Juergen Gross wrote: > Its time to plan the Xen 4.12 release dates. > > There have been concerns with the schedule of 6 months between releases, > as this scheme is leading to too many supported versions of Xen at a > time. The needed resources to backport bug fixes and security fixes as > well as doing the tests for all those releases are a limiting factor to > push out the current main release as well as point releases on time. > > After some discussions at the Xen developer summit, on xen-devel and > between the committers a slightly longer release cycle of 8 or 9 months > was suggested. > > With 18 months of full support and 36 months of security support the > number of concurrent supported releases will be the same with either 8 > or 9 months release cycles, so I have chosen an 8 month cycle for now. > Having only 3 possible times in the year for a release will make it > easier to avoid major holiday seasons. > > In case there is no objection I'm planning Xen 4.12 with: > > * Last posting date: December 14th, 2018 > * Hard code freeze: January 11th, 2019 > * Release: March 7th, 2019 > > Release of Xen 4.13 would then be early November 2019, 4.14 at early > July 2020. Given the holdidays season (it is not just Julien going on vacation but pretty much everybody), wouldn't it be better to move the hard code freeze by a couple of weeks? For instance Jan 25th? We can still keep the release date as Mar 7th, there should be still enough time? _______________________________________________ Xen-devel mailing list Xen-devel@lists.xenproject.org https://lists.xenproject.org/mailman/listinfo/xen-devel ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 20+ messages in thread
* Re: Xen 4.12 release planning 2018-07-26 22:13 ` Stefano Stabellini @ 2018-07-27 7:51 ` Juergen Gross 2018-07-27 10:32 ` Lars Kurth 0 siblings, 1 reply; 20+ messages in thread From: Juergen Gross @ 2018-07-27 7:51 UTC (permalink / raw) To: Stefano Stabellini; +Cc: xen-devel On 27/07/18 00:13, Stefano Stabellini wrote: > On Wed, 25 Jul 2018, Juergen Gross wrote: >> Its time to plan the Xen 4.12 release dates. >> >> There have been concerns with the schedule of 6 months between releases, >> as this scheme is leading to too many supported versions of Xen at a >> time. The needed resources to backport bug fixes and security fixes as >> well as doing the tests for all those releases are a limiting factor to >> push out the current main release as well as point releases on time. >> >> After some discussions at the Xen developer summit, on xen-devel and >> between the committers a slightly longer release cycle of 8 or 9 months >> was suggested. >> >> With 18 months of full support and 36 months of security support the >> number of concurrent supported releases will be the same with either 8 >> or 9 months release cycles, so I have chosen an 8 month cycle for now. >> Having only 3 possible times in the year for a release will make it >> easier to avoid major holiday seasons. >> >> In case there is no objection I'm planning Xen 4.12 with: >> >> * Last posting date: December 14th, 2018 >> * Hard code freeze: January 11th, 2019 >> * Release: March 7th, 2019 >> >> Release of Xen 4.13 would then be early November 2019, 4.14 at early >> July 2020. > > Given the holdidays season (it is not just Julien going on vacation but > pretty much everybody), wouldn't it be better to move the hard code > freeze by a couple of weeks? For instance Jan 25th? We can still keep > the release date as Mar 7th, there should be still enough time? I don't think planning with a 6 week freeze period is a good idea. The last releases took longer than 2 months. We could slip the complete release by 2 weeks, of course. In this case I'd move the last posting date to January. So something like: * Last posting date: January 11th, 2019 * Hard code freeze: January 25th, 2019 * Release: March 21st, 2019 Risks for that schedule are: - last posting date short after holiday season - is that really a problem? - Chinese new year rather soon after start of freeze period - planned release date rather close to eastern Opinions? Juergen _______________________________________________ Xen-devel mailing list Xen-devel@lists.xenproject.org https://lists.xenproject.org/mailman/listinfo/xen-devel ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 20+ messages in thread
* Re: Xen 4.12 release planning 2018-07-27 7:51 ` Juergen Gross @ 2018-07-27 10:32 ` Lars Kurth 2018-07-27 10:43 ` Juergen Gross 0 siblings, 1 reply; 20+ messages in thread From: Lars Kurth @ 2018-07-27 10:32 UTC (permalink / raw) To: Juergen Gross; +Cc: xen-devel, Stefano Stabellini [-- Attachment #1.1: Type: text/plain, Size: 3178 bytes --] > On 27 Jul 2018, at 08:51, Juergen Gross <jgross@suse.com> wrote: > > On 27/07/18 00:13, Stefano Stabellini wrote: >> On Wed, 25 Jul 2018, Juergen Gross wrote: >>> Its time to plan the Xen 4.12 release dates. >>> >>> There have been concerns with the schedule of 6 months between releases, >>> as this scheme is leading to too many supported versions of Xen at a >>> time. The needed resources to backport bug fixes and security fixes as >>> well as doing the tests for all those releases are a limiting factor to >>> push out the current main release as well as point releases on time. >>> >>> After some discussions at the Xen developer summit, on xen-devel and >>> between the committers a slightly longer release cycle of 8 or 9 months >>> was suggested. >>> >>> With 18 months of full support and 36 months of security support the >>> number of concurrent supported releases will be the same with either 8 >>> or 9 months release cycles, so I have chosen an 8 month cycle for now. >>> Having only 3 possible times in the year for a release will make it >>> easier to avoid major holiday seasons. >>> >>> In case there is no objection I'm planning Xen 4.12 with: >>> >>> * Last posting date: December 14th, 2018 >>> * Hard code freeze: January 11th, 2019 >>> * Release: March 7th, 2019 >>> >>> Release of Xen 4.13 would then be early November 2019, 4.14 at early >>> July 2020. >> >> Given the holdidays season (it is not just Julien going on vacation but >> pretty much everybody), wouldn't it be better to move the hard code >> freeze by a couple of weeks? For instance Jan 25th? We can still keep >> the release date as Mar 7th, there should be still enough time? > > I don't think planning with a 6 week freeze period is a good idea. The > last releases took longer than 2 months. > > We could slip the complete release by 2 weeks, of course. In this case > I'd move the last posting date to January. So something like: > > * Last posting date: January 11th, 2019 > * Hard code freeze: January 25th, 2019 > * Release: March 21st, 2019 Another alternative would be to move the dates backwards rather than forward. The 4.12 development window effectively opened 21-06-18, so a last posting data and hard code freeze before Xmas should be OK. Then assume that there won't be RC's for at last 2 (maybe 3) weeks during the winter holidays. But as long as someone is there to keep an eye on OSSTEST and to do a force push and build an RC1 before Xmas that may be OK: but it would probably still be OK if RC1 slipped until just after New Years Eve. > Risks for that schedule are: > - last posting date short after holiday season - is that really a > problem? > - Chinese new year rather soon after start of freeze period > - planned release date rather close to eastern > > Opinions? With this in mind. The only problem is that there will be Chinese New Year for some of the late to middle RCs ... Looking at possible RC dates RC1: wk Jan 1st RC2: wk Jan 8th RC3: wk Jan 15th RC4: wk Jan 22nd RC5: wk Jan 29th RC6: wk Feb 5th (Chinese New Year) RC7: wk Feb 12th RC8: wk Feb 19th Lars [-- Attachment #1.2: Type: text/html, Size: 12484 bytes --] [-- Attachment #2: Type: text/plain, Size: 157 bytes --] _______________________________________________ Xen-devel mailing list Xen-devel@lists.xenproject.org https://lists.xenproject.org/mailman/listinfo/xen-devel ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 20+ messages in thread
* Re: Xen 4.12 release planning 2018-07-27 10:32 ` Lars Kurth @ 2018-07-27 10:43 ` Juergen Gross 2018-07-27 15:50 ` Stefano Stabellini 0 siblings, 1 reply; 20+ messages in thread From: Juergen Gross @ 2018-07-27 10:43 UTC (permalink / raw) To: Lars Kurth; +Cc: xen-devel, Stefano Stabellini On 27/07/18 12:32, Lars Kurth wrote: > > >> On 27 Jul 2018, at 08:51, Juergen Gross <jgross@suse.com >> <mailto:jgross@suse.com>> wrote: >> >> On 27/07/18 00:13, Stefano Stabellini wrote: >>> On Wed, 25 Jul 2018, Juergen Gross wrote: >>>> Its time to plan the Xen 4.12 release dates. >>>> >>>> There have been concerns with the schedule of 6 months between releases, >>>> as this scheme is leading to too many supported versions of Xen at a >>>> time. The needed resources to backport bug fixes and security fixes as >>>> well as doing the tests for all those releases are a limiting factor to >>>> push out the current main release as well as point releases on time. >>>> >>>> After some discussions at the Xen developer summit, on xen-devel and >>>> between the committers a slightly longer release cycle of 8 or 9 months >>>> was suggested. >>>> >>>> With 18 months of full support and 36 months of security support the >>>> number of concurrent supported releases will be the same with either 8 >>>> or 9 months release cycles, so I have chosen an 8 month cycle for now. >>>> Having only 3 possible times in the year for a release will make it >>>> easier to avoid major holiday seasons. >>>> >>>> In case there is no objection I'm planning Xen 4.12 with: >>>> >>>> * Last posting date: December 14th, 2018 >>>> * Hard code freeze: January 11th, 2019 >>>> * Release: March 7th, 2019 >>>> >>>> Release of Xen 4.13 would then be early November 2019, 4.14 at early >>>> July 2020. >>> >>> Given the holdidays season (it is not just Julien going on vacation but >>> pretty much everybody), wouldn't it be better to move the hard code >>> freeze by a couple of weeks? For instance Jan 25th? We can still keep >>> the release date as Mar 7th, there should be still enough time? >> >> I don't think planning with a 6 week freeze period is a good idea. The >> last releases took longer than 2 months. >> >> We could slip the complete release by 2 weeks, of course. In this case >> I'd move the last posting date to January. So something like: >> >> * Last posting date: January 11th, 2019 >> * Hard code freeze: January 25th, 2019 >> * Release: March 21st, 2019 > > Another alternative would be to move the dates backwards rather than > forward. The 4.12 development window effectively opened 21-06-18, so a > last posting data and hard code freeze before Xmas should be OK. Then > assume that there won't be RC's for at last 2 (maybe 3) weeks during the > winter holidays. But as long as someone is there to keep an eye on > OSSTEST and to do a force push and build an RC1 before Xmas that may be > OK: but it would probably still be OK if RC1 slipped until just after > New Years Eve. You are neglecting that the reason for no RC directly after the freeze is normally due to bugs. And those need to be found and fixed by someone. So putting the freeze directly before a holiday season just makes the freeze longer without any major advantage. Juergen _______________________________________________ Xen-devel mailing list Xen-devel@lists.xenproject.org https://lists.xenproject.org/mailman/listinfo/xen-devel ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 20+ messages in thread
* Re: Xen 4.12 release planning 2018-07-27 10:43 ` Juergen Gross @ 2018-07-27 15:50 ` Stefano Stabellini 2018-07-27 16:10 ` Juergen Gross 0 siblings, 1 reply; 20+ messages in thread From: Stefano Stabellini @ 2018-07-27 15:50 UTC (permalink / raw) To: Juergen Gross; +Cc: Lars Kurth, xen-devel, Stefano Stabellini On Fri, 27 Jul 2018, Juergen Gross wrote: > On 27/07/18 12:32, Lars Kurth wrote: > > > > > >> On 27 Jul 2018, at 08:51, Juergen Gross <jgross@suse.com > >> <mailto:jgross@suse.com>> wrote: > >> > >> On 27/07/18 00:13, Stefano Stabellini wrote: > >>> On Wed, 25 Jul 2018, Juergen Gross wrote: > >>>> Its time to plan the Xen 4.12 release dates. > >>>> > >>>> There have been concerns with the schedule of 6 months between releases, > >>>> as this scheme is leading to too many supported versions of Xen at a > >>>> time. The needed resources to backport bug fixes and security fixes as > >>>> well as doing the tests for all those releases are a limiting factor to > >>>> push out the current main release as well as point releases on time. > >>>> > >>>> After some discussions at the Xen developer summit, on xen-devel and > >>>> between the committers a slightly longer release cycle of 8 or 9 months > >>>> was suggested. > >>>> > >>>> With 18 months of full support and 36 months of security support the > >>>> number of concurrent supported releases will be the same with either 8 > >>>> or 9 months release cycles, so I have chosen an 8 month cycle for now. > >>>> Having only 3 possible times in the year for a release will make it > >>>> easier to avoid major holiday seasons. > >>>> > >>>> In case there is no objection I'm planning Xen 4.12 with: > >>>> > >>>> * Last posting date: December 14th, 2018 > >>>> * Hard code freeze: January 11th, 2019 > >>>> * Release: March 7th, 2019 > >>>> > >>>> Release of Xen 4.13 would then be early November 2019, 4.14 at early > >>>> July 2020. > >>> > >>> Given the holdidays season (it is not just Julien going on vacation but > >>> pretty much everybody), wouldn't it be better to move the hard code > >>> freeze by a couple of weeks? For instance Jan 25th? We can still keep > >>> the release date as Mar 7th, there should be still enough time? > >> > >> I don't think planning with a 6 week freeze period is a good idea. The > >> last releases took longer than 2 months. > >> > >> We could slip the complete release by 2 weeks, of course. In this case > >> I'd move the last posting date to January. So something like: > >> > >> * Last posting date: January 11th, 2019 > >> * Hard code freeze: January 25th, 2019 > >> * Release: March 21st, 2019 > > > > Another alternative would be to move the dates backwards rather than > > forward. The 4.12 development window effectively opened 21-06-18, so a > > last posting data and hard code freeze before Xmas should be OK. Then > > assume that there won't be RC's for at last 2 (maybe 3) weeks during the > > winter holidays. But as long as someone is there to keep an eye on > > OSSTEST and to do a force push and build an RC1 before Xmas that may be > > OK: but it would probably still be OK if RC1 slipped until just after > > New Years Eve. > > You are neglecting that the reason for no RC directly after the freeze > is normally due to bugs. And those need to be found and fixed by > someone. So putting the freeze directly before a holiday season just > makes the freeze longer without any major advantage. There is no silver bullet here, it is up to you. I'd say that given the current set of maintainers that we have, I think that overlapping with Chinese New Year is less damaging than overlapping with Christmas. So I'd move the dates backward by 2 weeks. _______________________________________________ Xen-devel mailing list Xen-devel@lists.xenproject.org https://lists.xenproject.org/mailman/listinfo/xen-devel ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 20+ messages in thread
* Re: Xen 4.12 release planning 2018-07-27 15:50 ` Stefano Stabellini @ 2018-07-27 16:10 ` Juergen Gross 0 siblings, 0 replies; 20+ messages in thread From: Juergen Gross @ 2018-07-27 16:10 UTC (permalink / raw) To: Stefano Stabellini; +Cc: Lars Kurth, xen-devel On 27/07/18 17:50, Stefano Stabellini wrote: > On Fri, 27 Jul 2018, Juergen Gross wrote: >> On 27/07/18 12:32, Lars Kurth wrote: >>> >>> >>>> On 27 Jul 2018, at 08:51, Juergen Gross <jgross@suse.com >>>> <mailto:jgross@suse.com>> wrote: >>>> >>>> On 27/07/18 00:13, Stefano Stabellini wrote: >>>>> On Wed, 25 Jul 2018, Juergen Gross wrote: >>>>>> Its time to plan the Xen 4.12 release dates. >>>>>> >>>>>> There have been concerns with the schedule of 6 months between releases, >>>>>> as this scheme is leading to too many supported versions of Xen at a >>>>>> time. The needed resources to backport bug fixes and security fixes as >>>>>> well as doing the tests for all those releases are a limiting factor to >>>>>> push out the current main release as well as point releases on time. >>>>>> >>>>>> After some discussions at the Xen developer summit, on xen-devel and >>>>>> between the committers a slightly longer release cycle of 8 or 9 months >>>>>> was suggested. >>>>>> >>>>>> With 18 months of full support and 36 months of security support the >>>>>> number of concurrent supported releases will be the same with either 8 >>>>>> or 9 months release cycles, so I have chosen an 8 month cycle for now. >>>>>> Having only 3 possible times in the year for a release will make it >>>>>> easier to avoid major holiday seasons. >>>>>> >>>>>> In case there is no objection I'm planning Xen 4.12 with: >>>>>> >>>>>> * Last posting date: December 14th, 2018 >>>>>> * Hard code freeze: January 11th, 2019 >>>>>> * Release: March 7th, 2019 >>>>>> >>>>>> Release of Xen 4.13 would then be early November 2019, 4.14 at early >>>>>> July 2020. >>>>> >>>>> Given the holdidays season (it is not just Julien going on vacation but >>>>> pretty much everybody), wouldn't it be better to move the hard code >>>>> freeze by a couple of weeks? For instance Jan 25th? We can still keep >>>>> the release date as Mar 7th, there should be still enough time? >>>> >>>> I don't think planning with a 6 week freeze period is a good idea. The >>>> last releases took longer than 2 months. >>>> >>>> We could slip the complete release by 2 weeks, of course. In this case >>>> I'd move the last posting date to January. So something like: >>>> >>>> * Last posting date: January 11th, 2019 >>>> * Hard code freeze: January 25th, 2019 >>>> * Release: March 21st, 2019 >>> >>> Another alternative would be to move the dates backwards rather than >>> forward. The 4.12 development window effectively opened 21-06-18, so a >>> last posting data and hard code freeze before Xmas should be OK. Then >>> assume that there won't be RC's for at last 2 (maybe 3) weeks during the >>> winter holidays. But as long as someone is there to keep an eye on >>> OSSTEST and to do a force push and build an RC1 before Xmas that may be >>> OK: but it would probably still be OK if RC1 slipped until just after >>> New Years Eve. >> >> You are neglecting that the reason for no RC directly after the freeze >> is normally due to bugs. And those need to be found and fixed by >> someone. So putting the freeze directly before a holiday season just >> makes the freeze longer without any major advantage. > > There is no silver bullet here, it is up to you. I'd say that given the > current set of maintainers that we have, I think that overlapping with > Chinese New Year is less damaging than overlapping with Christmas. So > I'd move the dates backward by 2 weeks. Just for the records: Via IRC we (Stefano and me) discussed the release schedule and now he is fine with my initial proposal: * Last posting date: December 14th, 2018 * Hard code freeze: January 11th, 2019 * Release: March 7th, 2019 with the addendum that depending on vacation plans over Christmas e.g. patch series needing an Ack from arm maintainers might have an earlier last posting date. Juergen _______________________________________________ Xen-devel mailing list Xen-devel@lists.xenproject.org https://lists.xenproject.org/mailman/listinfo/xen-devel ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 20+ messages in thread
end of thread, other threads:[~2018-07-27 16:10 UTC | newest] Thread overview: 20+ messages (download: mbox.gz / follow: Atom feed) -- links below jump to the message on this page -- 2018-07-25 7:19 Xen 4.12 release planning Juergen Gross 2018-07-25 8:15 ` Julien Grall 2018-07-25 8:19 ` Andrew Cooper 2018-07-25 9:22 ` Juergen Gross 2018-07-25 11:24 ` George Dunlap 2018-07-25 11:30 ` Andrew Cooper 2018-07-25 11:34 ` George Dunlap 2018-07-25 11:36 ` Andrew Cooper 2018-07-25 11:34 ` Juergen Gross 2018-07-25 11:37 ` Juergen Gross 2018-07-25 11:39 ` Lars Kurth 2018-07-25 11:45 ` Juergen Gross 2018-07-25 11:51 ` Lars Kurth 2018-07-25 11:58 ` Juergen Gross 2018-07-26 22:13 ` Stefano Stabellini 2018-07-27 7:51 ` Juergen Gross 2018-07-27 10:32 ` Lars Kurth 2018-07-27 10:43 ` Juergen Gross 2018-07-27 15:50 ` Stefano Stabellini 2018-07-27 16:10 ` Juergen Gross
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