Re: How to configure an IoT wifi setup

Re: How to configure an IoT wifi setup

[Denis Kenzior]

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Hi Diego,

>>> In theory 2 can be done today, either by iwd or combo iwd/hostapd with
>> some
>>> manual magic.
> 
> We do exactly this on our devices, when we explored things a while back it was not really an option to do it all with iwd, so we use iwd for the client part, create a new interface on the same WiFi adapter and fire up a hostapd + dnsmasq combo on it as a "configuration AP", if the device is not configured yet.  The advantage is that iwd works in parallel in client mode so we can get the list of available networks and test that the configuration provided by the user really works without having to disconnect the user from the "configuration AP" until configuration is complete.

Awesome, thanks for confirming that this can be done.  In theory iwd should be 
getting to the point where our AP mode support should be good enough for simple 
scenarios like this one.

> 
> Creating a second interface in AP mode works on all the WiFi adapters we have encountered, which are mainly Intel and Qualcomm.
> 

Keith,

Any P2P capable adapter should be able to do this (so pretty much any modern 
hardware).  There was an earlier discussion on the list where I suggested that 
we add a config option to main.conf to start iwd either in station + p2p or 
station + ap mode.

Patches are always welcome!

Regards,
-Denis

Re: How to configure an IoT wifi setup

[KeithG]

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On Thu, May 20, 2021 at 1:36 PM Denis Kenzior <denkenz@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> Hi Diego,
>
> >>> In theory 2 can be done today, either by iwd or combo iwd/hostapd with
> >> some
> >>> manual magic.
> >
> > We do exactly this on our devices, when we explored things a while back it was not really an option to do it all with iwd, so we use iwd for the client part, create a new interface on the same WiFi adapter and fire up a hostapd + dnsmasq combo on it as a "configuration AP", if the device is not configured yet.  The advantage is that iwd works in parallel in client mode so we can get the list of available networks and test that the configuration provided by the user really works without having to disconnect the user from the "configuration AP" until configuration is complete.
>
> Awesome, thanks for confirming that this can be done.  In theory iwd should be
> getting to the point where our AP mode support should be good enough for simple
> scenarios like this one.
>
> >
> > Creating a second interface in AP mode works on all the WiFi adapters we have encountered, which are mainly Intel and Qualcomm.
> >
>
> Keith,
>
> Any P2P capable adapter should be able to do this (so pretty much any modern
> hardware).  There was an earlier discussion on the list where I suggested that
> we add a config option to main.conf to start iwd either in station + p2p or
> station + ap mode.
>
> Patches are always welcome!
>
> Regards,
> -Denis
Denis,

I appreciate the confidence but this is way out of my depth! I will
wait and hope that someone can contribute to this capability. I can
confirm that the AP mode works quite well even with the broadcom fmac
card. As I said, we are set up to start in station mode, collect the
local ssids, put them in a redis key then switch to AP mode and allow
the user to select one of the previously collected SSIDs to configure.
I was just hoping for a real time scan capability when in AP mode.

Regards,

Keith

Re: How to configure an IoT wifi setup

[KeithG]

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On Thu, May 20, 2021 at 7:29 PM KeithG <ys3al35l@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> On Thu, May 20, 2021 at 1:36 PM Denis Kenzior <denkenz@gmail.com> wrote:
> >
> > Hi Diego,
> >
> > >>> In theory 2 can be done today, either by iwd or combo iwd/hostapd with
> > >> some
> > >>> manual magic.
> > >
> > > We do exactly this on our devices, when we explored things a while back it was not really an option to do it all with iwd, so we use iwd for the client part, create a new interface on the same WiFi adapter and fire up a hostapd + dnsmasq combo on it as a "configuration AP", if the device is not configured yet.  The advantage is that iwd works in parallel in client mode so we can get the list of available networks and test that the configuration provided by the user really works without having to disconnect the user from the "configuration AP" until configuration is complete.
> >
> > Awesome, thanks for confirming that this can be done.  In theory iwd should be
> > getting to the point where our AP mode support should be good enough for simple
> > scenarios like this one.
> >
> > >
> > > Creating a second interface in AP mode works on all the WiFi adapters we have encountered, which are mainly Intel and Qualcomm.
> > >
> >
> > Keith,
> >
> > Any P2P capable adapter should be able to do this (so pretty much any modern
> > hardware).  There was an earlier discussion on the list where I suggested that
> > we add a config option to main.conf to start iwd either in station + p2p or
> > station + ap mode.
> >
> > Patches are always welcome!
> >
> > Regards,
> > -Denis
> Denis,
>
> I appreciate the confidence but this is way out of my depth! I will
> wait and hope that someone can contribute to this capability. I can
> confirm that the AP mode works quite well even with the broadcom fmac
> card. As I said, we are set up to start in station mode, collect the
> local ssids, put them in a redis key then switch to AP mode and allow
> the user to select one of the previously collected SSIDs to configure.
> I was just hoping for a real time scan capability when in AP mode.
>
> Regards,
>
> Keith

Messing around with ap mode and seeing what was possible, tonight. I
can reliably get the AP mode to work. I can reliably get iwd to scan
and can save the SSIDs. What I cannot seem to be able to do is get it
to 'tether' in this manner. I have a cable on eth0 (192.168.2.x) and
iwd is in AP mode on wlan0 (192.168.5.1). I cannot get it to NAT using
iptables. This works fine for hostapd, but every time my phone
connects, I get 'connected, no internet'.

I've tried variants, but the iptables lines for hostapd are:
iptables -t nat -A POSTROUTING -o eth0 -j MASQUERADE'
iptables -A FORWARD -m conntrack --ctstate RELATED,ESTABLISHED -j ACCEPT'
iptables -A FORWARD -i wlan0 -o eth0 -j ACCEPT'
sysctl net.ipv4.ip_forward=1

I've also tried this:
iptables -t nat -A POSTROUTING -o eth0 -j MASQUERADE
iptables -A FORWARD -i eth0 -o wlan0 -m state --state
RELATED,ESTABLISHED -j ACCEPT
iptables -A FORWARD -i wlan0 -o eth0 -j ACCEPT

With either of these, I get no internet for wifi connected devices.
From cli, I can ping and wget, etc. What am I missing?

Re: How to configure an IoT wifi setup

[KeithG]

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On Fri, May 21, 2021 at 12:20 AM KeithG <ys3al35l@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> On Thu, May 20, 2021 at 7:29 PM KeithG <ys3al35l@gmail.com> wrote:
> >
> > On Thu, May 20, 2021 at 1:36 PM Denis Kenzior <denkenz@gmail.com> wrote:
> > >
> > > Hi Diego,
> > >
> > > >>> In theory 2 can be done today, either by iwd or combo iwd/hostapd with
> > > >> some
> > > >>> manual magic.
> > > >
> > > > We do exactly this on our devices, when we explored things a while back it was not really an option to do it all with iwd, so we use iwd for the client part, create a new interface on the same WiFi adapter and fire up a hostapd + dnsmasq combo on it as a "configuration AP", if the device is not configured yet.  The advantage is that iwd works in parallel in client mode so we can get the list of available networks and test that the configuration provided by the user really works without having to disconnect the user from the "configuration AP" until configuration is complete.
> > >
> > > Awesome, thanks for confirming that this can be done.  In theory iwd should be
> > > getting to the point where our AP mode support should be good enough for simple
> > > scenarios like this one.
> > >
> > > >
> > > > Creating a second interface in AP mode works on all the WiFi adapters we have encountered, which are mainly Intel and Qualcomm.
> > > >
> > >
> > > Keith,
> > >
> > > Any P2P capable adapter should be able to do this (so pretty much any modern
> > > hardware).  There was an earlier discussion on the list where I suggested that
> > > we add a config option to main.conf to start iwd either in station + p2p or
> > > station + ap mode.
> > >
> > > Patches are always welcome!
> > >
> > > Regards,
> > > -Denis
> > Denis,
> >
> > I appreciate the confidence but this is way out of my depth! I will
> > wait and hope that someone can contribute to this capability. I can
> > confirm that the AP mode works quite well even with the broadcom fmac
> > card. As I said, we are set up to start in station mode, collect the
> > local ssids, put them in a redis key then switch to AP mode and allow
> > the user to select one of the previously collected SSIDs to configure.
> > I was just hoping for a real time scan capability when in AP mode.
> >
> > Regards,
> >
> > Keith
>
> Messing around with ap mode and seeing what was possible, tonight. I
> can reliably get the AP mode to work. I can reliably get iwd to scan
> and can save the SSIDs. What I cannot seem to be able to do is get it
> to 'tether' in this manner. I have a cable on eth0 (192.168.2.x) and
> iwd is in AP mode on wlan0 (192.168.5.1). I cannot get it to NAT using
> iptables. This works fine for hostapd, but every time my phone
> connects, I get 'connected, no internet'.
>
> I've tried variants, but the iptables lines for hostapd are:
> iptables -t nat -A POSTROUTING -o eth0 -j MASQUERADE'
> iptables -A FORWARD -m conntrack --ctstate RELATED,ESTABLISHED -j ACCEPT'
> iptables -A FORWARD -i wlan0 -o eth0 -j ACCEPT'
> sysctl net.ipv4.ip_forward=1
>
> I've also tried this:
> iptables -t nat -A POSTROUTING -o eth0 -j MASQUERADE
> iptables -A FORWARD -i eth0 -o wlan0 -m state --state
> RELATED,ESTABLISHED -j ACCEPT
> iptables -A FORWARD -i wlan0 -o eth0 -j ACCEPT
>
> With either of these, I get no internet for wifi connected devices.
> From cli, I can ping and wget, etc. What am I missing?

Still messing with this. I decided to try to start an ad-hoc network
from the RPi to see how it works. This is on an RPi 3B (broadcom
fmac). I am running iwd built from git at e8eb05f. When I try to start
an ad-hoc network, I get 'Operation Failed'

# iwctl device wlan0 show
                                 Device: wlan0
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
  Settable  Property            Value
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
            Name                wlan0
         *  Mode                ad-hoc
         *  Powered             on
            Address             b8:27:eb:28:7d:8f
            Adapter             phy0
~# /usr/bin/iwctl ad-hoc wlan0 start test password
Operation failed

in the log:
May 23 10:03:23 runeaudio iwd[15027]:
src/netdev.c:netdev_link_notify() event 16 on ifindex 3
May 23 10:03:23 runeaudio iwd[15027]:
src/netdev.c:netdev_link_notify() event 16 on ifindex 3
May 23 10:04:22 runeaudio iwd[15027]: src/agent.c:agent_register()
agent register called
May 23 10:04:22 runeaudio iwd[15027]: src/agent.c:agent_register()
agent :1.569 path /agent/15328
May 23 10:04:22 runeaudio iwd[15027]: Failed to join adhoc network, -22
May 23 10:04:22 runeaudio iwd[15027]: src/agent.c:agent_disconnect()
agent :1.569 disconnected
May 23 10:04:22 runeaudio iwd[15027]: src/agent.c:agent_free() agent
free 0x1f257c0

I thought this should be easy, but am confused trying to set up a NAT
between the wlan0 connected devices (iwd running in AP mode) and the
eth0 connman managed DHCP connection to the router.

Keith

Re: How to configure an IoT wifi setup

[Daniel Wagner]

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Hi,

On Wed, May 19, 2021 at 04:20:20PM -0500, Denis Kenzior wrote:
> > If I set up connman by:
> > "# connmanctl tether wifi on SSID password" I can connect and 'see' my
> > new SSID, but I cannot scan for any APs to set up. I do not know how
> > to set the SSID IP address, if this has been enabled in connman.
> 
> Daniel or Marcel can correct me if I'm wrong, but I don't think this is a
> usecase connman supports.  Tethering is just that, sharing your
> ethernet/wwan/whatever connection over wifi.

You are right. ConnMan does not support AP mode. There is no D-Bus API
exposing the AP mode of an WiFi interface. ConnMan does not expose
devices either, so it's not something we could just add.

Thanks,
Daniel

RE: How to configure an IoT wifi setup

[Diego Santa Cruz]

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> -----Original Message-----
> From: KeithG <ys3al35l@gmail.com>
> Sent: 20 May 2021 00:41
> To: Denis Kenzior <denkenz@gmail.com>
> Cc: connman(a)lists.01.org; iwd(a)lists.01.org
> Subject: Re: How to configure an IoT wifi setup
> 
> On Wed, May 19, 2021 at 4:20 PM Denis Kenzior <denkenz@gmail.com>
> wrote:
> <snip>
> > So do you know how this works, exactly?
> >
> I think so.
> > >
> > > I have tried with iwctl as well:
> > > set up /etc/iwd/main.conf
> > > [General]
> > > EnableNetworkConfiguration=true
> > > APRanges=192.168.1.0/24
> > >
> > > # iwctl device wlan0 set-property Mode ap
> > > # iwctl ap wlan0 start SSID password
> > >
> > > With this I can connect, but once again, I cannot scan for any
> > > available SSIDs to connect to. It is not important that I be able to
> > > connect, but I do need to see the SSIDs so the user can set it up then
> > > reboot (or restart connman/iwd) to connect to the new 'known' SSID.
> >
> > So I think there are two ways of doing this:
> >
> > 1. Being able to scan while in AP mode.  This is something that has been
> brought
> > up before as desirable, etc.  But no one has made any contributions just
> yet.
> > All this does is lets you see the surrounding SSIDs...
> >
> > 2. Use multiple interfaces if your hw supports them.  So 1 interface in AP
> mode,
> > the other in station mode.  Then you could connect to the headless device
> on the
> > ap interface and run iwd on the station interface as usual to set up the
> network.
> >
> > In theory 2 can be done today, either by iwd or combo iwd/hostapd with
> some
> > manual magic.

We do exactly this on our devices, when we explored things a while back it was not really an option to do it all with iwd, so we use iwd for the client part, create a new interface on the same WiFi adapter and fire up a hostapd + dnsmasq combo on it as a "configuration AP", if the device is not configured yet.  The advantage is that iwd works in parallel in client mode so we can get the list of available networks and test that the configuration provided by the user really works without having to disconnect the user from the "configuration AP" until configuration is complete.

Creating a second interface in AP mode works on all the WiFi adapters we have encountered, which are mainly Intel and Qualcomm.

> >
> > Regards,
> > -Denis
> another way today is to:
> 3) start in station mode, scan and save the stations then switch to AP
> mode allow a
> connection then allow the user to set up the SSID. I have done this,
> but was hoping
> iwd could do both simultaneously.
> 
> I believe hostapd does this with modern wifi adapters. It does seem to
> work with the
> Broadcom fmac cards onboard the newer RPIs.I can be connected in AP
> mode with hostapd
> and also scan via 'connman scan wifi' or 'iwctl station wlan0 scan'
> then 'iwctl station wlan0
> get-networks' and get a list of the available networks. This allows me
> to get a 'current'
> list.
> 
> Keith
> _______________________________________________
> iwd mailing list -- iwd(a)lists.01.org
> To unsubscribe send an email to iwd-leave(a)lists.01.org

-- 
Diego Santa Cruz, PhD
Technology Architect
spinetix.com

 

Re: How to configure an IoT wifi setup

[KeithG]

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On Wed, May 19, 2021 at 4:20 PM Denis Kenzior <denkenz@gmail.com> wrote:
<snip>
> So do you know how this works, exactly?
>
I think so.
> >
> > I have tried with iwctl as well:
> > set up /etc/iwd/main.conf
> > [General]
> > EnableNetworkConfiguration=true
> > APRanges=192.168.1.0/24
> >
> > # iwctl device wlan0 set-property Mode ap
> > # iwctl ap wlan0 start SSID password
> >
> > With this I can connect, but once again, I cannot scan for any
> > available SSIDs to connect to. It is not important that I be able to
> > connect, but I do need to see the SSIDs so the user can set it up then
> > reboot (or restart connman/iwd) to connect to the new 'known' SSID.
>
> So I think there are two ways of doing this:
>
> 1. Being able to scan while in AP mode.  This is something that has been brought
> up before as desirable, etc.  But no one has made any contributions just yet.
> All this does is lets you see the surrounding SSIDs...
>
> 2. Use multiple interfaces if your hw supports them.  So 1 interface in AP mode,
> the other in station mode.  Then you could connect to the headless device on the
> ap interface and run iwd on the station interface as usual to set up the network.
>
> In theory 2 can be done today, either by iwd or combo iwd/hostapd with some
> manual magic.
>
> Regards,
> -Denis
another way today is to:
3) start in station mode, scan and save the stations then switch to AP
mode allow a
connection then allow the user to set up the SSID. I have done this,
but was hoping
iwd could do both simultaneously.

I believe hostapd does this with modern wifi adapters. It does seem to
work with the
Broadcom fmac cards onboard the newer RPIs.I can be connected in AP
mode with hostapd
and also scan via 'connman scan wifi' or 'iwctl station wlan0 scan'
then 'iwctl station wlan0
get-networks' and get a list of the available networks. This allows me
to get a 'current'
list.

Keith

Re: How to configure an IoT wifi setup

[Denis Kenzior]

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Hi Keith,

On 5/19/21 2:36 PM, KeithG wrote:
> Group,
> 
> I am not sure if this is the right terminology but this is what I am
> trying to do:
> Power up a headless device. If it does not get an ethernet or wifi
> connection, it launches AP mode of some sort and allows a device to
> connect then configure the wifi connection by selecting an AP and
> typing in a password.
> 
> This works with hostapd/dsnmasq, currently. I want to switch over to
> connman and/or iwd to do this, but have not been successful in doing
> this.

So do you know how this works, exactly?

> 
> If I set up connman by:
> "# connmanctl tether wifi on SSID password" I can connect and 'see' my
> new SSID, but I cannot scan for any APs to set up. I do not know how
> to set the SSID IP address, if this has been enabled in connman.

Daniel or Marcel can correct me if I'm wrong, but I don't think this is a 
usecase connman supports.  Tethering is just that, sharing your 
ethernet/wwan/whatever connection over wifi.

> 
> I have tried with iwctl as well:
> set up /etc/iwd/main.conf
> [General]
> EnableNetworkConfiguration=true
> APRanges=192.168.1.0/24
> 
> # iwctl device wlan0 set-property Mode ap
> # iwctl ap wlan0 start SSID password
> 
> With this I can connect, but once again, I cannot scan for any
> available SSIDs to connect to. It is not important that I be able to
> connect, but I do need to see the SSIDs so the user can set it up then
> reboot (or restart connman/iwd) to connect to the new 'known' SSID.

So I think there are two ways of doing this:

1. Being able to scan while in AP mode.  This is something that has been brought 
up before as desirable, etc.  But no one has made any contributions just yet. 
All this does is lets you see the surrounding SSIDs...

2. Use multiple interfaces if your hw supports them.  So 1 interface in AP mode, 
the other in station mode.  Then you could connect to the headless device on the 
ap interface and run iwd on the station interface as usual to set up the network.

In theory 2 can be done today, either by iwd or combo iwd/hostapd with some 
manual magic.

Regards,
-Denis

How to configure an IoT wifi setup

[KeithG]

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Group,

I am not sure if this is the right terminology but this is what I am
trying to do:
Power up a headless device. If it does not get an ethernet or wifi
connection, it launches AP mode of some sort and allows a device to
connect then configure the wifi connection by selecting an AP and
typing in a password.

This works with hostapd/dsnmasq, currently. I want to switch over to
connman and/or iwd to do this, but have not been successful in doing
this.

If I set up connman by:
"# connmanctl tether wifi on SSID password" I can connect and 'see' my
new SSID, but I cannot scan for any APs to set up. I do not know how
to set the SSID IP address, if this has been enabled in connman.

I have tried with iwctl as well:
set up /etc/iwd/main.conf
[General]
EnableNetworkConfiguration=true
APRanges=192.168.1.0/24

# iwctl device wlan0 set-property Mode ap
# iwctl ap wlan0 start SSID password

With this I can connect, but once again, I cannot scan for any
available SSIDs to connect to. It is not important that I be able to
connect, but I do need to see the SSIDs so the user can set it up then
reboot (or restart connman/iwd) to connect to the new 'known' SSID.

Thanks,

Keith