From: Paul Moore <paul@paul-moore.com>
To: keescook@chromium.org
Cc: casey@schaufler-ca.com, linux-security-module@vger.kernel.org,
James Morris <jmorris@namei.org>,
linux-kernel@vger.kernel.org, selinux@tycho.nsa.gov,
john.johansen@canonical.com, penguin-kernel@i-love.sakura.ne.jp,
Stephen Smalley <sds@tycho.nsa.gov>,
linux-fsdevel@vger.kernel.org, adobriyan@gmail.com,
casey.schaufler@intel.com
Subject: Re: [PATCH 10/10] LSM: Blob sharing support for S.A.R.A and LandLock
Date: Thu, 13 Sep 2018 22:42:59 -0400 [thread overview]
Message-ID: <CAHC9VhRXOuGqSw9yu18QZeA1z+vYwLFixTqEJ1WyBBFCeLebuA@mail.gmail.com> (raw)
In-Reply-To: <CAGXu5jLapViSK-j08Tq8cCZodiZXFsXze71xFPg6MQhDWDHDAA@mail.gmail.com>
On Thu, Sep 13, 2018 at 5:52 PM Kees Cook <keescook@chromium.org> wrote:
> On Thu, Sep 13, 2018 at 2:38 PM, Paul Moore <paul@paul-moore.com> wrote:
> > The infrastructure bits aren't really my concern; in fact I *like*
> > that the infrastructure is always exercised, it makes
> > testing/debugging easier. I also like the ability to limit the
> > user/admin to one LSM at boot time to make support easier; my goal is
> > to allow a distro to build support for multiple LSMs without also
> > requiring that distro to support *stacked* LSMs
>
> I see your point, but as soon as SARA and Landlock appear, they'll have:
>
> depends on SECURITY_STACKING
>
> and then all distros will enable it and there will be no sensible
> runtime way to manage it. If, instead, we make it entirely runtime
> now, then a CONFIG can control the default state and we can provide
> guidance to how SARA and Landlock should expose their "enable"ness.
I question why SARA and LandLock require stacking. While some LSMs
may benefit from stacking, e.g. Yama, traditionally each LSM has been
able to stand on its own. I think this is a quality that should be
preserved.
> > (see my earlier
> > comments about the difficulty in determining the source of a failed
> > operation).
>
> Agreed. I would hope that audit could help for that case. *stare at blue sky*
*also staring at blue sky*
Audit can help, but it is independent of the LSMs and not a hard
requirement for all, and even when it is enabled the config might not
be suitable to provide enough information to be helpful in this case.
--
paul moore
www.paul-moore.com
WARNING: multiple messages have this Message-ID (diff)
From: paul@paul-moore.com (Paul Moore)
To: linux-security-module@vger.kernel.org
Subject: [PATCH 10/10] LSM: Blob sharing support for S.A.R.A and LandLock
Date: Thu, 13 Sep 2018 22:42:59 -0400 [thread overview]
Message-ID: <CAHC9VhRXOuGqSw9yu18QZeA1z+vYwLFixTqEJ1WyBBFCeLebuA@mail.gmail.com> (raw)
In-Reply-To: <CAGXu5jLapViSK-j08Tq8cCZodiZXFsXze71xFPg6MQhDWDHDAA@mail.gmail.com>
On Thu, Sep 13, 2018 at 5:52 PM Kees Cook <keescook@chromium.org> wrote:
> On Thu, Sep 13, 2018 at 2:38 PM, Paul Moore <paul@paul-moore.com> wrote:
> > The infrastructure bits aren't really my concern; in fact I *like*
> > that the infrastructure is always exercised, it makes
> > testing/debugging easier. I also like the ability to limit the
> > user/admin to one LSM at boot time to make support easier; my goal is
> > to allow a distro to build support for multiple LSMs without also
> > requiring that distro to support *stacked* LSMs
>
> I see your point, but as soon as SARA and Landlock appear, they'll have:
>
> depends on SECURITY_STACKING
>
> and then all distros will enable it and there will be no sensible
> runtime way to manage it. If, instead, we make it entirely runtime
> now, then a CONFIG can control the default state and we can provide
> guidance to how SARA and Landlock should expose their "enable"ness.
I question why SARA and LandLock require stacking. While some LSMs
may benefit from stacking, e.g. Yama, traditionally each LSM has been
able to stand on its own. I think this is a quality that should be
preserved.
> > (see my earlier
> > comments about the difficulty in determining the source of a failed
> > operation).
>
> Agreed. I would hope that audit could help for that case. *stare at blue sky*
*also staring at blue sky*
Audit can help, but it is independent of the LSMs and not a hard
requirement for all, and even when it is enabled the config might not
be suitable to provide enough information to be helpful in this case.
--
paul moore
www.paul-moore.com
next prev parent reply other threads:[~2018-09-14 2:43 UTC|newest]
Thread overview: 117+ messages / expand[flat|nested] mbox.gz Atom feed top
2018-09-11 16:26 [PATCH v2 00/10] LSM: Module stacking in support of S.A.R.A and Landlock Casey Schaufler
2018-09-11 16:26 ` Casey Schaufler
2018-09-11 16:41 ` [PATCH 01/10] procfs: add smack subdir to attrs Casey Schaufler
2018-09-11 16:41 ` Casey Schaufler
2018-09-11 23:45 ` Ahmed S. Darwish
2018-09-11 23:45 ` Ahmed S. Darwish
2018-09-12 0:01 ` Casey Schaufler
2018-09-12 0:01 ` Casey Schaufler
2018-09-12 22:57 ` Kees Cook
2018-09-12 22:57 ` Kees Cook
2018-09-11 16:41 ` [PATCH 02/10] Smack: Abstract use of cred security blob Casey Schaufler
2018-09-11 16:41 ` Casey Schaufler
2018-09-12 23:04 ` Kees Cook
2018-09-12 23:04 ` Kees Cook
2018-09-11 16:41 ` [PATCH 03/10] SELinux: " Casey Schaufler
2018-09-11 16:41 ` Casey Schaufler
2018-09-12 23:10 ` Kees Cook
2018-09-12 23:10 ` Kees Cook
2018-09-11 16:41 ` [PATCH 04/10] LSM: Infrastructure management of the " Casey Schaufler
2018-09-11 16:41 ` Casey Schaufler
2018-09-12 23:53 ` Kees Cook
2018-09-12 23:53 ` Kees Cook
2018-09-13 19:01 ` Casey Schaufler
2018-09-13 19:01 ` Casey Schaufler
2018-09-13 21:12 ` Kees Cook
2018-09-13 21:12 ` Kees Cook
2018-09-11 16:41 ` [PATCH 05/10] SELinux: Abstract use of file " Casey Schaufler
2018-09-11 16:41 ` Casey Schaufler
2018-09-12 23:54 ` Kees Cook
2018-09-12 23:54 ` Kees Cook
2018-09-11 16:42 ` [PATCH 06/10] LSM: Infrastructure management of the " Casey Schaufler
2018-09-11 16:42 ` Casey Schaufler
2018-09-13 0:00 ` Kees Cook
2018-09-13 0:00 ` Kees Cook
2018-09-11 16:42 ` [PATCH 07/10] SELinux: Abstract use of inode " Casey Schaufler
2018-09-11 16:42 ` Casey Schaufler
2018-09-13 0:23 ` Kees Cook
2018-09-13 0:23 ` Kees Cook
2018-09-11 16:42 ` [PATCH 08/10] Smack: " Casey Schaufler
2018-09-11 16:42 ` Casey Schaufler
2018-09-13 0:24 ` Kees Cook
2018-09-13 0:24 ` Kees Cook
2018-09-11 16:42 ` [PATCH 09/10] LSM: Infrastructure management of the inode security Casey Schaufler
2018-09-11 16:42 ` Casey Schaufler
2018-09-13 0:30 ` Kees Cook
2018-09-13 0:30 ` Kees Cook
2018-09-11 16:42 ` [PATCH 10/10] LSM: Blob sharing support for S.A.R.A and LandLock Casey Schaufler
2018-09-11 16:42 ` Casey Schaufler
2018-09-13 4:19 ` Kees Cook
2018-09-13 4:19 ` Kees Cook
2018-09-13 13:16 ` Paul Moore
2018-09-13 13:16 ` Paul Moore
2018-09-13 15:19 ` Kees Cook
2018-09-13 15:19 ` Kees Cook
2018-09-13 19:12 ` Paul Moore
2018-09-13 19:12 ` Paul Moore
2018-09-13 20:58 ` Jordan Glover
2018-09-13 20:58 ` Jordan Glover
2018-09-13 20:58 ` Jordan Glover
2018-09-13 21:50 ` Paul Moore
2018-09-13 21:50 ` Paul Moore
2018-09-13 22:04 ` Jordan Glover
2018-09-13 22:04 ` Jordan Glover
2018-09-13 22:04 ` Jordan Glover
2018-09-13 23:01 ` Casey Schaufler
2018-09-13 23:01 ` Casey Schaufler
2018-09-13 21:01 ` Kees Cook
2018-09-13 21:01 ` Kees Cook
2018-09-13 21:38 ` Paul Moore
2018-09-13 21:38 ` Paul Moore
2018-09-13 21:51 ` Kees Cook
2018-09-13 21:51 ` Kees Cook
2018-09-13 23:06 ` Kees Cook
2018-09-13 23:06 ` Kees Cook
2018-09-13 23:32 ` John Johansen
2018-09-13 23:32 ` John Johansen
2018-09-13 23:51 ` Kees Cook
2018-09-13 23:51 ` Kees Cook
2018-09-14 0:03 ` Casey Schaufler
2018-09-14 0:03 ` Casey Schaufler
2018-09-14 0:06 ` Kees Cook
2018-09-14 0:06 ` Kees Cook
2018-09-13 23:51 ` Casey Schaufler
2018-09-13 23:51 ` Casey Schaufler
2018-09-13 23:57 ` Kees Cook
2018-09-13 23:57 ` Kees Cook
2018-09-14 0:08 ` Casey Schaufler
2018-09-14 0:08 ` Casey Schaufler
2018-09-14 0:19 ` Kees Cook
2018-09-14 0:19 ` Kees Cook
2018-09-14 15:57 ` Casey Schaufler
2018-09-14 15:57 ` Casey Schaufler
2018-09-14 20:05 ` Kees Cook
2018-09-14 20:05 ` Kees Cook
2018-09-14 20:47 ` Casey Schaufler
2018-09-14 20:47 ` Casey Schaufler
2018-09-14 18:18 ` James Morris
2018-09-14 18:18 ` James Morris
2018-09-14 18:23 ` John Johansen
2018-09-14 18:23 ` John Johansen
2018-09-14 0:03 ` Kees Cook
2018-09-14 0:03 ` Kees Cook
2018-09-14 2:42 ` Paul Moore [this message]
2018-09-14 2:42 ` Paul Moore
2018-09-11 20:43 ` [PATCH v2 00/10] LSM: Module stacking in support of S.A.R.A and Landlock James Morris
2018-09-11 20:43 ` James Morris
2018-09-12 21:29 ` James Morris
2018-09-12 21:29 ` James Morris
2018-09-16 16:54 ` Salvatore Mesoraca
2018-09-16 16:54 ` Salvatore Mesoraca
2018-09-16 17:25 ` Casey Schaufler
2018-09-16 17:25 ` Casey Schaufler
2018-09-16 17:45 ` Salvatore Mesoraca
2018-09-16 17:45 ` Salvatore Mesoraca
2018-09-18 7:44 ` Mickaël Salaün
2018-09-18 15:23 ` Casey Schaufler
2018-09-18 15:23 ` Casey Schaufler
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