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From: Andy Lutomirski <luto@amacapital.net>
To: David Herrmann <dh.herrmann@gmail.com>
Cc: "linux-kernel@vger.kernel.org" <linux-kernel@vger.kernel.org>,
	Michael Kerrisk <mtk.manpages@gmail.com>,
	Ryan Lortie <desrt@desrt.ca>,
	Linus Torvalds <torvalds@linux-foundation.org>,
	Andrew Morton <akpm@linux-foundation.org>,
	"linux-mm@kvack.org" <linux-mm@kvack.org>,
	Linux FS Devel <linux-fsdevel@vger.kernel.org>,
	Linux API <linux-api@vger.kernel.org>,
	Greg Kroah-Hartman <greg@kroah.com>,
	John Stultz <john.stultz@linaro.org>,
	Lennart Poettering <lennart@poettering.net>,
	Daniel Mack <zonque@gmail.com>, Kay Sievers <kay@vrfy.org>,
	Hugh Dickins <hughd@google.com>,
	Tony Battersby <tonyb@cybernetics.com>
Subject: Re: [RFC v3 7/7] shm: isolate pinned pages when sealing files
Date: Fri, 13 Jun 2014 10:23:23 -0700	[thread overview]
Message-ID: <CALCETrWsRQpuu2u9W5mcDTZKT9KVZn6TJHiMP7VWpR=6Zc_7Rw@mail.gmail.com> (raw)
In-Reply-To: <CANq1E4TQXKD8jaBcOJsL3h3ZPRXq176fz8Z9yevFbS3P0q1FQg@mail.gmail.com>

On Fri, Jun 13, 2014 at 8:27 AM, David Herrmann <dh.herrmann@gmail.com> wrote:
> Hi
>
> On Fri, Jun 13, 2014 at 5:06 PM, Andy Lutomirski <luto@amacapital.net> wrote:
>> On Fri, Jun 13, 2014 at 3:36 AM, David Herrmann <dh.herrmann@gmail.com> wrote:
>>> When setting SEAL_WRITE, we must make sure nobody has a writable reference
>>> to the pages (via GUP or similar). We currently check references and wait
>>> some time for them to be dropped. This, however, might fail for several
>>> reasons, including:
>>>  - the page is pinned for longer than we wait
>>>  - while we wait, someone takes an already pinned page for read-access
>>>
>>> Therefore, this patch introduces page-isolation. When sealing a file with
>>> SEAL_WRITE, we copy all pages that have an elevated ref-count. The newpage
>>> is put in place atomically, the old page is detached and left alone. It
>>> will get reclaimed once the last external user dropped it.
>>>
>>> Signed-off-by: David Herrmann <dh.herrmann@gmail.com>
>>
>> Won't this have unexpected effects?
>>
>> Thread 1:  start read into mapping backed by fd
>>
>> Thread 2:  SEAL_WRITE
>>
>> Thread 1: read finishes.  now the page doesn't match the sealed page
>
> Just to be clear: you're talking about read() calls that write into
> the memfd? (like my FUSE example does) Your language might be
> ambiguous to others as "read into" actually implies a write.
>
> No, this does not have unexpected effects. But yes, your conclusion is
> right. To be clear, this behavior would be part of the API. Any
> asynchronous write might be cut off by SEAL_WRITE _iff_ you unmap your
> buffer before the write finishes. But you actually have to extend your
> example:
>
> Thread 1: p = mmap(memfd, SIZE);
> Thread 1: h = async_read(some_fd, p, SIZE);
> Thread 1: munmap(p, SIZE);
> Thread 2: SEAL_WRITE
> Thread 1: async_wait(h);
>
> If you don't do the unmap(), then SEAL_WRITE will fail due to an
> elevated i_mmap_writable. I think this is fine. In fact, I remember
> reading that async-IO is not required to resolve user-space addresses
> at the time of the syscall, but might delay it to the time of the
> actual write. But you're right, it would be misleading that the AIO
> operation returns success. This would be part of the memfd-API,
> though. And if you mess with your address space while running an
> async-IO operation on it, you're screwed anyway.

Ok, I missed the part where you had to munmap to trigger the oddity.
That seems fine to me.

>
> Btw., your sealing use-case is really odd. No-one guarantees that the
> SEAL_WRITE happens _after_ you schedule your async-read. In case you
> have some synchronization there, you just have to move it after
> waiting for your async-io to finish.
>
> Does that clear things up?

I think so.

--Andy

WARNING: multiple messages have this Message-ID (diff)
From: Andy Lutomirski <luto@amacapital.net>
To: David Herrmann <dh.herrmann@gmail.com>
Cc: "linux-kernel@vger.kernel.org" <linux-kernel@vger.kernel.org>,
	Michael Kerrisk <mtk.manpages@gmail.com>,
	Ryan Lortie <desrt@desrt.ca>,
	Linus Torvalds <torvalds@linux-foundation.org>,
	Andrew Morton <akpm@linux-foundation.org>,
	"linux-mm@kvack.org" <linux-mm@kvack.org>,
	Linux FS Devel <linux-fsdevel@vger.kernel.org>,
	Linux API <linux-api@vger.kernel.org>,
	Greg Kroah-Hartman <greg@kroah.com>,
	John Stultz <john.stultz@linaro.org>,
	Lennart Poettering <lennart@poettering.net>,
	Daniel Mack <zonque@gmail.com>, Kay Sievers <kay@vrfy.org>,
	Hugh Dickins <hughd@google.com>,
	Tony Battersby <tonyb@cybernetics.com>
Subject: Re: [RFC v3 7/7] shm: isolate pinned pages when sealing files
Date: Fri, 13 Jun 2014 10:23:23 -0700	[thread overview]
Message-ID: <CALCETrWsRQpuu2u9W5mcDTZKT9KVZn6TJHiMP7VWpR=6Zc_7Rw@mail.gmail.com> (raw)
In-Reply-To: <CANq1E4TQXKD8jaBcOJsL3h3ZPRXq176fz8Z9yevFbS3P0q1FQg@mail.gmail.com>

On Fri, Jun 13, 2014 at 8:27 AM, David Herrmann <dh.herrmann@gmail.com> wrote:
> Hi
>
> On Fri, Jun 13, 2014 at 5:06 PM, Andy Lutomirski <luto@amacapital.net> wrote:
>> On Fri, Jun 13, 2014 at 3:36 AM, David Herrmann <dh.herrmann@gmail.com> wrote:
>>> When setting SEAL_WRITE, we must make sure nobody has a writable reference
>>> to the pages (via GUP or similar). We currently check references and wait
>>> some time for them to be dropped. This, however, might fail for several
>>> reasons, including:
>>>  - the page is pinned for longer than we wait
>>>  - while we wait, someone takes an already pinned page for read-access
>>>
>>> Therefore, this patch introduces page-isolation. When sealing a file with
>>> SEAL_WRITE, we copy all pages that have an elevated ref-count. The newpage
>>> is put in place atomically, the old page is detached and left alone. It
>>> will get reclaimed once the last external user dropped it.
>>>
>>> Signed-off-by: David Herrmann <dh.herrmann@gmail.com>
>>
>> Won't this have unexpected effects?
>>
>> Thread 1:  start read into mapping backed by fd
>>
>> Thread 2:  SEAL_WRITE
>>
>> Thread 1: read finishes.  now the page doesn't match the sealed page
>
> Just to be clear: you're talking about read() calls that write into
> the memfd? (like my FUSE example does) Your language might be
> ambiguous to others as "read into" actually implies a write.
>
> No, this does not have unexpected effects. But yes, your conclusion is
> right. To be clear, this behavior would be part of the API. Any
> asynchronous write might be cut off by SEAL_WRITE _iff_ you unmap your
> buffer before the write finishes. But you actually have to extend your
> example:
>
> Thread 1: p = mmap(memfd, SIZE);
> Thread 1: h = async_read(some_fd, p, SIZE);
> Thread 1: munmap(p, SIZE);
> Thread 2: SEAL_WRITE
> Thread 1: async_wait(h);
>
> If you don't do the unmap(), then SEAL_WRITE will fail due to an
> elevated i_mmap_writable. I think this is fine. In fact, I remember
> reading that async-IO is not required to resolve user-space addresses
> at the time of the syscall, but might delay it to the time of the
> actual write. But you're right, it would be misleading that the AIO
> operation returns success. This would be part of the memfd-API,
> though. And if you mess with your address space while running an
> async-IO operation on it, you're screwed anyway.

Ok, I missed the part where you had to munmap to trigger the oddity.
That seems fine to me.

>
> Btw., your sealing use-case is really odd. No-one guarantees that the
> SEAL_WRITE happens _after_ you schedule your async-read. In case you
> have some synchronization there, you just have to move it after
> waiting for your async-io to finish.
>
> Does that clear things up?

I think so.

--Andy

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  reply	other threads:[~2014-06-13 17:23 UTC|newest]

Thread overview: 107+ messages / expand[flat|nested]  mbox.gz  Atom feed  top
2014-06-13 10:36 [PATCH v3 0/7] File Sealing & memfd_create() David Herrmann
2014-06-13 10:36 ` David Herrmann
2014-06-13 10:36 ` [PATCH v3 1/7] mm: allow drivers to prevent new writable mappings David Herrmann
2014-06-13 10:36   ` David Herrmann
2014-07-09  8:55   ` Hugh Dickins
2014-07-09  8:55     ` Hugh Dickins
2014-07-19 16:12     ` David Herrmann
2014-07-19 16:12       ` David Herrmann
2014-06-13 10:36 ` [PATCH v3 2/7] shm: add sealing API David Herrmann
2014-06-13 10:36   ` David Herrmann
2014-07-16 10:06   ` Hugh Dickins
2014-07-16 10:06     ` Hugh Dickins
2014-07-19 16:17     ` David Herrmann
2014-07-19 16:17       ` David Herrmann
2014-06-13 10:36 ` [PATCH v3 3/7] shm: add memfd_create() syscall David Herrmann
2014-06-13 10:36   ` David Herrmann
2014-06-13 12:27   ` Michael Kerrisk (man-pages)
2014-06-13 12:27     ` Michael Kerrisk (man-pages)
2014-06-13 12:41     ` David Herrmann
2014-06-13 12:41       ` David Herrmann
2014-06-13 14:20       ` Michael Kerrisk (man-pages)
2014-06-13 14:20         ` Michael Kerrisk (man-pages)
2014-06-13 16:20         ` John Stultz
2014-06-13 16:20           ` John Stultz
2014-06-13 16:20           ` John Stultz
2014-06-16  4:12           ` Michael Kerrisk (man-pages)
2014-06-16  4:12             ` Michael Kerrisk (man-pages)
2014-07-08 18:39         ` David Herrmann
2014-07-08 18:39           ` David Herrmann
2014-06-15 10:50   ` Jann Horn
2014-07-16 10:07   ` Hugh Dickins
2014-07-16 10:07     ` Hugh Dickins
2014-07-19 16:29     ` David Herrmann
2014-07-19 16:29       ` David Herrmann
2014-06-13 10:36 ` [PATCH v3 4/7] selftests: add memfd_create() + sealing tests David Herrmann
2014-06-13 10:36   ` David Herrmann
2014-07-16 10:07   ` Hugh Dickins
2014-07-16 10:07     ` Hugh Dickins
2014-07-19 16:31     ` David Herrmann
2014-07-19 16:31       ` David Herrmann
2014-06-13 10:36 ` [PATCH v3 5/7] selftests: add memfd/sealing page-pinning tests David Herrmann
2014-06-13 10:36   ` David Herrmann
2014-07-16 10:08   ` Hugh Dickins
2014-07-16 10:08     ` Hugh Dickins
2014-07-19 16:32     ` David Herrmann
2014-07-19 16:32       ` David Herrmann
2014-06-13 10:36 ` [RFC v3 6/7] shm: wait for pins to be released when sealing David Herrmann
2014-06-13 10:36   ` David Herrmann
2014-07-16 10:09   ` Hugh Dickins
2014-07-16 10:09     ` Hugh Dickins
2014-07-19 16:36     ` David Herrmann
2014-07-19 16:36       ` David Herrmann
2014-06-13 10:36 ` [RFC v3 7/7] shm: isolate pinned pages when sealing files David Herrmann
2014-06-13 10:36   ` David Herrmann
2014-06-13 15:06   ` Andy Lutomirski
2014-06-13 15:06     ` Andy Lutomirski
2014-06-13 15:27     ` David Herrmann
2014-06-13 15:27       ` David Herrmann
2014-06-13 17:23       ` Andy Lutomirski [this message]
2014-06-13 17:23         ` Andy Lutomirski
2014-07-09  8:57   ` Hugh Dickins
2014-07-09  8:57     ` Hugh Dickins
2014-07-19 16:40     ` David Herrmann
2014-07-19 16:40       ` David Herrmann
2014-06-13 15:10 ` [PATCH v3 0/7] File Sealing & memfd_create() Andy Lutomirski
2014-06-13 15:10   ` Andy Lutomirski
2014-06-13 15:15   ` David Herrmann
2014-06-13 15:15     ` David Herrmann
2014-06-13 15:15     ` David Herrmann
2014-06-13 15:17     ` Andy Lutomirski
2014-06-13 15:17       ` Andy Lutomirski
2014-06-13 15:17       ` Andy Lutomirski
2014-06-13 15:33       ` David Herrmann
2014-06-13 15:33         ` David Herrmann
2014-06-13 15:33         ` David Herrmann
2014-06-17  9:54         ` Florian Weimer
2014-06-17  9:54           ` Florian Weimer
2014-06-17 10:01           ` David Herrmann
2014-06-17 10:01             ` David Herrmann
2014-06-17 10:01             ` David Herrmann
2014-06-17 10:04             ` Florian Weimer
2014-06-17 10:04               ` Florian Weimer
2014-06-17 10:10               ` David Herrmann
2014-06-17 10:10                 ` David Herrmann
2014-06-17 12:13                 ` Florian Weimer
2014-06-17 12:13                   ` Florian Weimer
2014-06-17 13:26                   ` David Herrmann
2014-06-17 13:26                     ` David Herrmann
2014-06-17 13:26                     ` David Herrmann
2014-06-17 16:20             ` Andy Lutomirski
2014-06-17 16:36               ` David Herrmann
2014-06-17 16:36                 ` David Herrmann
2014-06-17 16:41                 ` Andy Lutomirski
2014-06-17 16:41                   ` Andy Lutomirski
2014-06-17 16:51                   ` David Herrmann
2014-06-17 16:51                     ` David Herrmann
2014-06-17 17:01                     ` Andy Lutomirski
2014-06-17 17:01                       ` Andy Lutomirski
2014-06-17 20:31                       ` Hugh Dickins
2014-06-17 20:31                         ` Hugh Dickins
2014-06-17 20:31                         ` Hugh Dickins
2014-06-17 21:25                         ` Andy Lutomirski
2014-06-17 21:25                           ` Andy Lutomirski
2014-07-08 16:54 ` David Herrmann
2014-07-08 16:54   ` David Herrmann
2014-07-09  8:53   ` Hugh Dickins
2014-07-09  8:53     ` Hugh Dickins

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