* Problem with USB Class 2 Audio Driver
@ 2010-08-21 0:40 Demian Martin
2010-08-21 9:27 ` Daniel Mack
0 siblings, 1 reply; 11+ messages in thread
From: Demian Martin @ 2010-08-21 0:40 UTC (permalink / raw)
To: 'Daniel Mack', alsa-devel
Daniel:
I'm testing an early sample of the Wavelength Wavelink, a USB to S/PDIF
adapter that supports 44.1-192 KHz sample rates and uses async usb to talk
to ALSA. It works and plays all of the sample rates correctly with the git
version of Alsa from 7/30/2010 whenthe files are sourced from the network.
However if I try to play from a usb source to the usb dac it doesn't work
and the whole system gets unstable. The platforms I have tested it on seem
to have a single USB host interface but with USB 2 there should be enough
bandwidth to pass the data from a USB stick to the cpu and back. If I use an
older 96 only usb dac on the same system it works (unless the down
conversion isn't a direct divide, which overloads the CPU, but that is a
different issue). The problem seems to be sample rate independent and hits
the moment I try to access the file. This is using MPD as a player.
What additional info do you need to troubleshoot this? Is it an intrinsic
limitation to the interface? What additional tests should I do? It's
possible it's a hardware issue but how do I divide them so I can go back to
the hardware guy if it's his issue?
Demian Martin
Product Design Services
^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 11+ messages in thread
* Re: Problem with USB Class 2 Audio Driver
2010-08-21 0:40 Problem with USB Class 2 Audio Driver Demian Martin
@ 2010-08-21 9:27 ` Daniel Mack
2010-08-22 23:51 ` Demian Martin
0 siblings, 1 reply; 11+ messages in thread
From: Daniel Mack @ 2010-08-21 9:27 UTC (permalink / raw)
To: Demian Martin; +Cc: alsa-devel
On Fri, Aug 20, 2010 at 05:40:22PM -0700, Demian Martin wrote:
> I'm testing an early sample of the Wavelength Wavelink, a USB to S/PDIF
> adapter that supports 44.1-192 KHz sample rates and uses async usb to talk
> to ALSA. It works and plays all of the sample rates correctly with the git
> version of Alsa from 7/30/2010 whenthe files are sourced from the network.
What do you mean by "from the network"? How does your test setup look
like?
> However if I try to play from a usb source to the usb dac it doesn't work
> and the whole system gets unstable.
You could also be more precise here :) What doesn't work, how are you
testing, and in which regard does the system get unstable?
> The platforms I have tested it on seem
> to have a single USB host interface but with USB 2 there should be enough
> bandwidth to pass the data from a USB stick to the cpu and back. If I use an
> older 96 only usb dac on the same system it works (unless the down
> conversion isn't a direct divide, which overloads the CPU, but that is a
> different issue). The problem seems to be sample rate independent and hits
> the moment I try to access the file. This is using MPD as a player.
Ah, so your data file is stored on a media which is also connected to
USB? Did you connect the two devices to different USB ports or do they
share one uplink with a hub?
> What additional info do you need to troubleshoot this? Is it an intrinsic
> limitation to the interface? What additional tests should I do? It's
> possible it's a hardware issue but how do I divide them so I can go back to
> the hardware guy if it's his issue?
I'm not aware of any limitation, but there could be such issues as
exceeded bandwith on the bus and the like. How many audio channels are
we talking about?
You could measure the speed of your USB media by using something like
this:
$ time dd if=/path/to/192khz.file of=/dev/null
This should take significantly less time than - let's say - half the
real-time audio playback time of the file, so there's enough headroom to
transport the audio data back to the USB DAC.
What kind of system is this, after all? Did you try other OS on the same
hardware for comparsion?
Daniel
^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 11+ messages in thread
* Re: Problem with USB Class 2 Audio Driver
2010-08-21 9:27 ` Daniel Mack
@ 2010-08-22 23:51 ` Demian Martin
2010-08-23 12:41 ` J. Gordon Rankin
2010-08-23 19:12 ` Daniel Mack
0 siblings, 2 replies; 11+ messages in thread
From: Demian Martin @ 2010-08-22 23:51 UTC (permalink / raw)
To: 'Daniel Mack'; +Cc: alsa-devel, 'J. Gordon Rankin'
Daniel:
I'll try to provide all the info you want. I'll need some prompting for some
details, please be patient with me.
First the system.
I have tested on both an intel D945GSEJT atom based MB and an Alis 3.3 AMD
Geode based mb.
OS: Linux auraliti-player 2.6.32auraliti-2.0 #1 PREEMPT Fri Jul 30 06:48:14
GMT 2010 i686 GNU/Linux
Distro Voyage Linux 0.6.1
It's a dedicated headless 2 channel audio player, sort of a high performance
squeezebox. Details here: www.auraliti.com
When I play a file from a network source (connected through nfs) I have no
problems with either .wav or .flac.
I don't know how to tell with certainty if the USB devices are connecting
through a common or separate root hubs.
USB stick speed- It took 6.2 seconds to pass a 1 minute 19 second 192/24
file to dev/null so USB speed is not a problem.
It seems there is a collision when there is a high speed USB storage device
and the USB class 2 audio on the same host port both moving data at the same
time.
All of the following were done with the Alix board (Geode 500 MHz
processor). The Intel does similar but seems more likely to work.
Under some conditions the system loses connection to the USB audio device:
auraliti-player:~# aplay -v -Dplughw:1
/media/usb0/Trio-Mytek8X192ADDA-192k.WAV
Playing WAVE '/media/usb0/Trio-Mytek8X192ADDA-192k.WAV' : Signed 24 bit
Little Endian in 3bytes, Rate 192000 Hz, Stereo
aplay: set_params:1116: Unable to install hw params:
ACCESS: RW_INTERLEAVED
FORMAT: S24_3LE
SUBFORMAT: STD
SAMPLE_BITS: 24
FRAME_BITS: 48
CHANNELS: 2
RATE: 192000
PERIOD_TIME: 125000
PERIOD_SIZE: 24000
PERIOD_BYTES: 144000
PERIODS: 4
BUFFER_TIME: 500000
BUFFER_SIZE: 96000
BUFFER_BYTES: 576000
TICK_TIME: 0
auraliti-player:~#
Fixed by disconnecting and reconnecting the device.
Here is what I get playing a 44.1 file, after about 15 seconds:
Playing WAVE '/media/usb0/Piano_44_1.wav' : Signed 24 bit Little Endian in
3bytes, Rate 44100 Hz, Stereo
Plug PCM: Linear conversion PCM (S32_LE)
Its setup is:
stream : PLAYBACK
access : RW_INTERLEAVED
format : S24_3LE
subformat : STD
channels : 2
rate : 44100
exact rate : 44100 (44100/1)
msbits : 24
buffer_size : 22050
period_size : 5513
period_time : 125011
tstamp_mode : NONE
period_step : 1
avail_min : 5513
period_event : 0
start_threshold : 22050
stop_threshold : 22050
silence_threshold: 0
silence_size : 0
boundary : 1445068800
Slave: Hardware PCM card 1 'WaveLink HS SPDIF' device 0 subdevice 0
Its setup is:
stream : PLAYBACK
access : MMAP_INTERLEAVED
format : S32_LE
subformat : STD
channels : 2
rate : 44100
exact rate : 44100 (44100/1)
msbits : 32
buffer_size : 22050
period_size : 5513
period_time : 125011
tstamp_mode : NONE
period_step : 1
avail_min : 5513
period_event : 0
start_threshold : 22050
stop_threshold : 22050
silence_threshold: 0
silence_size : 0
boundary : 1445068800
appl_ptr : 0
hw_ptr : 0
underrun!!! (at least 0.015 ms long)
Status:
state : XRUN
trigger_time: 903.806908643
tstamp : 903.807038997
delay : 0
avail : 0
avail_max : 11028
aplay: xrun:1259: xrun: prepare error: File descriptor in bad state
auraliti-player:~#
And the system stops playing.
And very quickly on a 176.4 file:
Playing WAVE '/media/usb0/01_Rimsky-Korsakov Dance of the Tumblers.wav' :
Signed 24 bit Little Endian in 3bytes, Rate 176400 Hz, Stereo
Plug PCM: Linear conversion PCM (S32_LE)
Its setup is:
stream : PLAYBACK
access : RW_INTERLEAVED
format : S24_3LE
subformat : STD
channels : 2
rate : 176400
exact rate : 176400 (176400/1)
msbits : 24
buffer_size : 88200
period_size : 22050
period_time : 125000
tstamp_mode : NONE
period_step : 1
avail_min : 22050
period_event : 0
start_threshold : 88200
stop_threshold : 88200
silence_threshold: 0
silence_size : 0
boundary : 1445068800
Slave: Hardware PCM card 1 'WaveLink HS SPDIF' device 0 subdevice 0
Its setup is:
stream : PLAYBACK
access : MMAP_INTERLEAVED
format : S32_LE
subformat : STD
channels : 2
rate : 176400
exact rate : 176400 (176400/1)
msbits : 32
buffer_size : 88200
period_size : 22050
period_time : 125000
tstamp_mode : NONE
period_step : 1
avail_min : 22050
period_event : 0
start_threshold : 88200
stop_threshold : 88200
silence_threshold: 0
silence_size : 0
boundary : 1445068800
appl_ptr : 0
hw_ptr : 0
underrun!!! (at least 0.010 ms long)
Status:
state : XRUN
trigger_time: 1050.313984810
tstamp : 1050.314067000
delay : 0
avail : 1413
avail_max : 22071
aplay: xrun:1259: xrun: prepare error: File descriptor in bad state
auraliti-player:~#
If in interpose a USB 1 hub on the usb storage I get this:
auraliti-player:~# aplay -v -Dplughw:1 /media/usb0/01_Rimsky-Korsakov\
Dance\ of\ the\ Tumblers.wav
Playing WAVE '/media/usb0/01_Rimsky-Korsakov Dance of the Tumblers.wav' :
Signed 24 bit Little Endian in 3bytes, Rate 176400 Hz, Stereo
Plug PCM: Linear conversion PCM (S32_LE)
Its setup is:
stream : PLAYBACK
access : RW_INTERLEAVED
format : S24_3LE
subformat : STD
channels : 2
rate : 176400
exact rate : 176400 (176400/1)
msbits : 24
buffer_size : 88200
period_size : 22050
period_time : 125000
tstamp_mode : NONE
period_step : 1
avail_min : 22050
period_event : 0
start_threshold : 88200
stop_threshold : 88200
silence_threshold: 0
silence_size : 0
boundary : 1445068800
Slave: Hardware PCM card 1 'WaveLink HS SPDIF' device 0 subdevice 0
Its setup is:
stream : PLAYBACK
access : MMAP_INTERLEAVED
format : S32_LE
subformat : STD
channels : 2
rate : 176400
exact rate : 176400 (176400/1)
msbits : 32
buffer_size : 88200
period_size : 22050
period_time : 125000
tstamp_mode : NONE
period_step : 1
avail_min : 22050
period_event : 0
start_threshold : 88200
stop_threshold : 88200
silence_threshold: 0
silence_size : 0
boundary : 1445068800
appl_ptr : 0
hw_ptr : 0
underrun!!! (at least 1.537 ms long)
Status:
state : XRUN
trigger_time: 1219.804905467
tstamp : 1219.820257912
delay : 0
avail : 88220
avail_max : 88220
underrun!!! (at least 13.900 ms long)
Status:
state : XRUN
trigger_time: 1222.763695807
tstamp : 1222.902684537
delay : 0
avail : 66169
avail_max : 88219
underrun!!! (at least 1.279 ms long)
Status:
state : XRUN
trigger_time: 1225.972436940
tstamp : 1225.985216250
delay : 0
avail : 88221
avail_max : 88221
underrun!!! (at least 14.141 ms long)
etc. until I stop the playback.
44.1 playback is fine under these conditions (but then why USB audio class
2?)
Further, using MPD for playback I have discovered that the high bit rate
flac files play fine but the same files as wave have the same type of
stall/stop problems.
I tried Windows on the Intel platform with similar problems using windows
media player but no problems with VLC. However with Windows it is not easy
to know what is really going on inside.
Is it possible that the essentially synchronous nature of playing a wave
file from USB source to USB Audio device causes a collision since the data
is going both ways at essentially the same rate and timing?
Let me know what other info you need.
Thanks for looking at this.
-Demian
-----Original Message-----
From: Daniel Mack [mailto:daniel@caiaq.de]
Sent: Saturday, August 21, 2010 2:27 AM
To: Demian Martin
Cc: alsa-devel@alsa-project.org
Subject: Re: Problem with USB Class 2 Audio Driver
On Fri, Aug 20, 2010 at 05:40:22PM -0700, Demian Martin wrote:
> I'm testing an early sample of the Wavelength Wavelink, a USB to S/PDIF
> adapter that supports 44.1-192 KHz sample rates and uses async usb to talk
> to ALSA. It works and plays all of the sample rates correctly with the git
> version of Alsa from 7/30/2010 whenthe files are sourced from the network.
What do you mean by "from the network"? How does your test setup look
like?
> However if I try to play from a usb source to the usb dac it doesn't work
> and the whole system gets unstable.
You could also be more precise here :) What doesn't work, how are you
testing, and in which regard does the system get unstable?
> The platforms I have tested it on seem
> to have a single USB host interface but with USB 2 there should be enough
> bandwidth to pass the data from a USB stick to the cpu and back. If I use
an
> older 96 only usb dac on the same system it works (unless the down
> conversion isn't a direct divide, which overloads the CPU, but that is a
> different issue). The problem seems to be sample rate independent and hits
> the moment I try to access the file. This is using MPD as a player.
Ah, so your data file is stored on a media which is also connected to
USB? Did you connect the two devices to different USB ports or do they
share one uplink with a hub?
> What additional info do you need to troubleshoot this? Is it an intrinsic
> limitation to the interface? What additional tests should I do? It's
> possible it's a hardware issue but how do I divide them so I can go back
to
> the hardware guy if it's his issue?
I'm not aware of any limitation, but there could be such issues as
exceeded bandwith on the bus and the like. How many audio channels are
we talking about?
You could measure the speed of your USB media by using something like
this:
$ time dd if=/path/to/192khz.file of=/dev/null
This should take significantly less time than - let's say - half the
real-time audio playback time of the file, so there's enough headroom to
transport the audio data back to the USB DAC.
What kind of system is this, after all? Did you try other OS on the same
hardware for comparsion?
Daniel
^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 11+ messages in thread
* Re: Problem with USB Class 2 Audio Driver
2010-08-22 23:51 ` Demian Martin
@ 2010-08-23 12:41 ` J. Gordon Rankin
2010-08-23 19:12 ` Daniel Mack
1 sibling, 0 replies; 11+ messages in thread
From: J. Gordon Rankin @ 2010-08-23 12:41 UTC (permalink / raw)
To: Demian Martin; +Cc: 'Ray @ Auraliti', alsa-devel
Demian,
USB Hubs can come in several forms especially USB 2.0 hubs. There are
load leveling and store and forward hubs that can mask the underlying
problem.
I would suggest direct connection. BUT!!!!! We have found that some
front panel USB ports which either travel the length of the PCB or are
wire attached sometimes do not retain their correct impedance and run
into problems, especially with hard drives and such which have error
corrected protocols. Some front panel USB ports will actually force the
USB device into Full instead of High Speed because of this problem.
Presently the player is underruning data from the USB stick. Also not
all sticks are the same. I bought a 128GB unit for a show to store music
on and it's slower than any other unit I have available. You should make
sure you try many variations of these to assure success.
Thanks
Gordon
Demian Martin wrote:
> Daniel:
> I'll try to provide all the info you want. I'll need some prompting for some
> details, please be patient with me.
>
> First the system.
> I have tested on both an intel D945GSEJT atom based MB and an Alis 3.3 AMD
> Geode based mb.
> OS: Linux auraliti-player 2.6.32auraliti-2.0 #1 PREEMPT Fri Jul 30 06:48:14
> GMT 2010 i686 GNU/Linux
> Distro Voyage Linux 0.6.1
> It's a dedicated headless 2 channel audio player, sort of a high performance
> squeezebox. Details here: www.auraliti.com
>
> When I play a file from a network source (connected through nfs) I have no
> problems with either .wav or .flac.
>
> I don't know how to tell with certainty if the USB devices are connecting
> through a common or separate root hubs.
>
> USB stick speed- It took 6.2 seconds to pass a 1 minute 19 second 192/24
> file to dev/null so USB speed is not a problem.
>
> It seems there is a collision when there is a high speed USB storage device
> and the USB class 2 audio on the same host port both moving data at the same
> time.
>
> All of the following were done with the Alix board (Geode 500 MHz
> processor). The Intel does similar but seems more likely to work.
>
> Under some conditions the system loses connection to the USB audio device:
> auraliti-player:~# aplay -v -Dplughw:1
> /media/usb0/Trio-Mytek8X192ADDA-192k.WAV
> Playing WAVE '/media/usb0/Trio-Mytek8X192ADDA-192k.WAV' : Signed 24 bit
> Little Endian in 3bytes, Rate 192000 Hz, Stereo
> aplay: set_params:1116: Unable to install hw params:
> ACCESS: RW_INTERLEAVED
> FORMAT: S24_3LE
> SUBFORMAT: STD
> SAMPLE_BITS: 24
> FRAME_BITS: 48
> CHANNELS: 2
> RATE: 192000
> PERIOD_TIME: 125000
> PERIOD_SIZE: 24000
> PERIOD_BYTES: 144000
> PERIODS: 4
> BUFFER_TIME: 500000
> BUFFER_SIZE: 96000
> BUFFER_BYTES: 576000
> TICK_TIME: 0
> auraliti-player:~#
>
> Fixed by disconnecting and reconnecting the device.
>
>
> Here is what I get playing a 44.1 file, after about 15 seconds:
>
> Playing WAVE '/media/usb0/Piano_44_1.wav' : Signed 24 bit Little Endian in
> 3bytes, Rate 44100 Hz, Stereo
> Plug PCM: Linear conversion PCM (S32_LE)
> Its setup is:
> stream : PLAYBACK
> access : RW_INTERLEAVED
> format : S24_3LE
> subformat : STD
> channels : 2
> rate : 44100
> exact rate : 44100 (44100/1)
> msbits : 24
> buffer_size : 22050
> period_size : 5513
> period_time : 125011
> tstamp_mode : NONE
> period_step : 1
> avail_min : 5513
> period_event : 0
> start_threshold : 22050
> stop_threshold : 22050
> silence_threshold: 0
> silence_size : 0
> boundary : 1445068800
> Slave: Hardware PCM card 1 'WaveLink HS SPDIF' device 0 subdevice 0
> Its setup is:
> stream : PLAYBACK
> access : MMAP_INTERLEAVED
> format : S32_LE
> subformat : STD
> channels : 2
> rate : 44100
> exact rate : 44100 (44100/1)
> msbits : 32
> buffer_size : 22050
> period_size : 5513
> period_time : 125011
> tstamp_mode : NONE
> period_step : 1
> avail_min : 5513
> period_event : 0
> start_threshold : 22050
> stop_threshold : 22050
> silence_threshold: 0
> silence_size : 0
> boundary : 1445068800
> appl_ptr : 0
> hw_ptr : 0
> underrun!!! (at least 0.015 ms long)
> Status:
> state : XRUN
> trigger_time: 903.806908643
> tstamp : 903.807038997
> delay : 0
> avail : 0
> avail_max : 11028
> aplay: xrun:1259: xrun: prepare error: File descriptor in bad state
> auraliti-player:~#
>
> And the system stops playing.
>
> And very quickly on a 176.4 file:
>
> Playing WAVE '/media/usb0/01_Rimsky-Korsakov Dance of the Tumblers.wav' :
> Signed 24 bit Little Endian in 3bytes, Rate 176400 Hz, Stereo
> Plug PCM: Linear conversion PCM (S32_LE)
> Its setup is:
> stream : PLAYBACK
> access : RW_INTERLEAVED
> format : S24_3LE
> subformat : STD
> channels : 2
> rate : 176400
> exact rate : 176400 (176400/1)
> msbits : 24
> buffer_size : 88200
> period_size : 22050
> period_time : 125000
> tstamp_mode : NONE
> period_step : 1
> avail_min : 22050
> period_event : 0
> start_threshold : 88200
> stop_threshold : 88200
> silence_threshold: 0
> silence_size : 0
> boundary : 1445068800
> Slave: Hardware PCM card 1 'WaveLink HS SPDIF' device 0 subdevice 0
> Its setup is:
> stream : PLAYBACK
> access : MMAP_INTERLEAVED
> format : S32_LE
> subformat : STD
> channels : 2
> rate : 176400
> exact rate : 176400 (176400/1)
> msbits : 32
> buffer_size : 88200
> period_size : 22050
> period_time : 125000
> tstamp_mode : NONE
> period_step : 1
> avail_min : 22050
> period_event : 0
> start_threshold : 88200
> stop_threshold : 88200
> silence_threshold: 0
> silence_size : 0
> boundary : 1445068800
> appl_ptr : 0
> hw_ptr : 0
> underrun!!! (at least 0.010 ms long)
> Status:
> state : XRUN
> trigger_time: 1050.313984810
> tstamp : 1050.314067000
> delay : 0
> avail : 1413
> avail_max : 22071
> aplay: xrun:1259: xrun: prepare error: File descriptor in bad state
> auraliti-player:~#
>
> If in interpose a USB 1 hub on the usb storage I get this:
>
> auraliti-player:~# aplay -v -Dplughw:1 /media/usb0/01_Rimsky-Korsakov\
> Dance\ of\ the\ Tumblers.wav
> Playing WAVE '/media/usb0/01_Rimsky-Korsakov Dance of the Tumblers.wav' :
> Signed 24 bit Little Endian in 3bytes, Rate 176400 Hz, Stereo
> Plug PCM: Linear conversion PCM (S32_LE)
> Its setup is:
> stream : PLAYBACK
> access : RW_INTERLEAVED
> format : S24_3LE
> subformat : STD
> channels : 2
> rate : 176400
> exact rate : 176400 (176400/1)
> msbits : 24
> buffer_size : 88200
> period_size : 22050
> period_time : 125000
> tstamp_mode : NONE
> period_step : 1
> avail_min : 22050
> period_event : 0
> start_threshold : 88200
> stop_threshold : 88200
> silence_threshold: 0
> silence_size : 0
> boundary : 1445068800
> Slave: Hardware PCM card 1 'WaveLink HS SPDIF' device 0 subdevice 0
> Its setup is:
> stream : PLAYBACK
> access : MMAP_INTERLEAVED
> format : S32_LE
> subformat : STD
> channels : 2
> rate : 176400
> exact rate : 176400 (176400/1)
> msbits : 32
> buffer_size : 88200
> period_size : 22050
> period_time : 125000
> tstamp_mode : NONE
> period_step : 1
> avail_min : 22050
> period_event : 0
> start_threshold : 88200
> stop_threshold : 88200
> silence_threshold: 0
> silence_size : 0
> boundary : 1445068800
> appl_ptr : 0
> hw_ptr : 0
> underrun!!! (at least 1.537 ms long)
> Status:
> state : XRUN
> trigger_time: 1219.804905467
> tstamp : 1219.820257912
> delay : 0
> avail : 88220
> avail_max : 88220
> underrun!!! (at least 13.900 ms long)
> Status:
> state : XRUN
> trigger_time: 1222.763695807
> tstamp : 1222.902684537
> delay : 0
> avail : 66169
> avail_max : 88219
> underrun!!! (at least 1.279 ms long)
> Status:
> state : XRUN
> trigger_time: 1225.972436940
> tstamp : 1225.985216250
> delay : 0
> avail : 88221
> avail_max : 88221
> underrun!!! (at least 14.141 ms long)
>
> etc. until I stop the playback.
>
> 44.1 playback is fine under these conditions (but then why USB audio class
> 2?)
>
> Further, using MPD for playback I have discovered that the high bit rate
> flac files play fine but the same files as wave have the same type of
> stall/stop problems.
>
> I tried Windows on the Intel platform with similar problems using windows
> media player but no problems with VLC. However with Windows it is not easy
> to know what is really going on inside.
>
> Is it possible that the essentially synchronous nature of playing a wave
> file from USB source to USB Audio device causes a collision since the data
> is going both ways at essentially the same rate and timing?
>
> Let me know what other info you need.
>
> Thanks for looking at this.
> -Demian
>
>
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Daniel Mack [mailto:daniel@caiaq.de]
> Sent: Saturday, August 21, 2010 2:27 AM
> To: Demian Martin
> Cc: alsa-devel@alsa-project.org
> Subject: Re: Problem with USB Class 2 Audio Driver
>
> On Fri, Aug 20, 2010 at 05:40:22PM -0700, Demian Martin wrote:
>
>> I'm testing an early sample of the Wavelength Wavelink, a USB to S/PDIF
>> adapter that supports 44.1-192 KHz sample rates and uses async usb to talk
>> to ALSA. It works and plays all of the sample rates correctly with the git
>> version of Alsa from 7/30/2010 whenthe files are sourced from the network.
>>
>
> What do you mean by "from the network"? How does your test setup look
> like?
>
>
>> However if I try to play from a usb source to the usb dac it doesn't work
>> and the whole system gets unstable.
>>
>
> You could also be more precise here :) What doesn't work, how are you
> testing, and in which regard does the system get unstable?
>
>
>> The platforms I have tested it on seem
>> to have a single USB host interface but with USB 2 there should be enough
>> bandwidth to pass the data from a USB stick to the cpu and back. If I use
>>
> an
>
>> older 96 only usb dac on the same system it works (unless the down
>> conversion isn't a direct divide, which overloads the CPU, but that is a
>> different issue). The problem seems to be sample rate independent and hits
>> the moment I try to access the file. This is using MPD as a player.
>>
>
> Ah, so your data file is stored on a media which is also connected to
> USB? Did you connect the two devices to different USB ports or do they
> share one uplink with a hub?
>
>
>> What additional info do you need to troubleshoot this? Is it an intrinsic
>> limitation to the interface? What additional tests should I do? It's
>> possible it's a hardware issue but how do I divide them so I can go back
>>
> to
>
>> the hardware guy if it's his issue?
>>
>
> I'm not aware of any limitation, but there could be such issues as
> exceeded bandwith on the bus and the like. How many audio channels are
> we talking about?
>
> You could measure the speed of your USB media by using something like
> this:
>
> $ time dd if=/path/to/192khz.file of=/dev/null
>
> This should take significantly less time than - let's say - half the
> real-time audio playback time of the file, so there's enough headroom to
> transport the audio data back to the USB DAC.
>
> What kind of system is this, after all? Did you try other OS on the same
> hardware for comparsion?
>
>
> Daniel
>
>
>
>
>
--
J. Gordon Rankin
Owner and Chief Scientist
====== Wavelength Audio, ltd ======
High-End Audio since 1981
SET Tube Amplifiers, DACS & Preamps
http://www.WavelengthAudio.com
===================================
Computer USB DACS
http://www.USBDacs.com
===================================
SET Tube Guitar Amplifiers
NAMM Member since 1998
http://www.Guitar-Engines.com
===================================
3703 Petoskey Avenue
Cincinnati, Ohio 45227 USA
mailto:waudio@cinti.net
mailto:wavelength@fuse.net
(513) 271-4186 phone/voicemail
^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 11+ messages in thread
* Re: Problem with USB Class 2 Audio Driver
2010-08-22 23:51 ` Demian Martin
2010-08-23 12:41 ` J. Gordon Rankin
@ 2010-08-23 19:12 ` Daniel Mack
[not found] ` <20100823191209.GF17833-ahpEBR4enfnCULTFXS99ULNAH6kLmebB@public.gmane.org>
1 sibling, 1 reply; 11+ messages in thread
From: Daniel Mack @ 2010-08-23 19:12 UTC (permalink / raw)
To: Demian Martin
Cc: alsa-devel-K7yf7f+aM1XWsZ/bQMPhNw, 'J. Gordon Rankin',
linux-usb-u79uwXL29TY76Z2rM5mHXA
Hi,
FWIW, I currently have no clue what could be the reason for this issue.
I copied the linux-usb mailing list, maybe anyone over there has an
idea.
Summary is: Demian is trying to play back an audio file over an USB
connected soundcard, and the file itself is also stored on a media
connected via USB. The transfer alone seems to be reasonably fast
(tested with 'dd'), and the card itself also works fine (tested with a
file stored on a different media), but the combination of them both
fails. At least for high sample rates - iow, high data throughput.
Could there be anything wrong with the isochronous bandwith reservation?
Thanks,
Daniel
On Sun, Aug 22, 2010 at 04:51:55PM -0700, Demian Martin wrote:
> Daniel:
> I'll try to provide all the info you want. I'll need some prompting for some
> details, please be patient with me.
>
> First the system.
> I have tested on both an intel D945GSEJT atom based MB and an Alis 3.3 AMD
> Geode based mb.
> OS: Linux auraliti-player 2.6.32auraliti-2.0 #1 PREEMPT Fri Jul 30 06:48:14
> GMT 2010 i686 GNU/Linux
> Distro Voyage Linux 0.6.1
> It's a dedicated headless 2 channel audio player, sort of a high performance
> squeezebox. Details here: www.auraliti.com
>
> When I play a file from a network source (connected through nfs) I have no
> problems with either .wav or .flac.
>
> I don't know how to tell with certainty if the USB devices are connecting
> through a common or separate root hubs.
>
> USB stick speed- It took 6.2 seconds to pass a 1 minute 19 second 192/24
> file to dev/null so USB speed is not a problem.
>
> It seems there is a collision when there is a high speed USB storage device
> and the USB class 2 audio on the same host port both moving data at the same
> time.
>
> All of the following were done with the Alix board (Geode 500 MHz
> processor). The Intel does similar but seems more likely to work.
>
> Under some conditions the system loses connection to the USB audio device:
> auraliti-player:~# aplay -v -Dplughw:1
> /media/usb0/Trio-Mytek8X192ADDA-192k.WAV
> Playing WAVE '/media/usb0/Trio-Mytek8X192ADDA-192k.WAV' : Signed 24 bit
> Little Endian in 3bytes, Rate 192000 Hz, Stereo
> aplay: set_params:1116: Unable to install hw params:
> ACCESS: RW_INTERLEAVED
> FORMAT: S24_3LE
> SUBFORMAT: STD
> SAMPLE_BITS: 24
> FRAME_BITS: 48
> CHANNELS: 2
> RATE: 192000
> PERIOD_TIME: 125000
> PERIOD_SIZE: 24000
> PERIOD_BYTES: 144000
> PERIODS: 4
> BUFFER_TIME: 500000
> BUFFER_SIZE: 96000
> BUFFER_BYTES: 576000
> TICK_TIME: 0
> auraliti-player:~#
>
> Fixed by disconnecting and reconnecting the device.
>
>
> Here is what I get playing a 44.1 file, after about 15 seconds:
>
> Playing WAVE '/media/usb0/Piano_44_1.wav' : Signed 24 bit Little Endian in
> 3bytes, Rate 44100 Hz, Stereo
> Plug PCM: Linear conversion PCM (S32_LE)
> Its setup is:
> stream : PLAYBACK
> access : RW_INTERLEAVED
> format : S24_3LE
> subformat : STD
> channels : 2
> rate : 44100
> exact rate : 44100 (44100/1)
> msbits : 24
> buffer_size : 22050
> period_size : 5513
> period_time : 125011
> tstamp_mode : NONE
> period_step : 1
> avail_min : 5513
> period_event : 0
> start_threshold : 22050
> stop_threshold : 22050
> silence_threshold: 0
> silence_size : 0
> boundary : 1445068800
> Slave: Hardware PCM card 1 'WaveLink HS SPDIF' device 0 subdevice 0
> Its setup is:
> stream : PLAYBACK
> access : MMAP_INTERLEAVED
> format : S32_LE
> subformat : STD
> channels : 2
> rate : 44100
> exact rate : 44100 (44100/1)
> msbits : 32
> buffer_size : 22050
> period_size : 5513
> period_time : 125011
> tstamp_mode : NONE
> period_step : 1
> avail_min : 5513
> period_event : 0
> start_threshold : 22050
> stop_threshold : 22050
> silence_threshold: 0
> silence_size : 0
> boundary : 1445068800
> appl_ptr : 0
> hw_ptr : 0
> underrun!!! (at least 0.015 ms long)
> Status:
> state : XRUN
> trigger_time: 903.806908643
> tstamp : 903.807038997
> delay : 0
> avail : 0
> avail_max : 11028
> aplay: xrun:1259: xrun: prepare error: File descriptor in bad state
> auraliti-player:~#
>
> And the system stops playing.
>
> And very quickly on a 176.4 file:
>
> Playing WAVE '/media/usb0/01_Rimsky-Korsakov Dance of the Tumblers.wav' :
> Signed 24 bit Little Endian in 3bytes, Rate 176400 Hz, Stereo
> Plug PCM: Linear conversion PCM (S32_LE)
> Its setup is:
> stream : PLAYBACK
> access : RW_INTERLEAVED
> format : S24_3LE
> subformat : STD
> channels : 2
> rate : 176400
> exact rate : 176400 (176400/1)
> msbits : 24
> buffer_size : 88200
> period_size : 22050
> period_time : 125000
> tstamp_mode : NONE
> period_step : 1
> avail_min : 22050
> period_event : 0
> start_threshold : 88200
> stop_threshold : 88200
> silence_threshold: 0
> silence_size : 0
> boundary : 1445068800
> Slave: Hardware PCM card 1 'WaveLink HS SPDIF' device 0 subdevice 0
> Its setup is:
> stream : PLAYBACK
> access : MMAP_INTERLEAVED
> format : S32_LE
> subformat : STD
> channels : 2
> rate : 176400
> exact rate : 176400 (176400/1)
> msbits : 32
> buffer_size : 88200
> period_size : 22050
> period_time : 125000
> tstamp_mode : NONE
> period_step : 1
> avail_min : 22050
> period_event : 0
> start_threshold : 88200
> stop_threshold : 88200
> silence_threshold: 0
> silence_size : 0
> boundary : 1445068800
> appl_ptr : 0
> hw_ptr : 0
> underrun!!! (at least 0.010 ms long)
> Status:
> state : XRUN
> trigger_time: 1050.313984810
> tstamp : 1050.314067000
> delay : 0
> avail : 1413
> avail_max : 22071
> aplay: xrun:1259: xrun: prepare error: File descriptor in bad state
> auraliti-player:~#
>
> If in interpose a USB 1 hub on the usb storage I get this:
>
> auraliti-player:~# aplay -v -Dplughw:1 /media/usb0/01_Rimsky-Korsakov\
> Dance\ of\ the\ Tumblers.wav
> Playing WAVE '/media/usb0/01_Rimsky-Korsakov Dance of the Tumblers.wav' :
> Signed 24 bit Little Endian in 3bytes, Rate 176400 Hz, Stereo
> Plug PCM: Linear conversion PCM (S32_LE)
> Its setup is:
> stream : PLAYBACK
> access : RW_INTERLEAVED
> format : S24_3LE
> subformat : STD
> channels : 2
> rate : 176400
> exact rate : 176400 (176400/1)
> msbits : 24
> buffer_size : 88200
> period_size : 22050
> period_time : 125000
> tstamp_mode : NONE
> period_step : 1
> avail_min : 22050
> period_event : 0
> start_threshold : 88200
> stop_threshold : 88200
> silence_threshold: 0
> silence_size : 0
> boundary : 1445068800
> Slave: Hardware PCM card 1 'WaveLink HS SPDIF' device 0 subdevice 0
> Its setup is:
> stream : PLAYBACK
> access : MMAP_INTERLEAVED
> format : S32_LE
> subformat : STD
> channels : 2
> rate : 176400
> exact rate : 176400 (176400/1)
> msbits : 32
> buffer_size : 88200
> period_size : 22050
> period_time : 125000
> tstamp_mode : NONE
> period_step : 1
> avail_min : 22050
> period_event : 0
> start_threshold : 88200
> stop_threshold : 88200
> silence_threshold: 0
> silence_size : 0
> boundary : 1445068800
> appl_ptr : 0
> hw_ptr : 0
> underrun!!! (at least 1.537 ms long)
> Status:
> state : XRUN
> trigger_time: 1219.804905467
> tstamp : 1219.820257912
> delay : 0
> avail : 88220
> avail_max : 88220
> underrun!!! (at least 13.900 ms long)
> Status:
> state : XRUN
> trigger_time: 1222.763695807
> tstamp : 1222.902684537
> delay : 0
> avail : 66169
> avail_max : 88219
> underrun!!! (at least 1.279 ms long)
> Status:
> state : XRUN
> trigger_time: 1225.972436940
> tstamp : 1225.985216250
> delay : 0
> avail : 88221
> avail_max : 88221
> underrun!!! (at least 14.141 ms long)
>
> etc. until I stop the playback.
>
> 44.1 playback is fine under these conditions (but then why USB audio class
> 2?)
>
> Further, using MPD for playback I have discovered that the high bit rate
> flac files play fine but the same files as wave have the same type of
> stall/stop problems.
>
> I tried Windows on the Intel platform with similar problems using windows
> media player but no problems with VLC. However with Windows it is not easy
> to know what is really going on inside.
>
> Is it possible that the essentially synchronous nature of playing a wave
> file from USB source to USB Audio device causes a collision since the data
> is going both ways at essentially the same rate and timing?
>
> Let me know what other info you need.
>
> Thanks for looking at this.
> -Demian
>
>
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Daniel Mack [mailto:daniel-rDUAYElUppE@public.gmane.org]
> Sent: Saturday, August 21, 2010 2:27 AM
> To: Demian Martin
> Cc: alsa-devel-K7yf7f+aM1XWsZ/bQMPhNw@public.gmane.org
> Subject: Re: Problem with USB Class 2 Audio Driver
>
> On Fri, Aug 20, 2010 at 05:40:22PM -0700, Demian Martin wrote:
> > I'm testing an early sample of the Wavelength Wavelink, a USB to S/PDIF
> > adapter that supports 44.1-192 KHz sample rates and uses async usb to talk
> > to ALSA. It works and plays all of the sample rates correctly with the git
> > version of Alsa from 7/30/2010 whenthe files are sourced from the network.
>
> What do you mean by "from the network"? How does your test setup look
> like?
>
> > However if I try to play from a usb source to the usb dac it doesn't work
> > and the whole system gets unstable.
>
> You could also be more precise here :) What doesn't work, how are you
> testing, and in which regard does the system get unstable?
>
> > The platforms I have tested it on seem
> > to have a single USB host interface but with USB 2 there should be enough
> > bandwidth to pass the data from a USB stick to the cpu and back. If I use
> an
> > older 96 only usb dac on the same system it works (unless the down
> > conversion isn't a direct divide, which overloads the CPU, but that is a
> > different issue). The problem seems to be sample rate independent and hits
> > the moment I try to access the file. This is using MPD as a player.
>
> Ah, so your data file is stored on a media which is also connected to
> USB? Did you connect the two devices to different USB ports or do they
> share one uplink with a hub?
>
> > What additional info do you need to troubleshoot this? Is it an intrinsic
> > limitation to the interface? What additional tests should I do? It's
> > possible it's a hardware issue but how do I divide them so I can go back
> to
> > the hardware guy if it's his issue?
>
> I'm not aware of any limitation, but there could be such issues as
> exceeded bandwith on the bus and the like. How many audio channels are
> we talking about?
>
> You could measure the speed of your USB media by using something like
> this:
>
> $ time dd if=/path/to/192khz.file of=/dev/null
>
> This should take significantly less time than - let's say - half the
> real-time audio playback time of the file, so there's enough headroom to
> transport the audio data back to the USB DAC.
>
> What kind of system is this, after all? Did you try other OS on the same
> hardware for comparsion?
>
>
> Daniel
>
>
--
To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe linux-usb" in
the body of a message to majordomo-u79uwXL29TY76Z2rM5mHXA@public.gmane.org
More majordomo info at http://vger.kernel.org/majordomo-info.html
^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 11+ messages in thread
* Re: Problem with USB Class 2 Audio Driver
[not found] ` <20100823191209.GF17833-ahpEBR4enfnCULTFXS99ULNAH6kLmebB@public.gmane.org>
@ 2010-08-23 20:34 ` J. Gordon Rankin
[not found] ` <4C72DB6A.5080601-P3U7sUXGDiZeoWH0uzbU5w@public.gmane.org>
2010-08-24 14:56 ` Alan Stern
1 sibling, 1 reply; 11+ messages in thread
From: J. Gordon Rankin @ 2010-08-23 20:34 UTC (permalink / raw)
To: Daniel Mack
Cc: Demian Martin, alsa-devel-K7yf7f+aM1XWsZ/bQMPhNw,
linux-usb-u79uwXL29TY76Z2rM5mHXA
Daniel,
Part of the problem could be that everything is working synchronously.
The reading of the USB drive and the outputting to the USB converter are
both happening in sync because the application would work this way.
High End Audio is usually nuts... but I have experienced that this type
of combination results in poor output even when it works 100%. I have
yet had time to figure out why... same reason that FLAC never sounds as
good as a WAV file in my experience, though there I can verify that the
CPU usage does go up higher than most people and engineers would suspect.
Thanks
Gordon
Daniel Mack wrote:
> Hi,
>
> FWIW, I currently have no clue what could be the reason for this issue.
> I copied the linux-usb mailing list, maybe anyone over there has an
> idea.
>
> Summary is: Demian is trying to play back an audio file over an USB
> connected soundcard, and the file itself is also stored on a media
> connected via USB. The transfer alone seems to be reasonably fast
> (tested with 'dd'), and the card itself also works fine (tested with a
> file stored on a different media), but the combination of them both
> fails. At least for high sample rates - iow, high data throughput.
>
> Could there be anything wrong with the isochronous bandwith reservation?
>
>
> Thanks,
> Daniel
>
>
> On Sun, Aug 22, 2010 at 04:51:55PM -0700, Demian Martin wrote:
>
>> Daniel:
>> I'll try to provide all the info you want. I'll need some prompting for some
>> details, please be patient with me.
>>
>> First the system.
>> I have tested on both an intel D945GSEJT atom based MB and an Alis 3.3 AMD
>> Geode based mb.
>> OS: Linux auraliti-player 2.6.32auraliti-2.0 #1 PREEMPT Fri Jul 30 06:48:14
>> GMT 2010 i686 GNU/Linux
>> Distro Voyage Linux 0.6.1
>> It's a dedicated headless 2 channel audio player, sort of a high performance
>> squeezebox. Details here: www.auraliti.com
>>
>> When I play a file from a network source (connected through nfs) I have no
>> problems with either .wav or .flac.
>>
>> I don't know how to tell with certainty if the USB devices are connecting
>> through a common or separate root hubs.
>>
>> USB stick speed- It took 6.2 seconds to pass a 1 minute 19 second 192/24
>> file to dev/null so USB speed is not a problem.
>>
>> It seems there is a collision when there is a high speed USB storage device
>> and the USB class 2 audio on the same host port both moving data at the same
>> time.
>>
>> All of the following were done with the Alix board (Geode 500 MHz
>> processor). The Intel does similar but seems more likely to work.
>>
>> Under some conditions the system loses connection to the USB audio device:
>> auraliti-player:~# aplay -v -Dplughw:1
>> /media/usb0/Trio-Mytek8X192ADDA-192k.WAV
>> Playing WAVE '/media/usb0/Trio-Mytek8X192ADDA-192k.WAV' : Signed 24 bit
>> Little Endian in 3bytes, Rate 192000 Hz, Stereo
>> aplay: set_params:1116: Unable to install hw params:
>> ACCESS: RW_INTERLEAVED
>> FORMAT: S24_3LE
>> SUBFORMAT: STD
>> SAMPLE_BITS: 24
>> FRAME_BITS: 48
>> CHANNELS: 2
>> RATE: 192000
>> PERIOD_TIME: 125000
>> PERIOD_SIZE: 24000
>> PERIOD_BYTES: 144000
>> PERIODS: 4
>> BUFFER_TIME: 500000
>> BUFFER_SIZE: 96000
>> BUFFER_BYTES: 576000
>> TICK_TIME: 0
>> auraliti-player:~#
>>
>> Fixed by disconnecting and reconnecting the device.
>>
>>
>> Here is what I get playing a 44.1 file, after about 15 seconds:
>>
>> Playing WAVE '/media/usb0/Piano_44_1.wav' : Signed 24 bit Little Endian in
>> 3bytes, Rate 44100 Hz, Stereo
>> Plug PCM: Linear conversion PCM (S32_LE)
>> Its setup is:
>> stream : PLAYBACK
>> access : RW_INTERLEAVED
>> format : S24_3LE
>> subformat : STD
>> channels : 2
>> rate : 44100
>> exact rate : 44100 (44100/1)
>> msbits : 24
>> buffer_size : 22050
>> period_size : 5513
>> period_time : 125011
>> tstamp_mode : NONE
>> period_step : 1
>> avail_min : 5513
>> period_event : 0
>> start_threshold : 22050
>> stop_threshold : 22050
>> silence_threshold: 0
>> silence_size : 0
>> boundary : 1445068800
>> Slave: Hardware PCM card 1 'WaveLink HS SPDIF' device 0 subdevice 0
>> Its setup is:
>> stream : PLAYBACK
>> access : MMAP_INTERLEAVED
>> format : S32_LE
>> subformat : STD
>> channels : 2
>> rate : 44100
>> exact rate : 44100 (44100/1)
>> msbits : 32
>> buffer_size : 22050
>> period_size : 5513
>> period_time : 125011
>> tstamp_mode : NONE
>> period_step : 1
>> avail_min : 5513
>> period_event : 0
>> start_threshold : 22050
>> stop_threshold : 22050
>> silence_threshold: 0
>> silence_size : 0
>> boundary : 1445068800
>> appl_ptr : 0
>> hw_ptr : 0
>> underrun!!! (at least 0.015 ms long)
>> Status:
>> state : XRUN
>> trigger_time: 903.806908643
>> tstamp : 903.807038997
>> delay : 0
>> avail : 0
>> avail_max : 11028
>> aplay: xrun:1259: xrun: prepare error: File descriptor in bad state
>> auraliti-player:~#
>>
>> And the system stops playing.
>>
>> And very quickly on a 176.4 file:
>>
>> Playing WAVE '/media/usb0/01_Rimsky-Korsakov Dance of the Tumblers.wav' :
>> Signed 24 bit Little Endian in 3bytes, Rate 176400 Hz, Stereo
>> Plug PCM: Linear conversion PCM (S32_LE)
>> Its setup is:
>> stream : PLAYBACK
>> access : RW_INTERLEAVED
>> format : S24_3LE
>> subformat : STD
>> channels : 2
>> rate : 176400
>> exact rate : 176400 (176400/1)
>> msbits : 24
>> buffer_size : 88200
>> period_size : 22050
>> period_time : 125000
>> tstamp_mode : NONE
>> period_step : 1
>> avail_min : 22050
>> period_event : 0
>> start_threshold : 88200
>> stop_threshold : 88200
>> silence_threshold: 0
>> silence_size : 0
>> boundary : 1445068800
>> Slave: Hardware PCM card 1 'WaveLink HS SPDIF' device 0 subdevice 0
>> Its setup is:
>> stream : PLAYBACK
>> access : MMAP_INTERLEAVED
>> format : S32_LE
>> subformat : STD
>> channels : 2
>> rate : 176400
>> exact rate : 176400 (176400/1)
>> msbits : 32
>> buffer_size : 88200
>> period_size : 22050
>> period_time : 125000
>> tstamp_mode : NONE
>> period_step : 1
>> avail_min : 22050
>> period_event : 0
>> start_threshold : 88200
>> stop_threshold : 88200
>> silence_threshold: 0
>> silence_size : 0
>> boundary : 1445068800
>> appl_ptr : 0
>> hw_ptr : 0
>> underrun!!! (at least 0.010 ms long)
>> Status:
>> state : XRUN
>> trigger_time: 1050.313984810
>> tstamp : 1050.314067000
>> delay : 0
>> avail : 1413
>> avail_max : 22071
>> aplay: xrun:1259: xrun: prepare error: File descriptor in bad state
>> auraliti-player:~#
>>
>> If in interpose a USB 1 hub on the usb storage I get this:
>>
>> auraliti-player:~# aplay -v -Dplughw:1 /media/usb0/01_Rimsky-Korsakov\
>> Dance\ of\ the\ Tumblers.wav
>> Playing WAVE '/media/usb0/01_Rimsky-Korsakov Dance of the Tumblers.wav' :
>> Signed 24 bit Little Endian in 3bytes, Rate 176400 Hz, Stereo
>> Plug PCM: Linear conversion PCM (S32_LE)
>> Its setup is:
>> stream : PLAYBACK
>> access : RW_INTERLEAVED
>> format : S24_3LE
>> subformat : STD
>> channels : 2
>> rate : 176400
>> exact rate : 176400 (176400/1)
>> msbits : 24
>> buffer_size : 88200
>> period_size : 22050
>> period_time : 125000
>> tstamp_mode : NONE
>> period_step : 1
>> avail_min : 22050
>> period_event : 0
>> start_threshold : 88200
>> stop_threshold : 88200
>> silence_threshold: 0
>> silence_size : 0
>> boundary : 1445068800
>> Slave: Hardware PCM card 1 'WaveLink HS SPDIF' device 0 subdevice 0
>> Its setup is:
>> stream : PLAYBACK
>> access : MMAP_INTERLEAVED
>> format : S32_LE
>> subformat : STD
>> channels : 2
>> rate : 176400
>> exact rate : 176400 (176400/1)
>> msbits : 32
>> buffer_size : 88200
>> period_size : 22050
>> period_time : 125000
>> tstamp_mode : NONE
>> period_step : 1
>> avail_min : 22050
>> period_event : 0
>> start_threshold : 88200
>> stop_threshold : 88200
>> silence_threshold: 0
>> silence_size : 0
>> boundary : 1445068800
>> appl_ptr : 0
>> hw_ptr : 0
>> underrun!!! (at least 1.537 ms long)
>> Status:
>> state : XRUN
>> trigger_time: 1219.804905467
>> tstamp : 1219.820257912
>> delay : 0
>> avail : 88220
>> avail_max : 88220
>> underrun!!! (at least 13.900 ms long)
>> Status:
>> state : XRUN
>> trigger_time: 1222.763695807
>> tstamp : 1222.902684537
>> delay : 0
>> avail : 66169
>> avail_max : 88219
>> underrun!!! (at least 1.279 ms long)
>> Status:
>> state : XRUN
>> trigger_time: 1225.972436940
>> tstamp : 1225.985216250
>> delay : 0
>> avail : 88221
>> avail_max : 88221
>> underrun!!! (at least 14.141 ms long)
>>
>> etc. until I stop the playback.
>>
>> 44.1 playback is fine under these conditions (but then why USB audio class
>> 2?)
>>
>> Further, using MPD for playback I have discovered that the high bit rate
>> flac files play fine but the same files as wave have the same type of
>> stall/stop problems.
>>
>> I tried Windows on the Intel platform with similar problems using windows
>> media player but no problems with VLC. However with Windows it is not easy
>> to know what is really going on inside.
>>
>> Is it possible that the essentially synchronous nature of playing a wave
>> file from USB source to USB Audio device causes a collision since the data
>> is going both ways at essentially the same rate and timing?
>>
>> Let me know what other info you need.
>>
>> Thanks for looking at this.
>> -Demian
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: Daniel Mack [mailto:daniel-rDUAYElUppE@public.gmane.org]
>> Sent: Saturday, August 21, 2010 2:27 AM
>> To: Demian Martin
>> Cc: alsa-devel-K7yf7f+aM1XWsZ/bQMPhNw@public.gmane.org
>> Subject: Re: Problem with USB Class 2 Audio Driver
>>
>> On Fri, Aug 20, 2010 at 05:40:22PM -0700, Demian Martin wrote:
>>
>>> I'm testing an early sample of the Wavelength Wavelink, a USB to S/PDIF
>>> adapter that supports 44.1-192 KHz sample rates and uses async usb to talk
>>> to ALSA. It works and plays all of the sample rates correctly with the git
>>> version of Alsa from 7/30/2010 whenthe files are sourced from the network.
>>>
>> What do you mean by "from the network"? How does your test setup look
>> like?
>>
>>
>>> However if I try to play from a usb source to the usb dac it doesn't work
>>> and the whole system gets unstable.
>>>
>> You could also be more precise here :) What doesn't work, how are you
>> testing, and in which regard does the system get unstable?
>>
>>
>>> The platforms I have tested it on seem
>>> to have a single USB host interface but with USB 2 there should be enough
>>> bandwidth to pass the data from a USB stick to the cpu and back. If I use
>>>
>> an
>>
>>> older 96 only usb dac on the same system it works (unless the down
>>> conversion isn't a direct divide, which overloads the CPU, but that is a
>>> different issue). The problem seems to be sample rate independent and hits
>>> the moment I try to access the file. This is using MPD as a player.
>>>
>> Ah, so your data file is stored on a media which is also connected to
>> USB? Did you connect the two devices to different USB ports or do they
>> share one uplink with a hub?
>>
>>
>>> What additional info do you need to troubleshoot this? Is it an intrinsic
>>> limitation to the interface? What additional tests should I do? It's
>>> possible it's a hardware issue but how do I divide them so I can go back
>>>
>> to
>>
>>> the hardware guy if it's his issue?
>>>
>> I'm not aware of any limitation, but there could be such issues as
>> exceeded bandwith on the bus and the like. How many audio channels are
>> we talking about?
>>
>> You could measure the speed of your USB media by using something like
>> this:
>>
>> $ time dd if=/path/to/192khz.file of=/dev/null
>>
>> This should take significantly less time than - let's say - half the
>> real-time audio playback time of the file, so there's enough headroom to
>> transport the audio data back to the USB DAC.
>>
>> What kind of system is this, after all? Did you try other OS on the same
>> hardware for comparsion?
>>
>>
>> Daniel
>>
>>
>>
>
>
>
--
J. Gordon Rankin
Owner and Chief Scientist
====== Wavelength Audio, ltd ======
High-End Audio since 1981
SET Tube Amplifiers, DACS & Preamps
http://www.WavelengthAudio.com
===================================
Computer USB DACS
http://www.USBDacs.com
===================================
SET Tube Guitar Amplifiers
NAMM Member since 1998
http://www.Guitar-Engines.com
===================================
3703 Petoskey Avenue
Cincinnati, Ohio 45227 USA
mailto:waudio-P3U7sUXGDiZeoWH0uzbU5w@public.gmane.org
mailto:wavelength-rDkNP/OoUoU@public.gmane.org
(513) 271-4186 phone/voicemail
--
To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe linux-usb" in
the body of a message to majordomo-u79uwXL29TY76Z2rM5mHXA@public.gmane.org
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^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 11+ messages in thread
* Re: Problem with USB Class 2 Audio Driver
[not found] ` <4C72DB6A.5080601-P3U7sUXGDiZeoWH0uzbU5w@public.gmane.org>
@ 2010-08-24 7:06 ` Daniel Mack
[not found] ` <20100824070601.GK17833-ahpEBR4enfnCULTFXS99ULNAH6kLmebB@public.gmane.org>
0 siblings, 1 reply; 11+ messages in thread
From: Daniel Mack @ 2010-08-24 7:06 UTC (permalink / raw)
To: J. Gordon Rankin
Cc: Demian Martin, alsa-devel-K7yf7f+aM1XWsZ/bQMPhNw,
linux-usb-u79uwXL29TY76Z2rM5mHXA
On Mon, Aug 23, 2010 at 04:34:50PM -0400, J. Gordon Rankin wrote:
> Part of the problem could be that everything is working
> synchronously. The reading of the USB drive and the outputting to
> the USB converter are both happening in sync because the
> application would work this way.
True. But for the USB side of the story, there is a reserved part of the
bandwidth for isochronous (real-time) data which is guaranteed for
exacty such scenarios, so bulk data bursts wont't kill the stream.
The question is whether this reserved bandwidth is large enough for the
application that causes trouble here, and if the driver does the right
thing to let the core know about its needs.
> High End Audio is usually nuts... but I have experienced that this
> type of combination results in poor output even when it works 100%.
> I have yet had time to figure out why... same reason that FLAC never
> sounds as good as a WAV file in my experience, though there I can
> verify that the CPU usage does go up higher than most people and
> engineers would suspect.
That shouldn't be a problem as long as the application reads its bulk
data is chunks which are large enough. As far as I'm concerned, I've
never seen such issues on Linux or Mac OS X, unless for very small data
blocks, resulting in too tight scheduling. In other words, it might be
an issue for any kind of real-time audio processing which requires
minimal latency, but not for an audio player which can operate on huge
blocks.
Daniel
> Daniel Mack wrote:
> >Hi,
> >
> >FWIW, I currently have no clue what could be the reason for this issue.
> >I copied the linux-usb mailing list, maybe anyone over there has an
> >idea.
> >
> >Summary is: Demian is trying to play back an audio file over an USB
> >connected soundcard, and the file itself is also stored on a media
> >connected via USB. The transfer alone seems to be reasonably fast
> >(tested with 'dd'), and the card itself also works fine (tested with a
> >file stored on a different media), but the combination of them both
> >fails. At least for high sample rates - iow, high data throughput.
> >
> >Could there be anything wrong with the isochronous bandwith reservation?
> >
> >
> >Thanks,
> >Daniel
> >
> >
> >On Sun, Aug 22, 2010 at 04:51:55PM -0700, Demian Martin wrote:
> >>Daniel:
> >>I'll try to provide all the info you want. I'll need some prompting for some
> >>details, please be patient with me.
> >>
> >>First the system.
> >>I have tested on both an intel D945GSEJT atom based MB and an Alis 3.3 AMD
> >>Geode based mb.
> >>OS: Linux auraliti-player 2.6.32auraliti-2.0 #1 PREEMPT Fri Jul 30 06:48:14
> >>GMT 2010 i686 GNU/Linux
> >>Distro Voyage Linux 0.6.1
> >>It's a dedicated headless 2 channel audio player, sort of a high performance
> >>squeezebox. Details here: www.auraliti.com
> >>
> >>When I play a file from a network source (connected through nfs) I have no
> >>problems with either .wav or .flac.
> >>
> >>I don't know how to tell with certainty if the USB devices are connecting
> >>through a common or separate root hubs.
> >>
> >>USB stick speed- It took 6.2 seconds to pass a 1 minute 19 second 192/24
> >>file to dev/null so USB speed is not a problem.
> >>
> >>It seems there is a collision when there is a high speed USB storage device
> >>and the USB class 2 audio on the same host port both moving data at the same
> >>time.
> >>
> >>All of the following were done with the Alix board (Geode 500 MHz
> >>processor). The Intel does similar but seems more likely to work.
> >>
> >>Under some conditions the system loses connection to the USB audio device:
> >>auraliti-player:~# aplay -v -Dplughw:1
> >>/media/usb0/Trio-Mytek8X192ADDA-192k.WAV
> >>Playing WAVE '/media/usb0/Trio-Mytek8X192ADDA-192k.WAV' : Signed 24 bit
> >>Little Endian in 3bytes, Rate 192000 Hz, Stereo
> >>aplay: set_params:1116: Unable to install hw params:
> >>ACCESS: RW_INTERLEAVED
> >>FORMAT: S24_3LE
> >>SUBFORMAT: STD
> >>SAMPLE_BITS: 24
> >>FRAME_BITS: 48
> >>CHANNELS: 2
> >>RATE: 192000
> >>PERIOD_TIME: 125000
> >>PERIOD_SIZE: 24000
> >>PERIOD_BYTES: 144000
> >>PERIODS: 4
> >>BUFFER_TIME: 500000
> >>BUFFER_SIZE: 96000
> >>BUFFER_BYTES: 576000
> >>TICK_TIME: 0
> >>auraliti-player:~#
> >>
> >>Fixed by disconnecting and reconnecting the device.
> >>
> >>
> >>Here is what I get playing a 44.1 file, after about 15 seconds:
> >>
> >>Playing WAVE '/media/usb0/Piano_44_1.wav' : Signed 24 bit Little Endian in
> >>3bytes, Rate 44100 Hz, Stereo
> >>Plug PCM: Linear conversion PCM (S32_LE)
> >>Its setup is:
> >> stream : PLAYBACK
> >> access : RW_INTERLEAVED
> >> format : S24_3LE
> >> subformat : STD
> >> channels : 2
> >> rate : 44100
> >> exact rate : 44100 (44100/1)
> >> msbits : 24
> >> buffer_size : 22050
> >> period_size : 5513
> >> period_time : 125011
> >> tstamp_mode : NONE
> >> period_step : 1
> >> avail_min : 5513
> >> period_event : 0
> >> start_threshold : 22050
> >> stop_threshold : 22050
> >> silence_threshold: 0
> >> silence_size : 0
> >> boundary : 1445068800
> >>Slave: Hardware PCM card 1 'WaveLink HS SPDIF' device 0 subdevice 0
> >>Its setup is:
> >> stream : PLAYBACK
> >> access : MMAP_INTERLEAVED
> >> format : S32_LE
> >> subformat : STD
> >> channels : 2
> >> rate : 44100
> >> exact rate : 44100 (44100/1)
> >> msbits : 32
> >> buffer_size : 22050
> >> period_size : 5513
> >> period_time : 125011
> >> tstamp_mode : NONE
> >> period_step : 1
> >> avail_min : 5513
> >> period_event : 0
> >> start_threshold : 22050
> >> stop_threshold : 22050
> >> silence_threshold: 0
> >> silence_size : 0
> >> boundary : 1445068800
> >> appl_ptr : 0
> >> hw_ptr : 0
> >>underrun!!! (at least 0.015 ms long)
> >>Status:
> >> state : XRUN
> >> trigger_time: 903.806908643
> >> tstamp : 903.807038997
> >> delay : 0
> >> avail : 0
> >> avail_max : 11028
> >>aplay: xrun:1259: xrun: prepare error: File descriptor in bad state
> >>auraliti-player:~#
> >>
> >>And the system stops playing.
> >>
> >>And very quickly on a 176.4 file:
> >>
> >>Playing WAVE '/media/usb0/01_Rimsky-Korsakov Dance of the Tumblers.wav' :
> >>Signed 24 bit Little Endian in 3bytes, Rate 176400 Hz, Stereo
> >>Plug PCM: Linear conversion PCM (S32_LE)
> >>Its setup is:
> >> stream : PLAYBACK
> >> access : RW_INTERLEAVED
> >> format : S24_3LE
> >> subformat : STD
> >> channels : 2
> >> rate : 176400
> >> exact rate : 176400 (176400/1)
> >> msbits : 24
> >> buffer_size : 88200
> >> period_size : 22050
> >> period_time : 125000
> >> tstamp_mode : NONE
> >> period_step : 1
> >> avail_min : 22050
> >> period_event : 0
> >> start_threshold : 88200
> >> stop_threshold : 88200
> >> silence_threshold: 0
> >> silence_size : 0
> >> boundary : 1445068800
> >>Slave: Hardware PCM card 1 'WaveLink HS SPDIF' device 0 subdevice 0
> >>Its setup is:
> >> stream : PLAYBACK
> >> access : MMAP_INTERLEAVED
> >> format : S32_LE
> >> subformat : STD
> >> channels : 2
> >> rate : 176400
> >> exact rate : 176400 (176400/1)
> >> msbits : 32
> >> buffer_size : 88200
> >> period_size : 22050
> >> period_time : 125000
> >> tstamp_mode : NONE
> >> period_step : 1
> >> avail_min : 22050
> >> period_event : 0
> >> start_threshold : 88200
> >> stop_threshold : 88200
> >> silence_threshold: 0
> >> silence_size : 0
> >> boundary : 1445068800
> >> appl_ptr : 0
> >> hw_ptr : 0
> >>underrun!!! (at least 0.010 ms long)
> >>Status:
> >> state : XRUN
> >> trigger_time: 1050.313984810
> >> tstamp : 1050.314067000
> >> delay : 0
> >> avail : 1413
> >> avail_max : 22071
> >>aplay: xrun:1259: xrun: prepare error: File descriptor in bad state
> >>auraliti-player:~#
> >>
> >>If in interpose a USB 1 hub on the usb storage I get this:
> >>
> >>auraliti-player:~# aplay -v -Dplughw:1 /media/usb0/01_Rimsky-Korsakov\
> >>Dance\ of\ the\ Tumblers.wav
> >>Playing WAVE '/media/usb0/01_Rimsky-Korsakov Dance of the Tumblers.wav' :
> >>Signed 24 bit Little Endian in 3bytes, Rate 176400 Hz, Stereo
> >>Plug PCM: Linear conversion PCM (S32_LE)
> >>Its setup is:
> >> stream : PLAYBACK
> >> access : RW_INTERLEAVED
> >> format : S24_3LE
> >> subformat : STD
> >> channels : 2
> >> rate : 176400
> >> exact rate : 176400 (176400/1)
> >> msbits : 24
> >> buffer_size : 88200
> >> period_size : 22050
> >> period_time : 125000
> >> tstamp_mode : NONE
> >> period_step : 1
> >> avail_min : 22050
> >> period_event : 0
> >> start_threshold : 88200
> >> stop_threshold : 88200
> >> silence_threshold: 0
> >> silence_size : 0
> >> boundary : 1445068800
> >>Slave: Hardware PCM card 1 'WaveLink HS SPDIF' device 0 subdevice 0
> >>Its setup is:
> >> stream : PLAYBACK
> >> access : MMAP_INTERLEAVED
> >> format : S32_LE
> >> subformat : STD
> >> channels : 2
> >> rate : 176400
> >> exact rate : 176400 (176400/1)
> >> msbits : 32
> >> buffer_size : 88200
> >> period_size : 22050
> >> period_time : 125000
> >> tstamp_mode : NONE
> >> period_step : 1
> >> avail_min : 22050
> >> period_event : 0
> >> start_threshold : 88200
> >> stop_threshold : 88200
> >> silence_threshold: 0
> >> silence_size : 0
> >> boundary : 1445068800
> >> appl_ptr : 0
> >> hw_ptr : 0
> >>underrun!!! (at least 1.537 ms long)
> >>Status:
> >> state : XRUN
> >> trigger_time: 1219.804905467
> >> tstamp : 1219.820257912
> >> delay : 0
> >> avail : 88220
> >> avail_max : 88220
> >>underrun!!! (at least 13.900 ms long)
> >>Status:
> >> state : XRUN
> >> trigger_time: 1222.763695807
> >> tstamp : 1222.902684537
> >> delay : 0
> >> avail : 66169
> >> avail_max : 88219
> >>underrun!!! (at least 1.279 ms long)
> >>Status:
> >> state : XRUN
> >> trigger_time: 1225.972436940
> >> tstamp : 1225.985216250
> >> delay : 0
> >> avail : 88221
> >> avail_max : 88221
> >>underrun!!! (at least 14.141 ms long)
> >>
> >>etc. until I stop the playback.
> >>
> >>44.1 playback is fine under these conditions (but then why USB audio class
> >>2?)
> >>
> >>Further, using MPD for playback I have discovered that the high bit rate
> >>flac files play fine but the same files as wave have the same type of
> >>stall/stop problems.
> >>
> >>I tried Windows on the Intel platform with similar problems using windows
> >>media player but no problems with VLC. However with Windows it is not easy
> >>to know what is really going on inside.
> >>
> >>Is it possible that the essentially synchronous nature of playing a wave
> >>file from USB source to USB Audio device causes a collision since the data
> >>is going both ways at essentially the same rate and timing?
> >>
> >>Let me know what other info you need.
> >>
> >>Thanks for looking at this.
> >> -Demian
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>-----Original Message-----
> >>From: Daniel Mack [mailto:daniel-rDUAYElUppE@public.gmane.org] Sent: Saturday,
> >>August 21, 2010 2:27 AM
> >>To: Demian Martin
> >>Cc: alsa-devel-K7yf7f+aM1XWsZ/bQMPhNw@public.gmane.org
> >>Subject: Re: Problem with USB Class 2 Audio Driver
> >>
> >>On Fri, Aug 20, 2010 at 05:40:22PM -0700, Demian Martin wrote:
> >>>I'm testing an early sample of the Wavelength Wavelink, a USB to S/PDIF
> >>>adapter that supports 44.1-192 KHz sample rates and uses async usb to talk
> >>>to ALSA. It works and plays all of the sample rates correctly with the git
> >>>version of Alsa from 7/30/2010 whenthe files are sourced from the network.
> >>What do you mean by "from the network"? How does your test setup look
> >>like?
> >>
> >>>However if I try to play from a usb source to the usb dac it doesn't work
> >>>and the whole system gets unstable.
> >>You could also be more precise here :) What doesn't work, how are you
> >>testing, and in which regard does the system get unstable?
> >>
> >>>The platforms I have tested it on seem
> >>>to have a single USB host interface but with USB 2 there should be enough
> >>>bandwidth to pass the data from a USB stick to the cpu and back. If I use
> >>an
> >>>older 96 only usb dac on the same system it works (unless the down
> >>>conversion isn't a direct divide, which overloads the CPU, but that is a
> >>>different issue). The problem seems to be sample rate independent and hits
> >>>the moment I try to access the file. This is using MPD as a player.
> >>Ah, so your data file is stored on a media which is also connected to
> >>USB? Did you connect the two devices to different USB ports or do they
> >>share one uplink with a hub?
> >>
> >>>What additional info do you need to troubleshoot this? Is it an intrinsic
> >>>limitation to the interface? What additional tests should I do? It's
> >>>possible it's a hardware issue but how do I divide them so I can go back
> >>to
> >>>the hardware guy if it's his issue?
> >>I'm not aware of any limitation, but there could be such issues as
> >>exceeded bandwith on the bus and the like. How many audio channels are
> >>we talking about?
> >>
> >>You could measure the speed of your USB media by using something like
> >>this:
> >>
> >> $ time dd if=/path/to/192khz.file of=/dev/null
> >>
> >>This should take significantly less time than - let's say - half the
> >>real-time audio playback time of the file, so there's enough headroom to
> >>transport the audio data back to the USB DAC.
> >>
> >>What kind of system is this, after all? Did you try other OS on the same
> >>hardware for comparsion?
> >>
> >>
> >>Daniel
> >>
> >>
> >
> >
>
> --
> J. Gordon Rankin
> Owner and Chief Scientist
> ====== Wavelength Audio, ltd ======
> High-End Audio since 1981
> SET Tube Amplifiers, DACS & Preamps
> http://www.WavelengthAudio.com
> ===================================
> Computer USB DACS
> http://www.USBDacs.com
> ===================================
> SET Tube Guitar Amplifiers
> NAMM Member since 1998
> http://www.Guitar-Engines.com
> ===================================
> 3703 Petoskey Avenue
> Cincinnati, Ohio 45227 USA
> mailto:waudio-P3U7sUXGDiZeoWH0uzbU5w@public.gmane.org
> mailto:wavelength-rDkNP/OoUoU@public.gmane.org
> (513) 271-4186 phone/voicemail
>
--
To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe linux-usb" in
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More majordomo info at http://vger.kernel.org/majordomo-info.html
^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 11+ messages in thread
* Re: Problem with USB Class 2 Audio Driver
[not found] ` <20100824070601.GK17833-ahpEBR4enfnCULTFXS99ULNAH6kLmebB@public.gmane.org>
@ 2010-08-24 7:52 ` Oliver Neukum
0 siblings, 0 replies; 11+ messages in thread
From: Oliver Neukum @ 2010-08-24 7:52 UTC (permalink / raw)
To: Daniel Mack
Cc: J. Gordon Rankin, Demian Martin,
alsa-devel-K7yf7f+aM1XWsZ/bQMPhNw,
linux-usb-u79uwXL29TY76Z2rM5mHXA
Am Dienstag, 24. August 2010, 09:06:02 schrieb Daniel Mack:
> On Mon, Aug 23, 2010 at 04:34:50PM -0400, J. Gordon Rankin wrote:
> > Part of the problem could be that everything is working
> > synchronously. The reading of the USB drive and the outputting to
> > the USB converter are both happening in sync because the
> > application would work this way.
>
> True. But for the USB side of the story, there is a reserved part of the
> bandwidth for isochronous (real-time) data which is guaranteed for
> exacty such scenarios, so bulk data bursts wont't kill the stream.
Yes, but note that this works one-way. The audio can still starve the disk.
You need to check in the device descriptors, how much bandwidth
the audio device will take. Then you need to compute whether the
rest left to the disk is enough.
Regards
Oliver
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^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 11+ messages in thread
* Re: Problem with USB Class 2 Audio Driver
[not found] ` <20100823191209.GF17833-ahpEBR4enfnCULTFXS99ULNAH6kLmebB@public.gmane.org>
2010-08-23 20:34 ` J. Gordon Rankin
@ 2010-08-24 14:56 ` Alan Stern
[not found] ` <Pine.LNX.4.44L0.1008241050320.1652-100000-IYeN2dnnYyZXsRXLowluHWD2FQJk+8+b@public.gmane.org>
1 sibling, 1 reply; 11+ messages in thread
From: Alan Stern @ 2010-08-24 14:56 UTC (permalink / raw)
To: Daniel Mack
Cc: Demian Martin, alsa-devel-K7yf7f+aM1XWsZ/bQMPhNw,
'J. Gordon Rankin',
linux-usb-u79uwXL29TY76Z2rM5mHXA
On Mon, 23 Aug 2010, Daniel Mack wrote:
> Hi,
>
> FWIW, I currently have no clue what could be the reason for this issue.
> I copied the linux-usb mailing list, maybe anyone over there has an
> idea.
>
> Summary is: Demian is trying to play back an audio file over an USB
> connected soundcard, and the file itself is also stored on a media
> connected via USB. The transfer alone seems to be reasonably fast
> (tested with 'dd'), and the card itself also works fine (tested with a
> file stored on a different media), but the combination of them both
> fails. At least for high sample rates - iow, high data throughput.
>
> Could there be anything wrong with the isochronous bandwith reservation?
I doubt it. But we have seen reports of problems before from people
trying to do high-bandwidth transfers to multiple devices concurrently.
To start, let's see the "lsusb -v" output for the audio card and the
storage device, together with the dmesg log showing the two devices
being plugged in.
For tracking down the exact problem, it will help to have a usbmon
trace showing what happens during playback. (Stop the playback after
the first underrun occurs.) Instructions are in
Documentation/usb/usbmon.txt.
Alan Stern
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^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 11+ messages in thread
* RE: Problem with USB Class 2 Audio Driver
[not found] ` <Pine.LNX.4.44L0.1008241050320.1652-100000-IYeN2dnnYyZXsRXLowluHWD2FQJk+8+b@public.gmane.org>
@ 2010-09-06 18:31 ` Demian Martin
2010-09-06 20:05 ` Alan Stern
0 siblings, 1 reply; 11+ messages in thread
From: Demian Martin @ 2010-09-06 18:31 UTC (permalink / raw)
To: 'Alan Stern', 'Daniel Mack'
Cc: alsa-devel-K7yf7f+aM1XWsZ/bQMPhNw, 'J. Gordon Rankin',
linux-usb-u79uwXL29TY76Z2rM5mHXA
Sorry for the slow response, the communications were trapped by Yahoo's spam
filter. More details to follow.
First, I switched to a more powerful platform (slightly) the Intel Atom
D945GSEJT.
I have managed to get Win & to run on this and it allowed me to test the
same hardware doing the same task (as much as Windows permits). I can using
adjacent USB ports boot Win & and play 192 KHz content through to the
Wavelink 192 KHz USB audio interface without problems. This suggests (but
isn't absolute proof) that the hardware is not a restriction.
Second, trying the suggestions below I noticed an error making this more
difficult. When connecting the Wavelink I see its accessible from ALSA:
auraliti-player:~# aplay -l
**** List of PLAYBACK Hardware Devices ****
card 1: SPDIF [WaveLink HS SPDIF], device 0: USB Audio [USB Audio]
Subdevices: 1/1
Subdevice #0: subdevice #0
But invisible to lsusb. Its device 009 below:
auraliti-player:~# lsusb
Bus 005 Device 001: ID 1d6b:0001 Linux Foundation 1.1 root hub
Bus 002 Device 006: ID 413c:3012 Dell Computer Corp. Optical Wheel Mouse
Bus 002 Device 005: ID 413c:2006 Dell Computer Corp.
Bus 002 Device 004: ID 10d5:000d Uni Class Technology Co., Ltd
Bus 002 Device 003: ID 413c:1004 Dell Computer Corp.
Bus 002 Device 002: ID 058f:9254 Alcor Micro Corp. Hub
Bus 002 Device 001: ID 1d6b:0001 Linux Foundation 1.1 root hub
Bus 004 Device 001: ID 1d6b:0001 Linux Foundation 1.1 root hub
Bus 003 Device 001: ID 1d6b:0001 Linux Foundation 1.1 root hub
Bus 001 Device 009: ID 21b4:0210
Bus 001 Device 003: ID 1307:0163 Transcend Information, Inc. 256MB/512MB/1GB
Flash Drive
Bus 001 Device 001: ID 1d6b:0002 Linux Foundation 2.0 root hub
Here is the message when its installed:
Sep 6 17:22:29 localhost vmunix: [ 1537.716042] usb 1-7: new high speed USB
device using ehci_hcd and address 9
Sep 6 17:22:29 localhost vmunix: [ 1537.830436] usb 1-7: config 1 has an
invalid interface number: 3 but max is 2
Sep 6 17:22:29 localhost vmunix: [ 1537.830518] usb 1-7: config 1 has no
interface number 2
Sep 6 17:22:29 localhost vmunix: [ 1537.830804] usb 1-7: config 1 has an
invalid interface number: 3 but max is 2
Sep 6 17:22:29 localhost vmunix: [ 1537.830884] usb 1-7: config 1 has no
interface number 2
Sep 6 17:22:29 localhost vmunix: [ 1537.833069] usb 1-7: configuration #1
chosen from 2 choices
Here is the detailed output from lsusb -v -s 001:009 | tee usb.txt
Bus 001 Device 009: ID 21b4:0210
Device Descriptor:
bLength 18
bDescriptorType 1
bcdUSB 2.00
bDeviceClass 239 Miscellaneous Device
bDeviceSubClass 2 ?
bDeviceProtocol 1 Interface Association
bMaxPacketSize0 64
idVendor 0x21b4
idProduct 0x0210
bcdDevice 1.51
iManufacturer 1 Wavelength Audio, ltd.
iProduct 2 WaveLink HS SPDIF
iSerial 3 (C) 2010 XMOS/Wavelength Audio
bNumConfigurations 2
Configuration Descriptor:
bLength 9
bDescriptorType 2
wTotalLength 168
bNumInterfaces 3
bConfigurationValue 1
iConfiguration 0
bmAttributes 0x80
(Bus Powered)
MaxPower 500mA
Interface Association:
bLength 8
bDescriptorType 11
bFirstInterface 0
bInterfaceCount 2
bFunctionClass 1 Audio
bFunctionSubClass 0
bFunctionProtocol 32
iFunction 0
Interface Descriptor:
bLength 9
bDescriptorType 4
bInterfaceNumber 0
bAlternateSetting 0
bNumEndpoints 0
bInterfaceClass 1 Audio
bInterfaceSubClass 1 Control Device
bInterfaceProtocol 32
iInterface 7 WaveLink HS SPDIF
AudioControl Interface Descriptor:
bLength 9
bDescriptorType 36
bDescriptorSubtype 1 (HEADER)
bcdADC 2.00
wTotalLength 31496
bInCollection 0
junk at descriptor end: 00
AudioControl Interface Descriptor:
bLength 8
bDescriptorType 36
bDescriptorSubtype 10 (unknown)
Invalid desc subtype: 28 01 07 00 01
AudioControl Interface Descriptor:
bLength 17
bDescriptorType 36
bDescriptorSubtype 2 (INPUT_TERMINAL)
bTerminalID 2
wTerminalType 0x0101 USB Streaming
bAssocTerminal 0
bNrChannels 40
wChannelConfig 0x0302
Right Front (R)
Surround (S)
Side Left (SL)
iChannelNames 0
iTerminal 0
junk at descriptor end: 00 00 00 00 02
AudioControl Interface Descriptor:
bLength 18
bDescriptorType 36
bDescriptorSubtype 6 (FEATURE_UNIT)
bUnitID 10
bSourceID 2
bControlSize 0
iFeature 0
junk at descriptor end: 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 0f
AudioControl Interface Descriptor:
bLength 12
bDescriptorType 36
bDescriptorSubtype 3 (OUTPUT_TERMINAL)
bTerminalID 20
wTerminalType 0x0301 Speaker
bAssocTerminal 0
bSourceID 10
iTerminal 40 ËÌ
junk at descriptor end: 00 00 05
Interface Descriptor:
bLength 9
bDescriptorType 4
bInterfaceNumber 1
bAlternateSetting 0
bNumEndpoints 0
bInterfaceClass 1 Audio
bInterfaceSubClass 2 Streaming
bInterfaceProtocol 32
iInterface 8 WaveLink HS SPDIF
Interface Descriptor:
bLength 9
bDescriptorType 4
bInterfaceNumber 1
bAlternateSetting 1
bNumEndpoints 2
bInterfaceClass 1 Audio
bInterfaceSubClass 2 Streaming
bInterfaceProtocol 32
iInterface 9 WaveLink HS SPDIF
AudioStreaming Interface Descriptor:
bLength 16
bDescriptorType 36
bDescriptorSubtype 1 (AS_GENERAL)
bTerminalLink 2
bDelay 0 frames
wFormatTag 257 undefined
junk at descriptor end: 00 00 00 02 03 00 00 00 00
AudioStreaming Interface Descriptor:
bLength 6
bDescriptorType 36
bDescriptorSubtype 2 (FORMAT_TYPE)
Warning: Descriptor too short
bFormatType 1 (FORMAT_TYPE_I)
Warning: Descriptor too short
bNrChannels 4
bSubframeSize 24
bBitResolution 0
bSamFreqType 0 Continuous
tLowerSamFreq 0
tUpperSamFreq 12544
Endpoint Descriptor:
bLength 7
bDescriptorType 5
bEndpointAddress 0x01 EP 1 OUT
bmAttributes 5
Transfer Type Isochronous
Synch Type Asynchronous
Usage Type Data
wMaxPacketSize 0x0400 1x 1024 bytes
bInterval 1
AudioControl Endpoint Descriptor:
bLength 8
bDescriptorType 37
bDescriptorSubtype 1 (EP_GENERAL)
bmAttributes 0x00
bLockDelayUnits 0 Undefined
wLockDelay 2050 Undefined
junk at descriptor end: 00
Endpoint Descriptor:
bLength 7
bDescriptorType 5
bEndpointAddress 0x81 EP 1 IN
bmAttributes 17
Transfer Type Isochronous
Synch Type None
Usage Type Feedback
wMaxPacketSize 0x0004 1x 4 bytes
bInterval 8
Interface Descriptor:
bLength 9
bDescriptorType 4
bInterfaceNumber 3
bAlternateSetting 0
bNumEndpoints 0
bInterfaceClass 254 Application Specific Interface
bInterfaceSubClass 1 Device Firmware Update
bInterfaceProtocol 0
iInterface 0
Device Firmware Upgrade Interface Descriptor:
bLength 7
bDescriptorType 33
bmAttributes 7
Will Not Detach
Manifestation Tolerant
Upload Supported
Download Supported
wDetachTimeout 250 milliseconds
wTransferSize 64 bytes
Configuration Descriptor:
bLength 9
bDescriptorType 2
wTotalLength 168
bNumInterfaces 3
bConfigurationValue 1
iConfiguration 0
bmAttributes 0x80
(Bus Powered)
MaxPower 500mA
Interface Association:
bLength 8
bDescriptorType 11
bFirstInterface 0
bInterfaceCount 2
bFunctionClass 1 Audio
bFunctionSubClass 0
bFunctionProtocol 32
iFunction 0
Interface Descriptor:
bLength 9
bDescriptorType 4
bInterfaceNumber 0
bAlternateSetting 0
bNumEndpoints 0
bInterfaceClass 1 Audio
bInterfaceSubClass 1 Control Device
bInterfaceProtocol 32
iInterface 7 WaveLink HS SPDIF
AudioControl Interface Descriptor:
bLength 9
bDescriptorType 36
bDescriptorSubtype 1 (HEADER)
bcdADC 2.00
wTotalLength 31496
bInCollection 0
junk at descriptor end: 00
AudioControl Interface Descriptor:
bLength 8
bDescriptorType 36
bDescriptorSubtype 10 (unknown)
Invalid desc subtype: 28 01 07 00 01
AudioControl Interface Descriptor:
bLength 17
bDescriptorType 36
bDescriptorSubtype 2 (INPUT_TERMINAL)
bTerminalID 2
wTerminalType 0x0101 USB Streaming
bAssocTerminal 0
bNrChannels 40
wChannelConfig 0x0302
Right Front (R)
Surround (S)
Side Left (SL)
iChannelNames 0
iTerminal 0
junk at descriptor end: 00 00 00 00 02
AudioControl Interface Descriptor:
bLength 18
bDescriptorType 36
bDescriptorSubtype 6 (FEATURE_UNIT)
bUnitID 10
bSourceID 2
bControlSize 0
iFeature 0
junk at descriptor end: 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 0f
AudioControl Interface Descriptor:
bLength 12
bDescriptorType 36
bDescriptorSubtype 3 (OUTPUT_TERMINAL)
bTerminalID 20
wTerminalType 0x0301 Speaker
bAssocTerminal 0
bSourceID 10
iTerminal 40 ËÌ
junk at descriptor end: 00 00 05
Interface Descriptor:
bLength 9
bDescriptorType 4
bInterfaceNumber 1
bAlternateSetting 0
bNumEndpoints 0
bInterfaceClass 1 Audio
bInterfaceSubClass 2 Streaming
bInterfaceProtocol 32
iInterface 8 WaveLink HS SPDIF
Interface Descriptor:
bLength 9
bDescriptorType 4
bInterfaceNumber 1
bAlternateSetting 1
bNumEndpoints 2
bInterfaceClass 1 Audio
bInterfaceSubClass 2 Streaming
bInterfaceProtocol 32
iInterface 9 WaveLink HS SPDIF
AudioStreaming Interface Descriptor:
bLength 16
bDescriptorType 36
bDescriptorSubtype 1 (AS_GENERAL)
bTerminalLink 2
bDelay 0 frames
wFormatTag 257 undefined
junk at descriptor end: 00 00 00 02 03 00 00 00 00
AudioStreaming Interface Descriptor:
bLength 6
bDescriptorType 36
bDescriptorSubtype 2 (FORMAT_TYPE)
Warning: Descriptor too short
bFormatType 1 (FORMAT_TYPE_I)
Warning: Descriptor too short
bNrChannels 4
bSubframeSize 24
bBitResolution 0
bSamFreqType 0 Continuous
tLowerSamFreq 0
tUpperSamFreq 12544
Endpoint Descriptor:
bLength 7
bDescriptorType 5
bEndpointAddress 0x01 EP 1 OUT
bmAttributes 5
Transfer Type Isochronous
Synch Type Asynchronous
Usage Type Data
wMaxPacketSize 0x0400 1x 1024 bytes
bInterval 1
AudioControl Endpoint Descriptor:
bLength 8
bDescriptorType 37
bDescriptorSubtype 1 (EP_GENERAL)
bmAttributes 0x00
bLockDelayUnits 0 Undefined
wLockDelay 2050 Undefined
junk at descriptor end: 00
Endpoint Descriptor:
bLength 7
bDescriptorType 5
bEndpointAddress 0x81 EP 1 IN
bmAttributes 17
Transfer Type Isochronous
Synch Type None
Usage Type Feedback
wMaxPacketSize 0x0004 1x 4 bytes
bInterval 8
Interface Descriptor:
bLength 9
bDescriptorType 4
bInterfaceNumber 3
bAlternateSetting 0
bNumEndpoints 0
bInterfaceClass 254 Application Specific Interface
bInterfaceSubClass 1 Device Firmware Update
bInterfaceProtocol 0
iInterface 0
Device Firmware Upgrade Interface Descriptor:
bLength 7
bDescriptorType 33
bmAttributes 7
Will Not Detach
Manifestation Tolerant
Upload Supported
Download Supported
wDetachTimeout 250 milliseconds
wTransferSize 64 bytes
Device Qualifier (for other device speed):
bLength 10
bDescriptorType 6
bcdUSB 2.00
bDeviceClass 0 (Defined at Interface level)
bDeviceSubClass 0
bDeviceProtocol 0
bMaxPacketSize0 64
bNumConfigurations 1
Device Status: 0x0000
(Bus Powered)
I need to figure out how to install usbmon on this debian platform before I
can get a trace. I may be able to borrow a USB sniffer if that helps.
-Demian
-----Original Message-----
From: Alan Stern [mailto:stern-nwvwT67g6+6dFdvTe/nMLpVzexx5G7lz@public.gmane.org]
Sent: Tuesday, August 24, 2010 7:56 AM
To: Daniel Mack
Cc: Demian Martin; alsa-devel-K7yf7f+aM1XWsZ/bQMPhNw@public.gmane.org; 'J. Gordon Rankin';
linux-usb-u79uwXL29TY76Z2rM5mHXA@public.gmane.org
Subject: Re: Problem with USB Class 2 Audio Driver
On Mon, 23 Aug 2010, Daniel Mack wrote:
> Hi,
>
> FWIW, I currently have no clue what could be the reason for this issue.
> I copied the linux-usb mailing list, maybe anyone over there has an
> idea.
>
> Summary is: Demian is trying to play back an audio file over an USB
> connected soundcard, and the file itself is also stored on a media
> connected via USB. The transfer alone seems to be reasonably fast
> (tested with 'dd'), and the card itself also works fine (tested with a
> file stored on a different media), but the combination of them both
> fails. At least for high sample rates - iow, high data throughput.
>
> Could there be anything wrong with the isochronous bandwith reservation?
I doubt it. But we have seen reports of problems before from people
trying to do high-bandwidth transfers to multiple devices concurrently.
To start, let's see the "lsusb -v" output for the audio card and the
storage device, together with the dmesg log showing the two devices
being plugged in.
For tracking down the exact problem, it will help to have a usbmon
trace showing what happens during playback. (Stop the playback after
the first underrun occurs.) Instructions are in
Documentation/usb/usbmon.txt.
Alan Stern
--
To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe linux-usb" in
the body of a message to majordomo-u79uwXL29TY76Z2rM5mHXA@public.gmane.org
More majordomo info at http://vger.kernel.org/majordomo-info.html
^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 11+ messages in thread
* RE: Problem with USB Class 2 Audio Driver
2010-09-06 18:31 ` Demian Martin
@ 2010-09-06 20:05 ` Alan Stern
0 siblings, 0 replies; 11+ messages in thread
From: Alan Stern @ 2010-09-06 20:05 UTC (permalink / raw)
To: Demian Martin
Cc: 'Daniel Mack',
alsa-devel-K7yf7f+aM1XWsZ/bQMPhNw, 'J. Gordon Rankin',
linux-usb-u79uwXL29TY76Z2rM5mHXA
On Mon, 6 Sep 2010, Demian Martin wrote:
> Sorry for the slow response, the communications were trapped by Yahoo's spam
> filter. More details to follow.
>
> First, I switched to a more powerful platform (slightly) the Intel Atom
> D945GSEJT.
> I have managed to get Win & to run on this and it allowed me to test the
Windows 7?
> same hardware doing the same task (as much as Windows permits). I can using
> adjacent USB ports boot Win & and play 192 KHz content through to the
> Wavelink 192 KHz USB audio interface without problems. This suggests (but
> isn't absolute proof) that the hardware is not a restriction.
>
> Second, trying the suggestions below I noticed an error making this more
> difficult. When connecting the Wavelink I see its accessible from ALSA:
> auraliti-player:~# aplay -l
> **** List of PLAYBACK Hardware Devices ****
> card 1: SPDIF [WaveLink HS SPDIF], device 0: USB Audio [USB Audio]
> Subdevices: 1/1
> Subdevice #0: subdevice #0
>
> But invisible to lsusb. Its device 009 below:
What do you mean by "invisible"? It's plainly visible as device 009,
as you point out.
> auraliti-player:~# lsusb
> Bus 005 Device 001: ID 1d6b:0001 Linux Foundation 1.1 root hub
> Bus 002 Device 006: ID 413c:3012 Dell Computer Corp. Optical Wheel Mouse
> Bus 002 Device 005: ID 413c:2006 Dell Computer Corp.
> Bus 002 Device 004: ID 10d5:000d Uni Class Technology Co., Ltd
> Bus 002 Device 003: ID 413c:1004 Dell Computer Corp.
> Bus 002 Device 002: ID 058f:9254 Alcor Micro Corp. Hub
> Bus 002 Device 001: ID 1d6b:0001 Linux Foundation 1.1 root hub
> Bus 004 Device 001: ID 1d6b:0001 Linux Foundation 1.1 root hub
> Bus 003 Device 001: ID 1d6b:0001 Linux Foundation 1.1 root hub
> Bus 001 Device 009: ID 21b4:0210
> Bus 001 Device 003: ID 1307:0163 Transcend Information, Inc. 256MB/512MB/1GB
> Flash Drive
> Bus 001 Device 001: ID 1d6b:0002 Linux Foundation 2.0 root hub
>
> Here is the message when its installed:
> Sep 6 17:22:29 localhost vmunix: [ 1537.716042] usb 1-7: new high speed USB
> device using ehci_hcd and address 9
> Sep 6 17:22:29 localhost vmunix: [ 1537.830436] usb 1-7: config 1 has an
> invalid interface number: 3 but max is 2
> Sep 6 17:22:29 localhost vmunix: [ 1537.830518] usb 1-7: config 1 has no
> interface number 2
> Sep 6 17:22:29 localhost vmunix: [ 1537.830804] usb 1-7: config 1 has an
> invalid interface number: 3 but max is 2
> Sep 6 17:22:29 localhost vmunix: [ 1537.830884] usb 1-7: config 1 has no
> interface number 2
> Sep 6 17:22:29 localhost vmunix: [ 1537.833069] usb 1-7: configuration #1
> chosen from 2 choices
The stupid firmware lists config 1 twice! And within config 1, it has
interfaces 0, 1, and 3! Nevertheless, it should still work.
> I need to figure out how to install usbmon on this debian platform before I
> can get a trace. I may be able to borrow a USB sniffer if that helps.
There's probably nothing to install. Try just following the
instructions.
Alan Stern
--
To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe linux-usb" in
the body of a message to majordomo-u79uwXL29TY76Z2rM5mHXA@public.gmane.org
More majordomo info at http://vger.kernel.org/majordomo-info.html
^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 11+ messages in thread
end of thread, other threads:[~2010-09-06 20:05 UTC | newest]
Thread overview: 11+ messages (download: mbox.gz / follow: Atom feed)
-- links below jump to the message on this page --
2010-08-21 0:40 Problem with USB Class 2 Audio Driver Demian Martin
2010-08-21 9:27 ` Daniel Mack
2010-08-22 23:51 ` Demian Martin
2010-08-23 12:41 ` J. Gordon Rankin
2010-08-23 19:12 ` Daniel Mack
[not found] ` <20100823191209.GF17833-ahpEBR4enfnCULTFXS99ULNAH6kLmebB@public.gmane.org>
2010-08-23 20:34 ` J. Gordon Rankin
[not found] ` <4C72DB6A.5080601-P3U7sUXGDiZeoWH0uzbU5w@public.gmane.org>
2010-08-24 7:06 ` Daniel Mack
[not found] ` <20100824070601.GK17833-ahpEBR4enfnCULTFXS99ULNAH6kLmebB@public.gmane.org>
2010-08-24 7:52 ` Oliver Neukum
2010-08-24 14:56 ` Alan Stern
[not found] ` <Pine.LNX.4.44L0.1008241050320.1652-100000-IYeN2dnnYyZXsRXLowluHWD2FQJk+8+b@public.gmane.org>
2010-09-06 18:31 ` Demian Martin
2010-09-06 20:05 ` Alan Stern
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