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From: Igor Stoppa <igor.stoppa@gmail.com>
To: Matthew Wilcox <willy@infradead.org>
Cc: keescook@chromium.org, paul@paul-moore.com, sds@tycho.nsa.gov,
	mhocko@kernel.org, corbet@lwn.net, labbott@redhat.com,
	david@fromorbit.com, rppt@linux.vnet.ibm.com, linux-mm@kvack.org,
	linux-kernel@vger.kernel.org,
	kernel-hardening@lists.openwall.com,
	Igor Stoppa <igor.stoppa@huawei.com>,
	Carlos Chinea Perez <carlos.chinea.perez@huawei.com>,
	Remi Denis Courmont <remi.denis.courmont@huawei.com>,
	linux-security-module@vger.kernel.org
Subject: Re: [PATCH 7/9] Pmalloc Rare Write: modify selected pools
Date: Tue, 24 Apr 2018 21:04:42 +0400	[thread overview]
Message-ID: <be0c9294-90a3-5820-dca2-7ce0a9a5dcab@gmail.com> (raw)
In-Reply-To: <98799559-121f-3d9d-343f-b22d30f21b6d@gmail.com>

On 24/04/18 16:33, Igor Stoppa wrote:
> 
> 
> On 24/04/18 15:50, Matthew Wilcox wrote:
>> On Mon, Apr 23, 2018 at 04:54:56PM +0400, Igor Stoppa wrote:
>>> While the vanilla version of pmalloc provides support for permanently
>>> transitioning between writable and read-only of a memory pool, this
>>> patch seeks to support a separate class of data, which would still
>>> benefit from write protection, most of the time, but it still needs to
>>> be modifiable. Maybe very seldom, but still cannot be permanently marked
>>> as read-only.
>>
>> This seems like a horrible idea that basically makes this feature 
>> useless.
>> I would say the right way to do this is to have:
>>
>> struct modifiable_data {
>>     struct immutable_data *d;
>>     ...
>> };
>>
>> Then allocate a new pool, change d and destroy the old pool.
> 
> I'm not sure I understand.

A few cups of coffee later ...

This seems like a regression from my case.

My case (see the example with the initialized state) is:

static void *pointer_to_pmalloc_memory __ro_after_init;

then, during init:

pointer_to_pmalloc_memory = pmalloc(pool, size);

then init happens

*pointer_to_pmalloc_memory = some_value;

pmalloc_protect_pool(pool9;

and to change the value:

support_variable = some_other_value;

pmalloc_rare_write(pool, pointer_to_pmalloc_memory,
                    &support_variable, size)

But in this case the pmalloc allocation would be assigned to a writable 
variable.

This seems like a regression to me: at this point who cares anymore 
about the pmalloc memory?

Just rewrite the pointer to point to somewhere else that is writable and 
has the desired (from the attacker) value.

It doesn't even require gadgets. pmalloc becomes useless.

Do I still need more coffee?

--
igor

WARNING: multiple messages have this Message-ID (diff)
From: igor.stoppa@gmail.com (Igor Stoppa)
To: linux-security-module@vger.kernel.org
Subject: [PATCH 7/9] Pmalloc Rare Write: modify selected pools
Date: Tue, 24 Apr 2018 21:04:42 +0400	[thread overview]
Message-ID: <be0c9294-90a3-5820-dca2-7ce0a9a5dcab@gmail.com> (raw)
In-Reply-To: <98799559-121f-3d9d-343f-b22d30f21b6d@gmail.com>

On 24/04/18 16:33, Igor Stoppa wrote:
> 
> 
> On 24/04/18 15:50, Matthew Wilcox wrote:
>> On Mon, Apr 23, 2018 at 04:54:56PM +0400, Igor Stoppa wrote:
>>> While the vanilla version of pmalloc provides support for permanently
>>> transitioning between writable and read-only of a memory pool, this
>>> patch seeks to support a separate class of data, which would still
>>> benefit from write protection, most of the time, but it still needs to
>>> be modifiable. Maybe very seldom, but still cannot be permanently marked
>>> as read-only.
>>
>> This seems like a horrible idea that basically makes this feature 
>> useless.
>> I would say the right way to do this is to have:
>>
>> struct modifiable_data {
>> ????struct immutable_data *d;
>> ????...
>> };
>>
>> Then allocate a new pool, change d and destroy the old pool.
> 
> I'm not sure I understand.

A few cups of coffee later ...

This seems like a regression from my case.

My case (see the example with the initialized state) is:

static void *pointer_to_pmalloc_memory __ro_after_init;

then, during init:

pointer_to_pmalloc_memory = pmalloc(pool, size);

then init happens

*pointer_to_pmalloc_memory = some_value;

pmalloc_protect_pool(pool9;

and to change the value:

support_variable = some_other_value;

pmalloc_rare_write(pool, pointer_to_pmalloc_memory,
                    &support_variable, size)

But in this case the pmalloc allocation would be assigned to a writable 
variable.

This seems like a regression to me: at this point who cares anymore 
about the pmalloc memory?

Just rewrite the pointer to point to somewhere else that is writable and 
has the desired (from the attacker) value.

It doesn't even require gadgets. pmalloc becomes useless.

Do I still need more coffee?

--
igor
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WARNING: multiple messages have this Message-ID (diff)
From: Igor Stoppa <igor.stoppa@gmail.com>
To: Matthew Wilcox <willy@infradead.org>
Cc: keescook@chromium.org, paul@paul-moore.com, sds@tycho.nsa.gov,
	mhocko@kernel.org, corbet@lwn.net, labbott@redhat.com,
	david@fromorbit.com, rppt@linux.vnet.ibm.com, linux-mm@kvack.org,
	linux-kernel@vger.kernel.org,
	kernel-hardening@lists.openwall.com,
	Igor Stoppa <igor.stoppa@huawei.com>,
	Carlos Chinea Perez <carlos.chinea.perez@huawei.com>,
	Remi Denis Courmont <remi.denis.courmont@huawei.com>,
	linux-security-module@vger.kernel.org
Subject: Re: [PATCH 7/9] Pmalloc Rare Write: modify selected pools
Date: Tue, 24 Apr 2018 21:04:42 +0400	[thread overview]
Message-ID: <be0c9294-90a3-5820-dca2-7ce0a9a5dcab@gmail.com> (raw)
In-Reply-To: <98799559-121f-3d9d-343f-b22d30f21b6d@gmail.com>

On 24/04/18 16:33, Igor Stoppa wrote:
> 
> 
> On 24/04/18 15:50, Matthew Wilcox wrote:
>> On Mon, Apr 23, 2018 at 04:54:56PM +0400, Igor Stoppa wrote:
>>> While the vanilla version of pmalloc provides support for permanently
>>> transitioning between writable and read-only of a memory pool, this
>>> patch seeks to support a separate class of data, which would still
>>> benefit from write protection, most of the time, but it still needs to
>>> be modifiable. Maybe very seldom, but still cannot be permanently marked
>>> as read-only.
>>
>> This seems like a horrible idea that basically makes this feature 
>> useless.
>> I would say the right way to do this is to have:
>>
>> struct modifiable_data {
>> A A A A struct immutable_data *d;
>> A A A A ...
>> };
>>
>> Then allocate a new pool, change d and destroy the old pool.
> 
> I'm not sure I understand.

A few cups of coffee later ...

This seems like a regression from my case.

My case (see the example with the initialized state) is:

static void *pointer_to_pmalloc_memory __ro_after_init;

then, during init:

pointer_to_pmalloc_memory = pmalloc(pool, size);

then init happens

*pointer_to_pmalloc_memory = some_value;

pmalloc_protect_pool(pool9;

and to change the value:

support_variable = some_other_value;

pmalloc_rare_write(pool, pointer_to_pmalloc_memory,
                    &support_variable, size)

But in this case the pmalloc allocation would be assigned to a writable 
variable.

This seems like a regression to me: at this point who cares anymore 
about the pmalloc memory?

Just rewrite the pointer to point to somewhere else that is writable and 
has the desired (from the attacker) value.

It doesn't even require gadgets. pmalloc becomes useless.

Do I still need more coffee?

--
igor

  reply	other threads:[~2018-04-24 17:04 UTC|newest]

Thread overview: 38+ messages / expand[flat|nested]  mbox.gz  Atom feed  top
2018-04-23 12:54 [RFC PATCH v23 0/6] mm: security: write protection for dynamic data Igor Stoppa
2018-04-23 12:54 ` [PATCH 1/9] struct page: add field for vm_struct Igor Stoppa
2018-04-23 12:54 ` [PATCH 2/9] vmalloc: rename llist field in vmap_area Igor Stoppa
2018-04-23 12:54 ` [PATCH 3/9] Protectable Memory Igor Stoppa
2018-04-23 12:54 ` [PATCH 4/9] Documentation for Pmalloc Igor Stoppa
2018-04-23 12:54 ` [PATCH 5/9] Pmalloc selftest Igor Stoppa
2018-04-23 12:54 ` [PATCH 6/9] lkdtm: crash on overwriting protected pmalloc var Igor Stoppa
2018-04-23 12:54 ` [PATCH 7/9] Pmalloc Rare Write: modify selected pools Igor Stoppa
2018-04-24 11:50   ` Matthew Wilcox
2018-04-24 12:32     ` lazytyped
2018-04-24 12:32       ` lazytyped
2018-04-24 12:39       ` Igor Stoppa
2018-04-24 12:39         ` Igor Stoppa
2018-04-24 14:44       ` Matthew Wilcox
2018-04-24 15:03         ` lazytyped
2018-04-24 15:03           ` lazytyped
2018-04-24 15:29           ` Igor Stoppa
2018-04-25 20:58         ` Igor Stoppa
2018-04-25 20:58           ` Igor Stoppa
2018-04-24 12:33     ` Igor Stoppa
2018-04-24 12:33       ` Igor Stoppa
2018-04-24 17:04       ` Igor Stoppa [this message]
2018-04-24 17:04         ` Igor Stoppa
2018-04-24 17:04         ` Igor Stoppa
2018-05-03 21:52     ` Correct way to access the physmap? - Was: " Igor Stoppa
2018-05-03 21:52       ` Igor Stoppa
2018-05-03 21:55       ` Dave Hansen
2018-05-03 21:55         ` Dave Hansen
2018-05-03 22:52         ` Igor Stoppa
2018-05-03 22:52           ` Igor Stoppa
2018-04-23 12:54 ` [PATCH 8/9] Preliminary self test for pmalloc rare write Igor Stoppa
2018-04-23 12:54 ` [PATCH 9/9] Protect SELinux initialized state with pmalloc Igor Stoppa
2018-04-24  5:58   ` kbuild test robot
2018-04-24  5:58     ` kbuild test robot
2018-04-24 12:49   ` Stephen Smalley
2018-04-24 12:49     ` Stephen Smalley
2018-04-24 14:35     ` Igor Stoppa
2018-04-24 14:35       ` Igor Stoppa

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