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From: Willy Tarreau <w@1wt.eu>
To: Thomas Schoebel-Theuer <tst@schoebel-theuer.de>
Cc: "Stephan Müller" <smueller@chronox.de>, "Tso Ted" <tytso@mit.edu>,
	linux-crypto@vger.kernel.org, "Nicolai Stange" <nstange@suse.de>,
	LKML <linux-kernel@vger.kernel.org>,
	"Arnd Bergmann" <arnd@arndb.de>,
	"Greg Kroah-Hartman" <gregkh@linuxfoundation.org>,
	"Eric W. Biederman" <ebiederm@xmission.com>,
	"Alexander E. Patrakov" <patrakov@gmail.com>,
	"Ahmed S. Darwish" <darwish.07@gmail.com>,
	"Matthew Garrett" <mjg59@srcf.ucam.org>,
	"Vito Caputo" <vcaputo@pengaru.com>,
	"Andreas Dilger" <adilger.kernel@dilger.ca>,
	"Jan Kara" <jack@suse.cz>, "Ray Strode" <rstrode@redhat.com>,
	"William Jon McCann" <mccann@jhu.edu>,
	zhangjs <zachary@baishancloud.com>,
	"Andy Lutomirski" <luto@kernel.org>,
	"Florian Weimer" <fweimer@redhat.com>,
	"Lennart Poettering" <mzxreary@0pointer.de>,
	"Peter Matthias" <matthias.peter@bsi.bund.de>,
	"Marcelo Henrique Cerri" <marcelo.cerri@canonical.com>,
	"Neil Horman" <nhorman@redhat.com>,
	"Randy Dunlap" <rdunlap@infradead.org>,
	"Julia Lawall" <julia.lawall@inria.fr>,
	"Dan Carpenter" <dan.carpenter@oracle.com>,
	"Andy Lavr" <andy.lavr@gmail.com>,
	"Eric Biggers" <ebiggers@kernel.org>,
	"Jason A. Donenfeld" <Jason@zx2c4.com>,
	"Petr Tesarik" <ptesarik@suse.cz>,
	"John Haxby" <john.haxby@oracle.com>,
	"Alexander Lobakin" <alobakin@mailbox.org>,
	"Jirka Hladky" <jhladky@redhat.com>
Subject: Re: [PATCH v43 00/15] /dev/random - a new approach
Date: Sat, 11 Dec 2021 17:04:25 +0100	[thread overview]
Message-ID: <20211211160425.GA6023@1wt.eu> (raw)
In-Reply-To: <f59e7a25-ea0b-b36e-791e-8ab49bc7102c@schoebel-theuer.de>

On Sat, Dec 11, 2021 at 04:45:55PM +0100, Thomas Schoebel-Theuer wrote:
> 4) Collection of entropy vs consumption of entropy: the old /dev/random has
> an important feature for me: any _mass_ usage by whatever class of users
> (whether tenthousands of UIDs per server and/or HTTP/second, or maybe even
> some privileged orchestration scripts) would _consume_ masses of entropy.
> When suchalike consumption would exceed the production rate, the old
> /dev/random would become so slow that our internal monitoring processes
> would certainly alert, and consequently would hint our responsibles (located
> at other teams) at the problem.

I'm sorry but I cannot agree with you on this. You are claiming that your
monitoring processes are so limited that the only situation they can
discover is when the machine is basically dead. There are plenty of
users who end up replacing /dev/random with /dev/urandom in production
to make sure a terrible service outage never happens again, and one
important feature of an RNG is its performance, particularly when it's
shared between processes and users. The fact that your monitoring only
triggers when the system becomes unusable is a proof that it must be
fixed, and certainly not an indication that any possible kernel
limitation you're benefitting from does not deserve to be addressed.

Willy

      reply	other threads:[~2021-12-11 16:05 UTC|newest]

Thread overview: 101+ messages / expand[flat|nested]  mbox.gz  Atom feed  top
2021-11-21 16:39 [PATCH v43 00/15] /dev/random - a new approach Stephan Müller
2021-11-21 16:40 ` [PATCH v43 01/15] Linux Random Number Generator Stephan Müller
2021-11-21 17:23   ` Joe Perches
2021-11-21 22:42   ` Jason A. Donenfeld
2021-11-22  5:34     ` Stephan Mueller
2021-11-22  6:02       ` Greg Kroah-Hartman
2021-11-22  6:42         ` Stephan Mueller
2021-11-22  6:55           ` Greg Kroah-Hartman
2021-11-22 15:09             ` Simo Sorce
2021-11-22 21:06               ` Jeffrey Walton
2021-11-23  5:38                 ` Stephan Mueller
2021-11-26 15:42               ` Greg Kroah-Hartman
2021-11-22 16:56         ` John Haxby
2021-11-26 15:40           ` Greg Kroah-Hartman
2021-11-22 14:59     ` Simo Sorce
2021-11-26 15:44       ` Greg Kroah-Hartman
2021-11-26 16:15         ` Stephan Mueller
2021-11-26 16:22           ` Greg Kroah-Hartman
2021-11-29 15:31             ` Stephan Mueller
2021-11-29 16:25               ` Greg Kroah-Hartman
2021-11-29 16:50                 ` Stephan Mueller
2021-11-30 12:24                 ` Jeffrey Walton
2021-11-30 14:04                   ` Greg Kroah-Hartman
2021-11-30 14:31                     ` Simo Sorce
2021-11-30 15:45                       ` Greg Kroah-Hartman
2021-11-30 17:05                         ` Willy Tarreau
2021-11-30 17:08                         ` Simo Sorce
2021-11-30 18:15                         ` Eric Biggers
2021-11-30 18:39                           ` Jason A. Donenfeld
2021-11-30 19:41                             ` Simo Sorce
2021-12-01 16:02                               ` Jason A. Donenfeld
2021-12-01 17:19                                 ` Simo Sorce
2021-12-01 17:55                                   ` Boris Krasnovskiy
2021-12-01 18:05                                     ` Greg Kroah-Hartman
2021-12-01 18:24                                   ` Jason A. Donenfeld
2021-12-02  0:24                                     ` Jeffrey Walton
2021-12-02  7:12                                       ` Greg Kroah-Hartman
2021-12-02 15:50                                         ` John Haxby
2021-12-01 18:29                                   ` Jason A. Donenfeld
     [not found]                                 ` <BY5PR14MB3416DF44172D8F47D0B078A986689@BY5PR14MB3416.namprd14.prod.outlook.com>
2021-12-01 18:05                                   ` Greg Kroah-Hartman
2021-12-10  1:43                                 ` Marcelo Henrique Cerri
2021-12-10  6:46                                   ` Greg Kroah-Hartman
2021-12-10  9:30                                     ` Marcelo Henrique Cerri
2021-12-10  9:48                                       ` Greg Kroah-Hartman
2021-12-10 17:02                                         ` Simo Sorce
2021-12-11  7:06                                           ` Willy Tarreau
2021-12-11  8:09                                             ` Stephan Müller
2021-12-11  8:57                                               ` Willy Tarreau
2022-01-10 13:23                                   ` Marcelo Henrique Cerri
2022-01-10 14:11                                     ` Jason A. Donenfeld
2022-01-10 14:29                                       ` Theodore Ts'o
2022-01-10 14:38                                         ` Jason A. Donenfeld
2022-01-10 17:38                                           ` Theodore Ts'o
2022-01-10 18:29                                             ` Eric Biggers
2022-01-10 18:44                                               ` Jason A. Donenfeld
2022-01-10 19:41                                                 ` Simo Sorce
2022-01-10 20:05                                                   ` Eric Biggers
2022-01-10 19:49                                                 ` Theodore Ts'o
2022-01-10 22:19                                                   ` Jason A. Donenfeld
2022-01-11  1:44                                                     ` Andy Lutomirski
2022-01-11  3:10                                                       ` Theodore Ts'o
2022-01-11  4:04                                                         ` Willy Tarreau
2022-01-11  4:13                                                         ` Matthew Garrett
2022-01-11 10:01                                                           ` Alexander E. Patrakov
     [not found]                                                           ` <CAN_LGv0CTDi9k=t=TGHvaHZz5YVT+OUEBaRXjP=Xv=kousHY1w@mail.gmail.com>
2022-01-11 17:10                                                             ` Matthew Garrett
2022-01-11 13:16                                                         ` Jason A. Donenfeld
2022-01-11 16:08                                                           ` Theodore Ts'o
2022-01-11 13:06                                                       ` Jason A. Donenfeld
2022-01-11 15:10                                                         ` Andy Lutomirski
2022-01-10 21:38                                                 ` Jason A. Donenfeld
2022-01-10 15:07                                         ` Marcelo Henrique Cerri
2021-11-30 15:13                     ` Jeffrey Walton
2021-11-30 15:39                       ` Greg Kroah-Hartman
2021-11-30  7:32       ` Sandy Harris
2021-11-30  7:55         ` Greg Kroah-Hartman
2021-11-30  8:56           ` Stephan Mueller
2021-11-30  9:12             ` Greg Kroah-Hartman
2021-12-04  9:53           ` Sandy Harris
2021-11-22 10:33   ` kernel test robot
2021-11-22 11:47     ` Stephan Mueller
2021-11-25  5:25       ` [kbuild-all] " Chen, Rong A
2021-11-30  2:55         ` Sandy Harris
2021-11-30  6:06           ` Stephan Müller
2021-11-21 16:40 ` [PATCH v43 02/15] LRNG - IRQ entropy source Stephan Müller
2021-11-21 16:40 ` [PATCH v43 03/15] LRNG - sysctls and /proc interface Stephan Müller
2021-11-21 16:41 ` [PATCH v43 04/15] LRNG - allocate one DRNG instance per NUMA node Stephan Müller
2021-11-21 16:42 ` [PATCH v43 05/15] LRNG - CPU entropy source Stephan Müller
2021-11-22  7:09   ` kernel test robot
2021-11-22 11:48     ` Stephan Mueller
2021-11-21 16:42 ` [PATCH v43 06/15] LRNG - add switchable DRNG support Stephan Müller
2021-11-21 16:43 ` [PATCH v43 07/15] LRNG - add common generic hash support Stephan Müller
2021-11-21 16:43 ` [PATCH v43 08/15] crypto: DRBG - externalize DRBG functions for LRNG Stephan Müller
2021-11-21 16:44 ` [PATCH v43 09/15] LRNG - add SP800-90A DRBG extension Stephan Müller
2021-11-21 16:45 ` [PATCH v43 10/15] LRNG - add kernel crypto API PRNG extension Stephan Müller
2021-11-21 16:45 ` [PATCH v43 11/15] crypto: move Jitter RNG header include dir Stephan Müller
2021-11-21 16:46 ` [PATCH v43 12/15] LRNG - add Jitter RNG fast noise source Stephan Müller
2021-11-21 16:46 ` [PATCH v43 13/15] LRNG - add SP800-90B compliant health tests Stephan Müller
2021-11-21 16:47 ` [PATCH v43 14/15] LRNG - add interface for gathering of raw entropy Stephan Müller
2021-11-21 16:47 ` [PATCH v43 15/15] LRNG - add power-on and runtime self-tests Stephan Müller
2021-12-11 15:45 ` [PATCH v43 00/15] /dev/random - a new approach Thomas Schoebel-Theuer
2021-12-11 16:04   ` Willy Tarreau [this message]

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