From: Alexander Holler <holler@ahsoftware.de>
To: Russell King - ARM Linux <linux@arm.linux.org.uk>
Cc: david@lang.hm, Nicolas Pitre <nico@fluxnic.net>,
Linus Torvalds <torvalds@linux-foundation.org>,
Arnd Bergmann <arnd@arndb.de>, Tony Lindgren <tony@atomide.com>,
David Brown <davidb@codeaurora.org>,
lkml <linux-kernel@vger.kernel.org>,
linux-arm-kernel@lists.infradead.org, linux-omap@vger.kernel.org,
Catalin Marinas <catalin.marinas@arm.com>
Subject: Re: [GIT PULL] omap changes for v2.6.39 merge window
Date: Thu, 31 Mar 2011 20:00:53 +0200 [thread overview]
Message-ID: <4D94C155.2090406@ahsoftware.de> (raw)
In-Reply-To: <20110331080954.GA14323@n2100.arm.linux.org.uk>
Hello,
Am 31.03.2011 10:09, schrieb Russell King - ARM Linux:
> We also need the various SoC designers and ARM architecture people to
> realise that what the hardware situation is rediculous; I have commented
> about this lack of standardisation to ARM in past years. ARM have had
> a standard set of peripherals for ten years, but the SoC people haven't
> really taken them up - and when they do, they seem to always introduce
> their own tweaks, sometimes with no way to detect those tweaks.
As a user of several ARM boards I fully agree. I've come to the
conclusion that if device tree or something similiar won't come up,
which offers a vendor independent description of the hardware, the ARM
market (at least with Linux as an OS) won't function. It's already
almost impossible to update an old vendor kernel to a mainline kernel
version without having schematics. Up to now this isn't a big problem
because most ARM-HW people are playing with are developer boards, but
thats already changing and more and more stuff will come without schematics.
And without the help of something like the x86 BIOS (or DT for ARM) you
are just lost using an ARM-HW where you don't have the schematics, when
you don't want to use the vendor provided kernel sources (for which you
almost never get e.g. any security fixes). Finding all the small knobs
to turn out of vendor provided kernel sources is a pain and just a waste
of time you almost never can't finish before the HW in question got
obsolete.
Just my 2¢ on that topic from a somewhat user point of view from one who
isn't really involved that much in kernel development.
At least I find such a rant from Linus from time to time a good thing.
Sometimes it helps if someone speaks out loud whats wrong. And if Linus
wouldn't be that one, who else would be courageous enough to do that? I
wouldn't (and I can't, I have to thank all kernel developers for their
hard work).
Regards,
Alexander
next prev parent reply other threads:[~2011-03-31 18:10 UTC|newest]
Thread overview: 159+ messages / expand[flat|nested] mbox.gz Atom feed top
2011-03-17 18:30 [GIT PULL] omap changes for v2.6.39 merge window Tony Lindgren
2011-03-18 2:50 ` Linus Torvalds
2011-03-18 7:06 ` Tony Lindgren
2011-03-18 10:15 ` Russell King - ARM Linux
2011-03-18 11:13 ` Uwe Kleine-König
2011-03-30 17:06 ` Arnd Bergmann
2011-03-30 19:21 ` Linus Torvalds
2011-03-30 20:41 ` Nicolas Pitre
2011-03-30 21:02 ` Linus Torvalds
2011-03-30 23:31 ` Nicolas Pitre
2011-03-30 23:59 ` Russell King - ARM Linux
2011-03-31 0:15 ` Tony Lindgren
2011-03-31 0:31 ` Bill Gatliff
2011-03-31 0:39 ` david
2011-03-31 3:17 ` Nicolas Pitre
2011-03-31 3:29 ` Dave Airlie
2011-03-31 4:38 ` Nicolas Pitre
2011-03-31 9:54 ` Alan Cox
2011-03-31 10:50 ` Russell King - ARM Linux
2011-03-31 12:23 ` Jean-Christophe PLAGNIOL-VILLARD
2011-03-31 12:38 ` Catalin Marinas
2011-03-31 13:01 ` Russell King - ARM Linux
2011-03-31 14:55 ` Bill Gatliff
2011-04-01 12:41 ` Arnd Bergmann
2011-03-31 18:12 ` Sam Ravnborg
2011-03-31 18:17 ` Russell King - ARM Linux
2011-03-31 18:34 ` Jesse Barnes
2011-03-31 13:54 ` Thomas Gleixner
2011-03-31 17:22 ` david
2011-03-31 18:08 ` Koen Kooi
2011-03-31 5:05 ` david
2011-03-31 7:15 ` Nicolas Pitre
2011-03-31 8:06 ` Ingo Molnar
2011-03-31 8:30 ` Russell King - ARM Linux
2011-03-31 10:41 ` Ingo Molnar
2011-03-31 13:25 ` Russell King - ARM Linux
2011-03-31 12:04 ` Thomas Gleixner
2011-03-31 14:43 ` Kevin Hilman
2011-03-31 15:01 ` Thomas Gleixner
2011-03-31 15:05 ` Russell King - ARM Linux
2011-03-31 15:45 ` david
2011-03-31 15:23 ` Arnd Bergmann
2011-03-31 16:58 ` Thomas Gleixner
2011-03-31 18:23 ` Nicolas Pitre
2011-03-31 18:55 ` Thomas Gleixner
2011-04-01 11:32 ` Arnd Bergmann
2011-03-31 20:35 ` Kevin Hilman
2011-04-01 11:29 ` Arnd Bergmann
2011-04-01 7:32 ` Tomi Valkeinen
2011-04-01 11:22 ` Arnd Bergmann
2011-04-01 11:55 ` Tomi Valkeinen
2011-04-01 12:07 ` Arnd Bergmann
2011-04-01 12:15 ` Tomi Valkeinen
2011-03-31 16:03 ` david
2011-03-31 16:45 ` Russell King - ARM Linux
2011-03-31 17:17 ` Linus Torvalds
2011-03-31 19:25 ` Nicolas Pitre
2011-03-31 20:05 ` Linus Torvalds
2011-03-31 20:28 ` Linus Torvalds
2011-03-31 22:49 ` Nicolas Pitre
2011-04-01 0:53 ` Mark Brown
2011-04-01 4:50 ` David Brown
2011-04-01 7:45 ` Ingo Molnar
2011-04-01 13:54 ` Arnd Bergmann
[not found] ` <4D95E112.4020400@vollmann.ch>
2011-04-01 14:59 ` Arnd Bergmann
[not found] ` <4D95EF8E.9080902@vollmann.ch>
2011-04-01 15:50 ` Arnd Bergmann
2011-04-01 17:44 ` Russell King - ARM Linux
2011-04-01 19:54 ` Nicolas Pitre
2011-04-01 21:00 ` Uwe Kleine-König
2011-04-01 22:08 ` Arnd Bergmann
2011-04-02 2:24 ` Nicolas Pitre
2011-04-03 15:26 ` Arnd Bergmann
2011-04-03 16:03 ` Russell King - ARM Linux
2011-04-04 0:59 ` Arnd Bergmann
2011-04-04 8:26 ` Marc Zyngier
2011-04-04 11:03 ` Catalin Marinas
2011-04-04 11:21 ` Russell King - ARM Linux
2011-04-04 13:24 ` Marc Zyngier
2011-04-04 13:31 ` Russell King - ARM Linux
2011-04-04 13:57 ` Marc Zyngier
2011-04-04 20:08 ` Linus Walleij
2011-04-05 6:40 ` Santosh Shilimkar
2011-04-05 7:45 ` Russell King - ARM Linux
2011-04-05 14:15 ` Catalin Marinas
2011-04-05 22:16 ` Linus Walleij
2011-04-06 6:43 ` Santosh Shilimkar
2011-04-05 22:22 ` Linus Walleij
2011-04-06 6:41 ` Santosh Shilimkar
2011-04-05 7:30 ` Marc Zyngier
2011-05-26 13:38 ` Pavel Machek
2011-04-02 2:59 ` Mark Brown
2011-04-04 5:16 ` Jean-Christophe PLAGNIOL-VILLARD
2011-04-04 9:27 ` Nicolas Ferre
2011-04-01 21:10 ` Kevin Hilman
2011-04-01 21:32 ` Arnd Bergmann
2011-04-01 21:51 ` Catalin Marinas
2011-04-03 22:18 ` Benjamin Herrenschmidt
2011-04-04 0:14 ` Arnd Bergmann
2011-04-04 2:49 ` Nicolas Pitre
2011-04-01 15:27 ` Will Deacon
2011-04-01 15:55 ` Arnd Bergmann
2011-04-01 16:39 ` Linus Torvalds
2011-04-03 22:26 ` Benjamin Herrenschmidt
2011-04-05 23:19 ` Linus Walleij
2011-04-06 8:41 ` Catalin Marinas
2011-04-07 1:44 ` Arnd Bergmann
2011-04-01 20:19 ` Nicolas Pitre
2011-04-02 4:38 ` Richard Cochran
2011-04-02 3:27 ` Mark Brown
2011-04-06 6:11 ` Barry Song
2011-04-06 7:31 ` Bryan Wu
2011-03-31 21:40 ` Thomas Gleixner
2011-03-31 17:56 ` Nicolas Pitre
2011-03-31 18:34 ` Thomas Gleixner
2011-03-31 19:02 ` Linus Torvalds
2011-03-31 8:09 ` Russell King - ARM Linux
2011-03-31 10:49 ` Felipe Balbi
2011-03-31 18:00 ` Alexander Holler [this message]
2011-03-31 5:45 ` Geert Uytterhoeven
2011-03-31 7:21 ` Nicolas Pitre
2011-03-30 22:08 ` Tony Lindgren
2011-03-30 21:10 ` Thomas Gleixner
2011-03-30 21:54 ` Tony Lindgren
2011-03-30 22:25 ` Thomas Gleixner
2011-03-30 22:45 ` Tony Lindgren
2011-03-30 22:56 ` Thomas Gleixner
2011-04-01 1:42 ` Mark Brown
2011-03-30 22:38 ` Paul E. McKenney
2011-03-30 22:47 ` Tony Lindgren
2011-03-30 23:13 ` Paul E. McKenney
2011-03-30 23:14 ` Thomas Gleixner
2011-03-30 23:28 ` Tony Lindgren
2011-03-31 11:00 ` Artem Bityutskiy
2011-03-31 13:54 ` Arnd Bergmann
2011-03-30 21:44 ` Tony Lindgren
2011-03-30 22:20 ` Linus Torvalds
2011-03-30 22:39 ` Tony Lindgren
2011-03-31 0:15 ` Russell King - ARM Linux
2011-03-31 0:55 ` Linus Torvalds
2011-03-31 1:15 ` Bill Gatliff
2011-03-31 1:37 ` Linus Torvalds
2011-03-31 1:44 ` Bill Gatliff
2011-03-31 1:56 ` Linus Torvalds
2011-03-31 2:20 ` Bill Gatliff
2011-03-31 3:24 ` Linus Torvalds
2011-03-31 6:42 ` Olof Johansson
2011-03-31 6:56 ` David Brown
2011-03-31 11:27 ` Felipe Balbi
2011-03-31 13:39 ` Thomas Gleixner
2011-03-31 4:09 ` Nicolas Pitre
2011-03-31 10:11 ` Thomas Gleixner
2011-03-30 21:07 ` Russell King - ARM Linux
2011-03-30 22:14 ` Tony Lindgren
2011-04-01 1:17 ` Mark Brown
2011-04-01 14:17 ` Arnd Bergmann
2011-03-18 3:02 ` Linus Torvalds
2011-03-18 7:09 ` Tony Lindgren
2011-03-18 8:06 ` Ohad Ben-Cohen
2011-03-18 23:43 ` Tony Lindgren
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