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From: Linus Torvalds <torvalds@linux-foundation.org>
To: Andrea Arcangeli <aarcange@redhat.com>
Cc: Will Deacon <will@kernel.org>, Linux-MM <linux-mm@kvack.org>,
	Linux Kernel Mailing List <linux-kernel@vger.kernel.org>,
	Yu Zhao <yuzhao@google.com>, Andy Lutomirski <luto@kernel.org>,
	Peter Xu <peterx@redhat.com>, Pavel Emelyanov <xemul@openvz.org>,
	Mike Kravetz <mike.kravetz@oracle.com>,
	Mike Rapoport <rppt@linux.vnet.ibm.com>,
	Minchan Kim <minchan@kernel.org>,
	Peter Zijlstra <peterz@infradead.org>,
	Hugh Dickins <hughd@google.com>,
	"Kirill A. Shutemov" <kirill.shutemov@linux.intel.com>,
	Matthew Wilcox <willy@infradead.org>,
	Oleg Nesterov <oleg@redhat.com>, Jann Horn <jannh@google.com>,
	Kees Cook <keescook@chromium.org>,
	John Hubbard <jhubbard@nvidia.com>,
	Leon Romanovsky <leonro@nvidia.com>,
	Jason Gunthorpe <jgg@ziepe.ca>, Jan Kara <jack@suse.cz>,
	Kirill Tkhai <ktkhai@virtuozzo.com>,
	Nadav Amit <nadav.amit@gmail.com>,
	Andrew Morton <akpm@linux-foundation.org>
Subject: Re: [PATCH 2/2] mm: soft_dirty: userfaultfd: introduce wrprotect_tlb_flush_pending
Date: Fri, 8 Jan 2021 09:39:56 -0800	[thread overview]
Message-ID: <CAHk-=wizOEqJTomh=K5CR300mtTCwWdj+QYYCXKHaiU-R0YE9Q@mail.gmail.com> (raw)
In-Reply-To: <X/iEyk0ijxhSvs9T@redhat.com>

On Fri, Jan 8, 2021 at 8:14 AM Andrea Arcangeli <aarcange@redhat.com> wrote:
>
> page_count in do_wp_page is a fix for the original security issue

Not just that.

page_count() is simply the right and efficient thing to do.

You talk about all these theoretical inefficiencies for cases like
zygote and page pinning, which have never ever been seen except as a
possible attack vector.

Stop talking about irrelevant things. Stop trying to "optimize" things
that never happen and don't matter.

Instead, what matters is the *NORMAL* VM flow.

Things like COW.

Things like "oh, now that we check just the page count, we don't even
need the page lock for the common case any more".

> For the long term, I can't see how using page_count in do_wp_page is a
> tenable proposition,

I think you should re-calibrate your expectations, and accept that
page_count() is the right thing to do, and live with it.

And instead of worrying about irrelevant special-case code, start
worrying about the code that gets triggered tens of thousands of times
a second, on regular loads, without anybody doing anything odd or
special at all, just running plain and normal shell scripts or any
other normal traditional load.

Those irrelevant special cases should be simple and work, not badly
optimized to the point where they are buggy. And they are MUCH LESS
IMPORTANT than the normal VM code, so if somebody does something odd,
and it's slow, then that is the problem for the _odd_ case, not for
the normal codepaths.

This is why I refuse to add crazy new special cases to core code. Make
the rules simple and straightforward, and make the code VM work well.

                  Linus

  reply	other threads:[~2021-01-08 17:41 UTC|newest]

Thread overview: 96+ messages / expand[flat|nested]  mbox.gz  Atom feed  top
2020-12-25  9:25 [RFC PATCH v2 0/2] mm: fix races due to deferred TLB flushes Nadav Amit
2020-12-25  9:25 ` [RFC PATCH v2 1/2] mm/userfaultfd: fix memory corruption due to writeprotect Nadav Amit
2021-01-04 12:22   ` Peter Zijlstra
2021-01-04 19:24     ` Andrea Arcangeli
2021-01-04 19:35       ` Nadav Amit
2021-01-04 20:19         ` Andrea Arcangeli
2021-01-04 20:39           ` Nadav Amit
2021-01-04 21:01             ` Andrea Arcangeli
2021-01-04 21:26               ` Nadav Amit
2021-01-05 18:45                 ` Andrea Arcangeli
2021-01-05 19:05                   ` Nadav Amit
2021-01-05 19:45                     ` Andrea Arcangeli
2021-01-05 20:06                       ` Nadav Amit
2021-01-05 21:06                         ` Andrea Arcangeli
2021-01-05 21:43                           ` Peter Xu
2021-01-05  8:13       ` Peter Zijlstra
2021-01-05  8:52         ` Nadav Amit
2021-01-05 14:26           ` Peter Zijlstra
2021-01-05  8:58       ` Peter Zijlstra
2021-01-05  9:22         ` Nadav Amit
2021-01-05 17:58         ` Andrea Arcangeli
2021-01-05 15:08   ` Peter Xu
2021-01-05 18:08     ` Andrea Arcangeli
2021-01-05 18:41       ` Peter Xu
2021-01-05 18:55         ` Andrea Arcangeli
2021-01-05 19:07     ` Nadav Amit
2021-01-05 19:43       ` Peter Xu
2020-12-25  9:25 ` [RFC PATCH v2 2/2] fs/task_mmu: acquire mmap_lock for write on soft-dirty cleanup Nadav Amit
2021-01-05 15:08   ` Will Deacon
2021-01-05 18:20   ` Andrea Arcangeli
2021-01-05 19:26     ` Nadav Amit
2021-01-05 20:39       ` Andrea Arcangeli
2021-01-05 21:20         ` Yu Zhao
2021-01-05 21:22         ` Nadav Amit
2021-01-05 22:16           ` Will Deacon
2021-01-06  0:29             ` Andrea Arcangeli
2021-01-06  0:02           ` Andrea Arcangeli
2021-01-07 20:04           ` [PATCH 0/2] page_count can't be used to decide when wp_page_copy Andrea Arcangeli
2021-01-07 20:04             ` [PATCH 1/2] mm: proc: Invalidate TLB after clearing soft-dirty page state Andrea Arcangeli
2021-01-07 20:04             ` [PATCH 2/2] mm: soft_dirty: userfaultfd: introduce wrprotect_tlb_flush_pending Andrea Arcangeli
2021-01-07 20:17               ` Linus Torvalds
2021-01-07 20:25                 ` Linus Torvalds
2021-01-07 20:58                 ` Andrea Arcangeli
2021-01-07 21:29                   ` Linus Torvalds
2021-01-07 21:53                     ` John Hubbard
2021-01-07 22:00                       ` Linus Torvalds
2021-01-07 22:14                         ` John Hubbard
2021-01-07 22:20                           ` Linus Torvalds
2021-01-07 22:24                             ` Linus Torvalds
2021-01-07 22:37                               ` John Hubbard
2021-01-15 11:27                       ` Jan Kara
2021-01-07 22:31                     ` Andrea Arcangeli
2021-01-07 22:42                       ` Linus Torvalds
2021-01-07 22:51                         ` Linus Torvalds
2021-01-07 23:48                           ` Andrea Arcangeli
2021-01-08  0:25                             ` Linus Torvalds
2021-01-08 12:48                               ` Will Deacon
2021-01-08 16:14                                 ` Andrea Arcangeli
2021-01-08 17:39                                   ` Linus Torvalds [this message]
2021-01-08 17:53                                     ` Andrea Arcangeli
2021-01-08 19:25                                       ` Linus Torvalds
2021-01-09  0:12                                         ` Andrea Arcangeli
2021-01-08 17:30                                 ` Linus Torvalds
2021-01-07 23:28                         ` Andrea Arcangeli
2021-01-07 21:36               ` kernel test robot
2021-01-07 20:25             ` [PATCH 0/2] page_count can't be used to decide when wp_page_copy Jason Gunthorpe
2021-01-07 20:32               ` Linus Torvalds
2021-01-07 21:05                 ` Linus Torvalds
2021-01-07 22:02                   ` Andrea Arcangeli
2021-01-07 22:17                     ` Linus Torvalds
2021-01-07 22:56                       ` Andrea Arcangeli
2021-01-09 19:32                   ` Matthew Wilcox
2021-01-09 19:46                     ` Linus Torvalds
2021-01-15 14:30                       ` Jan Kara
2021-01-07 21:54                 ` Andrea Arcangeli
2021-01-07 21:45               ` Andrea Arcangeli
2021-01-08 13:36                 ` Jason Gunthorpe
2021-01-08 17:00                   ` Andrea Arcangeli
2021-01-08 18:19                     ` Jason Gunthorpe
2021-01-08 18:31                       ` Andy Lutomirski
2021-01-08 18:38                         ` Linus Torvalds
2021-01-08 23:34                         ` Andrea Arcangeli
2021-01-09 19:03                           ` Andy Lutomirski
2021-01-09 19:15                             ` Linus Torvalds
2021-01-08 18:59                       ` Linus Torvalds
2021-01-08 22:43                       ` Andrea Arcangeli
2021-01-09  0:42                         ` Jason Gunthorpe
2021-01-09  2:50                           ` Andrea Arcangeli
2021-01-11 14:30                             ` Jason Gunthorpe
2021-01-13 21:56                           ` Jerome Glisse
2021-01-13 23:39                             ` Jason Gunthorpe
2021-01-14  2:35                               ` Jerome Glisse
     [not found]                     ` <20210109034958.6928-1-hdanton@sina.com>
2021-01-11 14:39                       ` Jason Gunthorpe
2021-01-05 21:55         ` [RFC PATCH v2 2/2] fs/task_mmu: acquire mmap_lock for write on soft-dirty cleanup Peter Xu
2021-03-02 22:13 ` [RFC PATCH v2 0/2] mm: fix races due to deferred TLB flushes Peter Xu
2021-03-02 22:14   ` Nadav Amit

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