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From: Linus Torvalds <torvalds@transmeta.com>
To: James Bottomley <James.Bottomley@SteelEye.com>
Cc: Jens Axboe <axboe@suse.de>, Linux Kernel <linux-kernel@vger.kernel.org>
Subject: Re: [BK PATCHES] add ata scsi driver
Date: Mon, 26 May 2003 13:45:25 -0700 (PDT)	[thread overview]
Message-ID: <Pine.LNX.4.44.0305261339340.13489-100000@home.transmeta.com> (raw)
In-Reply-To: <1053981380.1768.203.camel@mulgrave>


On 26 May 2003, James Bottomley wrote:
> 
> > I'd hate for SATA to pick up these kinds of mistakes from the SCSI layer.
> 
> The elevator is based on linear head movements.

Historically, yes.

But we've been moving more and more towards a latency-based elevator, or
at least one that takes latency into account. Which is exactly why you'd
like to leave unfinished requests on the queue, because otherwise your
queue doesn't really show what is really going on.

In particular, while the higher layers don't actually _do_ this yet, from 
a latency standpoint the right thing to do when some request seems to get 
starved is to refuse to feed more tagged requeusts to the device until the 
starved request has finished. 

As I mentioned, Andrew actually had some really bad latency numbers to
prove that this is a real issue. SCSI with more than 4 tags or so results 
in potentially _major_ starvation, because the disks themselves are not 
even trying to avoid it.

Also, even aside from the starvation issue with unfair disks, just from a
"linear head movement" standpoint, you really want to sort the queue
according to what is going on _now_ in the disk. If the disk eats the
requests immediately (but doesn't execute them immediately), the sorting
has nothing to go on, and you get tons of back-and-forth movements.

Basically, if you're trying to do an elevator, you need to know what the 
outstanding commands are. Think it through on paper, and you'll see what I 
mean.

			Linus


  reply	other threads:[~2003-05-26 20:32 UTC|newest]

Thread overview: 68+ messages / expand[flat|nested]  mbox.gz  Atom feed  top
2003-05-26 18:12 [BK PATCHES] add ata scsi driver James Bottomley
2003-05-26 18:18 ` Jens Axboe
2003-05-26 18:47   ` James Bottomley
2003-05-26 19:07     ` Jens Axboe
2003-05-26 19:17       ` James Bottomley
2003-05-26 19:33         ` Jens Axboe
2003-05-27 12:39           ` Jens Axboe
2003-05-27 14:26             ` James Bottomley
2003-05-27 17:16               ` Jens Axboe
2003-05-27 18:09                 ` James Bottomley
2003-05-27 18:21                   ` Jens Axboe
2003-05-27 18:30                     ` James Bottomley
2003-05-26 20:27         ` Linus Torvalds
2003-05-26 20:36           ` James Bottomley
2003-05-26 20:45             ` Linus Torvalds [this message]
2003-05-26 20:51               ` Jens Axboe
2003-05-26 20:56               ` James Bottomley
2003-05-26 20:38           ` Jens Axboe
2003-05-26 20:49             ` Linus Torvalds
2003-05-26 20:57               ` Jens Axboe
2003-05-26 21:34                 ` Linus Torvalds
2003-05-26 23:58                   ` Nick Piggin
2003-05-27  0:09                     ` Linus Torvalds
2003-05-27  0:49                       ` Nick Piggin
2003-05-27  0:16                   ` Alan Cox
2003-05-27  6:54                   ` Jens Axboe
2003-05-27 14:20                     ` James Bottomley
2003-05-27 14:36                     ` Linus Torvalds
2003-05-27 14:59                       ` James Bottomley
2003-05-27 15:21                         ` Jeff Garzik
2003-05-27 15:38                           ` James Bottomley
2003-05-27 15:50                             ` Jeff Garzik
2003-05-27 16:00                               ` James Bottomley
2003-05-27 16:16                                 ` Jeff Garzik
2003-05-28  9:35                                   ` Christoph Hellwig
2003-05-28 10:50                           ` Lincoln Dale
2003-05-27 19:43                       ` Jens Axboe
  -- strict thread matches above, loose matches on Subject: below --
2003-05-26  4:58 Jeff Garzik
2003-05-26  5:15 ` Linus Torvalds
2003-05-26  5:30   ` Jeff Garzik
2003-05-26  5:36     ` Jeff Garzik
2003-05-26  5:42       ` Linus Torvalds
2003-05-26  6:01         ` Jeff Garzik
2003-05-26 16:56           ` Linus Torvalds
2003-05-26 17:47             ` Jeff Garzik
2003-05-26 20:09               ` Linus Torvalds
2003-05-27  0:29                 ` Alan Cox
2003-05-27  6:07                 ` Jeff Garzik
2003-05-27  6:30                   ` Linus Torvalds
2003-05-27  6:51                     ` Linus Torvalds
2003-05-27  7:29                       ` Jeff Garzik
2003-05-26  5:40     ` Linus Torvalds
2003-05-26  5:53       ` Jeff Garzik
2003-05-26  6:21         ` Jeff Garzik
2003-05-26 16:57           ` Linus Torvalds
2003-05-26 17:24             ` Jens Axboe
2003-05-26 17:54               ` Jeff Garzik
2003-05-26 17:59               ` Jeff Garzik
2003-05-26 18:11                 ` Jens Axboe
2003-05-27  0:22       ` Alan Cox
2003-05-27  4:15         ` Linus Torvalds
2003-05-26 10:32     ` Bartlomiej Zolnierkiewicz
2003-05-26 11:13       ` Jeff Garzik
2003-05-26 11:37         ` Bartlomiej Zolnierkiewicz
2003-05-26  5:59 ` Benjamin Herrenschmidt
2003-05-26  6:03   ` Jeff Garzik
2003-06-02  9:46 ` Andre Hedrick
2003-06-02 13:56   ` Alan Cox

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