From: "Luis R. Rodriguez" <mcgrof@do-not-panic.com>
To: Tejun Heo <tj@kernel.org>
Cc: Lennart Poettering <lennart@poettering.net>,
Kay Sievers <kay@vrfy.org>,
Dmitry Torokhov <dmitry.torokhov@gmail.com>,
Greg Kroah-Hartman <gregkh@linuxfoundation.org>,
Wu Zhangjin <falcon@meizu.com>, Takashi Iwai <tiwai@suse.de>,
Arjan van de Ven <arjan@linux.intel.com>,
"linux-kernel@vger.kernel.org" <linux-kernel@vger.kernel.org>,
Oleg Nesterov <oleg@redhat.com>,
hare@suse.com, Andrew Morton <akpm@linux-foundation.org>,
Tetsuo Handa <penguin-kernel@i-love.sakura.ne.jp>,
Joseph Salisbury <joseph.salisbury@canonical.com>,
Benjamin Poirier <bpoirier@suse.de>,
Santosh Rastapur <santosh@chelsio.com>,
One Thousand Gnomes <gnomes@lxorguk.ukuu.org.uk>,
Tim Gardner <tim.gardner@canonical.com>,
Pierre Fersing <pierre-fersing@pierref.org>,
Nagalakshmi Nandigama <nagalakshmi.nandigama@avagotech.com>,
Praveen Krishnamoorthy <praveen.krishnamoorthy@avagotech.com>,
Sreekanth Redd
Subject: Re: [RFC v2 3/6] kthread: warn on kill signal if not OOM
Date: Mon, 8 Sep 2014 19:28:58 -0700 [thread overview]
Message-ID: <CAB=NE6VAe_96dezJmdXkOjy8mSz8EABX6i8C46GzUJRC-HLAZQ@mail.gmail.com> (raw)
In-Reply-To: <20140909014754.GG11706@mtj.dyndns.org>
On Mon, Sep 8, 2014 at 6:47 PM, Tejun Heo <tj@kernel.org> wrote:
> Hello,
>
> On Mon, Sep 08, 2014 at 06:38:34PM -0700, Luis R. Rodriguez wrote:
>> OK then one only concern I would have with this is that the presence
>> of such a flag doesn't necessarily mean that all drivers on a system
>> have been tested for asynch probe yet. I'd feel much more comfortable
>
> Given that the behvaior change is from driver core and that device
> probing can happen post-loading anyway,
Ah but lets not forget Dmitry's requirement which is for in-kernel
drivers. We'd need to deal with both built-in and modules. Dmitry's
case is completely orthogonal to the systemd issue and is just needed
to help not stall boot but I see no reason to blend these two issues
into one requirement together.
> I don't think we need to worry
> about drivers breaking from probing made asynchronous to loading. The
> problem is the expectation of the entity which initiated loading of
> the module. If it's depending on device being probed synchronously
> but insmod returns before that, it can break things. We probably
> should audit request_module() users and see which ones expect such
> behavior.
Sure. Based on a quick glance I see sloppy uses of this, this should
probably be fixed anyway.
>> if this global flag allowed say specific drivers that *did* have such
>> a bool enabled, for example. Then that would enable synchronous
>> behaviour for the kernel by default, require the flag for enabling the
>> new async feature but only for drivers that have been tested.
>
> If we're gonna do the global switch, I personally think the right
> approach is blacklisting instead of the other way around because each
> specific driver doesn't really have much to do with it and the
> exceptions are about specific use cases that we don't have a good way
> to identify them from module loading path.
OK sure... even if we did whitelist I'm afraid such a white list might
be subjective in terms of design to specific systems anyway... I
suppose the only real way to do it right is to push and strive towards
a full system whitelist and address the black list as you mention.
In terms of approach we would still need to decide on a path for how
to do asynch probing for both in-kernel drivers and modules, do we
want async_schedule(), or queue_work()? If async_schedule() do we want
to use a new domain or a new one shared for all drivers? Priority on
the schedular was one of my other concerns which we'd need to make
right to match existing load on drivers through finit_module() and
synchronous probe.
>> That also still would not technically solve the issue of the current
>> existence of the timeout, unless of course we wish to ask systemd to
>> only make the timeout take effect *iff* the global sysctl flag /
>> whatever was enabled.
>
> Userland could backport a fix to set the sysctl. Given that we need
> both synchrnous and asynchronous behaviors, it's unlikely that we can
> come up with a solution which doesn't need cooperation from userland.
True and then the timeout would also have to be skipped for device
drivers that have the sync_probe flag set, so I guess we'd need to
expose that too. I'm not too sure if systemd is equipped to be happy
with no timeout on module loading based previous discussions [0] so
we'd need to ensure we're all in agreement there that such drivers
exist and we may need *something*, if at the very least a really long
fucking timeout (TM) for such drivers.
[0] http://lists.freedesktop.org/archives/systemd-devel/2014-August/021852.html
Luis
next prev parent reply other threads:[~2014-09-09 2:28 UTC|newest]
Thread overview: 84+ messages / expand[flat|nested] mbox.gz Atom feed top
[not found] <1409899047-13045-1-git-send-email-mcgrof@do-not-panic.com>
2014-09-05 6:37 ` [RFC v2 2/6] driver-core: add driver async_probe support Luis R. Rodriguez
2014-09-05 11:24 ` Oleg Nesterov
2014-09-05 17:25 ` Luis R. Rodriguez
2014-09-05 22:10 ` Dmitry Torokhov
2014-10-20 23:43 ` Luis R. Rodriguez
2014-09-05 6:37 ` [RFC v2 3/6] kthread: warn on kill signal if not OOM Luis R. Rodriguez
2014-09-05 7:19 ` Tejun Heo
2014-09-05 7:47 ` Luis R. Rodriguez
2014-09-05 9:14 ` Mike Galbraith
2014-09-05 14:12 ` Tejun Heo
2014-09-05 16:44 ` Dmitry Torokhov
2014-09-05 17:49 ` Tejun Heo
2014-09-05 18:10 ` Dmitry Torokhov
2014-09-05 22:29 ` Tejun Heo
2014-09-05 22:31 ` Tejun Heo
2014-09-05 22:49 ` Dmitry Torokhov
2014-09-05 22:55 ` Tejun Heo
2014-09-05 23:22 ` Dmitry Torokhov
2014-09-05 23:32 ` Tejun Heo
2014-09-05 22:45 ` Arjan van de Ven
2014-09-05 22:52 ` Dmitry Torokhov
2014-09-05 22:57 ` Tejun Heo
2014-09-05 23:05 ` Arjan van de Ven
2014-09-05 23:18 ` Dmitry Torokhov
2014-09-05 18:12 ` Luis R. Rodriguez
2014-09-05 18:29 ` Dmitry Torokhov
2014-09-05 22:40 ` Tejun Heo
2014-09-09 1:04 ` Luis R. Rodriguez
2014-09-09 1:10 ` Tejun Heo
2014-09-09 1:13 ` Tejun Heo
2014-09-09 1:22 ` Tejun Heo
2014-09-09 1:26 ` Luis R. Rodriguez
2014-09-09 1:29 ` Tejun Heo
2014-09-09 1:38 ` Luis R. Rodriguez
2014-09-09 1:47 ` Tejun Heo
2014-09-09 2:28 ` Luis R. Rodriguez [this message]
2014-09-09 2:39 ` Tejun Heo
2014-09-09 2:57 ` Luis R. Rodriguez
2014-09-09 3:03 ` Tejun Heo
2014-09-09 3:19 ` Luis R. Rodriguez
2014-09-09 3:25 ` Tejun Heo
2014-09-09 23:03 ` Tejun Heo
2014-09-12 20:14 ` Luis R. Rodriguez
2014-09-22 16:36 ` Luis R. Rodriguez
2014-09-10 5:13 ` Tom Gundersen
2014-09-09 5:38 ` James Bottomley
2014-09-09 19:16 ` Luis R. Rodriguez
2014-09-09 19:35 ` James Bottomley
2014-09-09 20:45 ` Luis R. Rodriguez
2014-09-10 6:46 ` Tom Gundersen
2014-09-10 10:07 ` [systemd-devel] " Ceriel Jacobs
2014-09-10 13:31 ` James Bottomley
2014-09-10 21:10 ` Luis R. Rodriguez
2014-09-11 5:42 ` Alexander E. Patrakov
2014-09-11 21:43 ` Tom Gundersen
2014-09-11 22:26 ` [systemd-devel] " Luis R. Rodriguez
2014-09-12 5:48 ` Tom Gundersen
2014-09-12 20:09 ` Luis R. Rodriguez
2014-10-10 21:54 ` Anatol Pomozov
2014-10-10 22:45 ` Tom Gundersen
2014-10-15 19:41 ` Anatol Pomozov
2014-10-15 19:46 ` Alexander E. Patrakov
2014-09-09 21:42 ` Tejun Heo
2014-09-09 22:26 ` James Bottomley
2014-09-09 22:41 ` Tejun Heo
2014-09-09 22:46 ` James Bottomley
2014-09-09 22:52 ` Tejun Heo
2014-09-09 23:01 ` Dmitry Torokhov
2014-09-11 19:59 ` James Bottomley
2014-09-11 20:23 ` Dmitry Torokhov
2014-09-11 20:42 ` Luis R. Rodriguez
2014-09-11 20:53 ` Dmitry Torokhov
2014-09-11 21:08 ` Luis R. Rodriguez
2014-09-22 19:49 ` Pavel Machek
2014-09-22 20:23 ` Dmitry Torokhov
2014-09-30 21:06 ` Pavel Machek
2014-09-30 21:34 ` Dmitry Torokhov
2014-09-09 22:00 ` Jiri Kosina
2014-09-05 10:59 ` Oleg Nesterov
2014-09-05 17:35 ` Luis R. Rodriguez
2014-09-05 6:37 ` [RFC v2 4/6] cxgb4: use async probe Luis R. Rodriguez
2014-09-05 6:37 ` [RFC v2 5/6] mptsas: " Luis R. Rodriguez
2014-09-05 7:16 ` Tejun Heo
2014-09-05 7:23 ` Hannes Reinecke
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