From: Christoph Hellwig <hch@infradead.org>
To: "Darrick J. Wong" <djwong@kernel.org>
Cc: Christoph Hellwig <hch@infradead.org>,
Jane Chu <jane.chu@oracle.com>,
"david@fromorbit.com" <david@fromorbit.com>,
"dan.j.williams@intel.com" <dan.j.williams@intel.com>,
"vishal.l.verma@intel.com" <vishal.l.verma@intel.com>,
"dave.jiang@intel.com" <dave.jiang@intel.com>,
"agk@redhat.com" <agk@redhat.com>,
"snitzer@redhat.com" <snitzer@redhat.com>,
"dm-devel@redhat.com" <dm-devel@redhat.com>,
"ira.weiny@intel.com" <ira.weiny@intel.com>,
"willy@infradead.org" <willy@infradead.org>,
"vgoyal@redhat.com" <vgoyal@redhat.com>,
"linux-fsdevel@vger.kernel.org" <linux-fsdevel@vger.kernel.org>,
"nvdimm@lists.linux.dev" <nvdimm@lists.linux.dev>,
"linux-kernel@vger.kernel.org" <linux-kernel@vger.kernel.org>,
"linux-xfs@vger.kernel.org" <linux-xfs@vger.kernel.org>
Subject: Re: [dm-devel] [PATCH 0/6] dax poison recovery with RWF_RECOVERY_DATA flag
Date: Mon, 1 Nov 2021 23:18:56 -0700 [thread overview]
Message-ID: <YYDYUCCiEPXhZEw0@infradead.org> (raw)
In-Reply-To: <20211028002451.GB2237511@magnolia>
On Wed, Oct 27, 2021 at 05:24:51PM -0700, Darrick J. Wong wrote:
> ...so would you happen to know if anyone's working on solving this
> problem for us by putting the memory controller in charge of dealing
> with media errors?
The only one who could know is Intel..
> The trouble is, we really /do/ want to be able to (re)write the failed
> area, and we probably want to try to read whatever we can. Those are
> reads and writes, not {pre,f}allocation activities. This is where Dave
> and I arrived at a month ago.
>
> Unless you'd be ok with a second IO path for recovery where we're
> allowed to be slow? That would probably have the same user interface
> flag, just a different path into the pmem driver.
Which is fine with me. If you look at the API here we do have the
RWF_ API, which them maps to the IOMAP API, which maps to the DAX_
API which then gets special casing over three methods.
And while Pavel pointed out that he and Jens are now optimizing for
single branches like this. I think this actually is silly and it is
not my point.
The point is that the DAX in-kernel API is a mess, and before we make
it even worse we need to sort it first. What is directly relevant
here is that the copy_from_iter and copy_to_iter APIs do not make
sense. Most of the DAX API is based around getting a memory mapping
using ->direct_access, it is just the read/write path which is a slow
path that actually uses this. I have a very WIP patch series to try
to sort this out here:
http://git.infradead.org/users/hch/misc.git/shortlog/refs/heads/dax-devirtualize
But back to this series. The basic DAX model is that the callers gets a
memory mapping an just works on that, maybe calling a sync after a write
in a few cases. So any kind of recovery really needs to be able to
work with that model as going forward the copy_to/from_iter path will
be used less and less. i.e. file systems can and should use
direct_access directly instead of using the block layer implementation
in the pmem driver. As an example the dm-writecache driver, the pending
bcache nvdimm support and the (horribly and out of tree) nova file systems
won't even use this path. We need to find a way to support recovery
for them. And overloading it over the read/write path which is not
the main path for DAX, but the absolutely fast path for 99% of the
kernel users is a horrible idea.
So how can we work around the horrible nvdimm design for data recovery
in a way that:
a) actually works with the intended direct memory map use case
b) doesn't really affect the normal kernel too much
?
next prev parent reply other threads:[~2021-11-02 6:19 UTC|newest]
Thread overview: 62+ messages / expand[flat|nested] mbox.gz Atom feed top
2021-10-21 0:10 [PATCH 0/6] dax poison recovery with RWF_RECOVERY_DATA flag Jane Chu
2021-10-21 0:10 ` [PATCH 1/6] dax: introduce RWF_RECOVERY_DATA flag to preadv2() and pwritev2() Jane Chu
2021-10-21 0:10 ` [PATCH 2/6] dax: prepare dax_direct_access() API with DAXDEV_F_RECOVERY flag Jane Chu
2021-10-21 11:20 ` Christoph Hellwig
2021-10-21 18:19 ` Jane Chu
2021-10-21 0:10 ` [PATCH 3/6] pmem: pmem_dax_direct_access() to honor the " Jane Chu
2021-10-21 11:23 ` Christoph Hellwig
2021-10-21 18:24 ` Jane Chu
2021-10-21 0:10 ` [PATCH 4/6] dm,dax,pmem: prepare dax_copy_to/from_iter() APIs with DAXDEV_F_RECOVERY Jane Chu
2021-10-21 11:27 ` Christoph Hellwig
2021-10-22 0:49 ` Jane Chu
2021-10-22 1:41 ` correction: " Jane Chu
2021-10-22 5:33 ` Christoph Hellwig
2021-10-22 20:30 ` Jane Chu
2021-10-21 0:10 ` [PATCH 5/6] dax,pmem: Add data recovery feature to pmem_copy_to/from_iter() Jane Chu
2021-10-21 11:28 ` Christoph Hellwig
2021-10-22 0:58 ` Jane Chu
2021-10-21 0:10 ` [PATCH 6/6] dm: Ensure dm honors DAXDEV_F_RECOVERY flag on dax only Jane Chu
2021-10-21 11:31 ` [dm-devel] [PATCH 0/6] dax poison recovery with RWF_RECOVERY_DATA flag Christoph Hellwig
2021-10-22 1:37 ` Jane Chu
2021-10-22 1:58 ` Darrick J. Wong
2021-10-22 5:38 ` Christoph Hellwig
2021-10-22 5:36 ` Christoph Hellwig
2021-10-22 20:52 ` Jane Chu
2021-10-27 6:49 ` Christoph Hellwig
2021-10-28 0:24 ` Darrick J. Wong
2021-10-28 22:59 ` Dave Chinner
2021-10-29 11:46 ` Pavel Begunkov
2021-10-29 16:57 ` Darrick J. Wong
2021-10-29 19:23 ` Pavel Begunkov
2021-10-29 20:08 ` Darrick J. Wong
2021-10-31 13:27 ` Pavel Begunkov
2021-10-29 18:53 ` Jane Chu
2021-10-29 22:32 ` Dave Chinner
2021-10-31 13:19 ` Pavel Begunkov
2021-11-01 2:31 ` Matthew Wilcox
2021-11-02 6:18 ` Christoph Hellwig [this message]
2021-11-02 19:57 ` Dan Williams
2021-11-03 16:58 ` Christoph Hellwig
2021-11-03 20:33 ` Dan Williams
2021-11-04 8:30 ` Christoph Hellwig
2021-11-04 12:29 ` Matthew Wilcox
2021-11-04 16:24 ` Dan Williams
2021-11-04 17:43 ` Christoph Hellwig
2021-11-04 17:50 ` Dan Williams
2021-11-04 18:05 ` Matthew Wilcox
2021-11-04 18:33 ` Jane Chu
2021-11-04 19:00 ` Dan Williams
2021-11-04 20:27 ` Jane Chu
2021-11-05 0:46 ` Dan Williams
2021-11-05 1:35 ` Dan Williams
2021-11-05 5:56 ` Christoph Hellwig
2021-11-03 18:09 ` Jane Chu
2021-11-04 6:21 ` Dan Williams
2021-11-04 8:36 ` Christoph Hellwig
2021-11-04 16:08 ` Dan Williams
2021-11-04 17:46 ` Christoph Hellwig
2021-11-04 8:21 ` Christoph Hellwig
2021-11-02 16:12 ` Dan Williams
2021-11-02 16:03 ` Dan Williams
2021-11-03 16:53 ` Christoph Hellwig
2021-11-06 7:41 ` Lukas Straub
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