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From: Ingo Molnar <mingo@elte.hu>
To: Chris Friesen <cfriesen@nortel.com>,
	Peter Zijlstra <a.p.zijlstra@chello.nl>,
	Thomas Gleixner <tglx@linutronix.de>,
	Steven Rostedt <rostedt@goodmis.org>
Cc: David Miller <davem@davemloft.net>,
	linuxppc-dev@ozlabs.org, paulus@samba.org,
	netdev@vger.kernel.org
Subject: Re: question about softirqs
Date: Tue, 12 May 2009 10:12:37 +0200	[thread overview]
Message-ID: <20090512081237.GA16403@elte.hu> (raw)
In-Reply-To: <4A08C62F.1050105@nortel.com>


* Chris Friesen <cfriesen@nortel.com> wrote:

> This started out as a thread on the ppc list, but on the 
> suggestion of DaveM and Paul Mackerras I'm expanding the receiver 
> list a bit.
> 
> Currently, if a softirq is raised in process context the 
> TIF_RESCHED_PENDING flag gets set and on return to userspace we 
> run the scheduler, expecting it to switch to ksoftirqd to handle 
> the softirqd processing.
> 
> I think I see a possible problem with this. Suppose I have a 
> SCHED_FIFO task spinning on recvmsg() with MSG_DONTWAIT set. Under 
> the scenario above, schedule() would re-run the spinning task 
> rather than ksoftirqd, thus preventing any incoming packets from 
> being sent up the stack until we get a real hardware 
> interrupt--which could be a whole jiffy if interrupt mitigation is 
> enabled in the net device.

TIF_RESCHED_PENDING will not be set if a SCHED_FIFO task wakes up a 
SCHED_OTHER ksoftirqd task. But starvation of ksoftirqd processing 
will occur.

> DaveM pointed out that if we're doing transmits we're likely to 
> hit local_bh_enable(), which would process the softirq work.  
> However, I think we may still have a problem in the above rx-only 
> scenario--or is it too contrived to matter?

This could occur, and the problem is really that task priorities do 
not extend across softirq work processing.

This could occur in ordinary SCHED_OTHER tasks as well, if the 
softirq is bounced to ksoftirqd - which it only should be if there's 
serious softirq overload - or, as you describe it above, if the 
softirq is raised in process context:

        if (!in_interrupt())
                wakeup_softirqd();

that's not really clean. We look into eliminating process context 
use of raise_softirq_irqsoff(). Such code sequence:

	local_irq_save(flags);
	...
	raise_softirq_irqsoff(nr);
	...
	local_irq_restore(flags);

should be converted to something like:

	local_irq_save(flags);
	...
	raise_softirq_irqsoff(nr);
	...
	local_irq_restore(flags);
	recheck_softirqs();

If someone does not do proper local_bh_disable()/enable() sequences 
for micro-optimization reasons, then push the check to after the 
critcal section - and dont cause extra reschedules by waking up 
ksoftirqd. raise_softirq_irqsoff() will also be faster.

	Ingo

WARNING: multiple messages have this Message-ID (diff)
From: Ingo Molnar <mingo@elte.hu>
To: Chris Friesen <cfriesen@nortel.com>,
	Peter Zijlstra <a.p.zijlstra@chello.nl>,
	Thomas Gleixner <tglx@linutronix.de>,
	Steven Rostedt <rostedt@goodmis.org>
Cc: linuxppc-dev@ozlabs.org, paulus@samba.org,
	David Miller <davem@davemloft.net>,
	netdev@vger.kernel.org
Subject: Re: question about softirqs
Date: Tue, 12 May 2009 10:12:37 +0200	[thread overview]
Message-ID: <20090512081237.GA16403@elte.hu> (raw)
In-Reply-To: <4A08C62F.1050105@nortel.com>


* Chris Friesen <cfriesen@nortel.com> wrote:

> This started out as a thread on the ppc list, but on the 
> suggestion of DaveM and Paul Mackerras I'm expanding the receiver 
> list a bit.
> 
> Currently, if a softirq is raised in process context the 
> TIF_RESCHED_PENDING flag gets set and on return to userspace we 
> run the scheduler, expecting it to switch to ksoftirqd to handle 
> the softirqd processing.
> 
> I think I see a possible problem with this. Suppose I have a 
> SCHED_FIFO task spinning on recvmsg() with MSG_DONTWAIT set. Under 
> the scenario above, schedule() would re-run the spinning task 
> rather than ksoftirqd, thus preventing any incoming packets from 
> being sent up the stack until we get a real hardware 
> interrupt--which could be a whole jiffy if interrupt mitigation is 
> enabled in the net device.

TIF_RESCHED_PENDING will not be set if a SCHED_FIFO task wakes up a 
SCHED_OTHER ksoftirqd task. But starvation of ksoftirqd processing 
will occur.

> DaveM pointed out that if we're doing transmits we're likely to 
> hit local_bh_enable(), which would process the softirq work.  
> However, I think we may still have a problem in the above rx-only 
> scenario--or is it too contrived to matter?

This could occur, and the problem is really that task priorities do 
not extend across softirq work processing.

This could occur in ordinary SCHED_OTHER tasks as well, if the 
softirq is bounced to ksoftirqd - which it only should be if there's 
serious softirq overload - or, as you describe it above, if the 
softirq is raised in process context:

        if (!in_interrupt())
                wakeup_softirqd();

that's not really clean. We look into eliminating process context 
use of raise_softirq_irqsoff(). Such code sequence:

	local_irq_save(flags);
	...
	raise_softirq_irqsoff(nr);
	...
	local_irq_restore(flags);

should be converted to something like:

	local_irq_save(flags);
	...
	raise_softirq_irqsoff(nr);
	...
	local_irq_restore(flags);
	recheck_softirqs();

If someone does not do proper local_bh_disable()/enable() sequences 
for micro-optimization reasons, then push the check to after the 
critcal section - and dont cause extra reschedules by waking up 
ksoftirqd. raise_softirq_irqsoff() will also be faster.

	Ingo

  reply	other threads:[~2009-05-12  8:13 UTC|newest]

Thread overview: 57+ messages / expand[flat|nested]  mbox.gz  Atom feed  top
2009-05-08 22:51 question about softirqs Chris Friesen
2009-05-08 23:05 ` David Miller
2009-05-08 23:34 ` Paul Mackerras
2009-05-08 23:53   ` David Miller
2009-05-09  2:52     ` Benjamin Herrenschmidt
2009-05-09  3:31     ` Paul Mackerras
2009-05-09  6:48       ` David Miller
2009-05-11 18:25         ` Chris Friesen
2009-05-11 23:24           ` David Miller
2009-05-12  0:43             ` Chris Friesen
2009-05-12  8:12               ` Ingo Molnar [this message]
2009-05-12  8:12                 ` Ingo Molnar
2009-05-12  9:12                 ` Peter Zijlstra
2009-05-12  9:23                   ` Ingo Molnar
2009-05-12  9:32                     ` Peter Zijlstra
2009-05-12 12:20                       ` Steven Rostedt
2009-05-12 12:20                         ` Steven Rostedt
2009-05-13  4:45                         ` David Miller
2009-05-13  4:44                     ` David Miller
2009-05-13  4:44                       ` David Miller
2009-05-13  5:15                       ` Paul Mackerras
2009-05-13  5:15                         ` Paul Mackerras
2009-05-13  5:28                         ` David Miller
2009-05-13  5:28                           ` David Miller
2009-05-13  5:55                   ` Evgeniy Polyakov
2009-05-13  5:55                     ` Evgeniy Polyakov
2009-05-12 15:18                 ` Chris Friesen
2009-05-12 15:18                   ` Chris Friesen
2009-05-13  8:34                   ` Andi Kleen
2009-05-13  8:34                     ` Andi Kleen
2009-05-13 13:23                     ` Chris Friesen
2009-05-13 14:15                       ` Andi Kleen
2009-05-13 14:15                         ` Andi Kleen
2009-05-13 14:17                         ` Thomas Gleixner
2009-05-13 14:17                           ` Thomas Gleixner
2009-05-13 14:24                           ` Andi Kleen
2009-05-13 14:24                             ` Andi Kleen
2009-05-13 14:54                             ` Eric Dumazet
2009-05-13 14:54                               ` Eric Dumazet
2009-05-13 15:02                               ` Andi Kleen
2009-05-13 15:02                                 ` Andi Kleen
2009-05-13 15:05                             ` Chris Friesen
2009-05-13 15:54                               ` Thomas Gleixner
2009-05-13 15:54                                 ` Thomas Gleixner
2009-05-13 16:10                                 ` Chris Friesen
2009-05-13 17:01                               ` Andi Kleen
2009-05-13 19:04                                 ` Chris Friesen
2009-05-13 19:04                                   ` Chris Friesen
2009-05-13 19:13                                   ` Andi Kleen
2009-05-13 19:13                                     ` Andi Kleen
2009-05-13 19:44                                     ` Chris Friesen
2009-05-13 19:53                                       ` Andi Kleen
2009-05-13 19:53                                         ` Andi Kleen
2009-05-13 20:55                                         ` Thomas Gleixner
2009-05-13 20:55                                           ` Thomas Gleixner
2009-05-11 23:34           ` Paul Mackerras
2009-05-09  0:28   ` Chris Friesen

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