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From: Peter Zijlstra <peterz@infradead.org>
To: Frederic Weisbecker <frederic@kernel.org>
Cc: Yair Podemsky <ypodemsk@redhat.com>,
	linux@armlinux.org.uk, mpe@ellerman.id.au, npiggin@gmail.com,
	christophe.leroy@csgroup.eu, hca@linux.ibm.com,
	gor@linux.ibm.com, agordeev@linux.ibm.com,
	borntraeger@linux.ibm.com, svens@linux.ibm.com,
	davem@davemloft.net, tglx@linutronix.de, mingo@redhat.com,
	bp@alien8.de, dave.hansen@linux.intel.com, x86@kernel.org,
	hpa@zytor.com, will@kernel.org, aneesh.kumar@linux.ibm.com,
	akpm@linux-foundation.org, arnd@arndb.de, keescook@chromium.org,
	paulmck@kernel.org, jpoimboe@kernel.org, samitolvanen@google.com,
	ardb@kernel.org, juerg.haefliger@canonical.com,
	rmk+kernel@armlinux.org.uk, geert+renesas@glider.be,
	tony@atomide.com, linus.walleij@linaro.org,
	sebastian.reichel@collabora.com, nick.hawkins@hpe.com,
	linux-kernel@vger.kernel.org,
	linux-arm-kernel@lists.infradead.org,
	linuxppc-dev@lists.ozlabs.org, linux-s390@vger.kernel.org,
	sparclinux@vger.kernel.org, linux-arch@vger.kernel.org,
	linux-mm@kvack.org, mtosatti@redhat.com, vschneid@redhat.com,
	dhildenb@redhat.com, alougovs@redhat.com
Subject: Re: [PATCH 3/3] mm/mmu_gather: send tlb_remove_table_smp_sync IPI only to CPUs in kernel mode
Date: Wed, 5 Apr 2023 13:41:48 +0200	[thread overview]
Message-ID: <20230405114148.GA351571@hirez.programming.kicks-ass.net> (raw)
In-Reply-To: <ZC1XD/sEJY+zRujE@lothringen>

On Wed, Apr 05, 2023 at 01:10:07PM +0200, Frederic Weisbecker wrote:
> On Wed, Apr 05, 2023 at 12:44:04PM +0200, Frederic Weisbecker wrote:
> > On Tue, Apr 04, 2023 at 04:42:24PM +0300, Yair Podemsky wrote:
> > > +	int state = atomic_read(&ct->state);
> > > +	/* will return true only for cpus in kernel space */
> > > +	return state & CT_STATE_MASK == CONTEXT_KERNEL;
> > > +}
> > 
> > Also note that this doesn't stricly prevent userspace from being interrupted.
> > You may well observe the CPU in kernel but it may receive the IPI later after
> > switching to userspace.
> > 
> > We could arrange for avoiding that with marking ct->state with a pending work bit
> > to flush upon user entry/exit but that's a bit more overhead so I first need to
> > know about your expectations here, ie: can you tolerate such an occasional
> > interruption or not?
> 
> Bah, actually what can we do to prevent from that racy IPI? Not much I fear...

Yeah, so I don't think that's actually a problem. The premise is that
*IFF* NOHZ_FULL stays in userspace, then it will never observe the IPI.

If it violates this by doing syscalls or other kernel entries; it gets
to keep the pieces.



WARNING: multiple messages have this Message-ID (diff)
From: Peter Zijlstra <peterz@infradead.org>
To: Frederic Weisbecker <frederic@kernel.org>
Cc: Yair Podemsky <ypodemsk@redhat.com>,
	linux@armlinux.org.uk, mpe@ellerman.id.au, npiggin@gmail.com,
	christophe.leroy@csgroup.eu, hca@linux.ibm.com,
	gor@linux.ibm.com, agordeev@linux.ibm.com,
	borntraeger@linux.ibm.com, svens@linux.ibm.com,
	davem@davemloft.net, tglx@linutronix.de, mingo@redhat.com,
	bp@alien8.de, dave.hansen@linux.intel.com, x86@kernel.org,
	hpa@zytor.com, will@kernel.org, aneesh.kumar@linux.ibm.com,
	akpm@linux-foundation.org, arnd@arndb.de, keescook@chromium.org,
	paulmck@kernel.org, jpoimboe@kernel.org, samitolvanen@google.com,
	ardb@kernel.org, juerg.haefliger@canonical.com,
	rmk+kernel@armlinux.org.uk, geert+renesas@glider.be,
	tony@atomide.com, linus.walleij@linaro.org,
	sebastian.reichel@collabora.com, nick.hawkins@hpe.com,
	linux-kernel@vger.kernel.org,
	linux-arm-kernel@lists.infradead.org,
	linuxppc-dev@lists.ozlabs.org, linux-s390@vger.kernel.org,
	sparclinux@vger.kernel.org, linux-arch@vger.kernel.org,
	linux-mm@kvack.org, mtosatti@redhat.com, vschneid@redhat.com,
	dhildenb@redhat.com, alougovs@redhat.com
Subject: Re: [PATCH 3/3] mm/mmu_gather: send tlb_remove_table_smp_sync IPI only to CPUs in kernel mode
Date: Wed, 5 Apr 2023 13:41:48 +0200	[thread overview]
Message-ID: <20230405114148.GA351571@hirez.programming.kicks-ass.net> (raw)
In-Reply-To: <ZC1XD/sEJY+zRujE@lothringen>

On Wed, Apr 05, 2023 at 01:10:07PM +0200, Frederic Weisbecker wrote:
> On Wed, Apr 05, 2023 at 12:44:04PM +0200, Frederic Weisbecker wrote:
> > On Tue, Apr 04, 2023 at 04:42:24PM +0300, Yair Podemsky wrote:
> > > +	int state = atomic_read(&ct->state);
> > > +	/* will return true only for cpus in kernel space */
> > > +	return state & CT_STATE_MASK == CONTEXT_KERNEL;
> > > +}
> > 
> > Also note that this doesn't stricly prevent userspace from being interrupted.
> > You may well observe the CPU in kernel but it may receive the IPI later after
> > switching to userspace.
> > 
> > We could arrange for avoiding that with marking ct->state with a pending work bit
> > to flush upon user entry/exit but that's a bit more overhead so I first need to
> > know about your expectations here, ie: can you tolerate such an occasional
> > interruption or not?
> 
> Bah, actually what can we do to prevent from that racy IPI? Not much I fear...

Yeah, so I don't think that's actually a problem. The premise is that
*IFF* NOHZ_FULL stays in userspace, then it will never observe the IPI.

If it violates this by doing syscalls or other kernel entries; it gets
to keep the pieces.



_______________________________________________
linux-arm-kernel mailing list
linux-arm-kernel@lists.infradead.org
http://lists.infradead.org/mailman/listinfo/linux-arm-kernel

WARNING: multiple messages have this Message-ID (diff)
From: Peter Zijlstra <peterz@infradead.org>
To: Frederic Weisbecker <frederic@kernel.org>
Cc: geert+renesas@glider.be, tony@atomide.com,
	linus.walleij@linaro.org, dave.hansen@linux.intel.com,
	Yair Podemsky <ypodemsk@redhat.com>,
	sebastian.reichel@collabora.com, linux-mm@kvack.org,
	hpa@zytor.com, sparclinux@vger.kernel.org,
	agordeev@linux.ibm.com, will@kernel.org, ardb@kernel.org,
	linux-arch@vger.kernel.org, linux-s390@vger.kernel.org,
	vschneid@redhat.com, arnd@arndb.de, paulmck@kernel.org,
	aneesh.kumar@linux.ibm.com, x86@kernel.org,
	linux@armlinux.org.uk, mingo@redhat.com, samitolvanen@google.com,
	borntraeger@linux.ibm.com, keescook@chromium.org,
	gor@linux.ibm.com, hca@linux.ibm.com, npiggin@gmail.com,
	rmk+kernel@armlinux.org.uk, bp@alien8.de, nick.hawkins@hpe.com,
	tglx@linutronix.de, jpoimboe@kernel.org,
	linux-arm-kernel@lists.infradead.org, alougovs@redhat.com,
	mtosatti@redhat.com, linux-kernel@vger.kernel.org,
	juerg.haefliger@canonical.com, svens@linux.ibm.com,
	dhildenb@redhat.com, akpm@linux-foundation.org,
	linuxppc-dev@lists.ozlabs.org, davem@davemloft.net
Subject: Re: [PATCH 3/3] mm/mmu_gather: send tlb_remove_table_smp_sync IPI only to CPUs in kernel mode
Date: Wed, 5 Apr 2023 13:41:48 +0200	[thread overview]
Message-ID: <20230405114148.GA351571@hirez.programming.kicks-ass.net> (raw)
In-Reply-To: <ZC1XD/sEJY+zRujE@lothringen>

On Wed, Apr 05, 2023 at 01:10:07PM +0200, Frederic Weisbecker wrote:
> On Wed, Apr 05, 2023 at 12:44:04PM +0200, Frederic Weisbecker wrote:
> > On Tue, Apr 04, 2023 at 04:42:24PM +0300, Yair Podemsky wrote:
> > > +	int state = atomic_read(&ct->state);
> > > +	/* will return true only for cpus in kernel space */
> > > +	return state & CT_STATE_MASK == CONTEXT_KERNEL;
> > > +}
> > 
> > Also note that this doesn't stricly prevent userspace from being interrupted.
> > You may well observe the CPU in kernel but it may receive the IPI later after
> > switching to userspace.
> > 
> > We could arrange for avoiding that with marking ct->state with a pending work bit
> > to flush upon user entry/exit but that's a bit more overhead so I first need to
> > know about your expectations here, ie: can you tolerate such an occasional
> > interruption or not?
> 
> Bah, actually what can we do to prevent from that racy IPI? Not much I fear...

Yeah, so I don't think that's actually a problem. The premise is that
*IFF* NOHZ_FULL stays in userspace, then it will never observe the IPI.

If it violates this by doing syscalls or other kernel entries; it gets
to keep the pieces.



  reply	other threads:[~2023-04-05 11:43 UTC|newest]

Thread overview: 107+ messages / expand[flat|nested]  mbox.gz  Atom feed  top
2023-04-04 13:42 [PATCH 0/3] send tlb_remove_table_smp_sync IPI only to necessary CPUs Yair Podemsky
2023-04-04 13:42 ` Yair Podemsky
2023-04-04 13:42 ` Yair Podemsky
2023-04-04 13:42 ` [PATCH 1/3] arch: Introduce ARCH_HAS_CPUMASK_BITS Yair Podemsky
2023-04-04 13:42   ` Yair Podemsky
2023-04-04 13:42   ` Yair Podemsky
2023-04-04 13:47   ` David Hildenbrand
2023-04-04 13:47     ` David Hildenbrand
2023-04-04 13:42 ` [PATCH 2/3] mm/mmu_gather: send tlb_remove_table_smp_sync IPI only to MM CPUs Yair Podemsky
2023-04-04 13:42   ` Yair Podemsky
2023-04-04 13:42   ` Yair Podemsky
2023-04-04 14:57   ` Peter Zijlstra
2023-04-04 14:57     ` Peter Zijlstra
2023-04-04 14:57     ` Peter Zijlstra
2023-04-04 13:42 ` [PATCH 3/3] mm/mmu_gather: send tlb_remove_table_smp_sync IPI only to CPUs in kernel mode Yair Podemsky
2023-04-04 13:42   ` Yair Podemsky
2023-04-04 13:42   ` Yair Podemsky
2023-04-04 14:03   ` David Hildenbrand
2023-04-04 14:03     ` David Hildenbrand
2023-04-04 15:12   ` Peter Zijlstra
2023-04-04 15:12     ` Peter Zijlstra
2023-04-04 15:12     ` Peter Zijlstra
2023-04-04 16:00     ` Peter Zijlstra
2023-04-04 16:00       ` Peter Zijlstra
2023-04-04 16:00       ` Peter Zijlstra
2023-04-05  0:53       ` Hillf Danton
2023-04-05 10:43   ` Frederic Weisbecker
2023-04-05 10:43     ` Frederic Weisbecker
2023-04-05 10:43     ` Frederic Weisbecker
2023-04-05 11:10     ` Frederic Weisbecker
2023-04-05 11:10       ` Frederic Weisbecker
2023-04-05 11:10       ` Frederic Weisbecker
2023-04-05 11:41       ` Peter Zijlstra [this message]
2023-04-05 11:41         ` Peter Zijlstra
2023-04-05 11:41         ` Peter Zijlstra
2023-04-05 12:00         ` David Hildenbrand
2023-04-05 12:00           ` David Hildenbrand
2023-04-05 12:00           ` David Hildenbrand
2023-04-05 12:05         ` Frederic Weisbecker
2023-04-05 12:05           ` Frederic Weisbecker
2023-04-05 12:05           ` Frederic Weisbecker
2023-04-05 12:31           ` Frederic Weisbecker
2023-04-05 12:31             ` Frederic Weisbecker
2023-04-05 12:31             ` Frederic Weisbecker
2023-04-05 12:45           ` Valentin Schneider
2023-04-05 12:45             ` Valentin Schneider
2023-04-05 12:45             ` Valentin Schneider
2023-04-06 13:38             ` Peter Zijlstra
2023-04-06 13:38               ` Peter Zijlstra
2023-04-06 13:38               ` Peter Zijlstra
2023-04-06 14:11               ` Valentin Schneider
2023-04-06 14:11                 ` Valentin Schneider
2023-04-06 14:11                 ` Valentin Schneider
2023-04-06 14:39                 ` Peter Zijlstra
2023-04-06 14:39                   ` Peter Zijlstra
2023-04-06 14:39                   ` Peter Zijlstra
2023-04-05 19:45       ` Marcelo Tosatti
2023-04-05 19:45         ` Marcelo Tosatti
2023-04-05 19:45         ` Marcelo Tosatti
2023-04-05 19:52         ` Peter Zijlstra
2023-04-05 19:52           ` Peter Zijlstra
2023-04-05 19:52           ` Peter Zijlstra
2023-04-06 12:38           ` Marcelo Tosatti
2023-04-06 12:38             ` Marcelo Tosatti
2023-04-06 12:38             ` Marcelo Tosatti
2023-04-06 13:29             ` Peter Zijlstra
2023-04-06 13:29               ` Peter Zijlstra
2023-04-06 13:29               ` Peter Zijlstra
2023-04-06 14:04               ` Peter Zijlstra
2023-04-06 14:04                 ` Peter Zijlstra
2023-04-06 14:04                 ` Peter Zijlstra
2023-04-06 14:42                 ` David Hildenbrand
2023-04-06 14:42                   ` David Hildenbrand
2023-04-06 14:42                   ` David Hildenbrand
2023-04-06 15:06                   ` Peter Zijlstra
2023-04-06 15:06                     ` Peter Zijlstra
2023-04-06 15:06                     ` Peter Zijlstra
2023-04-06 15:02                 ` Peter Zijlstra
2023-04-06 15:02                   ` Peter Zijlstra
2023-04-06 15:02                   ` Peter Zijlstra
2023-04-06 15:51                   ` David Hildenbrand
2023-04-06 15:51                     ` David Hildenbrand
2023-04-06 15:51                     ` David Hildenbrand
2023-04-06 18:27                     ` Peter Zijlstra
2023-04-06 18:27                       ` Peter Zijlstra
2023-04-06 18:27                       ` Peter Zijlstra
2023-04-19 11:30                       ` David Hildenbrand
2023-04-19 11:30                         ` David Hildenbrand
2023-04-19 11:30                         ` David Hildenbrand
2023-04-19 11:39                         ` Marcelo Tosatti
2023-04-19 11:39                           ` Marcelo Tosatti
2023-04-19 11:39                           ` Marcelo Tosatti
2023-04-05 19:43     ` Marcelo Tosatti
2023-04-05 19:43       ` Marcelo Tosatti
2023-04-05 19:43       ` Marcelo Tosatti
2023-04-05 19:54       ` Peter Zijlstra
2023-04-05 19:54         ` Peter Zijlstra
2023-04-05 19:54         ` Peter Zijlstra
2023-04-06 12:49         ` Marcelo Tosatti
2023-04-06 12:49           ` Marcelo Tosatti
2023-04-06 12:49           ` Marcelo Tosatti
2023-04-06 13:32           ` Peter Zijlstra
2023-04-06 13:32             ` Peter Zijlstra
2023-04-06 13:32             ` Peter Zijlstra
2023-04-19 11:01             ` Marcelo Tosatti
2023-04-19 11:01               ` Marcelo Tosatti
2023-04-19 11:01               ` Marcelo Tosatti

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