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From: Ohad Ben-Cohen <ohad@wizery.com>
To: Linux-pm mailing list <linux-pm@lists.linux-foundation.org>
Cc: "Rafael J. Wysocki" <rjw@sisk.pl>,
	linux-mmc@vger.kernel.org, Ido Yariv <ido@wizery.com>,
	linux-wireless@vger.kernel.org,
	Alan Stern <stern@rowland.harvard.edu>,
	Johannes Berg <johannes@sipsolutions.net>
Subject: Re: [linux-pm] subtle pm_runtime_put_sync race and sdio functions
Date: Sat, 18 Dec 2010 21:08:55 +0200	[thread overview]
Message-ID: <AANLkTin6zdUb2C-3GU-FySb3Pmk5iHaG5neLNSG38Tdx@mail.gmail.com> (raw)
In-Reply-To: <1292690407.3653.2.camel@jlt3.sipsolutions.net>

On Sat, Dec 18, 2010 at 6:40 PM, Johannes Berg
<johannes@sipsolutions.net> wrote:
> On Sat, 2010-12-18 at 18:00 +0200, Ohad Ben-Cohen wrote:
>
>> > That's where the problem is.  If there's a difference, from the driver's
>> > point of view, between suspend and some other operation, there should be a
>> > way to tell the driver what case it actually is dealing with.
>>
>> Yes, the problem will be solved if the driver would bypass the runtime
>> PM framework on system suspend. mac80211 obviously has this
>> information, and technically it's very easy to let the driver know
>> about it.
>>
>> But the difference between suspend and normal operation is really
>> artificial: in both cases mac80211 just asks the driver to power its
>> device down, and the end result is exactly the same (a GPIO line of
>> the device is de-asserted in our case). The difference between these
>> two scenarios
>> exist only because runtime PM is effectively disabled during system
>> suspend, and therefore the driver has to look for an alternative way
>> to power down the device.
>
> Sounds to me like the difference isn't really in the driver, but the
> core PM subsystem. Why does it care when powering off a device whether
> it's during suspend, or during runtime?

Agree.

If we can add a dev_pm_info bit, that would allow using runtime PM API
during suspend/resume transitions, the driver will not have to care.

Rafael what do you think ? Is that totally unacceptable ?

Thanks,
Ohad.

WARNING: multiple messages have this Message-ID (diff)
From: Ohad Ben-Cohen <ohad-Ix1uc/W3ht7QT0dZR+AlfA@public.gmane.org>
To: Linux-pm mailing list
	<linux-pm-cunTk1MwBs9QetFLy7KEm3xJsTq8ys+cHZ5vskTnxNA@public.gmane.org>
Cc: "Rafael J. Wysocki" <rjw-KKrjLPT3xs0@public.gmane.org>,
	linux-mmc-u79uwXL29TY76Z2rM5mHXA@public.gmane.org,
	Ido Yariv <ido-Ix1uc/W3ht7QT0dZR+AlfA@public.gmane.org>,
	linux-wireless-u79uwXL29TY76Z2rM5mHXA@public.gmane.org,
	Alan Stern
	<stern-nwvwT67g6+6dFdvTe/nMLpVzexx5G7lz@public.gmane.org>,
	Johannes Berg <johannes-cdvu00un1VgdHxzADdlk8Q@public.gmane.org>
Subject: Re: [linux-pm] subtle pm_runtime_put_sync race and sdio functions
Date: Sat, 18 Dec 2010 21:08:55 +0200	[thread overview]
Message-ID: <AANLkTin6zdUb2C-3GU-FySb3Pmk5iHaG5neLNSG38Tdx@mail.gmail.com> (raw)
In-Reply-To: <1292690407.3653.2.camel-8upI4CBIZJIJvtFkdXX2HixXY32XiHfO@public.gmane.org>

On Sat, Dec 18, 2010 at 6:40 PM, Johannes Berg
<johannes-cdvu00un1VgdHxzADdlk8Q@public.gmane.org> wrote:
> On Sat, 2010-12-18 at 18:00 +0200, Ohad Ben-Cohen wrote:
>
>> > That's where the problem is.  If there's a difference, from the driver's
>> > point of view, between suspend and some other operation, there should be a
>> > way to tell the driver what case it actually is dealing with.
>>
>> Yes, the problem will be solved if the driver would bypass the runtime
>> PM framework on system suspend. mac80211 obviously has this
>> information, and technically it's very easy to let the driver know
>> about it.
>>
>> But the difference between suspend and normal operation is really
>> artificial: in both cases mac80211 just asks the driver to power its
>> device down, and the end result is exactly the same (a GPIO line of
>> the device is de-asserted in our case). The difference between these
>> two scenarios
>> exist only because runtime PM is effectively disabled during system
>> suspend, and therefore the driver has to look for an alternative way
>> to power down the device.
>
> Sounds to me like the difference isn't really in the driver, but the
> core PM subsystem. Why does it care when powering off a device whether
> it's during suspend, or during runtime?

Agree.

If we can add a dev_pm_info bit, that would allow using runtime PM API
during suspend/resume transitions, the driver will not have to care.

Rafael what do you think ? Is that totally unacceptable ?

Thanks,
Ohad.
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  reply	other threads:[~2010-12-18 19:09 UTC|newest]

Thread overview: 179+ messages / expand[flat|nested]  mbox.gz  Atom feed  top
2010-12-09 23:37 subtle pm_runtime_put_sync race and sdio functions Ohad Ben-Cohen
2010-12-10  0:00 ` Rafael J. Wysocki
2010-12-10  0:00 ` [linux-pm] " Rafael J. Wysocki
2010-12-10 17:24   ` Alan Stern
2010-12-10 17:24   ` [linux-pm] " Alan Stern
2010-12-10 22:01     ` Rafael J. Wysocki
2010-12-10 22:01     ` [linux-pm] " Rafael J. Wysocki
2010-12-10 23:02       ` Ohad Ben-Cohen
2010-12-10 23:02       ` [linux-pm] " Ohad Ben-Cohen
2010-12-10 22:59     ` Ohad Ben-Cohen
2010-12-10 22:59     ` [linux-pm] " Ohad Ben-Cohen
2010-12-11  1:17       ` Ohad Ben-Cohen
2010-12-11 14:53         ` Alan Stern
2010-12-11  1:17       ` Ohad Ben-Cohen
2010-12-11 14:50       ` Alan Stern
2010-12-18 13:29         ` Ohad Ben-Cohen
2010-12-18 13:29         ` [linux-pm] " Ohad Ben-Cohen
2010-12-18 14:16           ` David Vrabel
2010-12-18 15:12             ` Ohad Ben-Cohen
2010-12-18 15:12             ` Ohad Ben-Cohen
2010-12-18 14:16           ` David Vrabel
2010-12-18 15:07           ` [linux-pm] " Rafael J. Wysocki
2010-12-18 16:00             ` Ohad Ben-Cohen
2010-12-18 16:00             ` [linux-pm] " Ohad Ben-Cohen
2010-12-18 16:40               ` Johannes Berg
2010-12-18 19:08                 ` Ohad Ben-Cohen [this message]
2010-12-18 19:08                   ` Ohad Ben-Cohen
2010-12-18 21:30                   ` Alan Stern
2010-12-18 21:30                     ` Alan Stern
2010-12-18 22:57                     ` Rafael J. Wysocki
2010-12-18 22:57                     ` [linux-pm] " Rafael J. Wysocki
2010-12-18 21:30                   ` Alan Stern
2010-12-18 22:52                   ` Rafael J. Wysocki
2010-12-18 22:52                   ` [linux-pm] " Rafael J. Wysocki
2010-12-18 19:08                 ` Ohad Ben-Cohen
2010-12-18 21:29                 ` [linux-pm] " Alan Stern
2010-12-18 21:29                   ` Alan Stern
2010-12-18 21:29                 ` Alan Stern
2010-12-18 22:50                 ` Rafael J. Wysocki
2010-12-18 22:50                 ` [linux-pm] " Rafael J. Wysocki
2010-12-18 16:40               ` Johannes Berg
2010-12-18 22:47               ` [linux-pm] " Rafael J. Wysocki
2010-12-18 22:47                 ` Rafael J. Wysocki
2010-12-19  7:48                 ` Ohad Ben-Cohen
2010-12-19  7:48                   ` Ohad Ben-Cohen
2010-12-19  7:48                 ` Ohad Ben-Cohen
2010-12-19 10:22                 ` Rafael J. Wysocki
2010-12-19 10:22                 ` [linux-pm] " Rafael J. Wysocki
2010-12-20  3:37                   ` Alan Stern
2010-12-20  3:37                     ` Alan Stern
2010-12-20 21:17                     ` Rafael J. Wysocki
2010-12-21  0:57                       ` Alan Stern
2010-12-21  0:57                         ` Alan Stern
2010-12-21 21:31                         ` Rafael J. Wysocki
2010-12-22  1:42                           ` Alan Stern
2010-12-22  1:42                             ` Alan Stern
2010-12-22 12:29                             ` Rafael J. Wysocki
2010-12-22 12:29                               ` Rafael J. Wysocki
2011-01-26 23:28                               ` Kevin Hilman
2011-01-26 23:28                                 ` Kevin Hilman
2011-01-27 18:13                                 ` Alan Stern
2011-01-27 18:13                                 ` [linux-pm] " Alan Stern
2011-01-27 18:13                                   ` Alan Stern
2011-01-27 19:22                                   ` Kevin Hilman
2011-01-27 19:22                                   ` [linux-pm] " Kevin Hilman
2011-01-27 19:22                                     ` Kevin Hilman
2011-01-27 19:49                                     ` Alan Stern
2011-01-27 19:49                                     ` [linux-pm] " Alan Stern
2011-01-27 19:49                                       ` Alan Stern
2011-01-27 20:15                                       ` Kevin Hilman
2011-01-27 20:15                                       ` [linux-pm] " Kevin Hilman
2011-01-27 20:15                                         ` Kevin Hilman
2011-01-27 22:18                                         ` Vitaly Wool
2011-01-27 22:18                                           ` Vitaly Wool
2011-01-27 22:18                                         ` Vitaly Wool
2011-01-27 23:21                                         ` Rafael J. Wysocki
2011-01-27 23:21                                         ` [linux-pm] " Rafael J. Wysocki
2011-01-27 23:49                                           ` Kevin Hilman
2011-01-27 23:49                                           ` [linux-pm] " Kevin Hilman
2011-01-27 23:11                                   ` Rafael J. Wysocki
2011-01-27 23:11                                   ` [linux-pm] " Rafael J. Wysocki
2011-01-27 18:20                                 ` Vitaly Wool
2011-01-27 18:20                                 ` [linux-pm] " Vitaly Wool
2011-01-27 18:20                                   ` Vitaly Wool
2011-01-27 18:54                                   ` Kevin Hilman
2011-01-27 18:54                                   ` [linux-pm] " Kevin Hilman
2010-12-22 12:29                             ` Rafael J. Wysocki
2010-12-22  1:42                           ` Alan Stern
2010-12-21 21:31                         ` Rafael J. Wysocki
2010-12-21  0:57                       ` Alan Stern
2010-12-20 21:17                     ` Rafael J. Wysocki
2010-12-20  3:37                   ` Alan Stern
2010-12-21 22:23                   ` Kevin Hilman
2010-12-21 22:23                   ` [linux-pm] " Kevin Hilman
2010-12-22  1:48                     ` Alan Stern
2010-12-22  1:48                       ` Alan Stern
2010-12-22  1:48                     ` Alan Stern
2010-12-23  7:51                   ` Ohad Ben-Cohen
2010-12-23  7:51                   ` [linux-pm] " Ohad Ben-Cohen
2010-12-23 16:03                     ` Alan Stern
2010-12-23 16:03                     ` [linux-pm] " Alan Stern
2010-12-23 16:03                       ` Alan Stern
2010-12-25  7:34                       ` Ohad Ben-Cohen
2010-12-25  7:34                         ` Ohad Ben-Cohen
2010-12-25 16:21                         ` Alan Stern
2010-12-25 16:21                           ` Alan Stern
2010-12-25 20:58                           ` Ohad Ben-Cohen
2010-12-25 20:58                           ` [linux-pm] " Ohad Ben-Cohen
2010-12-25 20:58                             ` Ohad Ben-Cohen
2010-12-25 21:50                             ` Vitaly Wool
2010-12-25 21:50                             ` [linux-pm] " Vitaly Wool
2010-12-26  5:27                               ` Ohad Ben-Cohen
2010-12-26  5:27                               ` [linux-pm] " Ohad Ben-Cohen
2010-12-25 21:54                             ` Vitaly Wool
2010-12-25 21:54                               ` Vitaly Wool
2010-12-25 21:54                             ` Vitaly Wool
2010-12-26  2:48                             ` [linux-pm] " Alan Stern
2010-12-26  2:48                               ` Alan Stern
2010-12-26  5:55                               ` Ohad Ben-Cohen
2010-12-26  5:55                               ` [linux-pm] " Ohad Ben-Cohen
2010-12-26  5:55                                 ` Ohad Ben-Cohen
2010-12-26 11:45                                 ` Rafael J. Wysocki
2010-12-26 12:43                                   ` Ohad Ben-Cohen
2010-12-26 12:43                                   ` [linux-pm] " Ohad Ben-Cohen
2010-12-26 12:43                                     ` Ohad Ben-Cohen
2010-12-26 18:35                                     ` Rafael J. Wysocki
2010-12-28 19:11                                       ` Ohad Ben-Cohen
2010-12-28 19:11                                       ` [linux-pm] " Ohad Ben-Cohen
2010-12-28 19:21                                         ` Rafael J. Wysocki
2010-12-28 19:21                                         ` [linux-pm] " Rafael J. Wysocki
2010-12-28 19:21                                           ` Rafael J. Wysocki
2010-12-28 19:34                                           ` Ohad Ben-Cohen
2010-12-28 20:36                                             ` Rafael J. Wysocki
2010-12-28 20:36                                             ` [linux-pm] " Rafael J. Wysocki
2010-12-28 19:34                                           ` Ohad Ben-Cohen
2010-12-26 18:35                                     ` Rafael J. Wysocki
2010-12-26 14:53                                   ` [linux-pm] " Ohad Ben-Cohen
2010-12-26 18:37                                     ` Rafael J. Wysocki
2010-12-26 18:37                                     ` [linux-pm] " Rafael J. Wysocki
2010-12-28 19:15                                       ` Ohad Ben-Cohen
2010-12-28 20:04                                         ` Rafael J. Wysocki
2010-12-28 20:04                                         ` [linux-pm] " Rafael J. Wysocki
2010-12-28 20:04                                           ` Rafael J. Wysocki
2010-12-28 20:41                                           ` Ohad Ben-Cohen
2010-12-28 20:41                                           ` [linux-pm] " Ohad Ben-Cohen
2010-12-28 20:41                                             ` Ohad Ben-Cohen
2010-12-28 19:15                                       ` Ohad Ben-Cohen
2010-12-26 14:53                                   ` Ohad Ben-Cohen
2010-12-26 11:45                                 ` Rafael J. Wysocki
2010-12-26 17:00                                 ` [linux-pm] " Alan Stern
2010-12-26 17:00                                   ` Alan Stern
2010-12-28 19:04                                   ` Ohad Ben-Cohen
2010-12-28 19:04                                   ` [linux-pm] " Ohad Ben-Cohen
2010-12-28 19:04                                     ` Ohad Ben-Cohen
2010-12-28 21:46                                     ` Alan Stern
2010-12-28 21:46                                     ` [linux-pm] " Alan Stern
2010-12-28 21:46                                       ` Alan Stern
2010-12-29  6:34                                       ` Ohad Ben-Cohen
2010-12-30  4:25                                         ` Alan Stern
2010-12-30  4:25                                           ` Alan Stern
2010-12-30  4:25                                         ` Alan Stern
2010-12-29  6:34                                       ` Ohad Ben-Cohen
2010-12-29  8:01                                       ` Ohad Ben-Cohen
2010-12-29  8:01                                       ` [linux-pm] " Ohad Ben-Cohen
2010-12-30  4:30                                         ` Alan Stern
2010-12-30  4:30                                         ` [linux-pm] " Alan Stern
2010-12-30  4:30                                           ` Alan Stern
2010-12-26 17:00                                 ` Alan Stern
2010-12-26  2:48                             ` Alan Stern
2010-12-25 16:21                         ` Alan Stern
2010-12-25  7:34                       ` Ohad Ben-Cohen
2010-12-18 22:47               ` Rafael J. Wysocki
2010-12-18 15:07           ` Rafael J. Wysocki
2010-12-18 21:20           ` [linux-pm] " Alan Stern
2010-12-18 23:03             ` Rafael J. Wysocki
2010-12-18 23:03             ` Rafael J. Wysocki
2010-12-19 10:00             ` [linux-pm] " Ohad Ben-Cohen
2010-12-19 10:00             ` Ohad Ben-Cohen
2010-12-18 21:20           ` Alan Stern

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