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From: Shakeel Butt <shakeelb@google.com>
To: Michal Hocko <mhocko@kernel.org>
Cc: Andrey Ryabinin <aryabinin@virtuozzo.com>,
	Andrew Morton <akpm@linux-foundation.org>,
	Johannes Weiner <hannes@cmpxchg.org>,
	Vladimir Davydov <vdavydov.dev@gmail.com>,
	Cgroups <cgroups@vger.kernel.org>, Linux MM <linux-mm@kvack.org>,
	LKML <linux-kernel@vger.kernel.org>
Subject: Re: [PATCH v4] mm/memcg: try harder to decrease [memory,memsw].limit_in_bytes
Date: Fri, 12 Jan 2018 14:57:35 -0800	[thread overview]
Message-ID: <CALvZod6y8EfQt02+rNOP_JXgzpJJHjuVzd++T3E=NEMwwBv_CQ@mail.gmail.com> (raw)
In-Reply-To: <20180112122405.GK1732@dhcp22.suse.cz>

On Fri, Jan 12, 2018 at 4:24 AM, Michal Hocko <mhocko@kernel.org> wrote:
> On Fri 12-01-18 00:59:38, Andrey Ryabinin wrote:
>> On 01/11/2018 07:29 PM, Michal Hocko wrote:
> [...]
>> > I do not think so. Consider that this reclaim races with other
>> > reclaimers. Now you are reclaiming a large chunk so you might end up
>> > reclaiming more than necessary. SWAP_CLUSTER_MAX would reduce the over
>> > reclaim to be negligible.
>> >
>>
>> I did consider this. And I think, I already explained that sort of race in previous email.
>> Whether "Task B" is really a task in cgroup or it's actually a bunch of reclaimers,
>> doesn't matter. That doesn't change anything.
>
> I would _really_ prefer two patches here. The first one removing the
> hard coded reclaim count. That thing is just dubious at best. If you
> _really_ think that the higher reclaim target is meaningfull then make
> it a separate patch. I am not conviced but I will not nack it it either.
> But it will make our life much easier if my over reclaim concern is
> right and we will need to revert it. Conceptually those two changes are
> independent anywa.
>

Personally I feel that the cgroup-v2 semantics are much cleaner for
setting limit. There is no race with the allocators in the memcg,
though oom-killer can be triggered. For cgroup-v1, the user does not
expect OOM killer and EBUSY is expected on unsuccessful reclaim. How
about we do something similar here and make sure oom killer can not be
triggered for the given memcg?

// pseudo code
disable_oom(memcg)
old = xchg(&memcg->memory.limit, requested_limit)

reclaim memory until usage gets below new limit or retries are exhausted

if (unsuccessful) {
  reset_limit(memcg, old)
  ret = EBUSY
} else
  ret = 0;
enable_oom(memcg)

This way there is no race with the allocators and oom killer will not
be triggered. The processes in the memcg can suffer but that should be
within the expectation of the user. One disclaimer though, disabling
oom for memcg needs more thought.

Shakeel

WARNING: multiple messages have this Message-ID (diff)
From: Shakeel Butt <shakeelb@google.com>
To: Michal Hocko <mhocko@kernel.org>
Cc: Andrey Ryabinin <aryabinin@virtuozzo.com>,
	Andrew Morton <akpm@linux-foundation.org>,
	Johannes Weiner <hannes@cmpxchg.org>,
	Vladimir Davydov <vdavydov.dev@gmail.com>,
	Cgroups <cgroups@vger.kernel.org>, Linux MM <linux-mm@kvack.org>,
	LKML <linux-kernel@vger.kernel.org>
Subject: Re: [PATCH v4] mm/memcg: try harder to decrease [memory,memsw].limit_in_bytes
Date: Fri, 12 Jan 2018 14:57:35 -0800	[thread overview]
Message-ID: <CALvZod6y8EfQt02+rNOP_JXgzpJJHjuVzd++T3E=NEMwwBv_CQ@mail.gmail.com> (raw)
In-Reply-To: <20180112122405.GK1732@dhcp22.suse.cz>

On Fri, Jan 12, 2018 at 4:24 AM, Michal Hocko <mhocko@kernel.org> wrote:
> On Fri 12-01-18 00:59:38, Andrey Ryabinin wrote:
>> On 01/11/2018 07:29 PM, Michal Hocko wrote:
> [...]
>> > I do not think so. Consider that this reclaim races with other
>> > reclaimers. Now you are reclaiming a large chunk so you might end up
>> > reclaiming more than necessary. SWAP_CLUSTER_MAX would reduce the over
>> > reclaim to be negligible.
>> >
>>
>> I did consider this. And I think, I already explained that sort of race in previous email.
>> Whether "Task B" is really a task in cgroup or it's actually a bunch of reclaimers,
>> doesn't matter. That doesn't change anything.
>
> I would _really_ prefer two patches here. The first one removing the
> hard coded reclaim count. That thing is just dubious at best. If you
> _really_ think that the higher reclaim target is meaningfull then make
> it a separate patch. I am not conviced but I will not nack it it either.
> But it will make our life much easier if my over reclaim concern is
> right and we will need to revert it. Conceptually those two changes are
> independent anywa.
>

Personally I feel that the cgroup-v2 semantics are much cleaner for
setting limit. There is no race with the allocators in the memcg,
though oom-killer can be triggered. For cgroup-v1, the user does not
expect OOM killer and EBUSY is expected on unsuccessful reclaim. How
about we do something similar here and make sure oom killer can not be
triggered for the given memcg?

// pseudo code
disable_oom(memcg)
old = xchg(&memcg->memory.limit, requested_limit)

reclaim memory until usage gets below new limit or retries are exhausted

if (unsuccessful) {
  reset_limit(memcg, old)
  ret = EBUSY
} else
  ret = 0;
enable_oom(memcg)

This way there is no race with the allocators and oom killer will not
be triggered. The processes in the memcg can suffer but that should be
within the expectation of the user. One disclaimer though, disabling
oom for memcg needs more thought.

Shakeel

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WARNING: multiple messages have this Message-ID (diff)
From: Shakeel Butt <shakeelb-hpIqsD4AKlfQT0dZR+AlfA@public.gmane.org>
To: Michal Hocko <mhocko-DgEjT+Ai2ygdnm+yROfE0A@public.gmane.org>
Cc: Andrey Ryabinin
	<aryabinin-5HdwGun5lf+gSpxsJD1C4w@public.gmane.org>,
	Andrew Morton
	<akpm-de/tnXTf+JLsfHDXvbKv3WD2FQJk+8+b@public.gmane.org>,
	Johannes Weiner <hannes-druUgvl0LCNAfugRpC6u6w@public.gmane.org>,
	Vladimir Davydov
	<vdavydov.dev-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w@public.gmane.org>,
	Cgroups <cgroups-u79uwXL29TY76Z2rM5mHXA@public.gmane.org>,
	Linux MM <linux-mm-Bw31MaZKKs3YtjvyW6yDsg@public.gmane.org>,
	LKML <linux-kernel-u79uwXL29TY76Z2rM5mHXA@public.gmane.org>
Subject: Re: [PATCH v4] mm/memcg: try harder to decrease [memory,memsw].limit_in_bytes
Date: Fri, 12 Jan 2018 14:57:35 -0800	[thread overview]
Message-ID: <CALvZod6y8EfQt02+rNOP_JXgzpJJHjuVzd++T3E=NEMwwBv_CQ@mail.gmail.com> (raw)
In-Reply-To: <20180112122405.GK1732-2MMpYkNvuYDjFM9bn6wA6Q@public.gmane.org>

On Fri, Jan 12, 2018 at 4:24 AM, Michal Hocko <mhocko-DgEjT+Ai2ygdnm+yROfE0A@public.gmane.org> wrote:
> On Fri 12-01-18 00:59:38, Andrey Ryabinin wrote:
>> On 01/11/2018 07:29 PM, Michal Hocko wrote:
> [...]
>> > I do not think so. Consider that this reclaim races with other
>> > reclaimers. Now you are reclaiming a large chunk so you might end up
>> > reclaiming more than necessary. SWAP_CLUSTER_MAX would reduce the over
>> > reclaim to be negligible.
>> >
>>
>> I did consider this. And I think, I already explained that sort of race in previous email.
>> Whether "Task B" is really a task in cgroup or it's actually a bunch of reclaimers,
>> doesn't matter. That doesn't change anything.
>
> I would _really_ prefer two patches here. The first one removing the
> hard coded reclaim count. That thing is just dubious at best. If you
> _really_ think that the higher reclaim target is meaningfull then make
> it a separate patch. I am not conviced but I will not nack it it either.
> But it will make our life much easier if my over reclaim concern is
> right and we will need to revert it. Conceptually those two changes are
> independent anywa.
>

Personally I feel that the cgroup-v2 semantics are much cleaner for
setting limit. There is no race with the allocators in the memcg,
though oom-killer can be triggered. For cgroup-v1, the user does not
expect OOM killer and EBUSY is expected on unsuccessful reclaim. How
about we do something similar here and make sure oom killer can not be
triggered for the given memcg?

// pseudo code
disable_oom(memcg)
old = xchg(&memcg->memory.limit, requested_limit)

reclaim memory until usage gets below new limit or retries are exhausted

if (unsuccessful) {
  reset_limit(memcg, old)
  ret = EBUSY
} else
  ret = 0;
enable_oom(memcg)

This way there is no race with the allocators and oom killer will not
be triggered. The processes in the memcg can suffer but that should be
within the expectation of the user. One disclaimer though, disabling
oom for memcg needs more thought.

Shakeel

  reply	other threads:[~2018-01-12 22:57 UTC|newest]

Thread overview: 125+ messages / expand[flat|nested]  mbox.gz  Atom feed  top
2017-12-20 10:24 [PATCH 1/2] mm/memcg: try harder to decrease [memory,memsw].limit_in_bytes Andrey Ryabinin
2017-12-20 10:24 ` Andrey Ryabinin
2017-12-20 10:24 ` [PATCH 2/2] mm/memcg: Consolidate mem_cgroup_resize_[memsw]_limit() functions Andrey Ryabinin
2017-12-20 10:24   ` Andrey Ryabinin
2017-12-20 10:33 ` [PATCH 1/2] mm/memcg: try harder to decrease [memory,memsw].limit_in_bytes Michal Hocko
2017-12-20 10:33   ` Michal Hocko
2017-12-20 11:32   ` Andrey Ryabinin
2017-12-20 11:32     ` Andrey Ryabinin
2017-12-20 11:34     ` Michal Hocko
2017-12-20 11:34       ` Michal Hocko
2017-12-20 18:15       ` Shakeel Butt
2017-12-20 18:15         ` Shakeel Butt
2017-12-21 10:00         ` Andrey Ryabinin
2017-12-21 10:00           ` Andrey Ryabinin
2017-12-21 10:00           ` Andrey Ryabinin
2017-12-20 13:21 ` [PATCH v2 " Andrey Ryabinin
2017-12-20 13:21   ` Andrey Ryabinin
2017-12-20 13:21   ` [PATCH v2 2/2] mm/memcg: Consolidate mem_cgroup_resize_[memsw]_limit() functions Andrey Ryabinin
2017-12-20 13:21     ` Andrey Ryabinin
2017-12-20 13:53   ` [PATCH v2 1/2] mm/memcg: try harder to decrease [memory,memsw].limit_in_bytes Michal Hocko
2017-12-20 13:53     ` Michal Hocko
2018-01-09 16:58     ` [PATCH v3 " Andrey Ryabinin
2018-01-09 16:58       ` Andrey Ryabinin
2018-01-09 16:58       ` [PATCH v3 2/2] mm/memcg: Consolidate mem_cgroup_resize_[memsw]_limit() functions Andrey Ryabinin
2018-01-09 16:58         ` Andrey Ryabinin
2018-01-09 17:10         ` Shakeel Butt
2018-01-09 17:10           ` Shakeel Butt
2018-01-09 17:10           ` Shakeel Butt
2018-01-09 17:26           ` Andrey Ryabinin
2018-01-09 17:26             ` Andrey Ryabinin
2018-01-09 23:26             ` Andrew Morton
2018-01-09 23:26               ` Andrew Morton
2018-01-10 12:43               ` [PATCH v4] mm/memcg: try harder to decrease [memory,memsw].limit_in_bytes Andrey Ryabinin
2018-01-10 12:43                 ` Andrey Ryabinin
2018-01-10 12:43                 ` Andrey Ryabinin
2018-01-10 22:31                 ` Andrew Morton
2018-01-10 22:31                   ` Andrew Morton
2018-01-11 11:59                   ` Andrey Ryabinin
2018-01-11 11:59                     ` Andrey Ryabinin
2018-01-12  0:21                     ` Andrew Morton
2018-01-12  0:21                       ` Andrew Morton
2018-01-12  0:21                       ` Andrew Morton
2018-01-12  9:08                       ` Andrey Ryabinin
2018-01-12  9:08                         ` Andrey Ryabinin
2018-01-11 10:42                 ` Michal Hocko
2018-01-11 10:42                   ` Michal Hocko
2018-01-11 10:42                   ` Michal Hocko
2018-01-11 12:21                   ` Andrey Ryabinin
2018-01-11 12:21                     ` Andrey Ryabinin
2018-01-11 12:21                     ` Andrey Ryabinin
2018-01-11 12:46                     ` Michal Hocko
2018-01-11 12:46                       ` Michal Hocko
2018-01-11 15:23                       ` Andrey Ryabinin
2018-01-11 15:23                         ` Andrey Ryabinin
2018-01-11 15:23                         ` Andrey Ryabinin
2018-01-11 16:29                         ` Michal Hocko
2018-01-11 16:29                           ` Michal Hocko
2018-01-11 16:29                           ` Michal Hocko
2018-01-11 21:59                           ` Andrey Ryabinin
2018-01-11 21:59                             ` Andrey Ryabinin
2018-01-11 21:59                             ` Andrey Ryabinin
2018-01-12 12:24                             ` Michal Hocko
2018-01-12 12:24                               ` Michal Hocko
2018-01-12 22:57                               ` Shakeel Butt [this message]
2018-01-12 22:57                                 ` Shakeel Butt
2018-01-12 22:57                                 ` Shakeel Butt
2018-01-15 12:29                                 ` Andrey Ryabinin
2018-01-15 12:29                                   ` Andrey Ryabinin
2018-01-15 17:04                                   ` Shakeel Butt
2018-01-15 17:04                                     ` Shakeel Butt
2018-01-15 17:04                                     ` Shakeel Butt
2018-01-15 12:30                               ` Andrey Ryabinin
2018-01-15 12:30                                 ` Andrey Ryabinin
2018-01-15 12:46                                 ` Michal Hocko
2018-01-15 12:46                                   ` Michal Hocko
2018-01-15 12:53                                   ` Andrey Ryabinin
2018-01-15 12:53                                     ` Andrey Ryabinin
2018-01-15 12:58                                     ` Michal Hocko
2018-01-15 12:58                                       ` Michal Hocko
2018-01-09 17:08       ` [PATCH v3 1/2] " Andrey Ryabinin
2018-01-09 17:08         ` Andrey Ryabinin
2018-01-09 17:08         ` Andrey Ryabinin
2018-01-09 17:22       ` Shakeel Butt
2018-01-09 17:22         ` Shakeel Butt
2018-01-19 13:25 ` [PATCH v5 1/2] mm/memcontrol.c: " Andrey Ryabinin
2018-01-19 13:25   ` Andrey Ryabinin
2018-01-19 13:25   ` Andrey Ryabinin
2018-01-19 13:25   ` [PATCH v5 2/2] mm/memcontrol.c: Reduce reclaim retries in mem_cgroup_resize_limit() Andrey Ryabinin
2018-01-19 13:25     ` Andrey Ryabinin
2018-01-19 13:35     ` Michal Hocko
2018-01-19 13:35       ` Michal Hocko
2018-01-19 14:49       ` Shakeel Butt
2018-01-19 14:49         ` Shakeel Butt
2018-01-19 14:49         ` Shakeel Butt
2018-01-19 15:11         ` Michal Hocko
2018-01-19 15:11           ` Michal Hocko
2018-01-19 15:11           ` Michal Hocko
2018-01-19 15:24           ` Shakeel Butt
2018-01-19 15:24             ` Shakeel Butt
2018-01-19 15:31             ` Michal Hocko
2018-01-19 15:31               ` Michal Hocko
2018-01-19 15:31               ` Michal Hocko
2018-02-21 20:17           ` Andrew Morton
2018-02-21 20:17             ` Andrew Morton
2018-02-22 13:50             ` Andrey Ryabinin
2018-02-22 13:50               ` Andrey Ryabinin
2018-02-22 14:09               ` Michal Hocko
2018-02-22 14:09                 ` Michal Hocko
2018-02-22 15:13                 ` Andrey Ryabinin
2018-02-22 15:13                   ` Andrey Ryabinin
2018-02-22 15:33                   ` Michal Hocko
2018-02-22 15:33                     ` Michal Hocko
2018-02-22 15:38                     ` Andrey Ryabinin
2018-02-22 15:38                       ` Andrey Ryabinin
2018-02-22 15:44                       ` Michal Hocko
2018-02-22 15:44                         ` Michal Hocko
2018-02-22 16:01                         ` Andrey Ryabinin
2018-02-22 16:01                           ` Andrey Ryabinin
2018-02-22 16:30                           ` Michal Hocko
2018-02-22 16:30                             ` Michal Hocko
2018-01-19 13:32   ` [PATCH v5 1/2] mm/memcontrol.c: try harder to decrease [memory,memsw].limit_in_bytes Michal Hocko
2018-01-19 13:32     ` Michal Hocko
2018-01-19 13:32     ` Michal Hocko
2018-01-25 19:44   ` Andrey Ryabinin
2018-01-25 19:44     ` Andrey Ryabinin

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