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From: Gene Heskett <gene.heskett@verizon.net>
To: linux-kernel@vger.kernel.org
Cc: Lee Revell <rlrevell@joe-job.com>, Neil Brown <neilb@suse.de>,
	Michiel de Boer <x@rebelhomicide.demon.nl>,
	James Bottomley <James.Bottomley@steeleye.com>
Subject: Re: GPLv3 Position Statement
Date: Mon, 25 Sep 2006 16:58:07 -0400	[thread overview]
Message-ID: <200609251658.08058.gene.heskett@verizon.net> (raw)
In-Reply-To: <1159194447.2899.66.camel@mindpipe>

On Monday 25 September 2006 10:27, Lee Revell wrote:
>On Mon, 2006-09-25 at 20:51 +1000, Neil Brown wrote:
>> Tolerance of binary blogs seems to be steadily dropping.
>>
>> As far as I can tell, the DVD-CSS is purely a legal issue today - the
>> technical issues are solved (I can watch any-region on my Linux
>> computer, and in Australia, the law requires that all DVD players must
>> ignore region encoding as it is an anti-competitive practice).

I suspect thats history now, with the DMCA proposals now being voted on 
there.

>Tolerance by who?  As far as I can tell tolerance for binary blobs by
>the typical Linux desktop user is higher than ever.

Generaly speaking, from someone way up in the top level of the bleacher 
seats here, thats true, as for instance the ndiswrapper scenario, required 
by the rules of the various radio spectrum regulating agencies around the 
planet.  They would never, ever, give approval to a driver that was 100% 
open source because of the ease with which the open source coder could 
make them illegal, either for frequencies used, or for the Transmitter 
Power Output one of these software radios COULD be made to do.

>They consider it a 
>bug if their distro does not automagically install the nvidia/ATI
>drivers, and immediately write you off as a GPL zealot if you even
>mention that a tainted kernel cannot be debugged.

No, I do not, and never have said too much about it (as if anyone would 
listen to me anyway) unless I was pissed because the kernels available 
driver was obviously broken and caused crashes etc.  We DO understand, 
very well, that troubleshooting a problem just isn't possible when the 
srcs are not available, meaning there is no way in hell you can certify 
that the tainting driver didn't scribble all over memory it has no 
business scribbling into.

Begin rant:

Yeah, we'ed be fools to say we don't have a political agenda when we're 
forced to use substandard or questionably legal means for reasons related 
to the above.  But give us credit for understanding the reasons.  What we, 
the users, need in many cases, is a contact address to address our vents 
to, for instance for someone at broadcom, high enough to have meaningfull 
input to the discussions in the board room, that we could mail-bomb with 
requests for better support.  If 3000+ people who bought their stuff with 
some well known makers label on it, like HP, and found they couldn't use 
that builtin radio and do it 100% legal and compatibly, would email (and 
Cc: your countries regulatory agency too) that chip maker and gently but 
firmly bitch, that bit of 'politics' might well bring about some 
constructive change in broadcoms (and the regulatory agencies involved) 
attitude vis-a-vis specs release so better drivers could be written.

End rant.

-- 
Cheers, Gene
"There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty:
 soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order."
-Ed Howdershelt (Author)
Yahoo.com and AOL/TW attorneys please note, additions to the above
message by Gene Heskett are:
Copyright 2006 by Maurice Eugene Heskett, all rights reserved.

  parent reply	other threads:[~2006-09-25 21:05 UTC|newest]

Thread overview: 235+ messages / expand[flat|nested]  mbox.gz  Atom feed  top
2006-09-22 16:15 GPLv3 Position Statement James Bottomley
2006-09-22 16:16 ` James Bottomley
2006-09-22 17:49 ` The GPL: No shelter for the Linux kernel? Adrian Bunk
2006-09-22 18:00   ` Greg KH
2006-09-22 18:01   ` Manu Abraham
2006-09-22 20:04   ` David Schwartz
2006-09-22 21:25     ` Linus Torvalds
2006-09-22 21:44     ` Linus Torvalds
2006-09-23  0:11       ` David Schwartz
2006-09-23  1:36         ` Linus Torvalds
2006-09-23  7:28         ` Paul Jackson
2006-09-23  8:05       ` Manu Abraham
2006-09-23 15:32       ` Oleg Verych
     [not found]         ` <Pine.LNX.4.64.0609230941530.4388@g5.osdl.org>
2006-09-23 21:04           ` Forwarded message from Linus Torvalds <torvalds@osdl.org> Oleg Verych
2006-09-27  1:19             ` The GPL: No shelter for the Linux kernel? Oleg Verych
2006-09-23  8:10     ` Jan Engelhardt
2006-09-23 17:38       ` David Schwartz
2006-09-23 18:00       ` Linus Torvalds
2006-09-23 18:14         ` Petr Baudis
2006-09-24  7:53           ` Jan Engelhardt
2006-09-24 16:34             ` Linus Torvalds
2006-09-25  5:59               ` Jan Engelhardt
2006-09-25 15:14                 ` Linus Torvalds
     [not found] ` <200609221359.39519.gene.heskett@verizon.net>
2006-09-22 18:08   ` GPLv3 Position Statement James Bottomley
2006-09-22 18:30     ` Gene Heskett
2006-09-22 18:34       ` Jeff Garzik
2006-09-22 18:52         ` Gene Heskett
2006-09-22 19:05       ` Alan Cox
2006-09-22 18:54         ` Gene Heskett
2006-09-25  6:33       ` Marc Perkel
2006-09-22 20:42 ` Jeff Garzik
2006-09-23 11:38 ` Florian Weimer
2006-09-25  2:44 ` An Ode to GPLv2 (was Re: GPLv3 Position Statement) Linus Torvalds
2006-09-25  4:40   ` Willy Tarreau
2006-09-25 12:00     ` Arjan van de Ven
2006-09-25 13:07       ` Willy Tarreau
2006-09-28  0:12         ` H. Peter Anvin
2006-09-25  8:53 ` GPLv3 Position Statement Michiel de Boer
2006-09-25  9:06   ` Russell King
2006-09-25 10:51   ` Neil Brown
2006-09-25 11:31     ` Alan Cox
2006-09-25 16:10       ` Thomas Gleixner
2006-09-29 10:15         ` Helge Hafting
2006-09-29 11:07           ` Alan Cox
2006-09-29 14:02           ` Stephen Clark
2006-09-29 16:51           ` Linus Torvalds
2006-09-29 17:47             ` Alan Cox
2006-09-29 17:49               ` Linus Torvalds
2006-09-29 18:17                 ` Linus Torvalds
2006-09-29 18:26                 ` Alan Cox
2006-09-29 18:27                   ` Linus Torvalds
2006-09-29 18:40                     ` Linus Torvalds
2006-09-29 19:59                       ` alan
2006-09-29 20:06                         ` Linus Torvalds
2006-09-29 20:21                           ` alan
2006-09-29 20:32                             ` alan
2006-09-29 23:12                               ` Gene Heskett
2006-09-29 23:25                                 ` Randy Dunlap
2006-09-29 23:53                                   ` Gene Heskett
2006-09-30  0:31                                     ` Vadim Lobanov
2006-09-30  3:36                                       ` Gene Heskett
2006-09-30  4:37                                         ` Vadim Lobanov
2006-09-30  4:54                                           ` Randy Dunlap
2006-09-30  6:10                                             ` Vadim Lobanov
2006-09-29 21:11                             ` Chris Smith
2006-09-29 21:33                               ` alan
2006-09-29 20:51                           ` alan
2006-09-29 21:25                       ` Theodore Tso
2006-09-29 21:29                       ` Alan Cox
2006-10-02  8:46             ` Helge Hafting
2006-09-29 19:43           ` jdow
2006-09-30 18:38           ` Thomas Gleixner
2006-09-30 20:49             ` Alan Cox
2006-09-30 20:38               ` Thomas Gleixner
2006-09-25 14:27     ` Lee Revell
2006-09-25 19:05       ` Jan Engelhardt
2006-09-25 20:58       ` Gene Heskett [this message]
2006-09-25 22:10         ` linux-os (Dick Johnson)
2006-09-26 21:32       ` Oleg Verych
2006-09-25 19:46     ` Jeff Garzik
2006-09-25 21:10       ` Gene Heskett
2006-09-25 11:11   ` Jan Engelhardt
2006-09-25 14:12   ` James Bottomley
2006-09-25 16:50   ` Linus Torvalds
2006-09-25 17:26   ` James Bottomley
2006-09-25 15:30 ` Xavier Bestel
2006-09-27  1:11 ` Sergey Panov
2006-09-27  5:55   ` Jan Engelhardt
2006-09-27  7:36     ` Sergey Panov
2006-09-27  8:58       ` Jan Engelhardt
2006-09-27 12:19         ` Alan Cox
2006-09-27 17:28           ` Linus Torvalds
2006-09-27 18:37             ` Chase Venters
2006-09-27 19:11               ` Linus Torvalds
2006-09-29 12:42                 ` Pavel Machek
2006-09-27 22:58               ` Theodore Tso
2006-09-27 23:16                 ` Chase Venters
2006-09-28  0:03                   ` Neil Brown
2006-09-28  0:08                     ` David Miller
2006-09-28  0:18                   ` Linus Torvalds
2006-09-28  0:54                     ` Patrick McFarland
2006-09-28  3:15                       ` Linus Torvalds
2006-09-28  3:47                         ` Sergey Panov
2006-09-28  4:13                           ` Linus Torvalds
2006-09-28  5:05                             ` Sergey Panov
2006-09-28  4:39                           ` Chase Venters
2006-09-28  5:13                             ` Trond Myklebust
2006-09-28  5:15                             ` Jeff Garzik
2006-09-28  5:27                               ` Sergey Panov
2006-09-28  5:34                                 ` Jeff Garzik
2006-09-28  7:30                                 ` Al Viro
2006-09-28 13:55                             ` Lennart Sorensen
2006-09-28 14:19                               ` DervishD
2006-09-28 14:40                                 ` Jörn Engel
2006-09-28 14:59                                   ` DervishD
2006-09-28 15:04                                   ` Linus Torvalds
2006-09-28 15:20                                     ` Jörn Engel
2006-09-28 15:31                                       ` Linus Torvalds
2006-09-28 15:46                                       ` Björn Steinbrink
2006-09-28 15:24                                     ` Linus Torvalds
2006-09-29  0:26                                       ` Neil Brown
2006-09-29  6:22                                         ` Linus Torvalds
2006-09-29  1:34                                     ` jdow
2006-09-29  6:08                                     ` Jan Engelhardt
2006-09-29  7:07                                       ` Linus Torvalds
2006-09-29  7:18                                       ` David Schwartz
2006-09-29  2:29                                   ` David Schwartz
2006-09-29  2:45                                     ` Neil Brown
2006-09-29  3:05                                       ` Björn Steinbrink
2006-09-29  3:31                                         ` David Schwartz
2006-09-29  5:37                                           ` Björn Steinbrink
2006-09-29  7:18                                       ` David Schwartz
     [not found]                                     ` <20060928225008.ded4fa2c.seanlkml@sympatico.ca>
2006-09-29  2:50                                       ` Sean
2006-09-29  7:18                                         ` David Schwartz
2006-10-02  8:55                                         ` Maybe it's time to fork the GPL License - create the Linux license? Marc Perkel
2006-10-02  9:14                                           ` Jesper Juhl
2006-10-02  9:23                                             ` Marc Perkel
2006-10-03 10:31                                             ` Jan Engelhardt
2006-10-03 15:34                                               ` Marc Perkel
2006-10-02  9:18                                           ` Dumitru Ciobarcianu
2006-10-02  9:25                                           ` Patrick McFarland
2006-10-02 18:26                                             ` James Dickens
2006-10-03 20:59                                           ` Ivan Dimitrov
2006-10-03 21:00                                             ` Chase Venters
2006-10-03 21:17                                             ` It's not GNU/Linux - it's jusy LINUX Marc Perkel
2006-10-03 21:41                                               ` Neil Brown
2006-10-04 20:09                                                 ` Jan Engelhardt
2006-10-04 20:53                                                   ` linux-os (Dick Johnson)
2006-10-03 21:41                                               ` Adam Henley
2006-10-03 21:47                                                 ` Marc Perkel
2006-10-03 21:58                                                   ` Chase Venters
2006-10-03 22:00                                                   ` Hua Zhong
2006-10-04  1:17                                                     ` Patrick Draper
2006-10-04  2:06                                                       ` Patrick McFarland
2006-10-04 15:16                                                         ` Patrick Draper
2006-10-03 22:10                                                   ` M4y3c0
2006-10-03 22:02                                           ` Maybe it's time to fork the GPL License - create the Linux license? Daniel Barkalow
2006-09-28 14:51                                 ` GPLv3 Position Statement Simon Oosthoek
2006-09-28 15:07                                   ` DervishD
2006-09-28 15:38                               ` Linus Torvalds
2006-09-28 18:34                             ` Linus Torvalds
2006-09-28 17:16                         ` linux-os (Dick Johnson)
2006-09-28 18:59                           ` Segher Boessenkool
2006-09-28 19:34                             ` linux-os (Dick Johnson)
2006-09-28 20:01                               ` Oleg Verych
2006-09-28 23:12                                 ` Gene Heskett
2006-09-29  8:04                           ` Jan Engelhardt
2006-09-28  1:35                     ` Al Viro
2006-09-28  3:13                       ` Sergey Panov
2006-09-28  3:36                         ` Linus Torvalds
2006-09-28  1:53                     ` Alan Cox
2006-09-28  9:41                     ` Jörn Engel
2006-09-28  9:55                       ` Jeff Garzik
2006-09-28 14:45                         ` Linus Torvalds
2006-09-28 15:19                           ` Alan Cox
2006-09-28 14:40                       ` Linus Torvalds
2006-09-28  2:34                   ` Gene Heskett
2006-09-28  8:04             ` Jan Engelhardt
2006-09-28 13:50               ` Christer Weinigel
2006-09-28 20:43               ` Linus Torvalds
2006-09-27 18:01         ` Theodore Tso
2006-09-27 12:32     ` Theodore Tso
2006-09-27 21:05       ` David Schwartz
2006-09-29 12:47       ` Pavel Machek
2006-09-27 17:00     ` Linus Torvalds
2006-09-28  8:18       ` Jan Engelhardt
2006-09-28  9:39       ` Samuel Tardieu
2006-09-27 16:08   ` Greg KH
2006-09-25 10:02 tridge
2006-09-27  9:43 Nicolas Mailhot
2006-09-27 17:51 ` Linus Torvalds
2006-09-27 20:34   ` Krzysztof Halasa
2006-09-27 20:41     ` Linus Torvalds
2006-09-27 21:01       ` Krzysztof Halasa
2006-09-27 23:01       ` Alan Cox
2006-09-27 23:04         ` Linus Torvalds
2006-09-27 23:07         ` Thomas Gleixner
2006-09-28  7:36         ` Andi Kleen
2006-09-29  3:01 James Bottomley
2006-09-29  4:40 ` Neil Brown
2006-09-29  6:56   ` James Bottomley
2006-09-29  7:48     ` tridge
2006-09-29  9:37       ` David Schwartz
2006-09-29 10:08       ` Samuel Tardieu
2006-09-29 12:59       ` Alan Cox
2006-09-29 14:36       ` Linus Torvalds
2006-09-30 15:32       ` Andrea Arcangeli
2006-09-30 16:59         ` Linus Torvalds
2006-09-30 22:16         ` tridge
2006-09-29 11:59     ` Sanjoy Mahajan
2006-09-29 14:54     ` Horst H. von Brand
2006-09-29 21:46       ` tridge
     [not found]         ` <20060929180323.d2c0d2ee.seanlkml@sympatico.ca>
2006-09-29 22:03           ` Sean
2006-09-29 22:20         ` Jeff Garzik
2006-09-29  5:51 ` tridge
2006-09-29  7:31   ` James Bottomley
2006-09-29 12:08     ` Sanjoy Mahajan
2006-09-29 20:50       ` James Bottomley
2006-09-29  7:31   ` James Bottomley
2006-09-29  8:09     ` tridge
2006-09-29 20:28       ` James Bottomley
2006-09-29  8:53     ` tridge
2006-09-29  9:37       ` Jeff Garzik
2006-09-29  9:52         ` tridge
2006-09-30  0:56           ` James Bottomley
2006-09-29 19:50       ` James Bottomley
2006-09-30  7:05         ` tridge
2006-09-30 15:06           ` James Bottomley
2006-10-01  6:28             ` tridge
2006-10-01 15:45               ` James Bottomley
2006-10-01 16:48                 ` Valdis.Kletnieks
2006-09-30 21:11         ` David Lang
2006-09-30 22:29           ` Michiel de Boer
2006-10-01  6:52           ` tridge
2006-09-29  7:32   ` David Woodhouse

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