From: Jason Gunthorpe <jgg@nvidia.com> To: "Tian, Kevin" <kevin.tian@intel.com> Cc: Alex Williamson <alex.williamson@redhat.com>, Jean-Philippe Brucker <jean-philippe@linaro.org>, "Jiang, Dave" <dave.jiang@intel.com>, "Raj, Ashok" <ashok.raj@intel.com>, "kvm@vger.kernel.org" <kvm@vger.kernel.org>, Jonathan Corbet <corbet@lwn.net>, Robin Murphy <robin.murphy@arm.com>, LKML <linux-kernel@vger.kernel.org>, "iommu@lists.linux-foundation.org" <iommu@lists.linux-foundation.org>, David Gibson <david@gibson.dropbear.id.au>, Kirti Wankhede <kwankhede@nvidia.com>, David Woodhouse <dwmw2@infradead.org>, Jason Wang <jasowang@redhat.com> Subject: Re: [RFC] /dev/ioasid uAPI proposal Date: Fri, 4 Jun 2021 09:28:30 -0300 [thread overview] Message-ID: <20210604122830.GK1002214@nvidia.com> (raw) In-Reply-To: <MWHPR11MB1886469C0136C6523AB158B68C3B9@MWHPR11MB1886.namprd11.prod.outlook.com> On Fri, Jun 04, 2021 at 08:38:26AM +0000, Tian, Kevin wrote: > > I think more to drive the replacement design; if we can't figure out > > how to do something other than backwards compatibility trickery in the > > kernel, it's probably going to bite us. Thanks, > > I'm a bit lost on the desired flow in your minds. Here is one flow based > on my understanding of this discussion. Please comment whether it > matches your thinking: > > 0) ioasid_fd is created and registered to KVM via KVM_ADD_IOASID_FD; > > 1) Qemu binds dev1 to ioasid_fd; > > 2) Qemu calls IOASID_GET_DEV_INFO for dev1. This will carry IOMMU_ > CACHE info i.e. whether underlying IOMMU can enforce snoop; > > 3) Qemu plans to create a gpa_ioasid, and attach dev1 to it. Here Qemu > needs to figure out whether dev1 wants to do no-snoop. This might > be based a fixed vendor/class list or specified by user; > > 4) gpa_ioasid = ioctl(ioasid_fd, IOASID_ALLOC); At this point a 'snoop' > flag is specified to decide the page table format, which is supposed > to match dev1; > 5) Qemu attaches dev1 to gpa_ioasid via VFIO_ATTACH_IOASID. At this > point, specify snoop/no-snoop again. If not supported by related > iommu or different from what gpa_ioasid has, attach fails. Why do we need to specify it again? If the IOASID was created with the "block no-snoop" flag then it is blocked in that IOASID, and that blocking sets the page table format. The only question is if we can successfully attach a device to the page table, or not. The KVM interface is a bit tricky because Alex said this is partially security, wbinvd is only enabled if someone has a FD to a device that can support no-snoop. Personally I think this got way too complicated, the KVM interface should simply be ioctl(KVM_ALLOW_INCOHERENT_DMA, ioasidfd, device_label) ioctl(KVM_DISALLOW_INCOHERENT_DMA, ioasidfd, device_label) and let qemu sort it out based on command flags, detection, whatever. 'ioasidfd, device_label' is the security proof that Alex asked for. This needs to be some device in the ioasidfd that declares it is capabale of no-snoop. Eg vfio_pci would always declare it is capable of no-snoop. No kernel call backs, no kernel auto-sync/etc. If qemu mismatches the IOASID block no-snoop flag with the KVM_x_INCOHERENT_DMA state then it is just a kernel-harmless uerspace bug. Then user space can decide which of the various axis's it wants to optimize for. Jason
WARNING: multiple messages have this Message-ID (diff)
From: Jason Gunthorpe <jgg@nvidia.com> To: "Tian, Kevin" <kevin.tian@intel.com> Cc: Jean-Philippe Brucker <jean-philippe@linaro.org>, "Jiang, Dave" <dave.jiang@intel.com>, "Raj, Ashok" <ashok.raj@intel.com>, "kvm@vger.kernel.org" <kvm@vger.kernel.org>, Jonathan Corbet <corbet@lwn.net>, David Woodhouse <dwmw2@infradead.org>, Jason Wang <jasowang@redhat.com>, LKML <linux-kernel@vger.kernel.org>, "iommu@lists.linux-foundation.org" <iommu@lists.linux-foundation.org>, Alex Williamson <alex.williamson@redhat.com>, Kirti Wankhede <kwankhede@nvidia.com>, Robin Murphy <robin.murphy@arm.com>, David Gibson <david@gibson.dropbear.id.au> Subject: Re: [RFC] /dev/ioasid uAPI proposal Date: Fri, 4 Jun 2021 09:28:30 -0300 [thread overview] Message-ID: <20210604122830.GK1002214@nvidia.com> (raw) In-Reply-To: <MWHPR11MB1886469C0136C6523AB158B68C3B9@MWHPR11MB1886.namprd11.prod.outlook.com> On Fri, Jun 04, 2021 at 08:38:26AM +0000, Tian, Kevin wrote: > > I think more to drive the replacement design; if we can't figure out > > how to do something other than backwards compatibility trickery in the > > kernel, it's probably going to bite us. Thanks, > > I'm a bit lost on the desired flow in your minds. Here is one flow based > on my understanding of this discussion. Please comment whether it > matches your thinking: > > 0) ioasid_fd is created and registered to KVM via KVM_ADD_IOASID_FD; > > 1) Qemu binds dev1 to ioasid_fd; > > 2) Qemu calls IOASID_GET_DEV_INFO for dev1. This will carry IOMMU_ > CACHE info i.e. whether underlying IOMMU can enforce snoop; > > 3) Qemu plans to create a gpa_ioasid, and attach dev1 to it. Here Qemu > needs to figure out whether dev1 wants to do no-snoop. This might > be based a fixed vendor/class list or specified by user; > > 4) gpa_ioasid = ioctl(ioasid_fd, IOASID_ALLOC); At this point a 'snoop' > flag is specified to decide the page table format, which is supposed > to match dev1; > 5) Qemu attaches dev1 to gpa_ioasid via VFIO_ATTACH_IOASID. At this > point, specify snoop/no-snoop again. If not supported by related > iommu or different from what gpa_ioasid has, attach fails. Why do we need to specify it again? If the IOASID was created with the "block no-snoop" flag then it is blocked in that IOASID, and that blocking sets the page table format. The only question is if we can successfully attach a device to the page table, or not. The KVM interface is a bit tricky because Alex said this is partially security, wbinvd is only enabled if someone has a FD to a device that can support no-snoop. Personally I think this got way too complicated, the KVM interface should simply be ioctl(KVM_ALLOW_INCOHERENT_DMA, ioasidfd, device_label) ioctl(KVM_DISALLOW_INCOHERENT_DMA, ioasidfd, device_label) and let qemu sort it out based on command flags, detection, whatever. 'ioasidfd, device_label' is the security proof that Alex asked for. This needs to be some device in the ioasidfd that declares it is capabale of no-snoop. Eg vfio_pci would always declare it is capable of no-snoop. No kernel call backs, no kernel auto-sync/etc. If qemu mismatches the IOASID block no-snoop flag with the KVM_x_INCOHERENT_DMA state then it is just a kernel-harmless uerspace bug. Then user space can decide which of the various axis's it wants to optimize for. Jason _______________________________________________ iommu mailing list iommu@lists.linux-foundation.org https://lists.linuxfoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/iommu
next prev parent reply other threads:[~2021-06-04 12:28 UTC|newest] Thread overview: 518+ messages / expand[flat|nested] mbox.gz Atom feed top 2021-05-27 7:58 [RFC] /dev/ioasid uAPI proposal Tian, Kevin 2021-05-27 7:58 ` Tian, Kevin 2021-05-28 2:24 ` Jason Wang 2021-05-28 2:24 ` Jason Wang 2021-05-28 20:25 ` Jason Gunthorpe 2021-05-28 20:25 ` Jason Gunthorpe 2021-05-31 8:41 ` Liu Yi L 2021-06-01 2:36 ` Jason Wang 2021-06-01 2:36 ` Jason Wang 2021-06-01 3:31 ` Liu Yi L 2021-06-01 5:08 ` Jason Wang 2021-06-01 5:08 ` Jason Wang 2021-06-01 5:23 ` Lu Baolu 2021-06-01 5:23 ` Lu Baolu 2021-06-01 5:29 ` Jason Wang 2021-06-01 5:29 ` Jason Wang 2021-06-01 5:42 ` Tian, Kevin 2021-06-01 5:42 ` Tian, Kevin 2021-06-01 6:07 ` Jason Wang 2021-06-01 6:07 ` Jason Wang 2021-06-01 6:16 ` Tian, Kevin 2021-06-01 6:16 ` Tian, Kevin 2021-06-01 8:47 ` Jason Wang 2021-06-01 8:47 ` Jason Wang 2021-06-01 17:31 ` Jason Gunthorpe 2021-06-01 17:31 ` Jason Gunthorpe 2021-06-02 8:54 ` Jason Wang 2021-06-02 8:54 ` Jason Wang 2021-06-02 17:21 ` Jason Gunthorpe 2021-06-02 17:21 ` Jason Gunthorpe 2021-06-07 13:30 ` Enrico Weigelt, metux IT consult 2021-06-07 13:30 ` Enrico Weigelt, metux IT consult 2021-06-07 18:01 ` Jason Gunthorpe 2021-06-07 18:01 ` Jason Gunthorpe 2021-06-08 10:45 ` Enrico Weigelt, metux IT consult 2021-06-08 10:45 ` Enrico Weigelt, metux IT consult 2021-06-10 2:16 ` Jason Wang 2021-06-10 2:16 ` Jason Wang 2021-06-08 1:10 ` Jason Wang 2021-06-08 1:10 ` Jason Wang 2021-06-08 13:20 ` Jason Gunthorpe 2021-06-08 13:20 ` Jason Gunthorpe 2021-06-10 2:00 ` Jason Wang 2021-06-10 2:00 ` Jason Wang 2021-06-10 4:03 ` Jason Wang 2021-06-10 4:03 ` Jason Wang 2021-06-10 11:47 ` Jason Gunthorpe 2021-06-10 11:47 ` Jason Gunthorpe 2021-06-11 5:43 ` Jason Wang 2021-06-11 5:43 ` Jason Wang 2021-06-01 17:29 ` Jason Gunthorpe 2021-06-01 17:29 ` Jason Gunthorpe 2021-06-02 8:58 ` Jason Wang 2021-06-02 8:58 ` Jason Wang 2021-06-01 4:27 ` Shenming Lu 2021-06-01 4:27 ` Shenming Lu 2021-06-01 5:10 ` Jason Wang 2021-06-01 5:10 ` Jason Wang 2021-05-28 16:23 ` Jean-Philippe Brucker 2021-05-28 16:23 ` Jean-Philippe Brucker 2021-05-28 20:16 ` Jason Gunthorpe 2021-05-28 20:16 ` Jason Gunthorpe 2021-06-01 7:50 ` Tian, Kevin 2021-06-01 7:50 ` Tian, Kevin 2021-05-28 17:35 ` Jason Gunthorpe 2021-05-28 17:35 ` Jason Gunthorpe 2021-06-01 8:10 ` Tian, Kevin 2021-06-01 8:10 ` Tian, Kevin 2021-06-01 17:42 ` Jason Gunthorpe 2021-06-01 17:42 ` Jason Gunthorpe 2021-06-02 1:33 ` Tian, Kevin 2021-06-02 1:33 ` Tian, Kevin 2021-06-02 16:09 ` Jason Gunthorpe 2021-06-02 16:09 ` Jason Gunthorpe 2021-06-03 1:29 ` Tian, Kevin 2021-06-03 1:29 ` Tian, Kevin 2021-06-03 5:09 ` David Gibson 2021-06-03 5:09 ` David Gibson 2021-06-03 6:49 ` Tian, Kevin 2021-06-03 6:49 ` Tian, Kevin 2021-06-03 11:47 ` Jason Gunthorpe 2021-06-03 11:47 ` Jason Gunthorpe 2021-06-04 2:15 ` Tian, Kevin 2021-06-04 2:15 ` Tian, Kevin 2021-06-08 0:49 ` David Gibson 2021-06-08 0:49 ` David Gibson 2021-06-09 2:52 ` Tian, Kevin 2021-06-09 2:52 ` Tian, Kevin 2021-06-02 6:32 ` David Gibson 2021-06-02 6:32 ` David Gibson 2021-06-02 16:16 ` Jason Gunthorpe 2021-06-02 16:16 ` Jason Gunthorpe 2021-06-03 2:11 ` Tian, Kevin 2021-06-03 2:11 ` Tian, Kevin 2021-06-03 5:13 ` David Gibson 2021-06-03 5:13 ` David Gibson 2021-06-03 11:52 ` Jason Gunthorpe 2021-06-03 11:52 ` Jason Gunthorpe 2021-06-08 0:53 ` David Gibson 2021-06-08 0:53 ` David Gibson 2021-06-08 19:04 ` Jason Gunthorpe 2021-06-08 19:04 ` Jason Gunthorpe 2021-06-17 2:42 ` David Gibson 2021-06-17 2:42 ` David Gibson 2021-05-28 19:58 ` Jason Gunthorpe 2021-05-28 19:58 ` Jason Gunthorpe 2021-06-01 8:38 ` Tian, Kevin 2021-06-01 8:38 ` Tian, Kevin 2021-06-01 17:56 ` Jason Gunthorpe 2021-06-01 17:56 ` Jason Gunthorpe 2021-06-02 2:00 ` Tian, Kevin 2021-06-02 2:00 ` Tian, Kevin 2021-06-02 6:57 ` David Gibson 2021-06-02 6:57 ` David Gibson 2021-06-02 16:37 ` Jason Gunthorpe 2021-06-02 16:37 ` Jason Gunthorpe 2021-06-03 5:23 ` David Gibson 2021-06-03 5:23 ` David Gibson 2021-06-03 12:28 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2021-06-01 17:26 ` Jason Gunthorpe 2021-06-02 4:01 ` Lu Baolu 2021-06-02 4:01 ` Lu Baolu 2021-06-02 23:23 ` Jason Gunthorpe 2021-06-02 23:23 ` Jason Gunthorpe 2021-06-03 5:49 ` Lu Baolu 2021-06-03 5:49 ` Lu Baolu 2021-06-03 5:54 ` David Gibson 2021-06-03 5:54 ` David Gibson 2021-06-03 6:50 ` Lu Baolu 2021-06-03 6:50 ` Lu Baolu 2021-06-03 12:56 ` Jason Gunthorpe 2021-06-03 12:56 ` Jason Gunthorpe 2021-06-02 7:22 ` David Gibson 2021-06-02 7:22 ` David Gibson 2021-06-03 6:39 ` Tian, Kevin 2021-06-03 6:39 ` Tian, Kevin 2021-06-03 13:05 ` Jason Gunthorpe 2021-06-03 13:05 ` Jason Gunthorpe 2021-06-04 6:37 ` Tian, Kevin 2021-06-04 6:37 ` Tian, Kevin 2021-06-04 12:09 ` Jason Gunthorpe 2021-06-04 12:09 ` Jason Gunthorpe 2021-06-04 23:10 ` Tian, Kevin 2021-06-04 23:10 ` Tian, Kevin 2021-06-07 17:54 ` Jason Gunthorpe 2021-06-07 17:54 ` Jason Gunthorpe 2021-06-15 8:59 ` Tian, Kevin 2021-06-15 8:59 ` Tian, Kevin 2021-06-15 15:06 ` Jason Gunthorpe 2021-06-15 15:06 ` Jason Gunthorpe 2021-06-15 22:59 ` Tian, Kevin 2021-06-15 22:59 ` Tian, Kevin 2021-06-15 23:02 ` Jason Gunthorpe 2021-06-15 23:02 ` Jason Gunthorpe 2021-06-15 23:09 ` Tian, Kevin 2021-06-15 23:09 ` Tian, Kevin 2021-06-15 23:40 ` Jason Gunthorpe 2021-06-15 23:40 ` Jason Gunthorpe 2021-06-15 23:56 ` Tian, Kevin 2021-06-15 23:56 ` Tian, Kevin 2021-06-15 23:59 ` Jason Gunthorpe 2021-06-15 23:59 ` Jason Gunthorpe 2021-06-16 0:02 ` Tian, Kevin 2021-06-16 0:02 ` Tian, Kevin 2021-05-31 17:37 ` Parav Pandit 2021-05-31 17:37 ` Parav Pandit 2021-05-31 18:12 ` Jason Gunthorpe 2021-05-31 18:12 ` Jason Gunthorpe 2021-06-01 12:04 ` Parav Pandit 2021-06-01 12:04 ` Parav Pandit 2021-06-01 17:36 ` Jason Gunthorpe 2021-06-01 17:36 ` Jason Gunthorpe 2021-06-02 8:38 ` Enrico Weigelt, metux IT consult 2021-06-02 8:38 ` Enrico Weigelt, metux IT consult 2021-06-02 12:41 ` Parav Pandit 2021-06-02 12:41 ` Parav Pandit 2021-06-01 4:31 ` Shenming Lu 2021-06-01 4:31 ` Shenming Lu 2021-06-01 5:10 ` Lu Baolu 2021-06-01 5:10 ` Lu Baolu 2021-06-01 7:15 ` Shenming Lu 2021-06-01 7:15 ` Shenming Lu 2021-06-01 12:30 ` Lu Baolu 2021-06-01 12:30 ` Lu Baolu 2021-06-01 13:10 ` Shenming Lu 2021-06-01 13:10 ` Shenming Lu 2021-06-01 17:33 ` Jason Gunthorpe 2021-06-01 17:33 ` Jason Gunthorpe 2021-06-02 4:50 ` Shenming Lu 2021-06-02 4:50 ` Shenming Lu 2021-06-03 18:19 ` Jacob Pan 2021-06-03 18:19 ` Jacob Pan 2021-06-04 1:30 ` Jason Wang 2021-06-04 1:30 ` Jason Wang 2021-06-04 16:22 ` Jacob Pan 2021-06-04 16:22 ` Jacob Pan 2021-06-04 16:22 ` Jason Gunthorpe 2021-06-04 16:22 ` Jason Gunthorpe 2021-06-04 18:05 ` Jacob Pan 2021-06-04 18:05 ` Jacob Pan 2021-06-04 2:03 ` Shenming Lu 2021-06-04 2:03 ` Shenming Lu 2021-06-07 12:19 ` Liu, Yi L 2021-06-07 12:19 ` Liu, Yi L 2021-06-08 1:09 ` Shenming Lu 2021-06-08 1:09 ` Shenming Lu 2021-06-01 17:30 ` Parav Pandit 2021-06-01 17:30 ` Parav Pandit 2021-06-03 20:58 ` Jacob Pan 2021-06-03 20:58 ` Jacob Pan 2021-06-08 6:30 ` Parav Pandit 2021-06-08 6:30 ` Parav Pandit 2021-06-02 6:15 ` David Gibson 2021-06-02 6:15 ` David Gibson 2021-06-02 17:19 ` Jason Gunthorpe 2021-06-02 17:19 ` Jason Gunthorpe 2021-06-03 3:02 ` Tian, Kevin 2021-06-03 3:02 ` Tian, Kevin 2021-06-03 6:26 ` David Gibson 2021-06-03 6:26 ` David Gibson 2021-06-03 12:46 ` Jason Gunthorpe 2021-06-03 12:46 ` Jason Gunthorpe 2021-06-04 6:27 ` Tian, Kevin 2021-06-04 6:27 ` Tian, Kevin 2021-06-03 7:17 ` Tian, Kevin 2021-06-03 7:17 ` Tian, Kevin 2021-06-03 12:49 ` Jason Gunthorpe 2021-06-03 12:49 ` Jason Gunthorpe 2021-06-08 5:49 ` David Gibson 2021-06-08 5:49 ` David Gibson 2021-06-03 8:12 ` Tian, Kevin 2021-06-03 8:12 ` Tian, Kevin 2021-06-17 4:07 ` David Gibson 2021-06-17 4:07 ` David Gibson 2021-06-23 8:00 ` Tian, Kevin 2021-06-23 8:00 ` Tian, Kevin 2021-06-24 3:55 ` David Gibson 2021-06-24 3:55 ` David Gibson 2021-06-02 8:56 ` Enrico Weigelt, metux IT consult 2021-06-02 8:56 ` Enrico Weigelt, metux IT consult 2021-06-02 17:24 ` Jason Gunthorpe 2021-06-02 17:24 ` Jason Gunthorpe 2021-06-04 10:44 ` Enrico Weigelt, metux IT consult 2021-06-04 10:44 ` Enrico Weigelt, metux IT consult 2021-06-04 12:30 ` Jason Gunthorpe 2021-06-04 12:30 ` Jason Gunthorpe 2021-06-08 1:15 ` David Gibson 2021-06-08 1:15 ` David Gibson 2021-06-08 10:43 ` Enrico Weigelt, metux IT consult 2021-06-08 10:43 ` Enrico Weigelt, metux IT consult 2021-06-08 13:11 ` Jason Gunthorpe 2021-06-08 13:11 ` Jason Gunthorpe
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