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From: ebiederm-aS9lmoZGLiVWk0Htik3J/w@public.gmane.org (Eric W. Biederman)
To: "Michael Kerrisk (man-pages)"
	<mtk.manpages-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w@public.gmane.org>
Cc: Serge Hallyn
	<serge.hallyn-Z7WLFzj8eWMS+FvcfC7Uqw@public.gmane.org>,
	Andrew Vagin <avagin-5HdwGun5lf+gSpxsJD1C4w@public.gmane.org>,
	Linux API <linux-api-u79uwXL29TY76Z2rM5mHXA@public.gmane.org>,
	Linux Containers
	<containers-cunTk1MwBs9QetFLy7KEm3xJsTq8ys+cHZ5vskTnxNA@public.gmane.org>,
	LKML <linux-kernel-u79uwXL29TY76Z2rM5mHXA@public.gmane.org>,
	"criu-GEFAQzZX7r8dnm+yROfE0A@public.gmane.org"
	<criu-GEFAQzZX7r8dnm+yROfE0A@public.gmane.org>,
	Alexander Viro
	<viro-RmSDqhL/yNMiFSDQTTA3OLVCufUGDwFn@public.gmane.org>,
	linux-fsdevel
	<linux-fsdevel-u79uwXL29TY76Z2rM5mHXA@public.gmane.org>,
	James Bottomley
	<James.Bottomley-JuX6DAaQMKPCXq6kfMZ53/egYHeGw8Jk@public.gmane.org>,
	Andrey Vagin <avagin-GEFAQzZX7r8dnm+yROfE0A@public.gmane.org>
Subject: Re: [PATCH 0/5 RFC] Add an interface to discover relationships between namespaces
Date: Thu, 28 Jul 2016 07:56:42 -0500	[thread overview]
Message-ID: <87popxkjjp.fsf@x220.int.ebiederm.org> (raw)
In-Reply-To: <ca0787a3-b270-e962-46d1-7e63c9335a55-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w@public.gmane.org> (Michael Kerrisk's message of "Thu, 28 Jul 2016 12:45:12 +0200")

"Michael Kerrisk (man-pages)" <mtk.manpages-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w@public.gmane.org> writes:

> On 07/26/2016 10:39 PM, Andrew Vagin wrote:
>> On Tue, Jul 26, 2016 at 09:17:31PM +0200, Michael Kerrisk (man-pages) wrote:

>> If we want to compare two file descriptors of the current process,
>> it is one of cases for which kcmp can be used. We can call kcmp to
>> compare two namespaces which are opened in other processes.
>
> Is there really a use case there? I assume we're talking about the
> scenario where a process in one namespace opens a /proc/PID/ns/*
> file descriptor and passes that FD to another process via a UNIX
> domain socket. Is that correct?
>
> So, supposing that we want to build a map of the relationships
> between namespaces using the proposed kcmp() API, and there are
> say N namespaces? Does this mena we make (N * (N-1) / 2) calls
> to kcmp()?

Potentially.  The numbers are small enough O(N^2) isn't fatal.

Where kcmp shines is that it allows migration to happen.  Inode numbers
to change (which they very much will today), and still have things work.

We can keep it O(Nlog(N)) by taking advantage of not just the equality
but the ordering relationship.  Although Ugh.  One disadvantage of
kcmp currently is that the way the ordering relationship is defined
the order is not preserved over migration :(

Eric

WARNING: multiple messages have this Message-ID (diff)
From: ebiederm@xmission.com (Eric W. Biederman)
To: "Michael Kerrisk \(man-pages\)" <mtk.manpages@gmail.com>
Cc: Andrew Vagin <avagin@virtuozzo.com>,
	Andrey Vagin <avagin@openvz.org>,
	Serge Hallyn <serge.hallyn@canonical.com>,
	"criu\@openvz.org" <criu@openvz.org>,
	Linux API <linux-api@vger.kernel.org>,
	Linux Containers <containers@lists.linux-foundation.org>,
	LKML <linux-kernel@vger.kernel.org>,
	James Bottomley <James.Bottomley@hansenpartnership.com>,
	linux-fsdevel <linux-fsdevel@vger.kernel.org>,
	Alexander Viro <viro@zeniv.linux.org.uk>
Subject: Re: [PATCH 0/5 RFC] Add an interface to discover relationships between namespaces
Date: Thu, 28 Jul 2016 07:56:42 -0500	[thread overview]
Message-ID: <87popxkjjp.fsf@x220.int.ebiederm.org> (raw)
In-Reply-To: <ca0787a3-b270-e962-46d1-7e63c9335a55@gmail.com> (Michael Kerrisk's message of "Thu, 28 Jul 2016 12:45:12 +0200")

"Michael Kerrisk (man-pages)" <mtk.manpages@gmail.com> writes:

> On 07/26/2016 10:39 PM, Andrew Vagin wrote:
>> On Tue, Jul 26, 2016 at 09:17:31PM +0200, Michael Kerrisk (man-pages) wrote:

>> If we want to compare two file descriptors of the current process,
>> it is one of cases for which kcmp can be used. We can call kcmp to
>> compare two namespaces which are opened in other processes.
>
> Is there really a use case there? I assume we're talking about the
> scenario where a process in one namespace opens a /proc/PID/ns/*
> file descriptor and passes that FD to another process via a UNIX
> domain socket. Is that correct?
>
> So, supposing that we want to build a map of the relationships
> between namespaces using the proposed kcmp() API, and there are
> say N namespaces? Does this mena we make (N * (N-1) / 2) calls
> to kcmp()?

Potentially.  The numbers are small enough O(N^2) isn't fatal.

Where kcmp shines is that it allows migration to happen.  Inode numbers
to change (which they very much will today), and still have things work.

We can keep it O(Nlog(N)) by taking advantage of not just the equality
but the ordering relationship.  Although Ugh.  One disadvantage of
kcmp currently is that the way the ordering relationship is defined
the order is not preserved over migration :(

Eric

  parent reply	other threads:[~2016-07-28 12:56 UTC|newest]

Thread overview: 143+ messages / expand[flat|nested]  mbox.gz  Atom feed  top
2016-07-14 18:20 [PATCH 0/5 RFC] Add an interface to discover relationships between namespaces Andrey Vagin
2016-07-14 18:20 ` Andrey Vagin
2016-07-14 18:20 ` [PATCH 1/5] namespaces: move user_ns into ns_common Andrey Vagin
     [not found]   ` <1468520419-28220-2-git-send-email-avagin-GEFAQzZX7r8dnm+yROfE0A@public.gmane.org>
2016-07-15 12:21     ` kbuild test robot
2016-07-15 12:21       ` kbuild test robot
2016-07-14 18:20 ` [PATCH 3/5] nsfs: add ioctl to get an owning user namespace for ns file descriptor Andrey Vagin
2016-07-14 18:48   ` W. Trevor King
2016-07-14 18:48     ` W. Trevor King
     [not found]   ` <1468520419-28220-4-git-send-email-avagin-GEFAQzZX7r8dnm+yROfE0A@public.gmane.org>
2016-07-14 18:48     ` W. Trevor King
2016-07-14 22:02 ` [PATCH 0/5 RFC] Add an interface to discover relationships between namespaces Andrey Vagin
2016-07-14 22:02   ` Andrey Vagin
2016-07-24  5:10   ` Eric W. Biederman
2016-07-24  5:10     ` Eric W. Biederman
     [not found]     ` <87poq3liyq.fsf-JOvCrm2gF+uungPnsOpG7nhyD016LWXt@public.gmane.org>
2016-07-26  2:07       ` Andrew Vagin
2016-07-26  2:07         ` Andrew Vagin
     [not found]   ` <CANaxB-xw_xBUq=0uT14ANv-jfg2NsGaPy=jyDO9=yF03_7toSw-JsoAwUIsXosN+BqQ9rBEUg@public.gmane.org>
2016-07-15  2:12     ` [PATCH 1/5] namespaces: move user_ns into ns_common Andrey Vagin
2016-07-15  2:12       ` Andrey Vagin
2016-07-15  2:12       ` [PATCH 4/5] nsfs: add ioctl to get a parent namespace Andrey Vagin
2016-07-15  2:12         ` Andrey Vagin
     [not found]         ` <1468548742-32136-4-git-send-email-avagin-GEFAQzZX7r8dnm+yROfE0A@public.gmane.org>
2016-07-24  5:07           ` Eric W. Biederman
2016-07-24  5:07         ` Eric W. Biederman
2016-07-24  5:07           ` Eric W. Biederman
2016-07-15  2:12       ` [PATCH 5/5] tools/testing: add a test to check nsfs ioctl-s Andrey Vagin
     [not found]       ` <1468548742-32136-1-git-send-email-avagin-GEFAQzZX7r8dnm+yROfE0A@public.gmane.org>
2016-07-15  2:12         ` [PATCH 2/5] kernel: add a helper to get an owning user namespace for a namespace Andrey Vagin
2016-07-15  2:12           ` Andrey Vagin
     [not found]           ` <1468548742-32136-2-git-send-email-avagin-GEFAQzZX7r8dnm+yROfE0A@public.gmane.org>
2016-07-24  5:03             ` Eric W. Biederman
2016-07-24 16:54             ` W. Trevor King
2016-07-24 16:54               ` W. Trevor King
2016-07-24  5:03           ` Eric W. Biederman
2016-07-24  5:03             ` Eric W. Biederman
     [not found]             ` <878twrmxu2.fsf-JOvCrm2gF+uungPnsOpG7nhyD016LWXt@public.gmane.org>
2016-07-24  6:37               ` Andrew Vagin
2016-07-24  6:37                 ` Andrew Vagin
     [not found]                 ` <20160724063728.GA17810-1ViLX0X+lBJGNQ1M2rI3KwRV3xvJKrda@public.gmane.org>
2016-07-24 14:30                   ` Eric W. Biederman
2016-07-24 14:30                 ` Eric W. Biederman
2016-07-24 14:30                   ` Eric W. Biederman
     [not found]                   ` <87shuzglck.fsf-JOvCrm2gF+uungPnsOpG7nhyD016LWXt@public.gmane.org>
2016-07-24 17:05                     ` W. Trevor King
2016-07-24 17:05                       ` W. Trevor King
2016-07-15  2:12         ` [PATCH 3/5] nsfs: add ioctl to get an owning user namespace for ns file descriptor Andrey Vagin
2016-07-15  2:12           ` Andrey Vagin
2016-07-15  2:12         ` [PATCH 4/5] nsfs: add ioctl to get a parent namespace Andrey Vagin
2016-07-15  2:12         ` [PATCH 5/5] tools/testing: add a test to check nsfs ioctl-s Andrey Vagin
2016-07-16  8:21         ` [PATCH 1/5] namespaces: move user_ns into ns_common kbuild test robot
2016-07-16  8:21           ` kbuild test robot
2016-07-23 23:07         ` kbuild test robot
2016-07-23 23:07           ` kbuild test robot
2016-07-24  5:00         ` Eric W. Biederman
2016-07-24  5:00       ` Eric W. Biederman
2016-07-24  5:00         ` Eric W. Biederman
2016-07-24  5:54         ` Andrew Vagin
2016-07-24  5:54           ` Andrew Vagin
     [not found]         ` <87k2gbmy02.fsf-JOvCrm2gF+uungPnsOpG7nhyD016LWXt@public.gmane.org>
2016-07-24  5:54           ` Andrew Vagin
2016-07-24  5:54             ` Andrew Vagin
2016-07-24  5:54           ` Andrew Vagin
2016-07-24  5:54             ` Andrew Vagin
2016-07-24  5:54         ` Andrew Vagin
2016-07-24  5:54           ` Andrew Vagin
2016-07-24  5:10     ` [PATCH 0/5 RFC] Add an interface to discover relationships between namespaces Eric W. Biederman
2016-07-21 14:41 ` Michael Kerrisk (man-pages)
2016-07-21 14:41   ` Michael Kerrisk (man-pages)
     [not found]   ` <c9bdaf3d-ec93-d754-81ac-9f524a0d0954-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w@public.gmane.org>
2016-07-21 21:06     ` Andrew Vagin
2016-07-21 21:06       ` Andrew Vagin
2016-07-21 21:06       ` Andrew Vagin
     [not found]       ` <20160721210650.GA10989-1ViLX0X+lBJGNQ1M2rI3KwRV3xvJKrda@public.gmane.org>
2016-07-22  6:48         ` Michael Kerrisk (man-pages)
     [not found]           ` <1515f5f2-5a49-fcab-61f4-8b627d3ba3e2-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w@public.gmane.org>
2016-07-22 18:25             ` Andrey Vagin
2016-07-22 18:25               ` Andrey Vagin
2016-07-25 11:47               ` Michael Kerrisk (man-pages)
2016-07-25 11:47                 ` Michael Kerrisk (man-pages)
     [not found]                 ` <e2811bf1-4b86-e115-bcdb-301d6f2546eb-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w@public.gmane.org>
2016-07-25 13:18                   ` Eric W. Biederman
2016-07-25 13:18                     ` Eric W. Biederman
     [not found]                     ` <87lh0pg8jx.fsf-JOvCrm2gF+uungPnsOpG7nhyD016LWXt@public.gmane.org>
2016-07-25 14:46                       ` Michael Kerrisk (man-pages)
2016-07-25 14:46                         ` Michael Kerrisk (man-pages)
     [not found]                         ` <44ca0e41-dc92-45b1-2a6c-c41a048a072d-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w@public.gmane.org>
2016-07-25 14:54                           ` Serge E. Hallyn
2016-07-25 14:59                           ` Eric W. Biederman
2016-07-25 14:59                             ` Eric W. Biederman
     [not found]                             ` <87r3ahepb4.fsf-JOvCrm2gF+uungPnsOpG7nhyD016LWXt@public.gmane.org>
2016-07-26  2:54                               ` Andrew Vagin
2016-07-26  2:54                                 ` Andrew Vagin
2016-07-26  8:03                                 ` Michael Kerrisk (man-pages)
2016-07-26  8:03                                   ` Michael Kerrisk (man-pages)
     [not found]                                   ` <3390535b-0660-757f-aeba-c03d936b3485-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w@public.gmane.org>
2016-07-26 18:25                                     ` Andrew Vagin
2016-07-26 18:25                                       ` Andrew Vagin
2016-07-26 18:32                                       ` W. Trevor King
2016-07-26 18:32                                         ` W. Trevor King
     [not found]                                         ` <20160726183224.GN24913-q4NCUed9G3sTnwFZoN752g@public.gmane.org>
2016-07-26 19:11                                           ` Andrew Vagin
2016-07-26 19:11                                             ` Andrew Vagin
     [not found]                                       ` <20160726182524.GA328-1ViLX0X+lBJGNQ1M2rI3KwRV3xvJKrda@public.gmane.org>
2016-07-26 18:32                                         ` W. Trevor King
2016-07-26 19:17                                         ` Michael Kerrisk (man-pages)
2016-07-26 19:17                                       ` Michael Kerrisk (man-pages)
     [not found]                                         ` <CAKgNAkjmOu+vfiMDyeYQkkf7wQBH9PVmJ4nH2CTg43GrN-k7eA-JsoAwUIsXosN+BqQ9rBEUg@public.gmane.org>
2016-07-26 20:39                                           ` Andrew Vagin
2016-07-26 20:39                                             ` Andrew Vagin
2016-07-28 10:45                                             ` Michael Kerrisk (man-pages)
2016-07-28 10:45                                               ` Michael Kerrisk (man-pages)
     [not found]                                               ` <ca0787a3-b270-e962-46d1-7e63c9335a55-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w@public.gmane.org>
2016-07-28 12:56                                                 ` Eric W. Biederman [this message]
2016-07-28 12:56                                                   ` Eric W. Biederman
2016-07-28 19:00                                                   ` Michael Kerrisk (man-pages)
2016-07-29 18:05                                                     ` Eric W. Biederman
2016-07-29 18:05                                                       ` Eric W. Biederman
     [not found]                                                       ` <87h9b8e2v7.fsf-JOvCrm2gF+uungPnsOpG7nhyD016LWXt@public.gmane.org>
2016-07-31 21:31                                                         ` Michael Kerrisk (man-pages)
2016-07-31 21:31                                                           ` Michael Kerrisk (man-pages)
2016-08-01 23:01                                                         ` Andrew Vagin
2016-08-01 23:01                                                           ` Andrew Vagin
     [not found]                                                     ` <40e35f1a-10e6-b7a5-936e-a09f008be0d0-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w@public.gmane.org>
2016-07-29 18:05                                                       ` Eric W. Biederman
     [not found]                                                   ` <87popxkjjp.fsf-JOvCrm2gF+uungPnsOpG7nhyD016LWXt@public.gmane.org>
2016-07-28 19:00                                                     ` Michael Kerrisk (man-pages)
     [not found]                                             ` <20160726203955.GA9415-1ViLX0X+lBJGNQ1M2rI3KwRV3xvJKrda@public.gmane.org>
2016-07-28 10:45                                               ` Michael Kerrisk (man-pages)
     [not found]                                 ` <20160726025455.GC26206-1ViLX0X+lBJGNQ1M2rI3KwRV3xvJKrda@public.gmane.org>
2016-07-26  8:03                                   ` Michael Kerrisk (man-pages)
2016-07-26 19:38                                   ` Eric W. Biederman
2016-07-26 19:38                                     ` Eric W. Biederman
2016-07-25 14:54                         ` Serge E. Hallyn
2016-07-25 14:54                           ` Serge E. Hallyn
2016-07-25 15:17                           ` Eric W. Biederman
2016-07-25 15:17                             ` Eric W. Biederman
     [not found]                           ` <20160725145445.GA19879-7LNsyQBKDXoIagZqoN9o3w@public.gmane.org>
2016-07-25 15:17                             ` Eric W. Biederman
     [not found]               ` <CANaxB-w8H8Wo8FmtmBBZTpJX-ZDGRQx0rbm9E5c9WbduQ_Ukmw-JsoAwUIsXosN+BqQ9rBEUg@public.gmane.org>
2016-07-25 11:47                 ` Michael Kerrisk (man-pages)
     [not found] ` <1468520419-28220-1-git-send-email-avagin-GEFAQzZX7r8dnm+yROfE0A@public.gmane.org>
2016-07-14 18:20   ` [PATCH 1/5] namespaces: move user_ns into ns_common Andrey Vagin
2016-07-14 18:20   ` [PATCH 2/5] kernel: add a helper to get an owning user namespace for a namespace Andrey Vagin
2016-07-14 18:20     ` Andrey Vagin
     [not found]     ` <1468520419-28220-3-git-send-email-avagin-GEFAQzZX7r8dnm+yROfE0A@public.gmane.org>
2016-07-14 19:07       ` W. Trevor King
2016-07-14 19:07         ` W. Trevor King
2016-07-14 18:20   ` [PATCH 3/5] nsfs: add ioctl to get an owning user namespace for ns file descriptor Andrey Vagin
2016-07-14 18:20   ` [PATCH 4/5] nsfs: add ioctl to get a parent namespace Andrey Vagin
2016-07-14 18:20     ` Andrey Vagin
2016-07-14 18:20   ` [PATCH 5/5] tools/testing: add a test to check nsfs ioctl-s Andrey Vagin
2016-07-14 18:20     ` Andrey Vagin
2016-07-14 22:02   ` [PATCH 0/5 RFC] Add an interface to discover relationships between namespaces Andrey Vagin
2016-07-21 14:41   ` Michael Kerrisk (man-pages)
2016-07-23 21:14   ` W. Trevor King
2016-07-23 21:14     ` W. Trevor King
     [not found]     ` <20160723211414.GA25371-q4NCUed9G3sTnwFZoN752g@public.gmane.org>
2016-07-23 21:38       ` James Bottomley
2016-07-23 21:38         ` James Bottomley
     [not found]         ` <1469309936.2332.35.camel-d9PhHud1JfjCXq6kfMZ53/egYHeGw8Jk@public.gmane.org>
2016-07-23 21:58           ` W. Trevor King
2016-07-23 21:58         ` W. Trevor King
2016-07-23 21:58           ` W. Trevor King
2016-07-23 21:56           ` Eric W. Biederman
2016-07-23 21:56             ` Eric W. Biederman
     [not found]             ` <87mvl8nhlv.fsf-JOvCrm2gF+uungPnsOpG7nhyD016LWXt@public.gmane.org>
2016-07-23 22:34               ` W. Trevor King
2016-07-23 22:34                 ` W. Trevor King
     [not found]                 ` <20160723223448.GP24913-q4NCUed9G3sTnwFZoN752g@public.gmane.org>
2016-07-24  4:51                   ` Eric W. Biederman
2016-07-24  4:51                     ` Eric W. Biederman
     [not found]           ` <20160723215802.GO24913-q4NCUed9G3sTnwFZoN752g@public.gmane.org>
2016-07-23 21:56             ` Eric W. Biederman
2016-08-01 18:20   ` Alban Crequy
2016-08-01 18:20     ` Alban Crequy
     [not found]     ` <CAMXgnP6j+rTeb5XJgoPV20y8puGyVm=9O9gdg9Sah4DuF5qm9w-JsoAwUIsXosN+BqQ9rBEUg@public.gmane.org>
2016-08-01 23:32       ` Andrew Vagin
2016-08-01 23:32         ` Andrew Vagin
2016-07-14 18:20 Andrey Vagin

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