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From: David Laight <David.Laight@ACULAB.COM>
To: 'Arnd Bergmann' <arnd@arndb.de>,
	Matthew Wilcox <willy@infradead.org>,
	Linus Torvalds <torvalds@linux-foundation.org>,
	Segher Boessenkool <segher@kernel.crashing.org>,
	Joe Perches <joe@perches.com>,
	Miguel Ojeda <miguel.ojeda.sandonis@gmail.com>,
	Masahiro Yamada <masahiroy@kernel.org>,
	Albert Ou <aou@eecs.berkeley.edu>,
	Linux Kbuild mailing list <linux-kbuild@vger.kernel.org>,
	Greg Kroah-Hartman <gregkh@linuxfoundation.org>,
	Jonathan Corbet <corbet@lwn.net>,
	"Linux Doc Mailing List" <linux-doc@vger.kernel.org>,
	linux-kernel <linux-kernel@vger.kernel.org>,
	Palmer Dabbelt <palmer@dabbelt.com>,
	"Paul Walmsley" <paul.walmsley@sifive.com>,
	Catalin Marinas <catalin.marinas@arm.com>,
	Miguel Ojeda <ojeda@kernel.org>,
	Paul Mackerras <paulus@samba.org>,
	linux-riscv <linux-riscv@lists.infradead.org>,
	linuxppc-dev <linuxppc-dev@lists.ozlabs.org>,
	Will Deacon <will@kernel.org>,
	Linux ARM <linux-arm-kernel@lists.infradead.org>
Subject: RE: [PATCH] Raise the minimum GCC version to 5.2
Date: Mon, 3 May 2021 12:20:45 +0000	[thread overview]
Message-ID: <fc0c7c092f274ab8b760b3c897830347@AcuMS.aculab.com> (raw)
In-Reply-To: <CAK8P3a0kV4ZfMEFh0DcMDjXqxA0yhj8a8CL-YFGV6B4pszHeGg@mail.gmail.com>

From: Arnd Bergmann
> Sent: 03 May 2021 10:25
...
> One scenario that I've seen previously is where user space and
> kernel are built together as a source based distribution (OE, buildroot,
> openwrt, ...), and the compiler is picked to match the original sources
> of the user space because that is best tested, but the same compiler
> then gets used to build the kernel as well because that is the default
> in the build environment.

If you are building programs for release to customers who might
be running then on old distributions then you need a system with
the original userspace headers and almost certainly a similar
vintage compiler.
Never mind RHEL7 we have customers running RHEL6.
(We've managed to get everyone off RHEL5.)
So the build machine is running a 10+ year old distro.

I did try to build on a newer system (only 5 years old)
but the complete fubar of memcpy() makes it impossible
to compile C programs that will run on an older libc.
And don't even mention C++, the 'character traits' is just
plain horrid - enough to make me want to remove every
reference to CString from the small amount of C++ we have.

To quote our makefile:
# C++ is fighting back.
# I'd like to be able to compile on a 'new' system and still be able to run
# the binaries on RHEL 6 (2.6.32 kernel 2011 era libraries).
# But even linking libstdc++ static still leaves
# an undefined C++ symbol that the dynamic loader barfs on.
# The static libstdc++ also references memcpy@GLIBC_2.14 - but that can be
# 'solved' by adding an extra .so that defines the symbol (and calls memmove()).
# I've also tried pulling a single .o out of libstc++.a. This might work if
# the .o is small and self contained.
#
# For now we statically link libstc++ and continue to build on an old system.
C++LDLIBS := -Wl,-Bstatic -lstdc++ -Wl,-Bdynamic

It would be nice to be able to build current kernels (for local
use) on the 'new' system - but gcc is already too old.

	David

-
Registered Address Lakeside, Bramley Road, Mount Farm, Milton Keynes, MK1 1PT, UK
Registration No: 1397386 (Wales)

WARNING: multiple messages have this Message-ID (diff)
From: David Laight <David.Laight@ACULAB.COM>
To: 'Arnd Bergmann' <arnd@arndb.de>,
	Matthew Wilcox <willy@infradead.org>,
	Linus Torvalds <torvalds@linux-foundation.org>,
	Segher Boessenkool <segher@kernel.crashing.org>,
	Joe Perches <joe@perches.com>,
	Miguel Ojeda <miguel.ojeda.sandonis@gmail.com>,
	Masahiro Yamada <masahiroy@kernel.org>,
	Albert Ou <aou@eecs.berkeley.edu>,
	Linux Kbuild mailing list <linux-kbuild@vger.kernel.org>,
	Greg Kroah-Hartman <gregkh@linuxfoundation.org>,
	Jonathan Corbet <corbet@lwn.net>,
	"Linux Doc Mailing List" <linux-doc@vger.kernel.org>,
	linux-kernel <linux-kernel@vger.kernel.org>,
	Palmer Dabbelt <palmer@dabbelt.com>,
	"Paul Walmsley" <paul.walmsley@sifive.com>,
	Catalin Marinas <catalin.marinas@arm.com>,
	Miguel Ojeda <ojeda@kernel.org>,
	Paul Mackerras <paulus@samba.org>,
	linux-riscv <linux-riscv@lists.infradead.org>,
	linuxppc-dev <linuxppc-dev@lists.ozlabs.org>,
	Will Deacon <will@kernel.org>,
	Linux ARM <linux-arm-kernel@lists.infradead.org>
Subject: RE: [PATCH] Raise the minimum GCC version to 5.2
Date: Mon, 3 May 2021 12:20:45 +0000	[thread overview]
Message-ID: <fc0c7c092f274ab8b760b3c897830347@AcuMS.aculab.com> (raw)
In-Reply-To: <CAK8P3a0kV4ZfMEFh0DcMDjXqxA0yhj8a8CL-YFGV6B4pszHeGg@mail.gmail.com>

From: Arnd Bergmann
> Sent: 03 May 2021 10:25
...
> One scenario that I've seen previously is where user space and
> kernel are built together as a source based distribution (OE, buildroot,
> openwrt, ...), and the compiler is picked to match the original sources
> of the user space because that is best tested, but the same compiler
> then gets used to build the kernel as well because that is the default
> in the build environment.

If you are building programs for release to customers who might
be running then on old distributions then you need a system with
the original userspace headers and almost certainly a similar
vintage compiler.
Never mind RHEL7 we have customers running RHEL6.
(We've managed to get everyone off RHEL5.)
So the build machine is running a 10+ year old distro.

I did try to build on a newer system (only 5 years old)
but the complete fubar of memcpy() makes it impossible
to compile C programs that will run on an older libc.
And don't even mention C++, the 'character traits' is just
plain horrid - enough to make me want to remove every
reference to CString from the small amount of C++ we have.

To quote our makefile:
# C++ is fighting back.
# I'd like to be able to compile on a 'new' system and still be able to run
# the binaries on RHEL 6 (2.6.32 kernel 2011 era libraries).
# But even linking libstdc++ static still leaves
# an undefined C++ symbol that the dynamic loader barfs on.
# The static libstdc++ also references memcpy@GLIBC_2.14 - but that can be
# 'solved' by adding an extra .so that defines the symbol (and calls memmove()).
# I've also tried pulling a single .o out of libstc++.a. This might work if
# the .o is small and self contained.
#
# For now we statically link libstc++ and continue to build on an old system.
C++LDLIBS := -Wl,-Bstatic -lstdc++ -Wl,-Bdynamic

It would be nice to be able to build current kernels (for local
use) on the 'new' system - but gcc is already too old.

	David

-
Registered Address Lakeside, Bramley Road, Mount Farm, Milton Keynes, MK1 1PT, UK
Registration No: 1397386 (Wales)
_______________________________________________
linux-riscv mailing list
linux-riscv@lists.infradead.org
http://lists.infradead.org/mailman/listinfo/linux-riscv

WARNING: multiple messages have this Message-ID (diff)
From: David Laight <David.Laight@ACULAB.COM>
To: 'Arnd Bergmann' <arnd@arndb.de>,
	Matthew Wilcox <willy@infradead.org>,
	Linus Torvalds <torvalds@linux-foundation.org>,
	Segher Boessenkool <segher@kernel.crashing.org>,
	Joe Perches <joe@perches.com>,
	Miguel Ojeda <miguel.ojeda.sandonis@gmail.com>,
	Masahiro Yamada <masahiroy@kernel.org>,
	Albert Ou <aou@eecs.berkeley.edu>,
	Linux Kbuild mailing list <linux-kbuild@vger.kernel.org>,
	Greg Kroah-Hartman <gregkh@linuxfoundation.org>,
	Jonathan Corbet <corbet@lwn.net>,
	"Linux Doc Mailing List" <linux-doc@vger.kernel.org>,
	linux-kernel <linux-kernel@vger.kernel.org>,
	Palmer Dabbelt <palmer@dabbelt.com>,
	"Paul Walmsley" <paul.walmsley@sifive.com>,
	Catalin Marinas <catalin.marinas@arm.com>,
	Miguel Ojeda <ojeda@kernel.org>,
	Paul Mackerras <paulus@samba.org>,
	linux-riscv <linux-riscv@lists.infradead.org>,
	linuxppc-dev <linuxppc-dev@lists.ozlabs.org>,
	Will Deacon <will@kernel.org>,
	Linux ARM <linux-arm-kernel@lists.infradead.org>
Subject: RE: [PATCH] Raise the minimum GCC version to 5.2
Date: Mon, 3 May 2021 12:20:45 +0000	[thread overview]
Message-ID: <fc0c7c092f274ab8b760b3c897830347@AcuMS.aculab.com> (raw)
In-Reply-To: <CAK8P3a0kV4ZfMEFh0DcMDjXqxA0yhj8a8CL-YFGV6B4pszHeGg@mail.gmail.com>

From: Arnd Bergmann
> Sent: 03 May 2021 10:25
...
> One scenario that I've seen previously is where user space and
> kernel are built together as a source based distribution (OE, buildroot,
> openwrt, ...), and the compiler is picked to match the original sources
> of the user space because that is best tested, but the same compiler
> then gets used to build the kernel as well because that is the default
> in the build environment.

If you are building programs for release to customers who might
be running then on old distributions then you need a system with
the original userspace headers and almost certainly a similar
vintage compiler.
Never mind RHEL7 we have customers running RHEL6.
(We've managed to get everyone off RHEL5.)
So the build machine is running a 10+ year old distro.

I did try to build on a newer system (only 5 years old)
but the complete fubar of memcpy() makes it impossible
to compile C programs that will run on an older libc.
And don't even mention C++, the 'character traits' is just
plain horrid - enough to make me want to remove every
reference to CString from the small amount of C++ we have.

To quote our makefile:
# C++ is fighting back.
# I'd like to be able to compile on a 'new' system and still be able to run
# the binaries on RHEL 6 (2.6.32 kernel 2011 era libraries).
# But even linking libstdc++ static still leaves
# an undefined C++ symbol that the dynamic loader barfs on.
# The static libstdc++ also references memcpy@GLIBC_2.14 - but that can be
# 'solved' by adding an extra .so that defines the symbol (and calls memmove()).
# I've also tried pulling a single .o out of libstc++.a. This might work if
# the .o is small and self contained.
#
# For now we statically link libstc++ and continue to build on an old system.
C++LDLIBS := -Wl,-Bstatic -lstdc++ -Wl,-Bdynamic

It would be nice to be able to build current kernels (for local
use) on the 'new' system - but gcc is already too old.

	David

-
Registered Address Lakeside, Bramley Road, Mount Farm, Milton Keynes, MK1 1PT, UK
Registration No: 1397386 (Wales)
_______________________________________________
linux-arm-kernel mailing list
linux-arm-kernel@lists.infradead.org
http://lists.infradead.org/mailman/listinfo/linux-arm-kernel

  reply	other threads:[~2021-05-03 12:20 UTC|newest]

Thread overview: 146+ messages / expand[flat|nested]  mbox.gz  Atom feed  top
2021-05-01 15:15 [PATCH] Raise the minimum GCC version to 5.2 Masahiro Yamada
2021-05-01 15:15 ` Masahiro Yamada
2021-05-01 15:15 ` Masahiro Yamada
2021-05-01 15:15 ` Masahiro Yamada
2021-05-01 15:52 ` Miguel Ojeda
2021-05-01 15:52   ` Miguel Ojeda
2021-05-01 15:52   ` Miguel Ojeda
2021-05-01 15:52   ` Miguel Ojeda
2021-05-01 17:38   ` Christophe Leroy
2021-05-01 17:38     ` Christophe Leroy
2021-05-01 17:38     ` Christophe Leroy
2021-05-01 17:38     ` Christophe Leroy
2021-05-02  2:41   ` Joe Perches
2021-05-02  2:41     ` Joe Perches
2021-05-02  2:41     ` Joe Perches
2021-05-02  2:41     ` Joe Perches
2021-05-02 18:30     ` Segher Boessenkool
2021-05-02 18:30       ` Segher Boessenkool
2021-05-02 18:30       ` Segher Boessenkool
2021-05-02 18:30       ` Segher Boessenkool
2021-05-02 20:00       ` Joe Perches
2021-05-02 20:00         ` Joe Perches
2021-05-02 20:00         ` Joe Perches
2021-05-02 20:00         ` Joe Perches
2021-05-02 20:32         ` Segher Boessenkool
2021-05-02 20:32           ` Segher Boessenkool
2021-05-02 20:32           ` Segher Boessenkool
2021-05-02 20:32           ` Segher Boessenkool
2021-05-02 21:05           ` Ali Kaasinen
2021-05-02 21:05             ` Ali Kaasinen
2021-05-02 21:05             ` Ali Kaasinen
2021-05-02 21:05             ` Ali Kaasinen
2021-05-02 21:08           ` Linus Torvalds
2021-05-02 21:08             ` Linus Torvalds
2021-05-02 21:08             ` Linus Torvalds
2021-05-02 21:08             ` Linus Torvalds
2021-05-02 22:30             ` Matthew Wilcox
2021-05-02 22:30               ` Matthew Wilcox
2021-05-02 22:30               ` Matthew Wilcox
2021-05-02 22:30               ` Matthew Wilcox
2021-05-03  7:34               ` Alexander Dahl
2021-05-03  7:34                 ` Alexander Dahl
2021-05-03  7:34                 ` Alexander Dahl
2021-05-03  7:34                 ` Alexander Dahl
2021-05-03  8:54                 ` Joe Perches
2021-05-03  8:54                   ` Joe Perches
2021-05-03  8:54                   ` Joe Perches
2021-05-03  8:54                   ` Joe Perches
2021-05-03  9:25                 ` Arnd Bergmann
2021-05-03  9:25                   ` Arnd Bergmann
2021-05-03  9:25                   ` Arnd Bergmann
2021-05-03  9:25                   ` Arnd Bergmann
2021-05-03 12:20                   ` David Laight [this message]
2021-05-03 12:20                     ` David Laight
2021-05-03 12:20                     ` David Laight
2021-05-03 13:10                     ` Miguel Ojeda
2021-05-03 13:10                       ` Miguel Ojeda
2021-05-03 13:10                       ` Miguel Ojeda
2021-05-03 13:10                       ` Miguel Ojeda
2021-05-04  5:30                   ` Alexander Dahl
2021-05-04  5:30                     ` Alexander Dahl
2021-05-04  5:30                     ` Alexander Dahl
2021-05-04  5:30                     ` Alexander Dahl
2021-05-04  6:33                     ` Christophe Leroy
2021-05-04  6:33                       ` Christophe Leroy
2021-05-04  6:33                       ` Christophe Leroy
2021-05-04 12:07                     ` Arnd Bergmann
2021-05-04 12:07                       ` Arnd Bergmann
2021-05-04 12:07                       ` Arnd Bergmann
2021-05-04 12:07                       ` Arnd Bergmann
2021-05-04 13:25                   ` Andy Shevchenko
2021-05-04 13:25                     ` Andy Shevchenko
2021-05-04 13:25                     ` Andy Shevchenko
2021-05-04 13:25                     ` Andy Shevchenko
2021-05-03 11:35               ` Arnd Bergmann
2021-05-03 11:35                 ` Arnd Bergmann
2021-05-03 11:35                 ` Arnd Bergmann
2021-05-03 11:35                 ` Arnd Bergmann
2021-05-03  9:49             ` Kirill A. Shutemov
2021-05-03  9:49               ` Kirill A. Shutemov
2021-05-03  9:49               ` Kirill A. Shutemov
2021-05-03  9:49               ` Kirill A. Shutemov
2021-05-02 21:23           ` Joe Perches
2021-05-02 21:23             ` Joe Perches
2021-05-02 21:23             ` Joe Perches
2021-05-02 21:23             ` Joe Perches
2021-05-03  0:44             ` Segher Boessenkool
2021-05-03  0:44               ` Segher Boessenkool
2021-05-03  0:44               ` Segher Boessenkool
2021-05-03  0:44               ` Segher Boessenkool
2021-05-03  9:57               ` Arnd Bergmann
2021-05-03  9:57                 ` Arnd Bergmann
2021-05-03  9:57                 ` Arnd Bergmann
2021-05-03  9:57                 ` Arnd Bergmann
2021-05-04  7:56     ` Ben Dooks
2021-05-04  7:56       ` Ben Dooks
2021-05-04  7:56       ` Ben Dooks
2021-05-04  7:56       ` Ben Dooks
2021-05-04  8:38       ` Miguel Ojeda
2021-05-04  8:38         ` Miguel Ojeda
2021-05-04  8:38         ` Miguel Ojeda
2021-05-04  8:38         ` Miguel Ojeda
2021-05-04  9:22         ` Michal Suchánek
2021-05-04  9:22           ` Michal Suchánek
2021-05-04  9:22           ` Michal Suchánek
2021-05-04  9:22           ` Michal Suchánek
2021-05-04 12:09           ` Miguel Ojeda
2021-05-04 12:09             ` Miguel Ojeda
2021-05-04 12:09             ` Miguel Ojeda
2021-05-04 12:09             ` Miguel Ojeda
2021-05-04 12:17             ` Michal Suchánek
2021-05-04 12:17               ` Michal Suchánek
2021-05-04 12:17               ` Michal Suchánek
2021-05-04 12:17               ` Michal Suchánek
2021-05-04 12:26               ` Christophe Leroy
2021-05-04 12:26                 ` Christophe Leroy
2021-05-04 12:26                 ` Christophe Leroy
2021-05-04 12:26                 ` Christophe Leroy
2021-05-02 18:37 ` Segher Boessenkool
2021-05-02 18:37   ` Segher Boessenkool
2021-05-02 18:37   ` Segher Boessenkool
2021-05-02 18:37   ` Segher Boessenkool
2021-05-03  6:16 ` Christophe Leroy
2021-05-03  6:16   ` Christophe Leroy
2021-05-03  6:16   ` Christophe Leroy
2021-05-03  6:16   ` Christophe Leroy
2021-05-04  2:13   ` Masahiro Yamada
2021-05-04  2:13     ` Masahiro Yamada
2021-05-04  2:13     ` Masahiro Yamada
2021-05-04  2:13     ` Masahiro Yamada
2021-05-04 13:18   ` Andy Shevchenko
2021-05-04 13:18     ` Andy Shevchenko
2021-05-04 13:18     ` Andy Shevchenko
2021-05-04 13:18     ` Andy Shevchenko
2021-05-03 12:27 ` David Sterba
2021-05-03 12:27   ` David Sterba
2021-05-03 12:27   ` David Sterba
2021-05-03 12:27   ` David Sterba
2021-05-15  7:14 ` Pavel Machek
2021-05-15  7:14   ` Pavel Machek
2021-05-15  7:14   ` Pavel Machek
2021-05-15  7:14   ` Pavel Machek
2021-05-15  7:27   ` Joe Perches
2021-05-15  7:27     ` Joe Perches
2021-05-15  7:27     ` Joe Perches
2021-05-15  7:27     ` Joe Perches

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