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From: Horst von Brand <vonbrand@inf.utfsm.cl>
To: Michael Loftis <mloftis@wgops.com>
Cc: Matthew Frost <artusemrys@sbcglobal.net>,
	linux-kernel@vger.kernel.org,
	James Courtier-Dutton <James@superbug.co.uk>
Subject: Re: Development tree, PLEASE?
Date: Sat, 21 Jan 2006 15:09:37 -0300	[thread overview]
Message-ID: <200601211809.k0LI9bXJ012151@laptop11.inf.utfsm.cl> (raw)
In-Reply-To: Message from Michael Loftis <mloftis@wgops.com>  of "Sat, 21 Jan 2006 00:22:03 PDT." <1FA093EB58B02DE48E424157@dhcp-2-206.wgops.com>

Michael Loftis <mloftis@wgops.com> wrote:

[...]

> The thread in part diverged into three separate discussions more or
> less. I still have a big problem with how the development of the
> kernel is being done now, with a total lack of a stable branch.
> Stable in my mind also means not a moving target for developers, nor
> maintainers.  Try maintaining a lot of very demanding applications
> that must run right so changes must always be fully tested before
> rolling out.  It makes it nearly impossible to do that when the kernel
> has no stable branch that's mostly bug fixes, instead any time a bug
> is discovered a full process must be started to make sure no new bugs
> in all the new code features, etc, that became present during the
> interim are not found.  It makes maintenance a real nightmare for
> atleast one environment in which I maintain production systems, and
> also makes it rather a bit more difficult in others too since changes
> must be vetted.  Not necessarily *all* of them, but when there's lots
> of changes it's hard to track whats 'interesting' and what doesn't
> affect one.  If there was/is a stable tree then when bugfixes come
> they are applied there, and one can upgrade along that tree with much
> less concern about things changing underfoot.

What has changed underfoot you? If it affects userspace, I gather that
would be considered a bug (or you doing nasty things you shouldn't have
done in the first place). 

> That's my root problem.  The devfs stuff is just ancillary and came
> about as examples of where I've been backed into a no win situation.

No. /You/ decided to paint yourself into a tight corner there. Ad did it
carefully, over a couple of years.

[...]

> Over on my end I have to make a decision as to if I have the time to
> try to...promote/lead some sort of effort along these lines so that we
> can all benefit instead of just those willing to use and install
> RedHat or SuSE or Debian or Ubuntu or whatever distro.

Ask the Red Hat people how much it costs them to keep the stuff up to date
for RHEL... better go for 2.4.x or so.
-- 
Dr. Horst H. von Brand                   User #22616 counter.li.org
Departamento de Informatica                     Fono: +56 32 654431
Universidad Tecnica Federico Santa Maria              +56 32 654239
Casilla 110-V, Valparaiso, Chile                Fax:  +56 32 797513

  parent reply	other threads:[~2006-01-23 21:26 UTC|newest]

Thread overview: 126+ messages / expand[flat|nested]  mbox.gz  Atom feed  top
2006-01-20 15:17 Development tree, PLEASE? Michael Loftis
2006-01-20 15:31 ` Michael Loftis
2006-01-20 15:59 ` Marc Koschewski
2006-01-20 16:07   ` Michael Loftis
2006-01-20 16:34     ` Marc Koschewski
2006-01-20 17:04       ` Michael Loftis
2006-01-20 16:35     ` Marc Koschewski
2006-01-20 17:06       ` Michael Loftis
2006-01-20 17:31         ` Diego Calleja
2006-01-20 20:43         ` Kyle Moffett
2006-01-20 16:41     ` Jan Engelhardt
2006-01-20 17:14       ` Michael Loftis
2006-01-20 19:43         ` Greg KH
2006-01-20 20:56           ` Michael Loftis
2006-01-20 21:06             ` Christopher Friesen
2006-01-20 23:00             ` Horst von Brand
2006-01-20 23:17             ` Russell King
2006-01-20 23:33               ` Michael Loftis
2006-01-20 23:55                 ` Russell King
2006-01-21  0:05                   ` Michael Loftis
2006-01-21  0:26                     ` Lars Marowsky-Bree
2006-01-20 23:27             ` Greg KH
2006-01-20 23:52               ` Michael Loftis
2006-01-21  0:03                 ` Russell King
2006-01-21  1:38             ` Alan Cox
2006-01-20 20:25         ` Russell King
2006-01-20 22:05           ` Michael Loftis
2006-01-20 22:54     ` Horst von Brand
2006-01-20 16:40   ` Dmitry Torokhov
2006-01-20 16:48     ` Marc Koschewski
2006-01-20 16:55       ` Dmitry Torokhov
     [not found]         ` <20060120172431.GE5873@stiffy.osknowledge.org>
2006-01-20 17:43           ` Dmitry Torokhov
2006-01-20 17:53             ` Marc Koschewski
2006-01-20 18:00               ` Dmitry Torokhov
2006-01-20 18:06                 ` Marc Koschewski
2006-02-13 17:17               ` Dmitry Torokhov
2006-01-20 16:29 ` James Courtier-Dutton
2006-01-20 16:36   ` Michael Loftis
2006-01-20 16:50     ` Dmitry Torokhov
2006-01-20 17:31       ` Michael Loftis
2006-01-20 19:03         ` Valdis.Kletnieks
2006-01-20 19:10           ` Michael Loftis
2006-01-20 23:20             ` Bernd Petrovitsch
2006-01-20 23:54               ` Michael Loftis
2006-01-20 19:21           ` Michael Loftis
2006-01-20 19:24             ` Valdis.Kletnieks
2006-01-20 20:00             ` Russell King
2006-01-20 21:21               ` Michael Loftis
2006-01-20 21:40                 ` Doug McNaught
2006-01-20 22:09                   ` Michael Loftis
2006-02-02 12:16                     ` David Weinehall
2006-02-02 18:25                       ` Michael Loftis
2006-02-02 20:10                         ` Dave Jones
2006-02-02 22:05                           ` Sam Ravnborg
2006-02-02 22:10                             ` Dave Jones
2006-02-02 22:19                               ` Sam Ravnborg
2006-02-02 22:31                                 ` Dave Jones
2006-02-02 22:42                                   ` Sam Ravnborg
2006-02-03  1:29                                 ` Roman Zippel
2006-02-03  4:45                                 ` Theodore Ts'o
2006-02-03 12:28                               ` Roman Zippel
2006-02-03 16:04                                 ` Dave Jones
2006-02-02 22:01                         ` Willy Tarreau
2006-02-02 22:31                           ` Christopher Friesen
2006-02-03  5:08                             ` Willy Tarreau
2006-02-02 22:15                         ` David Weinehall
2006-02-02 22:47                           ` Michael Loftis
2006-01-20 20:10             ` James Courtier-Dutton
2006-01-20 20:20         ` Jesper Juhl
2006-01-20 21:48           ` Michael Loftis
2006-01-20 22:00             ` Dmitry Torokhov
2006-01-20 22:14               ` Michael Loftis
2006-01-21  9:22             ` Jan Engelhardt
2006-01-21 14:52               ` Alistair John Strachan
2006-01-21 17:03                 ` Jan Engelhardt
2006-01-20 21:50           ` Michael Loftis
2006-01-21  9:13         ` Jan Engelhardt
2006-01-20 16:53     ` Joe George
2006-01-20 17:03       ` Randy.Dunlap
2006-01-20 17:33         ` Joe George
     [not found]     ` <20060120121116.62a8f0a6.seanlkml@sympatico.ca>
2006-01-20 17:11       ` sean
2006-01-20 17:56         ` Development tree, please? Michael Loftis
     [not found]           ` <20060120131120.338ebf17.seanlkml@sympatico.ca>
2006-01-20 18:11             ` sean
2006-01-20 18:43               ` Michael Loftis
2006-01-20 17:11     ` Development tree, PLEASE? Diego Calleja
2006-01-21  1:56     ` Matthew Frost
2006-01-21  3:19       ` Matthew Frost
2006-01-21  7:22         ` Michael Loftis
2006-01-21  7:38           ` Lee Revell
2006-01-21 21:56             ` Sven-Haegar Koch
2006-01-21 22:18               ` Lee Revell
2006-01-21 22:40                 ` Michael Loftis
2006-01-21 22:47                   ` Lee Revell
2006-01-21 22:51                     ` Bernd Petrovitsch
2006-01-22  8:57                       ` Michael Loftis
2006-01-22  9:41                         ` Theodore Ts'o
2006-01-22 16:09                         ` Bernd Petrovitsch
2006-01-22 22:59                         ` Daniel Barkalow
2006-01-21 22:49                   ` Bernd Petrovitsch
2006-01-21 23:03                   ` Lee Revell
2006-01-22  9:03                     ` Michael Loftis
2006-01-22 17:03                       ` Bernd Petrovitsch
2006-01-25 21:30                         ` Nix
2006-01-25 21:36                           ` Lee Revell
2006-01-25 22:12                             ` Nix
2006-01-26  8:44                               ` Bernd Petrovitsch
2006-01-26 21:12                                 ` Jan Engelhardt
2006-01-26 21:44                                   ` Bernd Petrovitsch
2006-01-22 17:14                       ` Arjan van de Ven
2006-01-22 17:24                       ` Lee Revell
2006-01-21 11:28           ` Jesper Juhl
2006-01-21 18:09           ` Horst von Brand [this message]
2006-01-20 17:08 ` Gábor Lénárt
2006-01-21  0:36   ` Michael Loftis
2006-01-20 19:16 ` Greg KH
2006-01-20 19:27 ` Ben Collins
2006-01-20 22:04   ` Vincent Hanquez
2006-01-21 18:29     ` Johan Kullstam
2006-01-23 13:45       ` Vincent Hanquez
2006-01-24 15:35       ` Bob Copeland
2006-01-21 11:41 ` Ralf Baechle
2006-01-21  6:58 Michael Loftis
2006-03-14 13:57 Chuck Ebbert
2006-03-14 14:09 ` Arjan van de Ven
2006-03-16 20:17   ` Jan Engelhardt
2006-03-16 20:21     ` Jan Engelhardt

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