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From: Rik van Riel <riel@redhat.com>
To: Miklos Szeredi <miklos@szeredi.hu>
Cc: akpm@osdl.org, torvalds@osdl.org, hbryan@us.ibm.com,
	linux-fsdevel@vger.kernel.org, linux-kernel@vger.kernel.org,
	pavel@ucw.cz
Subject: Re: [PATCH] [Request for inclusion] Filesystem in Userspace
Date: Sat, 27 Nov 2004 12:07:48 -0500 (EST)	[thread overview]
Message-ID: <Pine.LNX.4.61.0411271200580.12575@chimarrao.boston.redhat.com> (raw)
In-Reply-To: <E1CV6vf-0006q1-00@dorka.pomaz.szeredi.hu>

On Fri, 19 Nov 2004, Miklos Szeredi wrote:

> The solution I'm thinking is along the lines of accounting the number
> of writable pages assigned to FUSE filesystems.  Limiting this should
> solve the deadlock problem.  This would only impact performance for
> shared writable mappings, which are rare anyway.

Note that NFS, and any filesystems on iSCSI or g/e/ndb block
devices have the exact same problem.  To explain why this is
the case, lets start with the VM allocation and pageout
thresholds:

   pages_min ------------------

  GFP_ATOMIC ------------------

PF_MEMALLOC ------------------

 	  0 ------------------

When writing out a dirty page, the pageout code is allowed
to allocate network buffers down to the PF_MEMALLOC boundary.

However, when receiving the ACK network packets from the server,
the network stack is only allowed to allocate memory down to the
GFP_ATOMIC watermark.

This means it is relatively easy to get the system to deadlock,
under a heavy shared mmap workload.  Limiting the number of
simultaneous writeouts might make the problem harder to trigger,
but is still no solution since the network layer could exhaust
its allowed memory for other packets, and never get around to
processing the ACKs for the pageout related network traffic!

I have a solution in mind, but it's not pretty. It might be safe
now that DaveM no longer travels.  Still have to come up with a
way to avoid being maimed by the other network developers, though...

-- 
"Debugging is twice as hard as writing the code in the first place.
Therefore, if you write the code as cleverly as possible, you are,
by definition, not smart enough to debug it." - Brian W. Kernighan

  reply	other threads:[~2004-11-27 17:08 UTC|newest]

Thread overview: 124+ messages / expand[flat|nested]  mbox.gz  Atom feed  top
2004-11-15 21:15 [PATCH] [Request for inclusion] Filesystem in Userspace Miklos Szeredi
2004-11-15 21:43 ` Greg KH
2004-11-15 22:35 ` Linus Torvalds
2004-11-16  9:08   ` Miklos Szeredi
2004-11-16  9:18     ` Arjan van de Ven
2004-11-16  9:40       ` Miklos Szeredi
2004-11-16  9:46         ` Arjan van de Ven
2004-11-16  9:52           ` Miklos Szeredi
2004-11-16 10:17             ` David Woodhouse
2004-11-16 10:25               ` Miklos Szeredi
2004-11-16 10:13     ` Pekka Enberg
2004-11-16 10:20       ` Miklos Szeredi
2004-11-16 10:35         ` Pekka Enberg
2004-11-16 10:42           ` Miklos Szeredi
2004-11-16 12:19             ` Pekka Enberg
2004-11-16 11:01           ` Simon Braunschmidt
2004-11-16 11:20             ` Pekka Enberg
2004-11-16 15:18               ` Ralph Corderoy
2004-11-16 12:31             ` Jan Engelhardt
2004-11-16 11:02         ` Jan Kratochvil
2004-11-16 14:01           ` Miklos Szeredi
2004-11-16 16:33             ` Greg KH
2004-11-16 16:45               ` Miklos Szeredi
2004-11-16 17:03                 ` Greg KH
2004-11-16 17:50                   ` Miklos Szeredi
2004-11-16 17:58                     ` Greg KH
2004-11-16 19:09                       ` Miklos Szeredi
2004-11-16 19:16                         ` Greg KH
2004-11-16 19:30                           ` Miklos Szeredi
2004-11-16 19:38                             ` Greg KH
2004-11-16 19:24                         ` Jan Engelhardt
2004-11-16 19:32                           ` Miklos Szeredi
2004-11-16 19:42                             ` Anton Altaparmakov
2004-11-16 19:48                               ` Jan Engelhardt
2004-11-16 20:12                               ` Miklos Szeredi
2004-11-17 15:42               ` Miklos Szeredi
2004-11-17 16:57                 ` Nikita Danilov
2004-11-17 17:10                   ` Jan Engelhardt
2004-11-17 17:33                     ` Nikita Danilov
2004-11-17 17:38                       ` Jan Engelhardt
2004-11-17 17:58                         ` Nikita Danilov
2004-11-17 18:09                           ` Jan Engelhardt
2004-11-17 19:58                             ` Mike Waychison
2004-11-17 18:53                           ` [PATCH] " Al Viro
2004-11-17 17:56                   ` Miklos Szeredi
2004-11-17 18:11                     ` Greg KH
2004-11-17 18:17                       ` Miklos Szeredi
2004-11-17 18:20                     ` Nikita Danilov
2004-11-17 17:52                 ` Greg KH
2004-11-17 15:36             ` Alan Cox
2004-11-17 21:37               ` Bryan Henderson
2004-11-17 19:00 ` Pavel Machek
2004-11-17 19:45   ` Miklos Szeredi
2004-11-17 20:44     ` Pavel Machek
2004-11-18  8:17       ` Miklos Szeredi
2004-11-18 14:46         ` Pavel Machek
2004-11-21  7:42           ` Miklos Szeredi
2004-11-21  7:50             ` Miklos Szeredi
2004-11-21  9:50             ` Jan Hudec
2004-11-21 10:31               ` Miklos Szeredi
2004-11-21 10:39                 ` Jan Hudec
2004-11-21 11:29                   ` Miklos Szeredi
2004-11-21 11:53                     ` Anton Altaparmakov
2004-11-21 12:01                       ` Miklos Szeredi
2004-11-21 18:13             ` Pavel Machek
2004-11-22 16:12               ` Miklos Szeredi
2004-11-18 17:00         ` Bryan Henderson
2004-11-18 17:14           ` Miklos Szeredi
2004-11-18 18:49             ` Bryan Henderson
2004-11-18 19:12               ` Miklos Szeredi
2004-11-19  7:01               ` Jan Engelhardt
2004-11-20 12:00             ` Jan Hudec
2004-11-18 17:12         ` Bryan Henderson
2004-11-18 17:28           ` Miklos Szeredi
2004-11-18 18:01             ` Linus Torvalds
2004-11-18 17:29               ` Alan Cox
2004-11-18 18:55                 ` Linus Torvalds
2004-11-18 19:28                   ` Miklos Szeredi
2004-11-19  9:46                     ` Pavel Machek
2004-11-18 20:57                   ` Andrew Morton
2004-11-24  6:20                     ` Daniel Phillips
2004-11-24 12:15                 ` Avi Kivity
2004-11-24 13:05                   ` Miklos Szeredi
     [not found]                     ` <200411242001.59504.oliver@neukum.org>
2004-11-24 19:20                       ` Miklos Szeredi
2004-11-25  6:26                     ` Jan Hudec
2004-11-25  7:29                       ` Miklos Szeredi
2004-11-25  7:47                         ` Jan Hudec
2004-11-25  9:15                           ` Miklos Szeredi
2004-11-25  9:54                           ` Pavel Machek
2004-11-30 18:44                     ` Avi Kivity
2004-11-30 19:16                       ` Miklos Szeredi
2004-11-30 19:55                         ` Avi Kivity
2004-11-30 21:13                           ` Miklos Szeredi
2004-11-30 21:37                             ` Avi Kivity
2004-11-30 21:58                               ` Miklos Szeredi
2004-11-30 22:57                                 ` Avi Kivity
2004-11-30 23:19                                   ` Miklos Szeredi
2004-12-15 17:55                                     ` Avi Kivity
2004-12-15 21:49                                       ` Miklos Szeredi
2004-12-03 22:07                               ` Daniel Phillips
2004-12-15 17:45                                 ` Avi Kivity
2004-12-01  7:16                             ` Jan Hudec
2004-12-01 13:35                               ` Miklos Szeredi
2004-11-30 21:54                       ` Pavel Machek
2004-11-18 18:21               ` Miklos Szeredi
2004-11-18 18:31                 ` Linus Torvalds
2004-11-18 18:56                   ` Miklos Szeredi
2004-11-18 19:16                     ` Linus Torvalds
2004-11-18 19:33                       ` Miklos Szeredi
2004-11-18 19:43                         ` Linus Torvalds
2004-11-18 20:05                           ` Miklos Szeredi
2004-11-18 20:13                       ` Nikita Danilov
2004-11-18 21:06                     ` Andrew Morton
2004-11-18 21:33                       ` Miklos Szeredi
2004-11-19 11:27                       ` Miklos Szeredi
2004-11-27 17:07                         ` Rik van Riel [this message]
2004-11-27 17:13                           ` Pavel Machek
2004-12-03 22:07                           ` Daniel Phillips
2004-11-18 20:16                   ` Elladan
2004-11-18 18:28               ` Jamie Lokier
2004-11-18 18:47                 ` Linus Torvalds
2004-11-18 19:12             ` Bryan Henderson
2004-11-18 19:51               ` Miklos Szeredi
2004-11-18 22:00                 ` Jan Hudec

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