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From: Hannu Savolainen <hannu@opensound.com>
To: Marcin Dalecki <martin@dalecki.de>
Cc: Jesper Juhl <jesper.juhl@gmail.com>,
	Lee Revell <rlrevell@joe-job.com>,
	Jan Engelhardt <jengelh@linux01.gwdg.de>,
	Takashi Iwai <tiwai@suse.de>, Adrian Bunk <bunk@stusta.de>,
	Tomasz Torcz <zdzichu@irc.pl>,
	Olivier Galibert <galibert@pobox.com>,
	Alistair John Strachan <s0348365@sms.ed.ac.uk>,
	Andi Kleen <ak@suse.de>,
	perex@suse.cz, alsa-devel@alsa-project.org,
	James@superbug.demon.co.uk, sailer@ife.ee.ethz.ch,
	linux-sound@vger.kernel.org, zab@zabbo.net,
	kyle@parisc-linux.org, parisc-linux@lists.parisc-linux.org,
	jgarzik@pobox.com, Thorsten Knabe <linux@thorsten-knabe.de>,
	zwane@commfireservices.com, zaitcev@yahoo.com,
	linux-kernel@vger.kernel.org
Subject: Re: [2.6 patch] schedule obsolete OSS drivers for removal
Date: Fri, 6 Jan 2006 03:36:47 +0200 (EET)	[thread overview]
Message-ID: <Pine.LNX.4.61.0601060302370.29362@zeus.compusonic.fi> (raw)
In-Reply-To: <A1ECA9D1-29EB-4C44-A343-87B5EAAD4ADA@dalecki.de>

On Fri, 6 Jan 2006, Marcin Dalecki wrote:

> 
> 
> No I do not. How do you dare to assume I do?
> I never ever did ask for any support on behalf of the ALSA bunch...
> We are just discussing the merits of one sound system design
> over another one (without design).
Which is really a good subject to discuss about (LKML may not be the right 
place for this). ALSA has been in the official kernel for two years now so 
might this be a good time to look back?

There are two very opposite approaches to do a sound subsystem. The ALSA 
way is to expose every single detail of the hardware to the applications 
and to allow (or force) application developers to deal with them. The OSS 
approach is to provide maximum device abstraction in the API level (by 
isolating the apps from the hardware as much as practically possible).

Both ways have their good and bad sides. During past years the ALSA 
advocates have been dictating that the ALSA approach is the only available 
way to go (all resistance is futile). But after all what is the authority 
who makes the final decision? Is it the ALSA team (who would like to think 
in this way)? Or do the Linux/Unix users and audio application developers 
have any word to say?

Btw, about the current OSS drivers in the kernel. They are really obsolete 
because they are based on some 10 years old API version. For this reason 
it's necessary to remove them in the nearish future (maybe at the same 
time when we release the OpenOSS version). Comparing ALSA against the 
kernel OSS drivers is pointless because current OSS has very little 
common with that code.

Best regards,

Hannu
-----
Hannu Savolainen (hannu@opensound.com)
http://www.opensound.com (Open Sound System (OSS))
http://www.compusonic.fi (Finnish OSS pages)
OH2GLH QTH: Karkkila, Finland LOC: KP20CM

  parent reply	other threads:[~2006-01-06  1:39 UTC|newest]

Thread overview: 289+ messages / expand[flat|nested]  mbox.gz  Atom feed  top
2005-07-26 15:08 [2.6 patch] schedule obsolete OSS drivers for removal Adrian Bunk
2005-07-26 15:41 ` Jesper Juhl
2005-07-26 15:46   ` Adrian Bunk
2005-07-26 15:41 ` Thomas Sailer
2005-07-26 15:48 ` Jeff Garzik
2005-07-26 16:04   ` Adrian Bunk
2005-07-26 16:49   ` Lee Revell
2005-07-26 17:49     ` John W. Linville
2005-07-26 17:03   ` Gene Heskett
2005-07-26 18:13     ` Adrian Bunk
2005-07-27  3:19       ` Gene Heskett
2005-07-26 15:51 ` Lee Revell
2005-07-26 15:57   ` Jeff Garzik
2005-07-26 16:02     ` Lee Revell
2005-07-27 18:24     ` Adrian Bunk
2005-07-27 20:31       ` John W. Linville
2005-07-27 20:43         ` Jeff Garzik
2005-07-28 14:00           ` Alan Cox
2005-07-28 13:43             ` Jaroslav Kysela
2005-07-28 14:15               ` Adrian Bunk
2006-01-03 13:14               ` Adrian Bunk
2005-07-26 16:30   ` Adrian Bunk
2005-07-26 16:17 ` Andrew Haninger
2005-07-31 19:29   ` Adrian Bunk
2005-07-26 16:27 ` Zach Brown
2005-07-26 21:41   ` Krzysztof Halasa
2005-07-26 23:38   ` Zoran Dzelajlija
2005-07-27 23:28     ` Lee Revell
2005-07-27 23:58       ` Rogério Brito
2005-07-28  8:09     ` Takashi Iwai
2005-07-31 19:36     ` Adrian Bunk
2005-07-27 18:39 ` Kyle McMartin
2005-07-28  3:01   ` [parisc-linux] " Randolph Chung
2005-07-28 14:14   ` Adrian Bunk
2005-07-28 15:04 ` Thorsten Knabe
2005-07-28 15:46   ` Adrian Bunk
2005-07-28 18:33   ` [Alsa-devel] " Lee Revell
2005-07-29  6:52   ` Jaroslav Kysela
2005-07-29 15:16     ` Adrian Bunk
2005-07-29 15:58     ` Thorsten Knabe
2005-07-31 19:39       ` Adrian Bunk
2005-08-01 14:26         ` Andrew Haninger
2005-08-02  0:13           ` Thorsten Knabe
2005-08-02  5:05             ` Lee Revell
2005-08-02 12:59             ` James Courtier-Dutton
2005-08-02 15:55             ` Thorsten Knabe
2005-07-31 13:38 ` James Courtier-Dutton
2006-01-03 13:21 ` Andi Kleen
2006-01-03 13:47   ` Alistair John Strachan
2006-01-03 13:52     ` Andi Kleen
2006-01-03 13:58       ` David Lang
2006-01-03 14:33         ` Alistair John Strachan
2006-01-03 14:34           ` Alistair John Strachan
2006-01-03 14:01       ` Alistair John Strachan
2006-01-03 18:24       ` Lee Revell
     [not found]       ` <mailman.1136300646.6679.linux-kernel2news@redhat.com>
2006-01-04 11:13         ` Pete Zaitcev
2006-01-04 11:16           ` Jaroslav Kysela
2006-01-03 14:38     ` Jan Engelhardt
2006-01-03 14:41       ` Alistair John Strachan
2006-01-03 14:50         ` Jan Engelhardt
2006-01-03 15:22           ` Alistair John Strachan
2006-01-03 16:05             ` Tomasz Torcz
2006-01-03 16:29               ` Alistair John Strachan
2006-01-03 17:03                 ` Olivier Galibert
2006-01-03 17:16                   ` Alistair John Strachan
2006-01-03 19:24                     ` Olivier Galibert
2006-01-03 19:37                       ` Adrian Bunk
2006-01-03 21:40                         ` Olivier Galibert
2006-01-03 23:10                         ` Tomasz Kłoczko
2006-01-04  0:33                           ` Thomas Sailer
2006-01-04  1:48                             ` Olivier Galibert
2006-01-04  9:03                           ` Jan Engelhardt
2006-01-04  9:37                           ` [OT] ALSA userspace API complexity Alistair John Strachan
     [not found]                           ` <mailman.1136368805.14661.linux-kernel2news@redhat.com>
2006-01-04 11:00                             ` Pete Zaitcev
2006-01-04 11:35                               ` Jaroslav Kysela
2006-01-04 11:47                                 ` Pete Zaitcev
2006-01-04 14:23                                 ` Alistair John Strachan
2006-01-05 11:41                                   ` Olivier Galibert
2006-01-05 12:01                                 ` Tomasz Kłoczko
2006-01-05 12:23                                   ` Jaroslav Kysela
2006-01-05 14:21                                     ` Olivier Galibert
2006-01-05 14:56                                       ` [parisc-linux] " Alan Cox
2006-01-05 21:14                                         ` Jan Engelhardt
2006-01-05 15:07                                     ` Tomasz Kłoczko
2006-01-05 16:14                                       ` Takashi Iwai
2006-01-05 17:19                                         ` Marcin Dalecki
2006-01-05 20:13                                         ` Tomasz Kłoczko
2006-01-07 14:32                                           ` Takashi Iwai
2006-01-08  2:03                                             ` Olivier Galibert
2006-01-08  2:26                                               ` Martin Drab
2006-01-08 13:21                                                 ` Olivier Galibert
2006-01-08 13:32                                                   ` Jaroslav Kysela
2006-01-08 23:18                                                     ` Pavel Machek
2006-01-09  0:33                                                     ` [Alsa-devel] " Hannu Savolainen
2006-01-09 12:24                                                       ` Takashi Iwai
2006-01-09 17:49                                                   ` Thierry Vignaud
2006-01-08  9:42                                               ` Jaroslav Kysela
2006-01-08 13:04                                                 ` Olivier Galibert
2006-01-08 13:23                                                   ` Jaroslav Kysela
2006-01-08 13:38                                                 ` Marcin Dalecki
2006-01-09  0:30                                                 ` [Alsa-devel] " Hannu Savolainen
2006-01-05 23:06                                         ` Hannu Savolainen
2006-01-05 23:39                                           ` Lee Revell
2006-01-05 23:56                                             ` Hannu Savolainen
2006-01-06  0:03                                               ` Lee Revell
2006-01-05 23:40                                           ` Lee Revell
2006-01-05 23:59                                             ` Hannu Savolainen
2006-01-06 15:03                                               ` Stefan Smietanowski
2006-01-06 15:48                                                 ` Erik Mouw
2006-01-06 18:37                                                 ` Lee Revell
2006-01-10  9:43                                               ` Jaroslav Kysela
2006-01-10 13:42                                                 ` Hannu Savolainen
2006-01-10 14:08                                                   ` Jaroslav Kysela
2006-01-10 14:17                                                     ` Hannu Savolainen
2006-01-10 20:13                                                     ` Marcin Dalecki
2006-01-06  0:14                                             ` Marcin Dalecki
2006-01-06  0:29                                               ` Martin Drab
2006-01-06  0:57                                                 ` Marcin Dalecki
2006-01-06  1:49                                                   ` Martin Drab
2006-01-06  1:21                                               ` Zan Lynx
2006-01-06 15:17                                                 ` Stefan Smietanowski
2006-01-09 23:55                                                   ` jerome lacoste
2006-01-10  2:29                                                     ` Stefan Smietanowski
2006-01-06  3:14                                           ` Edgar Toernig
2006-01-06  3:33                                             ` Hannu Savolainen
2006-01-06 11:34                                               ` Florian Schmidt
2006-01-06  7:47                                           ` Jan Engelhardt
2006-01-07 14:45                                           ` Takashi Iwai
     [not found]                                             ` <Pine.LNX.4.61.0601080225500.17252@zeus.compusonic.fi>
2006-01-08  9:24                                               ` [Alsa-devel] " Jaroslav Kysela
2006-01-09 13:05                                                 ` René Rebe
2006-01-09 15:10                                                   ` Hannu Savolainen
2006-01-09 17:12                                                     ` René Rebe
2006-01-09 21:58                                                       ` David Lang
2006-01-09 23:20                                                         ` John Rigg
2006-01-09 23:21                                                           ` David Lang
2006-01-10  0:16                                                             ` John Rigg
2006-01-10  0:29                                                               ` David Lang
2006-01-10  0:44                                                                 ` Alan Cox
2006-01-10  1:56                                                                   ` Lee Revell
2006-01-10  1:27                                                                 ` John Rigg
2006-01-10  1:02                                                               ` John Rigg
2006-01-10  0:48                                                           ` Hannu Savolainen
2006-01-10  2:00                                                             ` John Rigg
2006-01-10  2:17                                                               ` Hannu Savolainen
     [not found]                                                 ` <Pine.LNX.4.61.0601090010090.31763@zeus.compusonic.fi>
2006-01-10 10:51                                                   ` Jaroslav Kysela
     [not found]                                                     ` <Pine.LNX.4.61.0601101550390.24146@zeus.compusonic.fi>
2006-01-10 14:17                                                       ` Jaroslav Kysela
2006-01-10 14:39                                                         ` Adam Tlałka
2006-01-05 18:56                                       ` Lee Revell
2006-01-05 22:39                                       ` Joern Nettingsmeier
2006-01-05 23:44                                         ` Tomasz Kłoczko
2006-01-05 23:49                                         ` Olivier Galibert
2006-01-06  0:22                                           ` Joern Nettingsmeier
2006-01-06  1:30                                             ` Olivier Galibert
2006-01-06  2:20                                             ` Hannu Savolainen
2006-01-10  9:54                                               ` Jaroslav Kysela
2006-01-10 13:50                                                 ` Hannu Savolainen
2006-01-06  0:00                                         ` Marcin Dalecki
2006-01-05 12:47                                   ` Leonard Milcin Jr.
2006-01-04 12:13                           ` [2.6 patch] schedule obsolete OSS drivers for removal Joern Nettingsmeier
2006-01-04 12:35                             ` Andi Kleen
2006-01-04 12:41                               ` Jaroslav Kysela
2006-01-04 17:31                                 ` Alistair John Strachan
2006-01-04 17:48                                   ` Takashi Iwai
2006-01-05  6:42                       ` Lee Revell
2006-01-03 18:28                   ` Lee Revell
2006-01-03 19:30                     ` Thomas Sailer
2006-01-03 19:37                       ` Jaroslav Kysela
2006-01-03 19:56                         ` Thomas Sailer
2006-01-03 20:06                           ` Jaroslav Kysela
2006-01-04  0:23                             ` Thomas Sailer
2006-01-03 22:39                           ` James Courtier-Dutton
2006-01-03 20:22                   ` Takashi Iwai
2006-01-03 20:37                     ` Tomasz Torcz
2006-01-03 20:44                       ` Takashi Iwai
2006-01-03 20:56                         ` Jesper Juhl
2006-01-03 21:56                           ` Adrian Bunk
2006-01-03 22:11                             ` Jesper Juhl
2006-01-04 11:46                               ` Takashi Iwai
2006-01-04 14:46                                 ` Jan Engelhardt
2006-01-04 16:43                                   ` Marcin Dalecki
2006-01-05 10:57                                     ` Jan Engelhardt
2006-01-05 12:44                                       ` Marcin Dalecki
2006-01-05 18:33                                         ` Lee Revell
2006-01-05 20:03                                           ` Marcin Dalecki
2006-01-05 20:05                                             ` Lee Revell
2006-01-05 20:18                                               ` Marcin Dalecki
2006-01-05 20:28                                                 ` Lee Revell
2006-01-05 20:32                                                   ` Marcin Dalecki
2006-01-05 20:39                                                     ` Lee Revell
2006-01-05 20:32                                                 ` Lee Revell
2006-01-05 20:54                                                   ` Marcin Dalecki
2006-01-05 21:01                                                     ` Lee Revell
2006-01-05 21:43                                                       ` Marcin Dalecki
2006-01-05 21:47                                                         ` Lee Revell
2006-01-05 23:35                                                     ` Jesper Juhl
2006-01-06  0:04                                                       ` Marcin Dalecki
2006-01-06  0:08                                                         ` Jesper Juhl
2006-01-06  1:36                                                         ` Hannu Savolainen [this message]
2006-01-06  9:54                                                           ` James Courtier-Dutton
2006-01-06 13:37                                                             ` Hannu Savolainen
2006-01-06 10:34                                                           ` Gabor Gombas
2006-01-06 12:48                                                             ` Hannu Savolainen
2006-01-07 14:09                                                           ` Takashi Iwai
2006-01-07 14:57                                                             ` Marcin Dalecki
2006-01-08  0:21                                                             ` Hannu Savolainen
2006-01-06  2:40                                             ` Diego Calleja
2006-01-06 14:57                                               ` Olivier Galibert
2006-01-06 20:26                                                 ` Jaroslav Kysela
2006-01-07  0:40                                                   ` Marcin Dalecki
2006-01-07  0:56                                                   ` Olivier Galibert
2006-01-05 23:19                                           ` Hannu Savolainen
2006-01-05 23:33                                             ` Lee Revell
2006-01-06 13:20                                               ` caszonyi
2006-01-06 13:43                                                 ` James Courtier-Dutton
2006-01-06 18:24                                                 ` Lee Revell
2006-01-06 18:27                                                 ` Lee Revell
2006-01-04 20:12                                   ` Kyle Moffett
2006-01-04 22:25                                     ` Olivier Galibert
2006-01-03 22:13                             ` Tomasz Torcz
2006-01-03 23:10                               ` Adrian Bunk
2006-01-03 23:51                                 ` Tomasz Kłoczko
2006-01-04  0:03                                   ` Adrian Bunk
2006-01-04  0:46                                     ` Tomasz Kłoczko
2006-01-04  1:01                                       ` Adrian Bunk
2006-01-04  2:51                                         ` Tomasz Kłoczko
2006-01-04  8:50                                           ` Alan Cox
2006-01-04 13:21                                             ` Greg Louis
2006-01-04 14:41                                               ` Adrian Bunk
2006-01-04 10:37                                           ` tapas
2006-01-04 17:28                                             ` Alistair John Strachan
2006-01-05  7:14                                               ` Jan Engelhardt
2006-01-04 17:54                                             ` Takashi Iwai
2006-01-04 18:17                                               ` Florian Schmidt
2006-01-04 19:28                                                 ` Marcin Dalecki
2006-01-04 19:52                                                   ` Florian Schmidt
2006-01-05  7:11                                                     ` Jan Engelhardt
2006-01-05 11:15                                                     ` Takashi Iwai
2006-01-05 21:20                                                   ` Jim Crilly
2006-01-05  7:11                                                 ` Lee Revell
2006-01-05 19:09                                                   ` Edgar Toernig
2006-01-05 19:29                                                     ` Lee Revell
2006-01-05 20:19                                                       ` Lee Revell
2006-01-05 21:05                                                         ` Edgar Toernig
2006-01-05 21:10                                                           ` Lee Revell
2006-01-05 20:24                                                       ` Edgar Toernig
2006-01-05 20:29                                                         ` Lee Revell
2006-01-05  7:16                                             ` Lee Revell
2006-01-05 11:43                                               ` Florian Schmidt
2006-01-05 17:48                                                 ` Lee Revell
2006-01-08 21:07                                                   ` Ville Herva
2006-01-08 21:44                                                     ` Lee Revell
2006-01-09  8:16                                                       ` Ville Herva
2006-01-09 13:52                                                         ` Lee Revell
2006-01-09 14:22                                                           ` Ville Herva
2006-01-09 15:18                                                             ` Lee Revell
2006-01-09 16:21                                                               ` Ville Herva
2006-01-09 16:22                                                                 ` Lee Revell
2006-01-05 18:36                                                 ` Lee Revell
2006-01-05 18:47                                                   ` Tomasz Torcz
2006-01-05 19:10                                                     ` Lee Revell
2006-01-05 19:15                                                   ` Florian Schmidt
2006-01-04  0:28                                   ` Stefan Smietanowski
2006-01-04  1:38                                     ` Tomasz Kłoczko
2006-01-04  9:48                                       ` Stefan Smietanowski
2006-01-05  3:03                                         ` Peter Bortas
2006-01-05  7:13                                           ` Jan Engelhardt
2006-01-05  7:19                                             ` Lee Revell
2006-01-05  8:41                                               ` Stefan Smietanowski
2006-01-05  9:57                                             ` Peter Bortas
2006-01-03 17:09             ` Jan Engelhardt
2005-10-30 10:51 Adrian Bunk
2005-10-30 13:41 ` Gene Heskett
2005-10-30 13:51   ` Adrian Bunk
2005-10-30 13:53   ` Alistair John Strachan
2005-10-30 14:27 ` Kyle McMartin
2005-10-30 15:12   ` Adrian Bunk
2005-10-30 15:19     ` Kyle McMartin
2005-10-31 16:50     ` Lee Revell
2005-11-01 14:55       ` Adrian Bunk
2005-10-30 18:06 ` Andi Kleen
2005-10-30 18:38   ` Adrian Bunk
2005-10-30 19:35     ` Andi Kleen
2005-10-30 19:49       ` Adrian Bunk
2005-10-31 11:09         ` Takashi Iwai
2005-10-31 15:59         ` Nix
2005-10-31 16:27           ` Michael Buesch
2005-10-31 16:36             ` Nix
2005-10-31  7:06   ` Lee Revell
     [not found] <5r1ql-4Af-11@gated-at.bofh.it>
     [not found] ` <5r2mU-63n-79@gated-at.bofh.it>
     [not found]   ` <5r2FQ-6FS-37@gated-at.bofh.it>
     [not found]     ` <5r3C3-88G-55@gated-at.bofh.it>
     [not found]       ` <5r4ey-wy-17@gated-at.bofh.it>
     [not found]         ` <5r4of-Wo-39@gated-at.bofh.it>
     [not found]           ` <5r50O-1IR-3@gated-at.bofh.it>
     [not found]             ` <5r5k8-2kx-1@gated-at.bofh.it>
     [not found]               ` <5r72E-4AS-5@gated-at.bofh.it>
     [not found]                 ` <5rcOF-4ci-1@gated-at.bofh.it>
     [not found]                   ` <5rgSv-1KJ-41@gated-at.bofh.it>
2006-01-04 14:03                     ` Patrizio Bassi

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