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From: Alan Cox <gnomes@lxorguk.ukuu.org.uk>
To: Mauro Carvalho Chehab <mchehab+samsung@kernel.org>
Cc: James Bottomley <James.Bottomley@HansenPartnership.com>,
	linux-kernel <linux-kernel@vger.kernel.org>,
	ksummit-discuss@lists.linuxfoundation.org
Subject: Re: [Ksummit-discuss] [PATCH 2/2] code-of-conduct: Strip the enforcement paragraph pending community discussion
Date: Wed, 10 Oct 2018 21:09:48 +0100	[thread overview]
Message-ID: <20181010210948.62ed5ce6@alans-desktop> (raw)
In-Reply-To: <20181010141917.611fb5d8@coco.lan>

On Wed, 10 Oct 2018 14:19:17 -0300
Mauro Carvalho Chehab <mchehab+samsung@kernel.org> wrote:

> Em Wed, 10 Oct 2018 16:53:08 +0100
> Alan Cox <gnomes@lxorguk.ukuu.org.uk> escreveu:
> 
> > > -Maintainers have the right and responsibility to remove, edit, or reject
> > > +Maintainers may remove, edit, or reject
> > >  comments, commits, code, wiki edits, issues, and other contributions that are
> > >  not aligned to this Code of Conduct, or to ban temporarily or permanently any
> > >  contributor for other behaviors that they deem inappropriate, threatening,
> > > 
> > > The previous text seems too much legal for my taste.
> > >     
> > 
> > That is just as confusing. Maintainers have the right to remove, edit,
> > reject commits that *are* aligned with the code as well.  
> 
> Good point. Yeah, a maintainer can do whatever he thinks it is 
> appropriate for a patch - even when it follows the CoC.
> 
> > So what exactly is the point here ?  
> 
> The point is "responsibility" - that sounds like it is bounding a legal
> duty to a maintainer.

If you remove the responsibility aspect you might as well remove the
entire clause. It doesn't say anything as it's simply a subset of what
maintainers do anyway.

So how about

"Maintainers should remove, edit or reject..."

that keeps the sense that there should be pressure against abusive
behaviour.

except of course someone will attach a zero day exploit and fix to a
coc-violating rant and then you are a bit stuffed 8)

Alan

WARNING: multiple messages have this Message-ID (diff)
From: Alan Cox <gnomes@lxorguk.ukuu.org.uk>
To: Mauro Carvalho Chehab <mchehab+samsung@kernel.org>
Cc: James Bottomley <James.Bottomley@HansenPartnership.com>,
	ksummit-discuss@lists.linuxfoundation.org,
	linux-kernel <linux-kernel@vger.kernel.org>
Subject: Re: [Ksummit-discuss] [PATCH 2/2] code-of-conduct: Strip the enforcement paragraph pending community discussion
Date: Wed, 10 Oct 2018 21:09:48 +0100	[thread overview]
Message-ID: <20181010210948.62ed5ce6@alans-desktop> (raw)
In-Reply-To: <20181010141917.611fb5d8@coco.lan>

On Wed, 10 Oct 2018 14:19:17 -0300
Mauro Carvalho Chehab <mchehab+samsung@kernel.org> wrote:

> Em Wed, 10 Oct 2018 16:53:08 +0100
> Alan Cox <gnomes@lxorguk.ukuu.org.uk> escreveu:
> 
> > > -Maintainers have the right and responsibility to remove, edit, or reject
> > > +Maintainers may remove, edit, or reject
> > >  comments, commits, code, wiki edits, issues, and other contributions that are
> > >  not aligned to this Code of Conduct, or to ban temporarily or permanently any
> > >  contributor for other behaviors that they deem inappropriate, threatening,
> > > 
> > > The previous text seems too much legal for my taste.
> > >     
> > 
> > That is just as confusing. Maintainers have the right to remove, edit,
> > reject commits that *are* aligned with the code as well.  
> 
> Good point. Yeah, a maintainer can do whatever he thinks it is 
> appropriate for a patch - even when it follows the CoC.
> 
> > So what exactly is the point here ?  
> 
> The point is "responsibility" - that sounds like it is bounding a legal
> duty to a maintainer.

If you remove the responsibility aspect you might as well remove the
entire clause. It doesn't say anything as it's simply a subset of what
maintainers do anyway.

So how about

"Maintainers should remove, edit or reject..."

that keeps the sense that there should be pressure against abusive
behaviour.

except of course someone will attach a zero day exploit and fix to a
coc-violating rant and then you are a bit stuffed 8)

Alan

  reply	other threads:[~2018-10-10 20:09 UTC|newest]

Thread overview: 93+ messages / expand[flat|nested]  mbox.gz  Atom feed  top
2018-10-06 21:35 [Ksummit-discuss] [PATCH 0/2] code of conduct fixes James Bottomley
2018-10-06 21:35 ` James Bottomley
2018-10-06 21:36 ` [Ksummit-discuss] [PATCH 1/2] code-of-conduct: Fix the ambiguity about collecting email addresses James Bottomley
2018-10-06 21:36   ` James Bottomley
2018-10-07  8:25   ` [Ksummit-discuss] " Geert Uytterhoeven
2018-10-07  8:25     ` Geert Uytterhoeven
2018-10-07 15:25     ` Shuah Khan
2018-10-07 15:25       ` Shuah Khan
2018-10-07  9:04   ` Daniel Vetter
2018-10-07  9:04     ` Daniel Vetter
2018-10-07  9:54     ` Hannes Reinecke
2018-10-07 15:29     ` James Bottomley
2018-10-08 19:49       ` Mauro Carvalho Chehab
2018-10-08 19:49         ` Mauro Carvalho Chehab
2018-10-07 17:53   ` Guenter Roeck
2018-10-07 22:25   ` Dave Airlie
2018-10-07 22:25     ` Dave Airlie
2018-10-07 22:56     ` Al Viro
2018-10-07 23:02       ` Al Viro
2018-10-07 23:37       ` Dave Airlie
2018-10-08 10:14         ` Mark Brown
2018-10-08 10:14           ` Mark Brown
2018-10-08 19:32         ` Mauro Carvalho Chehab
2018-10-08 19:32           ` Mauro Carvalho Chehab
2018-10-08 17:05       ` Luck, Tony
2018-10-08 17:05         ` Luck, Tony
2018-10-08 14:08     ` James Bottomley
2018-10-10 16:36     ` Pavel Machek
2018-10-10 16:36       ` Pavel Machek
2018-10-08 15:20   ` Josh Triplett
2018-10-08 15:20     ` Josh Triplett
2018-10-08 15:30     ` James Bottomley
2018-10-08 19:23       ` Mauro Carvalho Chehab
2018-10-08 19:23         ` Mauro Carvalho Chehab
2018-10-08 19:57         ` Josh Triplett
2018-10-09 10:55           ` Mark Brown
2018-10-09 18:29     ` Rainer Fiebig
2018-10-09 18:56       ` Josh Triplett
2018-10-09 19:38         ` Laurent Pinchart
2018-10-09 19:38           ` Laurent Pinchart
2018-10-09 19:44           ` James Bottomley
2018-10-10  7:22             ` Rainer Fiebig
2018-10-10  5:52           ` Rainer Fiebig
2018-10-10  7:08         ` Rainer Fiebig
2018-10-08 19:24   ` Mauro Carvalho Chehab
2018-10-08 19:24     ` Mauro Carvalho Chehab
2018-10-10 20:48   ` Frank Rowand
2018-10-06 21:37 ` [Ksummit-discuss] [PATCH 2/2] code-of-conduct: Strip the enforcement paragraph pending community discussion James Bottomley
2018-10-06 21:37   ` James Bottomley
2018-10-06 21:43   ` [Ksummit-discuss] " Tim.Bird
2018-10-06 21:43     ` Tim.Bird
2018-10-07  3:33     ` James Bottomley
2018-10-08 13:51       ` Tim.Bird
2018-10-08 13:51         ` Tim.Bird
2018-10-08 14:09         ` James Bottomley
2018-10-08 17:58           ` Tim.Bird
2018-10-08 17:58             ` Tim.Bird
2018-10-08 18:11             ` James Bottomley
2018-10-08 18:54               ` Tim.Bird
2018-10-08 18:54                 ` Tim.Bird
2018-10-08 15:03         ` jonsmirl
2018-10-08 15:03           ` jonsmirl
2018-10-08 15:37       ` Alan Cox
2018-10-08 15:37         ` Alan Cox
2018-10-11  7:42         ` Dan Carpenter
2018-10-07 15:32   ` Shuah Khan
2018-10-07 15:32     ` Shuah Khan
2018-10-07 17:56   ` Guenter Roeck
2018-10-07 19:51   ` Geert Uytterhoeven
2018-10-07 19:51     ` Geert Uytterhoeven
2018-10-08 18:15   ` Chris Mason
2018-10-08 18:15     ` Chris Mason
2018-10-08 19:04     ` [Ksummit-discuss] " Josh Triplett
2018-10-08 20:23   ` Mauro Carvalho Chehab
2018-10-08 20:23     ` Mauro Carvalho Chehab
2018-10-10 15:53     ` Alan Cox
2018-10-10 15:53       ` Alan Cox
2018-10-10 17:19       ` Mauro Carvalho Chehab
2018-10-10 17:19         ` Mauro Carvalho Chehab
2018-10-10 20:09         ` Alan Cox [this message]
2018-10-10 20:09           ` Alan Cox
2018-10-10 20:30           ` Mauro Carvalho Chehab
2018-10-10 20:30             ` Mauro Carvalho Chehab
2018-10-10 20:32           ` Dave Airlie
2018-10-07 17:11 ` [Ksummit-discuss] [PATCH 0/2] code of conduct fixes Daniel Vetter
2018-10-07 17:11   ` Daniel Vetter
2018-10-07 17:40   ` James Bottomley
2018-10-07 17:50     ` jonsmirl
2018-10-07 17:50       ` jonsmirl
2018-10-07 17:52     ` Daniel Vetter
2018-10-10 16:12     ` Pavel Machek
2018-10-10 16:12       ` Pavel Machek
2018-10-10 16:25       ` Randy Dunlap

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