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From: Arnd Bergmann <arnd@kernel.org>
To: Linus Walleij <linus.walleij@linaro.org>
Cc: "Andy Shevchenko" <andy.shevchenko@gmail.com>,
	"William Breathitt Gray" <vilhelm.gray@gmail.com>,
	"David Laight" <David.Laight@aculab.com>,
	"Willy Tarreau" <w@1wt.eu>,
	"Linux ARM" <linux-arm-kernel@lists.infradead.org>,
	"Linux Kernel Mailing List" <linux-kernel@vger.kernel.org>,
	"Krzysztof Adamski" <krzysztof.adamski@nokia.com>,
	"Oleksij Rempel" <o.rempel@pengutronix.de>,
	"Baruch Siach" <baruch@tkos.co.il>,
	"Russell King - ARM Linux" <linux@armlinux.org.uk>,
	"Daniel Tang" <dt.tangr@gmail.com>,
	"Uwe Kleine-König" <u.kleine-koenig@pengutronix.de>,
	"Jamie Iles" <jamie@jamieiles.com>,
	"Barry Song" <song.bao.hua@hisilicon.com>,
	"Viresh Kumar" <viresh.kumar@linaro.org>,
	"Jonas Jensen" <jonas.jensen@gmail.com>,
	"Marc Gonzalez" <marc.w.gonzalez@free.fr>,
	"Hartley Sweeten" <hsweeten@visionengravers.com>,
	"Lubomir Rintel" <lkundrak@v3.sk>,
	"Neil Armstrong" <narmstrong@baylibre.com>,
	"Shawn Guo" <shawnguo@kernel.org>,
	"Alex Elder" <elder@linaro.org>,
	"Alexander Shiyan" <shc_work@mail.ru>,
	"Koen Vandeputte" <koen.vandeputte@ncentric.com>,
	"Hans Ulli Kroll" <ulli.kroll@googlemail.com>,
	"Vladimir Zapolskiy" <vz@mleia.com>,
	"Wei Xu" <xuwei5@hisilicon.com>,
	"Steven Rostedt" <rostedt@goodmis.org>,
	"Yoshinori Sato" <ysato@users.osdn.me>,
	"Mark Salter" <msalter@redhat.com>,
	"Michael Ellerman" <mpe@ellerman.id.au>,
	"Geert Uytterhoeven" <geert+renesas@glider.be>,
	"Thomas Bogendoerfer" <tsbogend@alpha.franken.de>
Subject: Re: Old platforms: bring out your dead
Date: Wed, 13 Jan 2021 14:44:59 +0100
Message-ID: <CAK8P3a1QLdPOcQoNWOYNGgN1vMNv2oOtittr1H1pVLrbbN4pPA@mail.gmail.com> (raw)
In-Reply-To: <CACRpkdaH-1s8DnRUPVRSQgqUE99MdWjKGLv_y6iYnXU6p4dwUg@mail.gmail.com>

On Wed, Jan 13, 2021 at 1:02 PM Linus Walleij <linus.walleij@linaro.org> wrote:
> On Wed, Jan 13, 2021 at 11:27 AM Andy Shevchenko <andy.shevchenko@gmail.com> wrote:
> > On Mon, Jan 11, 2021 at 11:55 AM David Laight <David.Laight@aculab.com> wrote:
> > > basically 486 but have a few extra instructions - probably just cpuid
> > > and (IIRC) rdtsc.
> > > Designed for low power embedded use they won't ever have been suitable
> > > for a desktop - but are probably fast enough for some uses.
> > > I'm not sure how much keeping 486 support actually costs, 386 was a
> > > PITA - but the 486 fixed most of those issues.
> >
> > Right, we have "last of mohicans" (to date) Intel Quark family of CPUs
> > (486 core + few i586 features).
> > This is for the embedded world and probably not for powerful use.
>
> What is the status of PC/104?
> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/PC/104
>
> I have three GPIO drivers for PC/104 machines and these are for
> embedded industrial usecases. I am curious about what CPUs these
> beasts run on in practice? Are they getting upgraded?

I had a look at those earlier when trying to find out what the remaining
users of CONFIG_ISA are. It turns out that you can still easily get new
x86 hardware with PC/104+ (combined ISA and PCI, not PCIe)
connectors, see e.g. https://www.versalogic.com/product/SandCat/.

Like the older VMEbus based systems, these would have at least 10
years of hardware availability (sometimes much more) and are indeed
designed for use over decades after that.

On the other hand, the set of ISA-style peripherals that you would
connect here has little overlap with the those you'd find on a 1990's
PC or Unix workstation, and I would expect that a lot of device
drivers for them were never submitted for mainline because they are
application specific.

We have a couple of ARMv5-generation systems with PC/104
support,  added before the start of the git history:

* s3c2410/bast
* s3c2410/vr1000
* pxa25x/viper
* pxa27x/zeus

I would assume that some of those are still operational somewhere
in the world (along with similar machines without mainline support),
but none have seen in field kernel updates for years.

There is also ep93xx/ts72xx, which has a  PC/104 connector
but no Linux support for it. A new version of the board was
added in 2017, so there are clearly still users, but they would
need add-on patches to use PC/104.

      Arnd

  parent reply index

Thread overview: 121+ messages / expand[flat|nested]  mbox.gz  Atom feed  top
2021-01-08 22:55 Arnd Bergmann
2021-01-08 23:32 ` Steven Rostedt
2021-01-09 22:04   ` Arnd Bergmann
2021-01-08 23:44 ` Thomas Bogendoerfer
2021-01-09  0:16 ` Linus Walleij
2021-01-09 17:32   ` Florian Fainelli
2021-01-09 21:59   ` Arnd Bergmann
2021-01-09  5:56 ` Willy Tarreau
2021-01-09 21:52   ` Arnd Bergmann
2021-01-10  6:21     ` Willy Tarreau
2021-01-10 10:44       ` Russell King - ARM Linux admin
2021-01-11  9:50     ` David Laight
2021-01-13 10:27       ` Andy Shevchenko
2021-01-13 12:02         ` Linus Walleij
2021-01-13 12:17           ` Andy Shevchenko
2021-01-13 12:21             ` Andy Shevchenko
2021-01-15  0:03               ` Bernd Petrovitsch
2021-01-15  0:24                 ` William Breathitt Gray
2021-01-15  8:59                   ` David Laight
2021-01-13 12:30           ` William Breathitt Gray
2021-01-13 12:56             ` William Breathitt Gray
2021-01-13 13:44           ` Arnd Bergmann [this message]
2021-02-04 21:01         ` Pavel Machek
2021-02-05  9:13           ` David Laight
2021-02-05  9:29             ` Pavel Machek
2021-01-09 17:34 ` Florian Fainelli
2021-01-09 21:18   ` Arnd Bergmann
2021-01-09 17:43 ` Russell King - ARM Linux admin
2021-01-09 21:34   ` Arnd Bergmann
2021-01-11 20:09     ` Russell King - ARM Linux admin
2021-01-09 20:19 ` Baruch Siach
2021-01-09 21:19   ` Arnd Bergmann
     [not found] ` <67171E13-6786-4B44-A8C2-3302963B055F@gmail.com>
2021-01-09 22:20   ` Arnd Bergmann
2021-01-10 18:12     ` Fabian Vogt
2021-01-10 19:20       ` Arnd Bergmann
2021-01-10 21:33       ` Linus Walleij
2021-01-11  0:33         ` Russell King - ARM Linux admin
2021-01-11 12:32           ` Arnd Bergmann
2021-01-11 12:36             ` Russell King - ARM Linux admin
2021-01-09 23:12 ` Andrew Lunn
2021-01-10  8:45   ` Arnd Bergmann
2021-01-10 16:46     ` Andrew Lunn
2021-01-10 17:27       ` Arnd Bergmann
2021-01-10 19:51         ` Andrew Lunn
2021-01-10 15:51 ` Neil Armstrong
2021-01-10 15:56   ` Arnd Bergmann
2021-01-10 17:35 ` John Paul Adrian Glaubitz
2021-01-10 21:46   ` Sam Ravnborg
2021-01-11  8:05     ` John Paul Adrian Glaubitz
2021-01-11 14:55       ` chase rayfield
2021-01-12  0:26         ` Rob Landley
2021-01-12  0:50           ` chase rayfield
2021-01-12 14:37         ` John Paul Adrian Glaubitz
2021-01-11 18:09     ` Rob Landley
2021-01-11 15:04   ` Gerhard Pircher
2021-01-12 14:44     ` John Paul Adrian Glaubitz
2021-01-12 22:46       ` Linus Walleij
2021-01-13  8:09         ` Rob Landley
2021-01-13  8:21           ` Geert Uytterhoeven
2021-01-13 13:25             ` Rob Landley
2021-01-13 12:02           ` Andy Shevchenko
2021-01-13  8:15         ` Geert Uytterhoeven
2021-01-13 10:39         ` Arnd Bergmann
2021-01-14  3:54           ` New platforms: bring out your dead, was " Finn Thain
2021-01-14  9:41         ` John Paul Adrian Glaubitz
2021-01-14  9:48           ` Geert Uytterhoeven
2021-01-14 21:21           ` Arnd Bergmann
2021-01-14 22:54             ` Undesirable code, was Re: Old platforms etc Finn Thain
2021-01-14 23:09             ` Old platforms: bring out your dead Max Filippov
2021-01-15  8:31               ` Arnd Bergmann
2021-01-13  0:12       ` Old platforms never die, was " Finn Thain
2021-01-16  6:54         ` Rob Landley
2021-01-16 23:22           ` Finn Thain
2021-01-13 11:47       ` Andy Shevchenko
2021-01-11  1:39 ` Daniel Palmer
2021-01-11  9:15   ` John Paul Adrian Glaubitz
2021-01-11  9:20     ` Geert Uytterhoeven
2021-01-11  9:26       ` John Paul Adrian Glaubitz
2021-01-11  9:36         ` Geert Uytterhoeven
2021-01-11  9:50           ` Greg Ungerer
2021-01-11  9:42     ` Daniel Palmer
2021-01-11 10:13   ` Arnd Bergmann
2021-01-11  8:19 ` Geert Uytterhoeven
2021-01-11  8:59   ` Arnd Bergmann
2021-01-11  9:16     ` Geert Uytterhoeven
2021-01-11 10:28       ` Geert Uytterhoeven
2021-01-11 10:37         ` Arnd Bergmann
2021-01-11  9:40     ` Thomas Bogendoerfer
2021-01-11 10:34       ` Arnd Bergmann
2021-01-11  8:40 ` efm32 is dead [Was: Old platforms: bring out your dead] Uwe Kleine-König
2021-01-11 11:10 ` Old platforms: bring out your dead Viresh Kumar
2021-01-11 19:59   ` Arnd Bergmann
2021-01-11 21:15     ` Mattias Wallin
2021-01-11 21:47       ` Arnd Bergmann
2021-01-11 13:13 ` Marc Gonzalez
2021-01-11 17:29   ` Måns Rullgård
2021-01-11 21:50     ` Arnd Bergmann
2021-01-12  8:23       ` Marc Gonzalez
2021-01-11 14:22 ` Mark Salter
2021-01-11 15:00   ` Arnd Bergmann
2021-01-11 14:44 ` Alexander Shiyan
2021-01-11 14:58   ` Arnd Bergmann
2021-01-11 16:23 ` Sylvain Lemieux
2021-01-11 22:17   ` Alexandre Belloni
2021-01-11 19:58 ` Thomas Petazzoni
2021-01-11 20:10   ` Arnd Bergmann
2021-01-11 20:25 ` Song Bao Hua (Barry Song)
2021-01-12  8:41   ` Marc Gonzalez
2021-01-13 10:30 ` Andy Shevchenko
2021-01-13 11:02   ` Arnd Bergmann
2021-01-13 16:14 ` [v2] " Arnd Bergmann
2021-01-13 19:00   ` Krzysztof Hałasa
2021-01-14  8:51     ` Arnd Bergmann
2021-01-15  7:08   ` Wei Xu
2021-01-15  9:26     ` Arnd Bergmann
2021-01-15 11:09       ` Leizhen (ThunderTown)
2021-01-15 12:04         ` Arnd Bergmann
2021-01-18 10:46           ` Wei Xu
2021-01-13 22:27 ` Richard Z
2021-02-05 13:37 ` Alexander Lobakin
2021-01-12  2:05 tedheadster

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