From: James Bottomley <James.Bottomley@HansenPartnership.com> To: Steven Rostedt <rostedt@goodmis.org> Cc: Carlos O'Donell <carlos@redhat.com>, linux-api@vger.kernel.org, Shuah Khan <shuahkh@osg.samsung.com>, ksummit-discuss@lists.linuxfoundation.org, Thorsten Leemhuis <linux@leemhuis.info> Subject: Re: [Ksummit-discuss] [MAINTAINERS SUMMIT] & [TECH TOPIC] Improve regression tracking Date: Wed, 05 Jul 2017 08:09:49 -0700 [thread overview] Message-ID: <1499267389.3668.16.camel@HansenPartnership.com> (raw) In-Reply-To: <20170705105651.5da9c969@gandalf.local.home> On Wed, 2017-07-05 at 10:56 -0400, Steven Rostedt wrote: > On Wed, 05 Jul 2017 07:50:28 -0700 > James Bottomley <James.Bottomley@HansenPartnership.com> wrote: > > > > > On Wed, 2017-07-05 at 10:36 -0400, Steven Rostedt wrote: > > > > > > On Wed, 5 Jul 2017 15:33:41 +0100 > > > Mark Brown <broonie@kernel.org> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > On Wed, Jul 05, 2017 at 04:06:07PM +0200, Greg KH wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I don't mean to poo-poo the idea, but please realize that > > > > > around 75% of the kernel is hardware/arch support, so that > > > > > means that 75% of the changes/fixes deal with hardware things > > > > > (yes, change is in direct correlation to size of the codebase > > > > > in the tree, strange but true). > > > > > > > > Then add in all the fixes for concurrency/locking issues and so > > > > on that're hard to reliably reproduce as well... > > > > > > All tests should be run with lockdep enabled ;-) Which a > > > surprising few developers appear to do :-p > > > > Lockdep checks the locking hierarchies and makes assumptions about > > them which it then validates ... it doesn't tell you if the data > > you think > > We should probably look at adding infrastructure that helps in that. > RCU already has a lot of there to help know if data is being > protected by RCU or not. > > Hmm, maybe we could add a __rcu like type that we can associate > protected data with, where a config can associate access to a > variable with a lock being held? That's about 10x more complex than the releases/acquires/must_hold annotation, which we have fairly dismal coverage on. If you remember the hotplug annotations, which were a shining example: there's a limit of complexity before any annotation system simply becomes a make work tyranny. > > you're protecting was accessed outside the lock, which is the usual > > source of concurrency problems. In other words lockdep is useful > > but it's not a panacea. > > Still not an excuse to not have lockdep enabled during tests. OK, what makes you think lockdep isn't enabled? Since Kconfig is so complex, I usually use a distro config ... they have it enabled (or at least openSUSE does), so it's enabled for everything I do. James
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From: James Bottomley <James.Bottomley-d9PhHud1JfjCXq6kfMZ53/egYHeGw8Jk@public.gmane.org> To: Steven Rostedt <rostedt-nx8X9YLhiw1AfugRpC6u6w@public.gmane.org> Cc: ksummit-discuss-cunTk1MwBs98uUxBSJOaYoYkZiVZrdSR2LY78lusg7I@public.gmane.org, Carlos O'Donell <carlos-H+wXaHxf7aLQT0dZR+AlfA@public.gmane.org>, linux-api-u79uwXL29TY76Z2rM5mHXA@public.gmane.org, Shuah Khan <shuahkh-JPH+aEBZ4P+UEJcrhfAQsw@public.gmane.org>, Thorsten Leemhuis <linux-rCxcAJFjeRkk+I/owrrOrA@public.gmane.org> Subject: Re: [Ksummit-discuss] [MAINTAINERS SUMMIT] & [TECH TOPIC] Improve regression tracking Date: Wed, 05 Jul 2017 08:09:49 -0700 [thread overview] Message-ID: <1499267389.3668.16.camel@HansenPartnership.com> (raw) In-Reply-To: <20170705105651.5da9c969-f9ZlEuEWxVcJvu8Pb33WZ0EMvNT87kid@public.gmane.org> On Wed, 2017-07-05 at 10:56 -0400, Steven Rostedt wrote: > On Wed, 05 Jul 2017 07:50:28 -0700 > James Bottomley <James.Bottomley-d9PhHud1JfjCXq6kfMZ53/egYHeGw8Jk@public.gmane.org> wrote: > > > > > On Wed, 2017-07-05 at 10:36 -0400, Steven Rostedt wrote: > > > > > > On Wed, 5 Jul 2017 15:33:41 +0100 > > > Mark Brown <broonie-DgEjT+Ai2ygdnm+yROfE0A@public.gmane.org> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > On Wed, Jul 05, 2017 at 04:06:07PM +0200, Greg KH wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I don't mean to poo-poo the idea, but please realize that > > > > > around 75% of the kernel is hardware/arch support, so that > > > > > means that 75% of the changes/fixes deal with hardware things > > > > > (yes, change is in direct correlation to size of the codebase > > > > > in the tree, strange but true). > > > > > > > > Then add in all the fixes for concurrency/locking issues and so > > > > on that're hard to reliably reproduce as well... > > > > > > All tests should be run with lockdep enabled ;-) Which a > > > surprising few developers appear to do :-p > > > > Lockdep checks the locking hierarchies and makes assumptions about > > them which it then validates ... it doesn't tell you if the data > > you think > > We should probably look at adding infrastructure that helps in that. > RCU already has a lot of there to help know if data is being > protected by RCU or not. > > Hmm, maybe we could add a __rcu like type that we can associate > protected data with, where a config can associate access to a > variable with a lock being held? That's about 10x more complex than the releases/acquires/must_hold annotation, which we have fairly dismal coverage on. If you remember the hotplug annotations, which were a shining example: there's a limit of complexity before any annotation system simply becomes a make work tyranny. > > you're protecting was accessed outside the lock, which is the usual > > source of concurrency problems. In other words lockdep is useful > > but it's not a panacea. > > Still not an excuse to not have lockdep enabled during tests. OK, what makes you think lockdep isn't enabled? Since Kconfig is so complex, I usually use a distro config ... they have it enabled (or at least openSUSE does), so it's enabled for everything I do. James
next prev parent reply other threads:[~2017-07-05 15:09 UTC|newest] Thread overview: 144+ messages / expand[flat|nested] mbox.gz Atom feed top 2017-07-02 17:51 [Ksummit-discuss] [MAINTAINERS SUMMIT] & [TECH TOPIC] Improve regression tracking Thorsten Leemhuis 2017-07-03 16:30 ` Steven Rostedt 2017-07-03 16:30 ` Steven Rostedt 2017-07-03 18:50 ` Dan Williams 2017-07-03 18:50 ` Dan Williams 2017-07-04 19:03 ` Thorsten Leemhuis 2017-07-04 19:03 ` Thorsten Leemhuis 2017-07-05 12:45 ` Steven Rostedt 2017-07-05 12:45 ` Steven Rostedt 2017-07-05 13:09 ` Carlos O'Donell 2017-07-05 13:09 ` Carlos O'Donell 2017-07-05 13:27 ` Steven Rostedt 2017-07-05 13:27 ` Steven Rostedt 2017-07-05 14:06 ` Greg KH 2017-07-05 14:06 ` Greg KH 2017-07-05 14:28 ` Carlos O'Donell 2017-07-05 14:28 ` Carlos O'Donell 2017-07-05 14:33 ` Steven Rostedt 2017-07-05 14:33 ` Steven Rostedt 2017-07-05 14:52 ` Mark Brown 2017-07-05 14:52 ` Mark Brown 2017-07-05 15:08 ` Carlos O'Donell 2017-07-05 15:08 ` Carlos O'Donell 2017-07-05 16:10 ` Steven Rostedt 2017-07-05 16:10 ` Steven Rostedt 2017-07-06 11:34 ` Laurent Pinchart 2017-07-06 11:34 ` Laurent Pinchart 2017-07-09 13:46 ` Thorsten Leemhuis 2017-07-09 13:46 ` Thorsten Leemhuis 2017-07-05 14:33 ` Mark Brown 2017-07-05 14:33 ` Mark Brown 2017-07-05 14:36 ` Steven Rostedt 2017-07-05 14:36 ` Steven Rostedt 2017-07-05 14:50 ` James Bottomley 2017-07-05 14:50 ` James Bottomley 2017-07-05 14:56 ` Steven Rostedt 2017-07-05 14:56 ` Steven Rostedt 2017-07-05 15:09 ` James Bottomley [this message] 2017-07-05 15:09 ` James Bottomley 2017-07-05 15:20 ` Mark Brown 2017-07-05 15:20 ` Mark Brown 2017-07-05 15:40 ` Geert Uytterhoeven 2017-07-05 15:40 ` Geert Uytterhoeven 2017-07-05 15:20 ` Steven Rostedt 2017-07-05 15:20 ` Steven Rostedt 2017-07-05 15:32 ` James Bottomley 2017-07-05 15:32 ` James Bottomley 2017-07-05 15:43 ` Steven Rostedt 2017-07-05 15:43 ` Steven Rostedt 2017-07-05 18:24 ` Daniel Vetter 2017-07-05 18:24 ` Daniel Vetter 2017-07-05 18:17 ` Daniel Vetter 2017-07-05 18:17 ` Daniel Vetter 2017-07-05 15:16 ` Guenter Roeck 2017-07-05 15:16 ` Guenter Roeck 2017-07-05 15:27 ` Steven Rostedt 2017-07-05 15:27 ` Steven Rostedt 2017-07-05 15:36 ` James Bottomley 2017-07-05 15:36 ` James Bottomley 2017-07-05 16:04 ` Steven Rostedt 2017-07-05 16:04 ` Steven Rostedt 2017-07-05 16:58 ` James Bottomley 2017-07-05 16:58 ` James Bottomley 2017-07-05 17:07 ` Steven Rostedt 2017-07-05 17:07 ` Steven Rostedt 2017-07-05 16:48 ` Guenter Roeck 2017-07-05 16:48 ` Guenter Roeck 2017-07-05 16:58 ` Dan Williams 2017-07-05 16:58 ` Dan Williams 2017-07-05 17:02 ` Steven Rostedt 2017-07-05 17:02 ` Steven Rostedt 2017-07-06 9:28 ` Mark Brown 2017-07-06 9:28 ` Mark Brown 2017-07-06 9:41 ` Daniel Vetter 2017-07-06 9:41 ` Daniel Vetter 2017-07-06 14:53 ` Theodore Ts'o 2017-07-06 14:53 ` Theodore Ts'o 2017-07-06 21:28 ` Daniel Vetter 2017-07-06 21:28 ` Daniel Vetter 2017-07-06 14:48 ` James Bottomley 2017-07-06 14:48 ` James Bottomley 2017-07-07 10:03 ` Mark Brown 2017-07-07 10:03 ` Mark Brown 2017-07-31 16:54 ` Eric W. Biederman 2017-07-31 16:54 ` Eric W. Biederman 2017-07-31 20:11 ` Steven Rostedt 2017-07-31 20:11 ` Steven Rostedt 2017-07-31 20:12 ` Eric W. Biederman 2017-07-31 20:12 ` Eric W. Biederman 2017-08-02 16:53 ` Shuah Khan 2017-08-02 16:53 ` Shuah Khan 2017-08-02 17:33 ` Eric W. Biederman 2017-08-02 17:33 ` Eric W. Biederman 2017-08-02 17:46 ` Shuah Khan 2017-08-02 17:46 ` Shuah Khan 2017-08-02 17:58 ` Shuah Khan 2017-08-02 17:58 ` Shuah Khan 2017-08-02 18:04 ` Eric W. Biederman 2017-08-02 18:04 ` Eric W. Biederman 2017-08-02 18:23 ` Randy Dunlap 2017-08-02 18:23 ` Randy Dunlap 2017-08-02 18:42 ` Shuah Khan 2017-08-02 18:42 ` Shuah Khan 2017-08-03 3:03 ` Theodore Ts'o 2017-08-03 3:03 ` Theodore Ts'o 2017-08-03 17:42 ` Bird, Timothy 2017-08-03 17:42 ` Bird, Timothy 2017-08-03 22:11 ` Shuah Khan 2017-08-03 22:11 ` Shuah Khan 2017-08-03 18:51 ` Shuah Khan 2017-08-03 18:51 ` Shuah Khan 2017-08-04 1:15 ` Theodore Ts'o 2017-08-04 1:15 ` Theodore Ts'o 2017-07-07 3:33 ` Fengguang Wu 2017-07-07 3:33 ` Fengguang Wu 2017-07-07 4:52 ` Frank Rowand 2017-07-07 4:52 ` Frank Rowand 2017-07-05 15:32 ` Greg KH 2017-07-05 15:32 ` Greg KH 2017-07-05 15:36 ` Carlos O'Donell 2017-07-05 15:36 ` Carlos O'Donell 2017-07-05 15:52 ` Steven Rostedt 2017-07-05 15:52 ` Steven Rostedt 2017-07-05 18:42 ` Greg KH 2017-07-05 18:42 ` Greg KH 2017-07-05 18:29 ` Daniel Vetter 2017-07-05 18:29 ` Daniel Vetter 2017-07-06 22:24 ` Shuah Khan 2017-07-06 22:24 ` Shuah Khan 2017-07-06 22:32 ` Steven Rostedt 2017-07-06 22:32 ` Steven Rostedt 2017-07-06 22:40 ` Shuah Khan 2017-07-06 22:40 ` Shuah Khan 2017-07-05 16:54 ` Dan Williams 2017-07-05 16:54 ` Dan Williams 2017-07-05 18:45 ` Greg KH 2017-07-05 18:45 ` Greg KH 2017-07-05 19:47 ` Dan Williams 2017-07-05 19:47 ` Dan Williams 2017-07-05 14:06 ` Carlos O'Donell 2017-07-05 14:06 ` Carlos O'Donell 2017-07-05 15:47 ` Mark Brown 2017-07-05 15:47 ` Mark Brown 2017-07-07 6:15 ` Andrei Vagin
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